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Autism Spectrum Disorders
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I believe it's either largely or entirely genetic.0
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My oldest son appears to have ASD. We started having him diagnosed, back when Asperger's was still a separate diagnosis from Autism, but we discontinued it. He is homeschooled and did not need accommodations for school. His case is mild and he has no behavioural problems. He was just the type of baby who never wanted to cuddle. As a toddler he would line up his Thomas trains in certain ways rather than "play" with them. He is a smart kid, who learns very quickly, especially in his areas of interest, which changes every few years or so.
Anyways, my son seemed to be born this way. People were calling him an old soul by time he was 8 months old. Some things became easier for him with dietary changes (gluten, some red dyes, and milk). Other things needed to be taught because he didn't intuitively "get" some social situations. He still gets overwhelmed by a lot of noise and people. He needs to leave or he just can't think well. That's his biggest struggle.
My next two boys came out with no autism, and they never developed it. I'm not sure what was different with my oldest. TBH, I don't think I would take it away from him. It's part of who he is. It makes him unique and has added positively to his life in many ways. We have to make a few accommodations for him, but I doubt he'd want to give up his high IQ just so he could tolerate a noisy classroom better. KWIM?
Our daughter's story is parallel to your son's. We never went through with formal diagnosis since I homeschooled her, even through dyslexia. Interestingly with her sensory issues, she also has synesthesia like I do, and her texture issues with food translate to that. Foods taste odd to her. She, for example, think carrots taste "square" and that lettuce tastes "purple".
Her dietary changes necessary were corn and milk. She outgrew them with puberty.
Our son had behavioral issues, but we don't think he was on the spectrum and never had him evaluated. We Feingolded him and it worked like a charm. He's basically outgrown that now that puberty has hit as well.2 -
kenyonhaff wrote: »Scientifically? WE DON'T KNOW SQUAT! That's what I believe.
I'm happy it only took a little scroll down to see that someone already said this!!..thankkkkk youu!!
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GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
Our daughter's story is parallel to your son's. We never went through with formal diagnosis since I homeschooled her, even through dyslexia. Interestingly with her sensory issues, she also has synesthesia like I do, and her texture issues with food translate to that. Foods taste odd to her. She, for example, think carrots taste "square" and that lettuce tastes "purple".
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I don't know about lettuce, but raw carrots DO taste square! That is funny, I never thought about it, but they do.
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GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
Our daughter's story is parallel to your son's. We never went through with formal diagnosis since I homeschooled her, even through dyslexia. Interestingly with her sensory issues, she also has synesthesia like I do, and her texture issues with food translate to that. Foods taste odd to her. She, for example, think carrots taste "square" and that lettuce tastes "purple".
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I don't know about lettuce, but raw carrots DO taste square! That is funny, I never thought about it, but they do.
If you haven't and if you're intersted, read up on Daniel Tammet an autistic savant who has beautifully described his synesthesia as well as other interesting aspects of autism.
I usually don't cite wiki for anything but I took this quote from there:
In his mind, Tammet says, each positive integer up to 10,000 has its own unique shape, colour, texture and feel. He has described his visual image of 289 as particularly ugly, 333 as particularly attractive, and pi, though not an integer, as beautiful. The number 6 apparently has no distinct image yet what he describes as an almost small nothingness, opposite to the number 9 which he calls large, towering, and quite intimidating. He also describes the number 117 as "a handsome number. It's tall, it's a lanky number, a little bit wobbly".[8][28] In his memoir, he describes experiencing a synaesthetic and emotional response for numbers and words.5 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
Our daughter's story is parallel to your son's. We never went through with formal diagnosis since I homeschooled her, even through dyslexia. Interestingly with her sensory issues, she also has synesthesia like I do, and her texture issues with food translate to that. Foods taste odd to her. She, for example, think carrots taste "square" and that lettuce tastes "purple".
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I don't know about lettuce, but raw carrots DO taste square! That is funny, I never thought about it, but they do.
If you haven't and if you're intersted, read up on Daniel Tammet an autistic savant who has beautifully described his synesthesia as well as other interesting aspects of autism.
I usually don't cite wiki for anything but I took this quote from there:
In his mind, Tammet says, each positive integer up to 10,000 has its own unique shape, colour, texture and feel. He has described his visual image of 289 as particularly ugly, 333 as particularly attractive, and pi, though not an integer, as beautiful. The number 6 apparently has no distinct image yet what he describes as an almost small nothingness, opposite to the number 9 which he calls large, towering, and quite intimidating. He also describes the number 117 as "a handsome number. It's tall, it's a lanky number, a little bit wobbly".[8][28] In his memoir, he describes experiencing a synaesthetic and emotional response for numbers and words.
I was once hospitalized for my migraines and had the interesting experience of having the whole staff of my migraine clinic come into my room along with quite a few of the nurses to just chat with me. Very few of them had run across a synesthete before.
Before it was too hard for me to do as a sustained activity thanks to arthritis, I used to love to draw, and colored pencils were my favorite medium. A lot of my experience of synethesia revolves around color. I can remember taking an art class back when I worked at an arts college and sort of confusing the instructor when I'd try to discuss things. When my instructor told me I had an eye for color, I told her that it was more like an ear and "feeling" for it.6 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
Our daughter's story is parallel to your son's. We never went through with formal diagnosis since I homeschooled her, even through dyslexia. Interestingly with her sensory issues, she also has synesthesia like I do, and her texture issues with food translate to that. Foods taste odd to her. She, for example, think carrots taste "square" and that lettuce tastes "purple".
.
I don't know about lettuce, but raw carrots DO taste square! That is funny, I never thought about it, but they do.
If you haven't and if you're intersted, read up on Daniel Tammet an autistic savant who has beautifully described his synesthesia as well as other interesting aspects of autism.
I usually don't cite wiki for anything but I took this quote from there:
In his mind, Tammet says, each positive integer up to 10,000 has its own unique shape, colour, texture and feel. He has described his visual image of 289 as particularly ugly, 333 as particularly attractive, and pi, though not an integer, as beautiful. The number 6 apparently has no distinct image yet what he describes as an almost small nothingness, opposite to the number 9 which he calls large, towering, and quite intimidating. He also describes the number 117 as "a handsome number. It's tall, it's a lanky number, a little bit wobbly".[8][28] In his memoir, he describes experiencing a synaesthetic and emotional response for numbers and words.
I was once hospitalized for my migraines and had the interesting experience of having the whole staff of my migraine clinic come into my room along with quite a few of the nurses to just chat with me. Very few of them had run across a synesthete before.
Before it was too hard for me to do as a sustained activity thanks to arthritis, I used to love to draw, and colored pencils were my favorite medium. A lot of my experience of synethesia revolves around color. I can remember taking an art class back when I worked at an arts college and sort of confusing the instructor when I'd try to discuss things. When my instructor told me I had an eye for color, I told her that it was more like an ear and "feeling" for it.
That's so interesting. I wish I knew if my daughter has this to any degree. She's smart and can communicate but she doesn't really converse. Abstract ideas are very difficult so it's something she wouldn't be able to articulate.3 -
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midwesterner85 wrote: »I'm sure some people are going to jump all over me for this viewpoint, but I don't really care. If you think there is something that would actually change my view, I'm open to it. If you just want to tell me I'm a terrible person for having this viewpoint, or that I'm wrong because your cousin/sibling/kid/etc. doesn't fit either of the things I see; my viewpoint won't change based on that.
Since they changed the DSM criteria several years ago, the number of ASD cases has drastically increased. If you read through the criteria, you might understand why... anybody could be diagnosed under one or more of the criteria. While I believe that many patients truly have a developmental issue, there are a lot diagnosed with ASD now that just have old-fashioned behavioral issues. Many of the latter are actually "bad parenting."
That isn't to say all ASD patients fit that scenario, but it has become a trend where terrible parents have kids with awful behavior, so they take them to someone who diagnoses ASD based on vague DSM criteria. Terrible parents then just excuse their absent parenting with "I just can't help it... my kid has ASD."
I can immediately tell from your post that you are not on the spectrum and have no clue how painful it is to know or be an adult with aspergers/autism.11 -
My son was diagnosed with ADHD and tested for Autism but was diagnosed as "quirky". The dr. said if they were still using the Aspergers diagnosis he'd be on the spectrum for that. but he's just quirky. Guess who else is quirky? Me. The more appointments I go to for him I realize I would have the same diagnosis if I were going to school today as would my brother and probably my husband.
so I say genetics.
My son has some sensory issues. He hates loud sounds or sudden sounds and has lots of food sensory issues. Then again hubs hate loud sounds and I have lots of issues with foods
I agree to a point that some parents just go looking for something and some kind of diagnosis. Heck when we went for our appointment to get the results of the boy's Autism test the Dr. said some parents would be unhappy with the lack of diagnosis. We were shocked but he said lots are looking for something to get them some services for help.2 -
midwesterner85 wrote: »I'm sure some people are going to jump all over me for this viewpoint, but I don't really care. If you think there is something that would actually change my view, I'm open to it. If you just want to tell me I'm a terrible person for having this viewpoint, or that I'm wrong because your cousin/sibling/kid/etc. doesn't fit either of the things I see; my viewpoint won't change based on that.
Since they changed the DSM criteria several years ago, the number of ASD cases has drastically increased. If you read through the criteria, you might understand why... anybody could be diagnosed under one or more of the criteria. While I believe that many patients truly have a developmental issue, there are a lot diagnosed with ASD now that just have old-fashioned behavioral issues. Many of the latter are actually "bad parenting."
That isn't to say all ASD patients fit that scenario, but it has become a trend where terrible parents have kids with awful behavior, so they take them to someone who diagnoses ASD based on vague DSM criteria. Terrible parents then just excuse their absent parenting with "I just can't help it... my kid has ASD."
The issue I take with this attitude is that it seems to boil down to behavioral issues. And while there are people who do want to blame bad behavior/hyperactivity on some sort of illness when it isn't, the idea that Autism always or usually comes down to behavioral issues is based on a severe lack of understanding on what Autism really is.
Behavioral issues are only one of many problems that a person on the spectrum can have and many of them don't.
I agree that's it's infuriating to see people not want to parent their kids and just blame it on something that really isn't the problem and yes, there has been an increase in that. But what's even more exasperating is the flippant judgement of people struggling by bystanders who see a very brief window in to that person's/family's life. This is what leads to nasty comments from strangers because someone's kid is overloaded and acting out.
It's fine to have an issue with methods of and criteria for diagnoses. I just wish people would not use that as a reason to judge individuals about whom they know next to nothing.9 -
midwesterner85 wrote: »I'm sure some people are going to jump all over me for this viewpoint, but I don't really care. If you think there is something that would actually change my view, I'm open to it. If you just want to tell me I'm a terrible person for having this viewpoint, or that I'm wrong because your cousin/sibling/kid/etc. doesn't fit either of the things I see; my viewpoint won't change based on that.
Since they changed the DSM criteria several years ago, the number of ASD cases has drastically increased. If you read through the criteria, you might understand why... anybody could be diagnosed under one or more of the criteria. While I believe that many patients truly have a developmental issue, there are a lot diagnosed with ASD now that just have old-fashioned behavioral issues. Many of the latter are actually "bad parenting."
That isn't to say all ASD patients fit that scenario, but it has become a trend where terrible parents have kids with awful behavior, so they take them to someone who diagnoses ASD based on vague DSM criteria. Terrible parents then just excuse their absent parenting with "I just can't help it... my kid has ASD."
The issue I take with this attitude is that it seems to boil down to behavioral issues. And while there are people who do want to blame bad behavior/hyperactivity on some sort of illness when it isn't, the idea that Autism always or usually comes down to behavioral issues is based on a severe lack of understanding on what Autism really is.
Behavioral issues are only one of many problems that a person on the spectrum can have and many of them don't.
I agree that's it's infuriating to see people not want to parent their kids and just blame it on something that really isn't the problem and yes, there has been an increase in that. But what's even more exasperating is the flippant judgement of people struggling by bystanders who see a very brief window in to that person's/family's life. This is what leads to nasty comments from strangers because someone's kid is overloaded and acting out.
It's fine to have an issue with methods of and criteria for diagnoses. I just wish people would not use that as a reason to judge individuals about whom they know next to nothing.
Yep, and that is exactly why I clarified, more than once, that there are people with real cases. I would guess that the increase in abuse of diagnosis must infuriate those people the most.0 -
I'm autistic too
I think it's genetic.2 -
WickAndArtoo wrote: »midwesterner85 wrote: »I'm sure some people are going to jump all over me for this viewpoint, but I don't really care. If you think there is something that would actually change my view, I'm open to it. If you just want to tell me I'm a terrible person for having this viewpoint, or that I'm wrong because your cousin/sibling/kid/etc. doesn't fit either of the things I see; my viewpoint won't change based on that.
Since they changed the DSM criteria several years ago, the number of ASD cases has drastically increased. If you read through the criteria, you might understand why... anybody could be diagnosed under one or more of the criteria. While I believe that many patients truly have a developmental issue, there are a lot diagnosed with ASD now that just have old-fashioned behavioral issues. Many of the latter are actually "bad parenting."
That isn't to say all ASD patients fit that scenario, but it has become a trend where terrible parents have kids with awful behavior, so they take them to someone who diagnoses ASD based on vague DSM criteria. Terrible parents then just excuse their absent parenting with "I just can't help it... my kid has ASD."
I can immediately tell from your post that you are not on the spectrum and have no clue how painful it is to know or be an adult with aspergers/autism.
I have never been diagnosed, nor have I ever sought a diagnosis. If I did, I am certain I would be diagnosed with ASD. That is true for many, based on the DSM being so vague.
https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/hcp-dsm.html
In fact, I probably fit even more than most... all of A without question, and all of B to varying extents lesser than A.
But once again, the criteria is so vague that it could apply to most people. It actually seems intentionally vague.
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midwesterner85 wrote: »midwesterner85 wrote: »I'm sure some people are going to jump all over me for this viewpoint, but I don't really care. If you think there is something that would actually change my view, I'm open to it. If you just want to tell me I'm a terrible person for having this viewpoint, or that I'm wrong because your cousin/sibling/kid/etc. doesn't fit either of the things I see; my viewpoint won't change based on that.
Since they changed the DSM criteria several years ago, the number of ASD cases has drastically increased. If you read through the criteria, you might understand why... anybody could be diagnosed under one or more of the criteria. While I believe that many patients truly have a developmental issue, there are a lot diagnosed with ASD now that just have old-fashioned behavioral issues. Many of the latter are actually "bad parenting."
That isn't to say all ASD patients fit that scenario, but it has become a trend where terrible parents have kids with awful behavior, so they take them to someone who diagnoses ASD based on vague DSM criteria. Terrible parents then just excuse their absent parenting with "I just can't help it... my kid has ASD."
The issue I take with this attitude is that it seems to boil down to behavioral issues. And while there are people who do want to blame bad behavior/hyperactivity on some sort of illness when it isn't, the idea that Autism always or usually comes down to behavioral issues is based on a severe lack of understanding on what Autism really is.
Behavioral issues are only one of many problems that a person on the spectrum can have and many of them don't.
I agree that's it's infuriating to see people not want to parent their kids and just blame it on something that really isn't the problem and yes, there has been an increase in that. But what's even more exasperating is the flippant judgement of people struggling by bystanders who see a very brief window in to that person's/family's life. This is what leads to nasty comments from strangers because someone's kid is overloaded and acting out.
It's fine to have an issue with methods of and criteria for diagnoses. I just wish people would not use that as a reason to judge individuals about whom they know next to nothing.
Yep, and that is exactly why I clarified, more than once, that there are people with real cases. I would guess that the increase in abuse of diagnosis must infuriate those people the most.
Yes, I know you did. I wasn't directing all of that at you. And yes, abuse of diagnoses is most hurtful to those with real issues. 3 -
midwesterner85 wrote: »WickAndArtoo wrote: »midwesterner85 wrote: »I'm sure some people are going to jump all over me for this viewpoint, but I don't really care. If you think there is something that would actually change my view, I'm open to it. If you just want to tell me I'm a terrible person for having this viewpoint, or that I'm wrong because your cousin/sibling/kid/etc. doesn't fit either of the things I see; my viewpoint won't change based on that.
Since they changed the DSM criteria several years ago, the number of ASD cases has drastically increased. If you read through the criteria, you might understand why... anybody could be diagnosed under one or more of the criteria. While I believe that many patients truly have a developmental issue, there are a lot diagnosed with ASD now that just have old-fashioned behavioral issues. Many of the latter are actually "bad parenting."
That isn't to say all ASD patients fit that scenario, but it has become a trend where terrible parents have kids with awful behavior, so they take them to someone who diagnoses ASD based on vague DSM criteria. Terrible parents then just excuse their absent parenting with "I just can't help it... my kid has ASD."
I can immediately tell from your post that you are not on the spectrum and have no clue how painful it is to know or be an adult with aspergers/autism.
I have never been diagnosed, nor have I ever sought a diagnosis. If I did, I am certain I would be diagnosed with ASD. That is true for many, based on the DSM being so vague.
https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/hcp-dsm.html
In fact, I probably fit even more than most... all of A without question, and all of B to varying extents lesser than A.
But once again, the criteria is so vague that it could apply to most people. It actually seems intentionally vague.
It is clear that you are not familiar with the process of diagnosis, because that isn't how autism is diagnosed in children. For my daughter, she underwent a battery of tests and assessments (at least 6 hours worth) and there were assessments completed by family, teachers, and anyone else who has spent a significant amount of time with her and observed her behavior long term - not just in one session or based on someone seeing a child acting up in a store.
Is there any actual evidence of a trend of over-diagnosis? The expanded criteria are allowing children who are in need of help and support to actually qualify to get it. It sounds like you are just assuming that people are getting their kids diagnosed so they don't have to deal with them.
What you saw as a terrible parent might have actually been a parent who has a child with autism, desperately needs help and support services, and isn't able to get them thanks to another reality of autism - limited services available with long wait lists. ABA therapy is costly and time-consuming, and most therapists travel to your home or school for the therapy, which means they not only need to calculate the multi-hour session times with a client, but also travel time between clients. There are only so many hours in a day, and then they also have to do paperwork and reports. They generally can't take on a large number of clients. Some other forms of therapy aren't covered by insurance, making them out of reach.7 -
I can't find the link or I'd post it, but I saw an interesting TED talk a while back which suggested that autism and other 'disorders' on the spectrum, are instances in a step forward of human evolution. It's only viewed as a problem because of pretty petty social conventions in the general population. But essentially they were suggesting that those on the spectrum are sort of super-humans, and that the rest of us have created a society where these people can't fully thrive.
... oh and to answer your question, I was of the opinion that autism was a combinatorial genetic disorder. There is a pattern of inheritance in families so it is definitely at least partly genetic. I'd be inclined to agree with the 95% genes, 5% environment thing I guess!6 -
@kgeyser
We drove 3 hours, multiple times, to UVA to have my daughter tested and my insurance would not tell me if it was covered without know the final diagnoses. It did cover it but man I was scared. We were young and poor. Then speech therapy was $100 an hour and weekly and insurance wouldn't cover it since Autism was considered a disorder and not a medical condition. Thankfully our families offered to help as they would do anything for her.
I can't imagin having to pay for multiple types of therapy as many do. Thankfully many types of insurance have improved on this since the early 2000s.
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I can't find the link or I'd post it, but I saw an interesting TED talk a while back which suggested that autism and other 'disorders' on the spectrum, are instances in a step forward of human evolution. It's only viewed as a problem because of pretty petty social conventions in the general population. But essentially they were suggesting that those on the spectrum are sort of super-humans, and that the rest of us have created a society where these people can't fully thrive.
... oh and to answer your question, I was of the opinion that autism was a combinatorial genetic disorder. There is a pattern of inheritance in families so it is definitely at least partly genetic. I'd be inclined to agree with the 95% genes, 5% environment thing I guess!
I agree that environment is part of it. If I gave my son a gluten filled pizza, with lots of cheese, a glass of milk and red candy, he would be off for days and days. Controlling environment is a huge help to him.
I do want to add, to others, that ASD is not always a behavioral problem. My son can't handle a lot of noise or actvity but he doesn't act out. He gets a headache, stims a bit and tends to cry. Quietly. It is embarassing to him now that he is in grade 9 but he just doesn't have control over his emotions like his peers. He has never acted out in school, nor does he act out at home. It's just who he was made as. No better or worse than other kids with ASD. Just different.2 -
My son is on the spectrum, diagnosed before they eliminated Aspergers as a diagnosis...when I told him they no longer recognise Aspergers he asked if that meant he no longer has it. He went through extensive testing and I can tell you I am 100% comfortable that the diagnosis was not given lightly. I am in Canada, Ontario specifically, and they do not identify just to label difficult children....a diagnosis enables you to engage in programs for behavioural therapy and school supports that would otherwise not be available. These supports are a burden on the health care system so they do everything they can to NOT identify on the spectrum. My son is 18 now, is high functioning and you would never know he was an Aspie...but he struggles every day to read facial cues and tone of voice, has struggled with sensory issues and textures, still has food issues. He struggles in the education system as there really isn't a place for him to pursue his interests and if he isn't interested, he won't engage.
He is one of the smartest, most unique individuals I have ever met. His perspective makes me evaluate everything I take for granted and instinctively believe. I am a better person for being his parent. That's what I know about ASD.
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