"first fast, then binge" or "first binge, then fast"
Replies
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TavistockToad wrote: »Ironandwine69 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Ironandwine69 wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »This would be the strangest way I've heard IF described, if that's what the topic here is. IF wouldn't typically be considered binge/fast cycles.
OP, can you describe the context in which you are using the terms binge and fast? That would help get clearer answers.
We might have different views of what "binge" means. There's many days I have 1500-2000 calories meals( one meal a day). And I meet most of my macros. I don't have an ED.
I would imagine that can be considered binging by most people, no?
What makes you think that is considered bingeing?
Bingeing by definition is uncontrollable eating - not a specific amount of calories.
Binge is a short period devoted to indulging in an activity to excess, especially drinking alcohol or eating.
Edit: Going out to bars is bingeing on alcohol, it doesn't make you an alcoholic.
Fasting to save your calories for a bigger meal doesn't mean you have an ED either.
That's the first reaction people have without even asking questions.
I'm not saying what OP is doing is healthy or not, but none of us have enough knowledge to make that determination
I'm not the only person to mention disordered eating, but Ok, just pull me up on it if it makes you feel better.
Sorry, didn't mean to only pull you on that, I just made the edit, since I was already on that post replying to your question. My apologies4 -
Oh how I hate seeing that cycle. It is the biggest hindrance to fat loss goals ever. FASTING: Don't make this complicated. It is merely the time between meals. We all fast when we sleep. We all spend some time fed and not fed. There is no wrong or right way, but certainly if your body is weak, you have no energy, you feel sick, and you BINGE, and you don't sleep well that is the wrong way regardless of what you think your timing should be. The ANSWER IS IN YOU. Listen to your body!
Intermittent fasting is INTERMITTENT. That means INTERMITTENT. That means NOT ALL THE TIME. Not every day. Not daily.
People get stuck in a rut thinking it has to be done this way, but in reality the trick for fat loss is to stay at maintenance, but also have 4-6 days during the week UNDER maintenance to lose fat. If done consistently this is like paying off a debt. It happens slowly over time, just like paying off a mortgage debt. It is the consistent payments that pay it off.
What matters is the calories at the end of the day in the 24 hour period, extend that out 7 days, 30, 60, and 90 days for results.
It is always good to eat up to maintenance at least one day a week (or more) to help keep hormones stable and ward off binges.4 -
BlackWhiteBlue wrote: »Hi!
Since both binging and fasting seem to have quite the impact on our digestive system, what would be better for your health (or weight loss progress), first a fast, then a binge, or first a binge, then a fast?
Well, if I have a big dinner, I'll skip breakfast. If I know I'm going to have a big dinner, I'll skip the afternoon snack. I don't think either counts as an eating disorder. (And I am not underweight. Please take care of yourself!)2 -
californiagirl2012 wrote: »Oh how I hate seeing that cycle. It is the biggest hindrance to fat loss goals ever. FASTING: Don't make this complicated. It is merely the time between meals. We all fast when we sleep. We all spend some time fed and not fed. There is no wrong or right way, but certainly if your body is weak, you have no energy, you feel sick, and you BINGE, and you don't sleep well that is the wrong way regardless of what you think your timing should be. The ANSWER IS IN YOU. Listen to your body!
Intermittent fasting is INTERMITTENT. That means INTERMITTENT. That means NOT ALL THE TIME. Not every day. Not daily.
People get stuck in a rut thinking it has to be done this way, but in reality the trick for fat loss is to stay at maintenance, but also have 4-6 days during the week UNDER maintenance to lose fat. If done consistently this is like paying off a debt. It happens slowly over time, just like paying off a mortgage debt. It is the consistent payments that pay it off.
What matters is the calories at the end of the day in the 24 hour period, extend that out 7 days, 30, 60, and 90 days for results.
It is always good to eat up to maintenance at least one day a week (or more) to help keep hormones stable and ward off binges.
Actually no, the calories at the end of day don't matter. If you goal is to lose one pound a week, what matters is calorie deficit at the end of the week.3 -
TavistockToad wrote: »Verity1111 wrote: »Ironandwine69 wrote: »I don't have much knowledge about eating disorders so take my reply keeping that in mind.
But I don't see a problem with fasting to save your calories for a big meal.
Let's say a person is on 2k calories a day. One meal a day is perfectly fine and not unhealthy, so that one meal will feel like a "binge", but it's still controlled and planned( as long as it doesn't turn into a 4k calories meal).
Well Ive had a planned 4000cal meal too and it was fine. But this shouldnt be every day. Thats how I took it? Maybe Im wrong. I took it as eat like 5000 calories then dont eat for 3 days... which is definitely not healthy.
If your calorie goal is 4000 then you can do it every day.
haha YES but most people are not that active (or overweight). But good point.0 -
Ironandwine69 wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »This would be the strangest way I've heard IF described, if that's what the topic here is. IF wouldn't typically be considered binge/fast cycles.
OP, can you describe the context in which you are using the terms binge and fast? That would help get clearer answers.
We might have different views of what "binge" means. There's many days I have 1500-2000 calories meals( one meal a day). And I meet most of my macros. I don't have an ED.
I would imagine that can be considered binging by most people, no?
Well it depends on the person. I guess because I had an ED and I go on an ED forum binge to me has a different meaning in day to day use of the word. Like Ive seen people say they devoured 10000-15000 calories, not 1500 so to me 2000 is nothing, just a treat day. I do that too. Totally normal... So if that's what OP means I see nothing wrong with it.0 -
Binge has a pretty clear definition. It's gorging on food (or other consumable substance) with a lack of self control. If you plan to do a 500 calorie fast tuesday and thursday so you can eat a 4,000 calorie pizza on wednesday, it is by definition not a binge.5
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Geocitiesuser wrote: »Binge has a pretty clear definition. It's gorging on food (or other consumable substance) with a lack of self control. If you plan to do a 500 calorie fast tuesday and thursday so you can eat a 4,000 calorie pizza on wednesday, it is by definition not a binge.
Yet, fasting and binge eating is not always an indication of binge eating disorder. Like overindulging during holidays, fasting for a big binge dinner, preparing for an athletic event. Etc1 -
If you're fasting for a binge dinner, or preparing for an athletic event, it's not a binge. It is controlled and planned and not the same thing. I'm not sure why you disagree. To me this is pretty cut and dry. The word binge its self implies (and partly defines) disordered eating. You don't fast in preparation for a big binge dinner, you fast in preparation for a big dinner. A binge has no concept of a singular meal.
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My point is OP asked one question, we don't know if she is planning in doing for one special occasion, what she means by binge et etc etc. We should ask more questions before jumping into conclusions.2
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OP isn't coming back. They have 1 post and ghosted, lol. It's just us now.
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Geocitiesuser wrote: »OP isn't coming back. They have 1 post and ghosted, lol. It's just us now.
Good old mfp... never let's you down :laugh:4 -
thiosulfate wrote: »Neither.
^^^This, end thread...1 -
Geocitiesuser wrote: »OP isn't coming back. They have 1 post and ghosted, lol. It's just us now.
So trolling.2 -
I don't know, it may have been an honest question. Fact is there is no "healthier" option in that situation. Whether you fast before or after, all things are about equal and involve the same types of spikes and valleys of hormones.0
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Oh my god so many replies! First of all, sorry for the late reply. I am studying for exams right now (21 years old I am not a small teenage girl), which is why 1) I am distracting myself with unnecessary questions and 2) haven't replied yet.
I was honestly thinking about how the digestive system would theoretically work in extreme conditions. By no means am I considering doing this nor do I have the habit of doing so. I swear, I was just procrastinating by getting curious about weird things (last week I did research on how to keep bees for over 20 hours, even though I have no intention of getting bees myself. The week before that is was narcissism, more specifically how having narcissistic parents would affect people when they become adults in terms of their view on having children themselves. I just have a weird habit of learning a lot about things that are very useless during exam period.)
Now, let's elaborate. My friend asked me if going on a water diet for ten days was a good idea to lose weight (literally only drinking water for ten days). I said it wasn't, because we need food, obviously, secondly she would literally starve herself and she probably would end up binging (however, I guess I should use another term for this, since I just meant "eating a lot", not the binging you do when you have binge eating disorder or bulimia). Secondly, I told her that her digestive system would slow down and that he would probably gain back all of her weight rapidly. With fasting I also meant the time it would take for our digestive system to slow down. I talked her out of it, but I simply started wondering how eating a lot and not eating at all would affect her (and other people) in extreme conditions in terms of health . Honestly, eating disorders didn't even cross my mind.
I myself eat three healthy meals every day, basically eating whatever I want, keeping junkfood to a minimum, in case you're wondering.
Edit: I am so sorry if I offended anyone in any way. Should I delete this post? this is not how I wanted my question to come across.
Edit 2: I feel legitimately guilty right now.6 -
Ironandwine69 wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »This would be the strangest way I've heard IF described, if that's what the topic here is. IF wouldn't typically be considered binge/fast cycles.
OP, can you describe the context in which you are using the terms binge and fast? That would help get clearer answers.
We might have different views of what "binge" means. There's many days I have 1500-2000 calories meals( one meal a day). And I meet most of my macros. I don't have an ED.
I would imagine that can be considered binging by most people, no?
I wouldn't consider that in and of itself a binge. I think binging is more of a mindset related to feeling helpless and out of control while consuming large quantities of food. Whether that's 2000 calories or 5000 would be individual.2 -
Ignoring all the politically charged drama, fasting first will yield better results than fasting afterwards. TL;DR version is that this is due to hormonal signalling and glycogen storage. Eating a huge caloric excess in a fed state = most of the surplus calories will be stored as fat first. Eating a huge caloric excess in a glycogen depleted state = surplus calories will go to replenishing glycogen stores first. Look into alternate-day fasting (ADF) for support of this. This is also a principle used in cyclical ketogenic diets (CKD) which are often used by bodybuilders trying to hit low single-digit body fat. Very low calorie, very low carb diet for several days followed by a high calorie high carb refeed to restore performance and preserve muscle without adding fat.4
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Ironandwine69 wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »This would be the strangest way I've heard IF described, if that's what the topic here is. IF wouldn't typically be considered binge/fast cycles.
OP, can you describe the context in which you are using the terms binge and fast? That would help get clearer answers.
We might have different views of what "binge" means. There's many days I have 1500-2000 calories meals( one meal a day). And I meet most of my macros. I don't have an ED.
I would imagine that can be considered binging by most people, no?
Coming in late, but no, I wouldn't call that a binge unless it otherwise met the factors that I think make up a binge (the uncontrolled, compulsive stuff).2 -
BlackWhiteBlue wrote: »My friend asked me if going on a water diet for ten days was a good idea to lose weight (literally only drinking water for ten days). I said it wasn't, because we need food, obviously, secondly she would literally starve herself and she probably would end up binging (however, I guess I should use another term for this, since I just meant "eating a lot", not the binging you do when you have binge eating disorder or bulimia).
After a lengthy time fasting (like 10 days), there is genuinely a risk that ANYONE would have a binge in the really controlled sense, it would be a physical reaction. And it would be dangerous -- you would need to refeed in a slow, controlled manner after a fast like that.3
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