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Too smart to lose weight?
Replies
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I think the current culture of abundance we've created is a big part of it. Having options isn't necessarily a good thing. We are so overwhelmed with CHOICES, making the right choice often becomes exhausting (buying toothpaste, god help me). Saying the fad diets appeal to our emotion, while totally true, ignores something more primal in us. It wasn't so long ago that our culture and location defined what we ate, severely limiting our choices. You could live in Ukraine and eat Borscht every day and that was that. I don't think our brains and bodies have adapted to all these choices. We crave the "simple" so we lock onto Paleo or Keto or Whole360 or whatever, trying to go back to the lack of choice humans have lived with for most of humanity. It doesn't work, obviously, we live in a world of choice now. There is an abundance of food, of information, of stuff, and we have to flex our restraint and refocus muscles more than our ancestors ever imagined.
So true. I found I'm most successful when I limit my choices. Eating relatively the same lunch every day and rotate between several dinners. I struggle on the weekends when the "world is my oyster"
But I know some people can't stand to do that. My SO can't do that. If it were up to me, I'd probably eat the same thing day in day out.3 -
I don't remember a time I didn't know that weight gain was caused by eating too many calories. I never bought into any diet woo or fads. I have never looked for a quick fix. I've fully understood the mechanics of weight control for as long as I can remember.
Weight control is still hard. I think there are 2 basic reasons why it's hard for me.
1. Food and wine tastes good and I enjoy consuming both to excess.
2. I dislike not letting myself do things I enjoy.12 -
@kommodevaran I hear you. Your bed story reminded me of my own story. My husband bought me a new sewing machine for Christmas one year and it took me 6 years to learn how to use it because I told myself that I did not have the time or energy to learn how to use a new machine. Finally, I sat down and told myself that I was going to learn how to use the new machine and how long did it take me? One hour. Seriously. And the new machine was AWESOME!!! What does this tell me about myself? That until I really want to make a change, and commit to making it, I won't. Like most humans, I have to really become uncomfortable before I am willing to make a change.
The same is true of my weight loss journey. I have two degrees and work in healthcare - I know all about the importance of health, wellness and fitness (in theory). I know all about calories in and calories out but I told myself this just wouldn't work for me! I also told myself that exercising every day was too lofty a goal for myself. Other people could do it, but that was just too much for me. I had a lot of "stories" I told myself to justify my unwillingness to change what I knew was an unhealthy lifestyle. I just wasn't uncomfortable enough and ready to commit to make the change.
Enter MFP this January. I started tracking all my food and riding my stationary bike every evening while I read my book (instead of lying in bed). I set a goal of 30 mins daily and now I am up to 60 mins every day. And honestly, it has been EASY. I have a personal gym set up in my basement and a trainer who comes twice a week. I always had a healthy diet and already owned a food scale. I am pretty good with portion sizes - my biggest issue has been LACK OF CONSISTENCY, especially when it comes to daily exercise. Lo and behold, eating the way I usually eat, but adding in daily exercise has resulted in a loss of 8 pounds over the past six weeks.
Tracking food and exercise makes me feel in control of my weight loss. When I know that I am going to be going out for dinner, I make sure that I get my exercise in before I go, so that I have additional calories should I wish to spend some of them. This feels very doable to me. No more "stories" about why I can't succeed. A new story instead, about how when I commit to making a change, I can do anything.15 -
I used to work in academia and found that many "smart" people get bogged down in attempting to understand relatively meaningless issues such as "Why did this happen?" rather than actually taking action and doing something...anything that may mitigate risk.
I often bring up the Pareto Principle - focusing on the 20% of effort that drives 80% of the results. In this case CICO and calorie counting is that 20%. Pretty much all else is irrelevant for the majority of the population unless you are an elite level athlete.11 -
It's easy to get psyched out. Especially if you're on the third or so go-around. It's also easy to get psyched out by the non linear nature of it all.4
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True story:
"I don't have time to count calories, I'm just too busy. However, I'm going all in on this fad diet for a month where it restricts sugar, maple syrup, honey, agave nectar, coconut sugar, date syrup, stevia, Splenda, Equal, Nutrasweet, xylitol, alcohol, grains, including wheat, rye, barley, oats, corn, rice, millet, bulgur, sorghum, sprouted grains, and all gluten-free pseudo-cereals like quinoa, amaranth, buckwheat. wheat, corn, and rice, bran, germ, starch, legumes, including beans of all kinds (black, red, pinto, navy, white, kidney, lima, fava, peas, chickpeas, lentils, and peanuts, peanut butter, soy, including soy sauce, miso, tofu, tempeh, edamame, dairy, including milk, cream, cheese, kefir, yogurt, sour cream, ice cream, or frozen yogurt., and baked goods, junk foods, or treats."
Because that is easier to manage than logging food.19 -
I used to work in academia and found that many "smart" people get bogged down in attempting to understand relatively meaningless issues such as "Why did this happen?" rather than actually taking action and doing something...anything that may mitigate risk.
I often bring up the Pareto Principle - focusing on the 20% of effort that drives 80% of the results. In this case CICO and calorie counting is that 20%. Pretty much all else is irrelevant for the majority of the population unless you are an elite level athlete.
Brilliant!!! Reminds me of that person that would stand and monologue to me for an hour about how busy they were. After each day, I got better at cutting them off, 'cause I don't have time for that. My only thought was, "You'd have more time if you stopped talking for a minute!" We do tend to over-complicate things, and there are a lot of thinkers that have a hard time being doers.
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I used to work in academia and found that many "smart" people get bogged down in attempting to understand relatively meaningless issues such as "Why did this happen?" rather than actually taking action and doing something...anything that may mitigate risk.
I often bring up the Pareto Principle - focusing on the 20% of effort that drives 80% of the results. In this case CICO and calorie counting is that 20%. Pretty much all else is irrelevant for the majority of the population unless you are an elite level athlete.
I can't find the quote right now, but somebody (I believe it was Eric Helms) recently wrote a piece about striving for "optimal" - as in the optimal diet, workout routine, etc. He made a comment to the effect that doing something that's 60% optimal 90% of the time will get much better results than doing something that's 90% optimal 60% of the time.13 -
I agree with much of the above (that we've over-imagined the difficulty, hedonistic self-indulgence, more - good stuff).
I'd add two more that I didn't notice on a quick read:
1. Weight loss is something that, at the time we do it, is for the benefit of Future Us, while the unpleasantness is all Current Us. Humans s**k at that - deferred gratification, Stanford marshmallow experiment, blah blah blah. Same reason most of us don't save for retirement.
2. Math. Counting calories sounds like math, and in reality does require a little math. Worse yet, it's "story problems", which is the math most of us hated the very most all through school. People will go a long way out of their way to avoid math. Pills, wraps & potions are not only magically easy, they don't involve math (beyond the initial $$$).
Plus, once you spend those $$$ and take the pill/potion, you've officially tried "so hard" to lose weight, which pays your admission to the social bonding conversation about "how hard it is at our age" (or "when you have children" or "when your SO won't even try" or whatever) or "business dinners - ugh" or commiserating about how well it was going until "you were bad because sugar addiction", etc.
Also, I guess:
3. Tens of thousands of years of evolution is working against our intention to reduce nourishment and expend needless energy.
8 -
I used to work in academia and found that many "smart" people get bogged down in attempting to understand relatively meaningless issues such as "Why did this happen?" rather than actually taking action and doing something...anything that may mitigate risk.
I often bring up the Pareto Principle - focusing on the 20% of effort that drives 80% of the results. In this case CICO and calorie counting is that 20%. Pretty much all else is irrelevant for the majority of the population unless you are an elite level athlete.
I can't find the quote right now, but somebody (I believe it was Eric Helms) recently wrote a piece about striving for "optimal" - as in the optimal diet, workout routine, etc. He made a comment to the effect that doing something that's 60% optimal 90% of the time will get much better results than doing something that's 90% optimal 60% of the time.
This what you were looking for?
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I used to work in academia and found that many "smart" people get bogged down in attempting to understand relatively meaningless issues such as "Why did this happen?" rather than actually taking action and doing something...anything that may mitigate risk.
I often bring up the Pareto Principle - focusing on the 20% of effort that drives 80% of the results. In this case CICO and calorie counting is that 20%. Pretty much all else is irrelevant for the majority of the population unless you are an elite level athlete.
That's actually to be expressed as "Put 80% of your effort on your 20% worst problems. Then re-rank and re-sort and re-sume."0 -
Agree with those that it's simple - but not easy.
We have a society that circles around convenience and ease of getting what we want, and quickly. Amazon Prime anyone? (I'm a huge fan by the way LOL).
Losing weight by the CICO method isn't instant, it takes time, and it's not convenient. It means regular trips to the grocery store, actually paying attention to what and how you're cooking it (and cooking yourself more often to begin with), and noticing everything that goes into what you're eating.
We also have way too many people who subscribe to the idea that things aren't their own fault.
Fad diets, pills, and anything that gives quick results (even if short lived) fits into the "popular" way of thinking.
Actually putting in the work and stopping with the excuses? THAT'S the hard part.
Really, IMO, it boils down to one thing - PRIORITIES.
If something is important to us, we will make it happen. If not, we will come up with excuses. If someone is honest about their priorities, they won't complain about their weight while doing nothing about it.
Perfect example - this last summer, I was way to stressed trying to save my leg to worry about my eating, and with walking being a challenge, I wasn't motivated to work on the things I could at the gym. I knew this, I knew I could control my weight by watching my food - I didn't want to. So I didn't, and yes, I put on weight, but it was a choice at that time. I knew the truth, and admitted to myself that it wasn't enough of a priority.
Now it is, and now I'm slowly working on reversing the damage.
FAR too many Americans at least (can't speak to other countries) can't admit that it is THEIR choice, and won't admit that what their priorities really are.4 -
HoneyBadger155 wrote: »Agree with those that it's simple - but not easy.
We have a society that circles around convenience and ease of getting what we want, and quickly. Amazon Prime anyone? (I'm a huge fan by the way LOL).
Losing weight by the CICO method isn't instant, it takes time, and it's not convenient. It means regular trips to the grocery store, actually paying attention to what and how you're cooking it (and cooking yourself more often to begin with), and noticing everything that goes into what you're eating.
We also have way too many people who subscribe to the idea that things aren't their own fault.
Fad diets, pills, and anything that gives quick results (even if short lived) fits into the "popular" way of thinking.
Actually putting in the work and stopping with the excuses? THAT'S the hard part.
Really, IMO, it boils down to one thing - PRIORITIES.
If something is important to us, we will make it happen. If not, we will come up with excuses. If someone is honest about their priorities, they won't complain about their weight while doing nothing about it.
Perfect example - this last summer, I was way to stressed trying to save my leg to worry about my eating, and with walking being a challenge, I wasn't motivated to work on the things I could at the gym. I knew this, I knew I could control my weight by watching my food - I didn't want to. So I didn't, and yes, I put on weight, but it was a choice at that time. I knew the truth, and admitted to myself that it wasn't enough of a priority.
Now it is, and now I'm slowly working on reversing the damage.
FAR too many Americans at least (can't speak to other countries) can't admit that it is THEIR choice, and won't admit that what their priorities really are.
Nothing worth having is simple or easy. Anything given has no value. We have allowed a society of blame as opposed to a society of responsibility. Much easier to reject responsibility than it is to accept it, but this is a sure recipe for failure.
Anytime I hear "I don't have time" I point out that there are 168 hours in a week. Explain to me how you can't budget in 3 hours/week to exercise.4 -
kommodevaran wrote: »
I agree, but overcomplicating isn't making things easier? Lots of people put in enormous effort to stay on the most hopeless diet and exercise regimens. I did too. Eating food I like, just a little less, and walking, is easy, not just simple!quiksylver296 wrote: »It's simple, but not easy. People want easy.
It's not easy when its not what you want to do or accustomed to doing. Just saying.1 -
HoneyBadger155 wrote: »Agree with those that it's simple - but not easy.
We have a society that circles around convenience and ease of getting what we want, and quickly. Amazon Prime anyone? (I'm a huge fan by the way LOL).
Losing weight by the CICO method isn't instant, it takes time, and it's not convenient. It means regular trips to the grocery store, actually paying attention to what and how you're cooking it (and cooking yourself more often to begin with), and noticing everything that goes into what you're eating.
We also have way too many people who subscribe to the idea that things aren't their own fault.
Fad diets, pills, and anything that gives quick results (even if short lived) fits into the "popular" way of thinking.
Actually putting in the work and stopping with the excuses? THAT'S the hard part.
Really, IMO, it boils down to one thing - PRIORITIES.
If something is important to us, we will make it happen. If not, we will come up with excuses. If someone is honest about their priorities, they won't complain about their weight while doing nothing about it.
Perfect example - this last summer, I was way to stressed trying to save my leg to worry about my eating, and with walking being a challenge, I wasn't motivated to work on the things I could at the gym. I knew this, I knew I could control my weight by watching my food - I didn't want to. So I didn't, and yes, I put on weight, but it was a choice at that time. I knew the truth, and admitted to myself that it wasn't enough of a priority.
Now it is, and now I'm slowly working on reversing the damage.
FAR too many Americans at least (can't speak to other countries) can't admit that it is THEIR choice, and won't admit that what their priorities really are.
Nothing worth having is simple or easy. Anything given has no value. We have allowed a society of blame as opposed to a society of responsibility. Much easier to reject responsibility than it is to accept it, but this is a sure recipe for failure.
Anytime I hear "I don't have time" I point out that there are 168 hours in a week. Explain to me how you can't budget in 3 hours/week to exercise.
Just be sure you listen before you judge. Today's culture is all about the hardship Olympics; many of the people you talk to are in mindless competition, but not all. I wasn't very healthy when I worked 2 full-time jobs on opposite ends of town for minimum wage and had to pay out of pocket for all my healthcare/medical needs. Technically, I still had time to make healthy choices, but exhaustion got the better of me. Yeah, I had priorities, and medical expenses required me to work that much until I scored a better job. It was A LOT easier to get healthy once I got into a better situation.3 -
HoneyBadger155 wrote: »Agree with those that it's simple - but not easy.
We have a society that circles around convenience and ease of getting what we want, and quickly. Amazon Prime anyone? (I'm a huge fan by the way LOL).
Losing weight by the CICO method isn't instant, it takes time, and it's not convenient. It means regular trips to the grocery store, actually paying attention to what and how you're cooking it (and cooking yourself more often to begin with), and noticing everything that goes into what you're eating.
We also have way too many people who subscribe to the idea that things aren't their own fault.
Fad diets, pills, and anything that gives quick results (even if short lived) fits into the "popular" way of thinking.
Actually putting in the work and stopping with the excuses? THAT'S the hard part.
Really, IMO, it boils down to one thing - PRIORITIES.
If something is important to us, we will make it happen. If not, we will come up with excuses. If someone is honest about their priorities, they won't complain about their weight while doing nothing about it.
Perfect example - this last summer, I was way to stressed trying to save my leg to worry about my eating, and with walking being a challenge, I wasn't motivated to work on the things I could at the gym. I knew this, I knew I could control my weight by watching my food - I didn't want to. So I didn't, and yes, I put on weight, but it was a choice at that time. I knew the truth, and admitted to myself that it wasn't enough of a priority.
Now it is, and now I'm slowly working on reversing the damage.
FAR too many Americans at least (can't speak to other countries) can't admit that it is THEIR choice, and won't admit that what their priorities really are.
Nothing worth having is simple or easy. Anything given has no value. We have allowed a society of blame as opposed to a society of responsibility. Much easier to reject responsibility than it is to accept it, but this is a sure recipe for failure.
Anytime I hear "I don't have time" I point out that there are 168 hours in a week. Explain to me how you can't budget in 3 hours/week to exercise.
Just be sure you listen before you judge. Today's culture is all about the hardship Olympics; many of the people you talk to are in mindless competition, but not all. I wasn't very healthy when I worked 2 full-time jobs on opposite ends of town for minimum wage and had to pay out of pocket for all my healthcare/medical needs. Technically, I still had time to make healthy choices, but exhaustion got the better of me. Yeah, I had priorities, and medical expenses required me to work that much until I scored a better job. It was A LOT easier to get healthy once I got into a better situation.
No judgement involved - just using data to prove or disprove a point. This is how growth occurs.1 -
But how do we know what we want, when we don't know what it's like? My current habits were very easy once I started. I also had more energy once I started to eat better and stopped hunting for and hiding candy. But I didn't know that. Things I enjoy now, snd do effortlessly - for instance, eating regularly, cooking from scratch, planning meals, freezing and thawing, using a food scale, cutting up melons and pineapples - seemed crazy, outdated, too much work, pointless! I was so against it, I actually remember thinking, "I'd rather be fat!".STLBADGIRL wrote: »kommodevaran wrote: »
I agree, but overcomplicating isn't making things easier? Lots of people put in enormous effort to stay on the most hopeless diet and exercise regimens. I did too. Eating food I like, just a little less, and walking, is easy, not just simple!quiksylver296 wrote: »It's simple, but not easy. People want easy.
It's not easy when its not what you want to do or accustomed to doing. Just saying.5 -
STLBADGIRL wrote: »kommodevaran wrote: »
I agree, but overcomplicating isn't making things easier? Lots of people put in enormous effort to stay on the most hopeless diet and exercise regimens. I did too. Eating food I like, just a little less, and walking, is easy, not just simple!quiksylver296 wrote: »It's simple, but not easy. People want easy.
It's not easy when its not what you want to do or accustomed to doing. Just saying.
But almost all high-payoff personal growth is like that. Yet after I make one uncomfortable major change for the better, future ones become easier. Life improvement accelerates, potentially.
I suspect - based on personal stories I've read here - that for some, successful weight loss turns out to be a "gateway drug" leading to other significant life improvements.
(It was not that for me. Becoming an athlete in my 40s kind of was, and one of the things it led to - 10+ years later - was weight loss).
Edit: wrong verb form3 -
STLBADGIRL wrote: »kommodevaran wrote: »
I agree, but overcomplicating isn't making things easier? Lots of people put in enormous effort to stay on the most hopeless diet and exercise regimens. I did too. Eating food I like, just a little less, and walking, is easy, not just simple!quiksylver296 wrote: »It's simple, but not easy. People want easy.
It's not easy when its not what you want to do or accustomed to doing. Just saying.
I don't think anyone here is saying it's easy. I think a lot of people are, or maybe just me, are saying we over-complicate a simple process. Simple =/= easy.
I imagine being in a situation where you had no other choice to lose weight, be it medical reasons - what have you, would be an entirely other beast added to the forest. But it boils down to emotional/mental (not including health/medical conditions/etc).
Have you ever tried learning a new language? It's hard. It's frustrating, it takes a lot of effort. I'm not use to learning another language, or anything with that amount of content. It's easier to not learn it, obviously. (Trying to learn Spanish... it's challenging)
If you've never experienced losing weight, you've never read any articles/studies, literally have had no exposure to it - its' going to be a massive undertaking to gain the knowledge you need to be successful.0 -
kommodevaran wrote: »
But how do we know what we want, when we don't know what it's like? My current habits were very easy once I started. I also had more energy once I started to eat better and stopped hunting for and hiding candy. But I didn't know that. Things I enjoy now, snd do effortlessly - for instance, eating regularly, cooking from scratch, planning meals, freezing and thawing, using a food scale, cutting up melons and pineapples - seemed crazy, outdated, too much work, pointless! I was so against it, I actually remember thinking, "I'd rather be fat!".STLBADGIRL wrote: »kommodevaran wrote: »
I agree, but overcomplicating isn't making things easier? Lots of people put in enormous effort to stay on the most hopeless diet and exercise regimens. I did too. Eating food I like, just a little less, and walking, is easy, not just simple!quiksylver296 wrote: »It's simple, but not easy. People want easy.
It's not easy when its not what you want to do or accustomed to doing. Just saying.
We are our own worst enemy...
Every now and then, when I go over my calorie goals to have an extra slice of pizza or cake, that I didn't really need b/c I'm already full - while I don't punish myself the next day... I always regret it. In that moment, my brain is like "dude - focus on the future, stop with this instant gratification crap" It's hard to look at a year from now. It takes a conscious effort in the moment to override your need for instant gratification.6
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