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Starting Lyle McDonald's Ultimatte Diet 2.0 question

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  • heybalesheybales Member Posts: 19,297 Member Member Posts: 19,297 Member
    The RFL Category 3 start at 26% + and 35% + male & female respectively - so not meant for just lean at all.
    Cat 2 is still 16-25% and 25-35% respectively.
    Cat 1 is the lowest range below those.

    And really, if the 5:2 diet plan works well in studies because of 5 days eating at maintenance letting body reset, then only doing 10-14 days of extreme RFL as suggested and perhaps 2-3 weeks maintenance might not be bad method either if you just don't want to eat so subnormal for so long.
  • psuLemonpsuLemon Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1RSie9shE4iuxWQHZbCWd3LulEbTJg4YHKyo6N_xyU0U/edit?usp=sharing

    Thought I would share this, but this is the workout that I currently designed and follow while doing UD2. Glycogen depletion sucks! Especially leg days.
  • heybalesheybales Member Posts: 19,297 Member Member Posts: 19,297 Member
    I find it so weird and wild that while 4 days on the RFL since last refeed meal, the day of the next one, I can do an evening lower body lifting routine at working weight (not really making progress, no surprise there) and feel the difficulty barely, though only protein shake for breakfast, and then go do a 2 hr bike ride at good intensity and barely start having problems at the end.

    I need to do one of the glycodep routines to see what that would cause different. I'd consider that long of a ride at good intensity to cause it - but that's what I find so strange I'm not totally dead in the legs.
    Then again RFL doesn't suggest such a routine.

    How many days on the high protein are you then doing the lifting to feel those effects?
  • psuLemonpsuLemon Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator
    heybales wrote: »
    I find it so weird and wild that while 4 days on the RFL since last refeed meal, the day of the next one, I can do an evening lower body lifting routine at working weight (not really making progress, no surprise there) and feel the difficulty barely, though only protein shake for breakfast, and then go do a 2 hr bike ride at good intensity and barely start having problems at the end.

    I need to do one of the glycodep routines to see what that would cause different. I'd consider that long of a ride at good intensity to cause it - but that's what I find so strange I'm not totally dead in the legs.
    Then again RFL doesn't suggest such a routine.

    How many days on the high protein are you then doing the lifting to feel those effects?

    Is thia directed at me?
  • heybalesheybales Member Posts: 19,297 Member Member Posts: 19,297 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    I find it so weird and wild that while 4 days on the RFL since last refeed meal, the day of the next one, I can do an evening lower body lifting routine at working weight (not really making progress, no surprise there) and feel the difficulty barely, though only protein shake for breakfast, and then go do a 2 hr bike ride at good intensity and barely start having problems at the end.

    I need to do one of the glycodep routines to see what that would cause different. I'd consider that long of a ride at good intensity to cause it - but that's what I find so strange I'm not totally dead in the legs.
    Then again RFL doesn't suggest such a routine.

    How many days on the high protein are you then doing the lifting to feel those effects?

    Is thia directed at me?

    Sorry yes, after looking at that workout sheet and your comments about leg day.
  • psuLemonpsuLemon Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator
    heybales wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    I find it so weird and wild that while 4 days on the RFL since last refeed meal, the day of the next one, I can do an evening lower body lifting routine at working weight (not really making progress, no surprise there) and feel the difficulty barely, though only protein shake for breakfast, and then go do a 2 hr bike ride at good intensity and barely start having problems at the end.

    I need to do one of the glycodep routines to see what that would cause different. I'd consider that long of a ride at good intensity to cause it - but that's what I find so strange I'm not totally dead in the legs.
    Then again RFL doesn't suggest such a routine.

    How many days on the high protein are you then doing the lifting to feel those effects?

    Is thia directed at me?

    Sorry yes, after looking at that workout sheet and your comments about leg day.

    So my refeeds start Thursday night into Friday (~400-500g of carbs). Saturday is a fairly normal day of eating (I eat high carb (~300g) with high protein (~175g)) and around maintenance or just below. Sunday, I start to transition to low carb. Monday is keto and my first glycogen depletion workout, tuesday is my second glycogen depletion workout + keto. Wednesday is rest with keto and thurdsday morning/afternoon is very low carb and then refeed at dinner. I often play tennis before my workout too. My keto days are 1500-1700 calories, maintenance days 2800-3000, and refeeds generally end up around 3500.


    But by the time I hit leg day, it can get fairly brutal. Combine a few days on low carb + low calories + 60 second rest periods between sets, it makes for a lot of volume with little rest.
  • LiftHeavyThings27105LiftHeavyThings27105 Member Posts: 2,104 Member Member Posts: 2,104 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    I find it so weird and wild that while 4 days on the RFL since last refeed meal, the day of the next one, I can do an evening lower body lifting routine at working weight (not really making progress, no surprise there) and feel the difficulty barely, though only protein shake for breakfast, and then go do a 2 hr bike ride at good intensity and barely start having problems at the end.

    I need to do one of the glycodep routines to see what that would cause different. I'd consider that long of a ride at good intensity to cause it - but that's what I find so strange I'm not totally dead in the legs.
    Then again RFL doesn't suggest such a routine.

    How many days on the high protein are you then doing the lifting to feel those effects?

    Is thia directed at me?

    Sorry yes, after looking at that workout sheet and your comments about leg day.

    So my refeeds start Thursday night into Friday (~400-500g of carbs). Saturday is a fairly normal day of eating (I eat high carb (~300g) with high protein (~175g)) and around maintenance or just below. Sunday, I start to transition to low carb. Monday is keto and my first glycogen depletion workout, tuesday is my second glycogen depletion workout + keto. Wednesday is rest with keto and thurdsday morning/afternoon is very low carb and then refeed at dinner. I often play tennis before my workout too. My keto days are 1500-1700 calories, maintenance days 2800-3000, and refeeds generally end up around 3500.


    But by the time I hit leg day, it can get fairly brutal. Combine a few days on low carb + low calories + 60 second rest periods between sets, it makes for a lot of volume with little rest.

    Now, that sounds like my kinda party! Where do I sign up for that? Oh, crapolla! I can't! Seriously, though....that does sound like my kinda party. When (not "if") I beat this high A1C and insulin resistance, I am gonna do this. Was seriously looking forward to it....I am "off".....so, this is kinda my thing!
  • annaskiskiannaskiski Member Posts: 1,212 Member Member Posts: 1,212 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    I find it so weird and wild that while 4 days on the RFL since last refeed meal, the day of the next one, I can do an evening lower body lifting routine at working weight (not really making progress, no surprise there) and feel the difficulty barely, though only protein shake for breakfast, and then go do a 2 hr bike ride at good intensity and barely start having problems at the end.

    I need to do one of the glycodep routines to see what that would cause different. I'd consider that long of a ride at good intensity to cause it - but that's what I find so strange I'm not totally dead in the legs.
    Then again RFL doesn't suggest such a routine.

    How many days on the high protein are you then doing the lifting to feel those effects?

    Is thia directed at me?

    Sorry yes, after looking at that workout sheet and your comments about leg day.

    So my refeeds start Thursday night into Friday (~400-500g of carbs). Saturday is a fairly normal day of eating (I eat high carb (~300g) with high protein (~175g)) and around maintenance or just below. Sunday, I start to transition to low carb. Monday is keto and my first glycogen depletion workout, tuesday is my second glycogen depletion workout + keto. Wednesday is rest with keto and thurdsday morning/afternoon is very low carb and then refeed at dinner. I often play tennis before my workout too. My keto days are 1500-1700 calories, maintenance days 2800-3000, and refeeds generally end up around 3500.


    But by the time I hit leg day, it can get fairly brutal. Combine a few days on low carb + low calories + 60 second rest periods between sets, it makes for a lot of volume with little rest.

    @psuLemon What results have you gotten so far? fat/weight loss? Can you give us a summary?
  • psuLemonpsuLemon Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator
    annaskiski wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    I find it so weird and wild that while 4 days on the RFL since last refeed meal, the day of the next one, I can do an evening lower body lifting routine at working weight (not really making progress, no surprise there) and feel the difficulty barely, though only protein shake for breakfast, and then go do a 2 hr bike ride at good intensity and barely start having problems at the end.

    I need to do one of the glycodep routines to see what that would cause different. I'd consider that long of a ride at good intensity to cause it - but that's what I find so strange I'm not totally dead in the legs.
    Then again RFL doesn't suggest such a routine.

    How many days on the high protein are you then doing the lifting to feel those effects?

    Is thia directed at me?

    Sorry yes, after looking at that workout sheet and your comments about leg day.

    So my refeeds start Thursday night into Friday (~400-500g of carbs). Saturday is a fairly normal day of eating (I eat high carb (~300g) with high protein (~175g)) and around maintenance or just below. Sunday, I start to transition to low carb. Monday is keto and my first glycogen depletion workout, tuesday is my second glycogen depletion workout + keto. Wednesday is rest with keto and thurdsday morning/afternoon is very low carb and then refeed at dinner. I often play tennis before my workout too. My keto days are 1500-1700 calories, maintenance days 2800-3000, and refeeds generally end up around 3500.


    But by the time I hit leg day, it can get fairly brutal. Combine a few days on low carb + low calories + 60 second rest periods between sets, it makes for a lot of volume with little rest.

    @psuLemon What results have you gotten so far? fat/weight loss? Can you give us a summary?

    This is my first dedicated week. I had a few trial weeks, but traveling overseas, my birthday and parties fell in there.

    Starting weight on Sunday was 182.5
  • annaskiskiannaskiski Member Posts: 1,212 Member Member Posts: 1,212 Member
    Any updates?
  • annaskiskiannaskiski Member Posts: 1,212 Member Member Posts: 1,212 Member
    @psuLemon @LiftHeavyThings27105

    Are you guys still doing this?
  • jseams1234jseams1234 Member Posts: 1,201 Member Member Posts: 1,201 Member
    annaskiski wrote: »
    @psuLemon @LiftHeavyThings27105

    Are you guys still doing this?

    @LiftHeavyThings27105 vanished without a trace mid August. I'm curious too - such a "prolific" poster and so enthusiastic to try RFL.... it's a pretty aggressive protocol and I was curious to see if he could handle it. I'm not sure what happened to him. Lemon's been posting periodic updates in the "Anybody cutting after a bulk?" thread.
  • annaskiskiannaskiski Member Posts: 1,212 Member Member Posts: 1,212 Member
    Thanks!! I'll check out Lemon's thread..
  • psuLemonpsuLemon Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator
    annaskiski wrote: »
    @psuLemon @LiftHeavyThings27105

    Are you guys still doing this?

    I ended up stopping. I had too much going on and it became a bit inconvenient. I may try to start again over the winter.
  • annaskiskiannaskiski Member Posts: 1,212 Member Member Posts: 1,212 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    annaskiski wrote: »
    @psuLemon @LiftHeavyThings27105

    Are you guys still doing this?

    I ended up stopping. I had too much going on and it became a bit inconvenient. I may try to start again over the winter.

    Thanks for the update!
    It does look like a tough plan....
  • psuLemonpsuLemon Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,761 MFP Moderator
    annaskiski wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    annaskiski wrote: »
    @psuLemon @LiftHeavyThings27105

    Are you guys still doing this?

    I ended up stopping. I had too much going on and it became a bit inconvenient. I may try to start again over the winter.

    Thanks for the update!
    It does look like a tough plan....

    The pattern wasn't too bad. I did get w bit sick of the low carb days, but i had a bunch of events that interfered.
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