Thoughts on Intermittent Fasting with Low Carb eating

deannalfisher

maureenkhilde wrote: »

Oh there is a bias no doubt about that.

I 100% agree how weight comes off is based on CICO, that is a true statement.

But what is also truth, is what each person does to achieve that. And this is where the road totally forks.

What I mean is many people successfully lose weight by counting calories and nothing else.

Others count macros, meaning how many carbs, fats and proteins they can have that will total their allotment of calories. Some do total carbs, some do net carbs. Some low carb, keto also count calories, some do not.

Others do volume eating,

Some follow some type of Intermittment fasting plan

And there are countless other plans that can be followed as well.

But each person should research, try and adjut to what makes them feel satisfied and what works for them.

I have seen incredibly cruel, mean, condensending comments on threads when people bring up Keto. I have seen where people are specifically asking for friends or advice, and instead they get paragraphs telling them they are wrong. That by the way is not helpful.
Example someone was asking how to get in the low carber forum group the other day. A response was well unless you take a pledge to give up sugar for life they will not let you join. Really?
Dr's are telling patients to go on low carb diets. Why? Because they want their patients to eat a healthier diet along with the lower calories. I think at times that is being overlooked with the CICO.

dr's who often have limited nutritional training are telling people to go on low carb diets because its a quick win/keto fad - very few dieticians will tell you do to Keto unless you have a medical necessitity to do it - i had a doctor tell me that running more than 3 times a week was bad for me, so they don't know everything

WayneG3

Well, now that we've set the table, let's eat Here's references for the information requested...

Topic #1 There's no bad foods that're unhealthy for you. (I still can't believe you think this but okay)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2805706/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0278691517301709
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4772793/
https://nutritionj.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1475-2891-13-61
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3103571/

Topic #2 Benefits of Keto.

Gibson AA, Seimon RV, Lee CM, Ayre J, Franklin J, Markovic TP, Caterson ID, Sainsbury A. Do ketogenic diets really suppress appetite? A systematic review and meta‐analysis. Obes Rev. 2015 Jan
Bueno NB, de Melo IS, de Oliveira SL, da Rocha Ataide T. Very-low-carbohydrate ketogenic diet v. low-fat diet for long-term weight loss: a meta-analysis of randomised controlled trials. Br J Nutr. 2013 Oct
Sumithran P, Prendergast LA, Delbridge E, Purcell K, Shulkes A, Kriketos A, Proietto J. Ketosis and appetite-mediating nutrients and hormones after weight loss. Eur J Clin Nutr. 2013 Jul
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2716748/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6719224/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6720297/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1334192/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4112040/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2213231714000925?via=ihub


Topic #3 Benefits of IF.

https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/full/10.1146/annurev-nutr-071816-064634?url_ver=Z39.88-2003&rfr_id=ori:rid:crossref.org&rfr_dat=cr_pub=pubmed
Huffman KM, Redman LM, Landerman LR, Pieper CF, Stevens RD, Muehlbauer MJ, Wenner BR, Bain JR, Kraus VB, Newgard CB, et al. Caloric restriction alters the metabolic response to a mixed-meal: results from a randomized, controlled trial.
Varady KA, Bhutani S, Klempel MC, Kroeger CM, Trepanowski JF, Haus JM, Hoddy KK, Calvo Y. Alternate day fasting for weight loss in normal weight and overweight subjects: a randomized controlled trial.
Teng NI, Shahar S, Rajab NF, Manaf ZA, Johari MH, Ngah WZW. Improvement of metabolic parameters in healthy older adult men following a fasting calorie restriction intervention.
Hussin NM, Shahar S, Teng NIMF, Ngah WZW, Das SK. Efficacy of fasting and calorie restriction (FCR) on mood and depression among ageing men
Horne BD, May HT, Anderson JL, Kfoury AG, Bailey BM, McClure BS, Renlund DG, Lappé DL, Carlquist JF, Fisher PW, et al. ; Intermountain Heart Collaborative Study. Usefulness of routine periodic fasting to lower risk of coronary artery disease among patients undergoing coronary angiography.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4899145/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2815756/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4516560/

There's much, much more information I can give you. I think this is enough to start
[edited by MFP mods]

NovusDies

I am done for the night so I only looked over the food links. I admit that for now I have only skimmed them. They seem credible but I don't see anything that says a single meal will cause an adverse physical reaction in someone. I also don't see anything that says that in moderation that any food is a problem.

If I missed your proof I will be glad to revisit it tomorrow. That is assuming you wish to actually make an on-topic reply instead of just attacking my post.

mmapags

NovusDies wrote: »

I am done for the night so I only looked over the food links. I admit that for now I have only skimmed them. They seem credible but I don't see anything that says a single meal will cause an adverse physical reaction in someone. I also don't see anything that says that in moderation that any food is a problem.

If I missed your proof I will be glad to revisit it tomorrow. That is assuming you wish to actually make an on-topic reply instead of just attacking my post.

After opening and skimming all the links, the TL/DNR version is:
Topic 1 Unhealthy Foods
If we eat a diet of primarily low nutrient foods it's bad for our health. Big revelation there. (sarcasm intended) No discussion of context and dose.

Topic 2 Keto Diets
They suppress hunger in some people and help them to lose weight. They are beneficial for some neurological diseases like epilepsy. They help with reducing insulin concentrations and seem to correlate with improved insulin sensitivity. Again, no surprise nor was anyone disputing that keto is a valid dietary modality for some.

Topic 3 IF Benefit
The usual collection of mice studies, small count human studies and the same meta analysis that has been posted multiple times here, including by me, that shows no conclusive evidence of any benefit beyond calorie control and possible increased insulin sensitivity. It does call for more and higher quality research. As I and others who are long term practitioners of IF have repeated stated on this forum, it would be great if some benefits get proven in future studies. But, as of now, that is not the case.

It appears this poster is no longer around but these links are just a rehash of the same old same old with little to no new info.

OP, if you feel like keto can benefit you in controlling calories and eating habits, do it by all means. If IF helps you to stay within calorie goals and helps with hunger signalling for you, by all means. If combining them is the key for you, great.

But there are many people who have lost a lot of weight/ body fat without having to be so extreme in their approach. I tend to eat a high protein, lower carb (100 to 150gr/day) diet and eat 2x per day. I've lost close to 40 lbs this way and don't struggle with hunger. Don't get caught up in all the trendy hype. Explore different methods and find what works best for you to maximize satiety and dietary compliance. Different things work for different people, as the postings in this thread indicate. There is no universal solution that applies to everyone except for a calorie deficit to lose weight.

vukotamick

Andrea7701 wrote: »

Just asking for thoughts and feedback on this. Have been hearing a lot more about intermittent fasting lately. I have never been able to follow a low carb diet so I do have concerns about that. Thanks.

There is a great Joe Rogan Podcast with Dr. Rhonda Patrick #1178 that may help your journey.