Runner with a serious sugar addiction

WendyTerry420

Both nicotine and cocaine are addictive and have associated physical withdrawal syndromes.

Well I never vomited or had diarrhea when withdrawing from either.

Yet I did both when coming off SSRIs.

Those were two examples of physical symptoms. They are by all means NOT an exhaustive list. :laugh:

You said "i.e. vomiting, diarrhea" so I'm guessing it's that you don't understand the difference between i.e. and e.g. To clarify, what you actually said is that vomiting and diarrhea occur on withdrawal from all addictive substances. I'm guessing by your subsequent response that you didn't mean to say this.

I believe she did correct herself quickly.

I don't think vomiting and diarrhea occur on withdrawal from all addictive substances; why would you think that? Nicotine withdrawal doesn't have that. Caffeine withdrawal doesn't have that. (necessarily)

And in the sense that your brain/body develop a physical dependence on SSRIs, I suppose you could call that an addiction, but if so, it's one I'm glad to be a practicing addict of, because my personality was straight up broken before and this high-functioning addict is much better than when I wasn't using.

:flowerforyou: Yes, for many, SSRIs are good therapy!

KombuchaCat

I knew you would be trolling this thread...once again I am not talking about limiting anything but fructose...glucose, lactose, no limiting. You need sugar to live and your brain runs best on glucose. I am talking about reducing the fructose. BTW I opened my diary so if you want to take a peek you can have a look. I looked at yours, you are basically just keeping fast food and supplement companies in business. If your diet was so perfect you wouldn't have to supplement it with protein powders.

Firstly, I don't see using protein supplements as somehow a failure. My diary's open too, so you can see that I shoot for 180 grams of protein every day because I am a strength athlete. Supplements help me achieve that while remaining in a reasonable calorie limit; it would be very, very difficult to achieve that otherwise (oh, I suppose I could start bringing a chicken breast to the gym with me for my post-workout, but I don't want to, frankly.).

Secondly, I don't see what business it is of yours if he chooses to eat a lot of fast food and/or supplements.

Finally, who said his diet was perfect? Why is that even a goal? I don't even think that statement has any truthful meaning. There's too much value judgment wrapped up in that to be healthy for my mindset. My diary is open precisely because I need to be OK with the world knowing that sometimes I eat 4000+ plus calories in one day and that nobody but me cares if I have sweet potato fries five days in a row. The daily reminder that nobody cares but me makes me feel freer to own my choices free of value judgment.

Admittedly I'm bringing some baggage from another thread where I had a run in with this poster and was pretty blatently insulted. I'm letting it go, I swear :flowerforyou:
I do not think that anyone needs to be perfect with what they eat. I'm certainly not perfect. We do the best we can in our busy lives. I'm not against using protein powder...I put hemp protein in my green smoothie this morning. However I think ideally nutrition is best received from whole foods or foods as minimally processed as possible. I'm not suggesting that anyone who does lots of strength training start drinking chicken smoothies after they work out. However I also do not think that striving to eat quality whole food is a bad thing.

likitisplit

I knew you would be trolling this thread...once again I am not talking about limiting anything but fructose...glucose, lactose, no limiting. You need sugar to live and your brain runs best on glucose. I am talking about reducing the fructose. BTW I opened my diary so if you want to take a peek you can have a look. I looked at yours, you are basically just keeping fast food and supplement companies in business. If your diet was so perfect you wouldn't have to supplement it with protein powders.

Firstly, I don't see using protein supplements as somehow a failure. My diary's open too, so you can see that I shoot for 180 grams of protein every day because I am a strength athlete. Supplements help me achieve that while remaining in a reasonable calorie limit; it would be very, very difficult to achieve that otherwise (oh, I suppose I could start bringing a chicken breast to the gym with me for my post-workout, but I don't want to, frankly.).

Secondly, I don't see what business it is of yours if he chooses to eat a lot of fast food and/or supplements.

Finally, who said his diet was perfect? Why is that even a goal? I don't even think that statement has any truthful meaning. There's too much value judgment wrapped up in that to be healthy for my mindset. My diary is open precisely because I need to be OK with the world knowing that sometimes I eat 4000+ plus calories in one day and that nobody but me cares if I have sweet potato fries five days in a row. The daily reminder that nobody cares but me makes me feel freer to own my choices free of value judgment.

I care that you eat sweet potato fries five days in a row: I think it's awesome. And knowing that somebody I admire is able to make a variety of choices in a variety of situations allows me to escape the trap of yogurt and rice cakes.

Do you mean me? :blushing: You're making me feel weird inside! :laugh:

You. Pick. Up. Rocks. How awesome is that!?!

WendyTerry420

I totally understand what you are going through. I am also a runner addicted to chocolate. Many people here have said that it isn't an addiction but if you haven't been there its difficult to understand.

To this, I could respond, if you haven't suffered from both an addiction and a behavioral disorder, then you can't understand the distinction between the two.

To this I could respond, if you aren't the person in question, then you just can't understand what they are going through. I've noticed that most people who have struggled with compulsions and/or addictions and who have worked to overcome them go either one of two ways - they are either very sympathetic and empathetic or very unforgiving of the person who still struggles. Your posts seem to indicate that you have no sympathy for someone who can't overcome their issues as you have or are doing. The whole post you made about not blaming inanimate objects first made met think this and this post does the same.

Every person is unique. Some people have experiences that make them similar, yet some people can have the same experiences and be completely different. No one is right or wrong. Have you ever heard the saying that your perception is your reality? No matter whether you think a person who is dealing with a compulsion or addiction is right or wrong, their perception will be what is real to them. You can try to educate a person and help them change their perceptions, but just telling them they are wrong or don't know anything does nothing to help the situation. Many people who truly struggle with compulsions and/or addictions don't want to struggle - I would gladly give up my compulsions to have a healthy relationship with food. Do I say that it's impossible to do because I've failed more times than I can count? No. Do I blame my weight on my compulsions? Yes. It's not an excuse, it's my reality. Do I want to feel helpless to the fact that even though I know what my problem is and I know the solution to it, I just can't seem to do that? No.

I don't disagree that the word addiction is thrown around way too much - the same with the word binge. I've seen posts and heard people talk about being addicted or binging and think "you have no idea". Then, I realize that just because I don't think they did these things doesn't mean that that isn't their reality.

I have sympathy for people who are trying to regain control of their life. I don't have sympathy for those who just make excuses and refuse to accept responsibility for their own actions.

There's a line in a Kid Rock song "...all the heroes at the methadone clinic..." that I find appropriate here. Everyone makes mistakes and bad choices in life. I respect people for accepting responsibility, but I can not respect anyone who would blame an inanimate object for their own poor choices.

jonnythan

Sugar is in almost everything processed including savory foods so it's a challenge to get it totally out of your system.

You can't get sugar totally out of your system. The human body manufactures sugar. It has a number of highly complex, sensitive systems in place to maintain sugar levels in the blood. If you got sugar totally out of your system, you would die instantly because your cells would starve.

I knew you would be trolling this thread...once again I am not talking about limiting anything but fructose...glucose, lactose, no limiting. You need sugar to live and your brain runs best on glucose. I am talking about reducing the fructose. BTW I opened my diary so if you want to take a peek you can have a look. I looked at yours, you are basically just keeping fast food and supplement companies in business. If your diet was so perfect you wouldn't have to supplement it with protein powders.

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

KombuchaCat

Sugar is in almost everything processed including savory foods so it's a challenge to get it totally out of your system.

You can't get sugar totally out of your system. The human body manufactures sugar. It has a number of highly complex, sensitive systems in place to maintain sugar levels in the blood. If you got sugar totally out of your system, you would die instantly because your cells would starve.

I knew you would be trolling this thread...once again I am not talking about limiting anything but fructose...glucose, lactose, no limiting. You need sugar to live and your brain runs best on glucose. I am talking about reducing the fructose. BTW I opened my diary so if you want to take a peek you can have a look. I looked at yours, you are basically just keeping fast food and supplement companies in business. If your diet was so perfect you wouldn't have to supplement it with protein powders.

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

There is a different between the words eliminating and limiting. Edited for snark factor.

jonnythan

Sugar is in almost everything processed including savory foods so it's a challenge to get it totally out of your system.

You can't get sugar totally out of your system. The human body manufactures sugar. It has a number of highly complex, sensitive systems in place to maintain sugar levels in the blood. If you got sugar totally out of your system, you would die instantly because your cells would starve.

I knew you would be trolling this thread...once again I am not talking about limiting anything but fructose...glucose, lactose, no limiting. You need sugar to live and your brain runs best on glucose. I am talking about reducing the fructose. BTW I opened my diary so if you want to take a peek you can have a look. I looked at yours, you are basically just keeping fast food and supplement companies in business. If your diet was so perfect you wouldn't have to supplement it with protein powders.

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

There is a different between the words eliminating and limiting. Edited for snark factor.

So can you be clear? What were you referring to getting "totally out of your system" in the quote?

"Sugar is in almost everything processed including savory foods so it's a challenge to get it totally out of your system."

tennisdude2004

Sugar is in almost everything processed including savory foods so it's a challenge to get it totally out of your system.

You can't get sugar totally out of your system. The human body manufactures sugar. It has a number of highly complex, sensitive systems in place to maintain sugar levels in the blood. If you got sugar totally out of your system, you would die instantly because your cells would starve.

I knew you would be trolling this thread...once again I am not talking about limiting anything but fructose...glucose, lactose, no limiting. You need sugar to live and your brain runs best on glucose. I am talking about reducing the fructose. BTW I opened my diary so if you want to take a peek you can have a look. I looked at yours, you are basically just keeping fast food and supplement companies in business. If your diet was so perfect you wouldn't have to supplement it with protein powders.

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

There is a different between the words eliminating and limiting. Edited for snark factor.

Not when it comes to certain members on MFP!

I was going to confess to only having half a spoon of sugar in my coffee, but I haven't worked up the courage yet.

parkscs

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

Did I miss where she's a resistance trained athlete? Not to mention, reduced protein intake doesn't cause lean mass loss instead of fat loss; it just leads to lean mass loss in addition to fat loss. For someone not doing resistance training, 0.6g/lb of LBM is adequate protein. Triple her protein intake... you really think she needs to be eating 200g of protein a day? What kind of advice is that?

Edit: Typo

jonnythan

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

Did I miss where she's a resistance trained athlete? Not to mention, reduced protein intake doesn't cause lean mass loss instead of fat loss; it just leads to lean mass loss in addition to fat loss. For someone not doing resistance training, 0.6g/lb of LBM is adequate protein. Triple her protein intake... you really think she needs to be eating 200g of protein a day? What kind of advice is that?

Edit: Typo

Yes. She is in a calorie deficit and does light resistance training, according to her profile.

I looked at a few random days of her diary and she appeared to be getting around 50g/day. So maybe tripling protein isn't necessary, more like doubling. I was thinking on the order of 130-150g a day, depending. But then again she didn't ask for advice. I was just throwing that out there because she felt the need to criticize my diary.

Fullsterkur_woman

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

Did I miss where she's a resistance trained athlete? Not to mention, reduced protein intake doesn't cause lean mass loss instead of fat loss; it just leads to lean mass loss in addition to fat loss. For someone not doing resistance training, 0.6g/lb of LBM is adequate protein. Triple her protein intake... you really think she needs to be eating 200g of protein a day? What kind of advice is that?

Edit: Typo

Based on her average protein intake over the last month, I think double would just about cover it. It's possible that sampling error led to the "triple" number.

KombuchaCat

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

Did I miss where she's a resistance trained athlete? Not to mention, reduced protein intake doesn't cause lean mass loss instead of fat loss; it just leads to lean mass loss in addition to fat loss. For someone not doing resistance training, 0.6g/lb of LBM is adequate protein. Triple her protein intake... you really think she needs to be eating 200g of protein a day? What kind of advice is that?

Edit: Typo

I'm not a resistance athlete and I'm not worried about protein. I hit my macro for this most days just fine. Some days I'm a little over or under on protein.

Fullsterkur_woman

Admittedly I'm bringing some baggage from another thread where I had a run in with this poster and was pretty blatently insulted. I'm letting it go, I swear :flowerforyou:

I'm really pleased to hear it. Also, your kitty's face is sweet. I have a picture in my profile of my girl on my shoulder, and her face was black where yours is grey.

I like whole foods too. They didn't call me the Spinach Assassin for nothing.

KombuchaCat

Admittedly I'm bringing some baggage from another thread where I had a run in with this poster and was pretty blatently insulted. I'm letting it go, I swear :flowerforyou:

I'm really pleased to hear it. Also, your kitty's face is sweet. I have a picture in my profile of my girl on my shoulder, and her face was black where yours is grey.

I like whole foods too. They didn't call me the Spinach Assassin for nothing.

Awe, thanks! Unfortunately he passed away earlier this year. Wow, I aspire for a nickname like the Spinach Assassin!

Fullsterkur_woman

Admittedly I'm bringing some baggage from another thread where I had a run in with this poster and was pretty blatently insulted. I'm letting it go, I swear :flowerforyou:

I'm really pleased to hear it. Also, your kitty's face is sweet. I have a picture in my profile of my girl on my shoulder, and her face was black where yours is grey.

I like whole foods too. They didn't call me the Spinach Assassin for nothing.

Awe, thanks! Unfortunately he passed away earlier this year. Wow, I aspire for a nickname like the Spinach Assassin!

I'm so sorry; I lost my girl, jeez, over a year and a half ago already. The candle that burns twice as brightly burns half as long.

I think the best way is to eat a spinach smoothie for breakfast every day, and eat spinach salads at lunch and dinner every day. I don't do that anymore, but when I was doing low-carb I sure did.

tennisdude2004

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

Did I miss where she's a resistance trained athlete? Not to mention, reduced protein intake doesn't cause lean mass loss instead of fat loss; it just leads to lean mass loss in addition to fat loss. For someone not doing resistance training, 0.6g/lb of LBM is adequate protein. Triple her protein intake... you really think she needs to be eating 200g of protein a day? What kind of advice is that?

Edit: Typo

Yes. She is in a calorie deficit and does light resistance training, according to her profile.

I looked at a few random days of her diary and she appeared to be getting around 50g/day. So maybe tripling protein isn't necessary, more like doubling. I was thinking on the order of 130-150g a day, depending. But then again she didn't ask for advice. I was just throwing that out there because she felt the need to criticize my diary.

Really how did you come to that calculation - please explain 130 - 150g?

parkscs

So you're talking about getting fructose "totally out of your system"? Is that right?

BTW, you'd do well to just about triple your protein intake if you want to lose fat mass instead of lean mass.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24092765
http://www.jissn.com/content/3/1/7

Did I miss where she's a resistance trained athlete? Not to mention, reduced protein intake doesn't cause lean mass loss instead of fat loss; it just leads to lean mass loss in addition to fat loss. For someone not doing resistance training, 0.6g/lb of LBM is adequate protein. Triple her protein intake... you really think she needs to be eating 200g of protein a day? What kind of advice is that?

Edit: Typo

Based on her average protein intake over the last month, I think double would just about cover it. It's possible that sampling error led to the "triple" number.

I'm just going by where her goal is set, but for someone whose "resistance training" consists of a bit of yoga, you really don't need to consume protein like a powerlifter or a resistance trained athlete (which those studies focus on). At 0.6g/lb of LBM, we're talking about 70-80g being adequate protein. Would 150g hurt? I highly doubt it. But is it beneficial or would eating less cause her to lose muscle *instead* of fat? I'm thinking the answer there is a big no. Even doubling her intake (using her set goal) would put her beyond the limit at which protein intake is likely to make any difference in her body composition and tripling it would put her into ridiculous levels of protein.

Either way, I do agree that someone consuming protein powder is fine and not really something to criticize in their food diary (not that I go around criticizing people's food diaries in the first place). If they're consuming 8 scoops a day, then maybe you could say that's whey too much brotein, but what's the harm in a bit of protein powder?

1moonshadow

I too am a sugar addict and could not stop until I was diagnosed with diabetes 2. Then when I had to start checking my blood glucose and saw what it was doing to me I was able to slow way down on sugar.

weird_me2

I totally understand what you are going through. I am also a runner addicted to chocolate. Many people here have said that it isn't an addiction but if you haven't been there its difficult to understand.

To this, I could respond, if you haven't suffered from both an addiction and a behavioral disorder, then you can't understand the distinction between the two.

To this I could respond, if you aren't the person in question, then you just can't understand what they are going through. I've noticed that most people who have struggled with compulsions and/or addictions and who have worked to overcome them go either one of two ways - they are either very sympathetic and empathetic or very unforgiving of the person who still struggles. Your posts seem to indicate that you have no sympathy for someone who can't overcome their issues as you have or are doing. The whole post you made about not blaming inanimate objects first made met think this and this post does the same.

Every person is unique. Some people have experiences that make them similar, yet some people can have the same experiences and be completely different. No one is right or wrong. Have you ever heard the saying that your perception is your reality? No matter whether you think a person who is dealing with a compulsion or addiction is right or wrong, their perception will be what is real to them. You can try to educate a person and help them change their perceptions, but just telling them they are wrong or don't know anything does nothing to help the situation. Many people who truly struggle with compulsions and/or addictions don't want to struggle - I would gladly give up my compulsions to have a healthy relationship with food. Do I say that it's impossible to do because I've failed more times than I can count? No. Do I blame my weight on my compulsions? Yes. It's not an excuse, it's my reality. Do I want to feel helpless to the fact that even though I know what my problem is and I know the solution to it, I just can't seem to do that? No.

I don't disagree that the word addiction is thrown around way too much - the same with the word binge. I've seen posts and heard people talk about being addicted or binging and think "you have no idea". Then, I realize that just because I don't think they did these things doesn't mean that that isn't their reality.

I have sympathy for people who are trying to regain control of their life. I don't have sympathy for those who just make excuses and refuse to accept responsibility for their own actions.

There's a line in a Kid Rock song "...all the heroes at the methadone clinic..." that I find appropriate here. Everyone makes mistakes and bad choices in life. I respect people for accepting responsibility, but I can not respect anyone who would blame an inanimate object for their own poor choices.

I get your feelings on accepting personal responsibility. You probably couldn't find someone who agrees with you more on the need for accepting personal responsibility, I guess I just didn't see too many places in this thread where people were shirking their responsibility. OP said she had a problem with sugar. No matter how we feel about it, it's a very real problem for her. She acknowledged the problem and asked for suggestions to help her overcome it. Is she addicted, does she have a compulsion to eat chocolate or is she just overstating the problem? We don't really know, but I don't see where she didn't accept personal responsibility for her problem and we don't have the right to tell her that her feelings on the matter are wrong or that she's just acting like a child or that she's just making excuses. We can try to offer solutions to help her overcome what is a very real problem to her - anything else really isn't helpful, even if we back it up by saying we're just being honest or telling the truth. Telling someone who already feels bad about their situation that they are wrong or lazy or anything else generally is not going to help them. Life isn't all sunshine and rainbows and all that other crap, but we don't have to be demeaning in how we communicate things.

WendyTerry420

I too am a sugar addict and could not stop until I was diagnosed with diabetes 2. Then when I had to start checking my blood glucose and saw what it was doing to me I was able to slow way down on sugar.

Diabetes cured your addiction?