Let the bloodbath begin....

LoosingMyLast15

My personal opinion is if i build up a sweat and let me tell you there are times when i do work up a sweat cleaning my house (spring cleaning for me means, cleaning EVERYTHING FROM TOP TO BOTTOM; INSIDE AND OUT) then i will count it as calories burned. try getting down on your hands and knees and scrubbing your kitchen floor - there's an ab workout for you.

I was reading another forum post where everyone was bashing the OP for wanting to log an activity that no one else seemed to deem as exercise. Am I one of the few on here that realizes that llllooooonnnnnggggg before there were gyms, people did chores to keep themselves fit?!? There was no such thing as an eliptical and people seemed to do just fine so why the heck shouldn't I log doing chores as exercise????

And, let the bloodbath begin....

jcstanton

I really don't get how that affects your or hinder your journey. There are people here who swear they eat only fast food, others who eat clean, some who just walk, others who do crossfit, some with thyroid and PCOS. Everyone has their own journey and what works for one doesn't work for everyone. So if someone is logging their chores and that works for them, I don't see how that could stop you from losing weight. This site is for education and support. You take the information you need to help with your goals.

I have to respectfully disagree with this. I do agree that what someone else logs has nothing to do with me. It's their body and their business. But what they post in an open internet forum does effect me and others. If you see someone post information that you feel is blatantly wrong and perhaps harmful, it can be really hard to bite your tongue (fingertips?) and not type a response. The whole purpose of a open internet forum is to exchange ideas, and exchange means it goes both ways. It does affect me, because I look to get advice on this site and if someone posts something that's wrong I could waste time and money while risking my health at the same time.

If someone posted that the best way to lose weight is to only eat 400 calories per day or drink poison or take steroids, would you feel it's wrong to post a contrary response? Even if you don't really care what that person does, wouldn't you want to warn other people that clicked on that thread that this is terrible advice? If you had personal experience with lifting/running/crossfit/paleo/veganism wouldn't you want to share your experiences? ESPECIALLY if you feel someone said something that you felt was blatantly wrong?

Obviously people should not be rude or insulting. But just disagreeing doesn't make them rude.

You are correct that this is an open internet forum where ideas and opinions are exchanged, but it is up to you to exercise good judgement. None of us are experts and even those who say they are could be making it up for all we know since this is cyberspace. If someone says they lost weight doing something harmful and you followed suit that is no one's fault but your own for taking that person's experience at face value and not researching it further. If someone logs their chores whether it be daily or ever so often that is their choice and is not going to hinder my journey. My needs and goals are unique to me and while I do find the exchange of ideas informative at the end of the day I'm going to do what's best for me and if more people on MFP did the same they would exert less energy criticizing people who follow a different fitness plan than one they prescribed too.

That's what I'M sayin'! It's up to us to make CHOICES for ourselves. We can take other people's opinions and experiences into consideration, but what we do or don't do is ultimately our own choice. No one is forcing us to follow, to the letter, what someone else does. That's the same as saying, "I'm fat because the fast food/soda/junk food industry manufactures food that's bad for me." Well, they may make the disgustingly unhealthy crap, but it's YOUR CHOICE whether or not to eat it.

jcstanton

I agree completely. If GARDENING, of all things, is exercies, then house cleaning is exercise, as well. Our need for gyms is more the result of so much automation. Cars, computers, telephones, dish washers, washing machines. . .everything that makes our lifestyle what it is is destroying our health. My rule of thumb is that if I use a machine to accomplish it, it doesn't count as exercies (rototillers and push mowers are notable exceptions). If I have to do it "the old fashioned way," then it's fair game as exercise. Doing the dishes, for example: with dishwasher - not exercise; by hand - (very) light exercise.

Further more, just like most people believe they eat less than they do, most people belive they are more active than they really are. If they are logging all of their physicial activity, perhaps this is the first step to gaining a clear picture of their activity level. It makes an obvious and dramatic difference when logging food. Why not expand that to include physicial activity. You've got to start somewhere.

Don't forget to add what I have said repeatedly in this thread. If your daily activity level is set at sedentary to moderate and you're not eating back all of your (MFP estimated) exercise calories (I rarely eat back more than half), you're not as likely to be hindered by inaccurate calorie burns. Having an excuse to eat more is not my motivation for logging my Saturday deep housecleaning and lawn mowing. I just like to keep track of my significant activity level each week. For me, it has nothing to do with the calorie burn, even though I DO burn a significant amount of calories when I engage in these activities.

jcstanton

Let's take the emotion of being a homebody vs. a career vs. younger vs. older out of this whole discussion.

Let's get scientific for a moment. The tab clearly says exercise and is broken down into cardio & strength training.

Exercise is defined as planned, structured, and progressive process by which a significant exertion is applied to stimulate a specific desired and positive bodily change.

Given that, I don't see how work around the house can be considered exercise. Walking the dog can qualify if there is significant exertion applied, obviously based upon your physical conditioning.

Work around the house can burn a great deal more calories and bring up your heart rate a lot higher than walking the dog. One poster mentioned their HRM showed an 1100 calorie burn for mowing her lawn. Another poster said 700 calories for giving the house a scrub down. So the physical exertion is there. I don't do a scrub down of my house daily, but when I do I sweat much more than I do from a half hour on the elliptical. Exercise has a very broad definition and does not have to be just want you do in the gym. Chores are included in the MFP database as well as other sites like Fitday. BTW Fitday also includes sex for exercise and you can log it based on length and intensity. Personally, I think MFP should follow suit.

The average person's definition of exercise is vague. But I don't see where mowing the lawn or scrubbing a house is progressive. I'm sure there are people that will argue that it's structured and planned.

If you sweat more doing house work than on an elliptical, then my observation would be that the intensity should be picked up on the elliptical.

I would argue that, if you're not working up a sweat and getting your HR up by doing deep house cleaning (for several hours, not a few minutes) and/or mowing your lawn (with a push mower), you're not doing THAT properly. As I said before, you've apparently never deep cleaned a house from top to bottom, nor have you ever seen what I look like after thirty minutes on the elliptical. I'm doing BOTH the way they should be done, and I'm here to tell you, I burn WAY more calories and get my HR MUCH higher doing three hours of deep cleaning than I do in thirty minutes to an hour on the elliptical.

MelissR75

My problem is the ripping into other people...

I couldn't care less about logging chores or not. I do not log them, I count them as part of my daily activity but if someone else logs them because they feel they worked up a sweat what do I care...

really, it's their journey and only they really know how hard they work.

Lauren

Amen!

k8blujay2

Let's take the emotion of being a homebody vs. a career vs. younger vs. older out of this whole discussion.

Let's get scientific for a moment. The tab clearly says exercise and is broken down into cardio & strength training.

Exercise is defined as planned, structured, and progressive process by which a significant exertion is applied to stimulate a specific desired and positive bodily change.

Given that, I don't see how work around the house can be considered exercise. Walking the dog can qualify if there is significant exertion applied, obviously based upon your physical conditioning.

Work around the house can burn a great deal more calories and bring up your heart rate a lot higher than walking the dog. One poster mentioned their HRM showed an 1100 calorie burn for mowing her lawn. Another poster said 700 calories for giving the house a scrub down. So the physical exertion is there. I don't do a scrub down of my house daily, but when I do I sweat much more than I do from a half hour on the elliptical. Exercise has a very broad definition and does not have to be just want you do in the gym. Chores are included in the MFP database as well as other sites like Fitday. BTW Fitday also includes sex for exercise and you can log it based on length and intensity. Personally, I think MFP should follow suit.

The average person's definition of exercise is vague. But I don't see where mowing the lawn or scrubbing a house is progressive. I'm sure there are people that will argue that it's structured and planned.

If you sweat more doing house work than on an elliptical, then my observation would be that the intensity should be picked up on the elliptical.

What if they aren't using a power mower on a decent sized lawn? While I might be inclined to agree with you if the person is using a ride on mower, I am more likely to disagree if they are using a push mower (even a power push mower)... from my own experience, scrubbing a house clean can be pretty hard work... I have definitely had sore muscles after doing a power cleaning session that lasted longer than 3 hours.... same for painting walls and ceilings... I have to wonder whether people that say cleaning is not hard work has ever really cleaned a day in their life.... and I'm not talking about pick up, doing the dishes or dusting with a feather duster.... I'm talking scrubbing the cupboards, cleaning the carpets... that kind of thing. When I lost a bunch of weight as a late teenager, I was working as a housekeeper for a campground most of the year.... and that stuff is hard work... all the climbing and moving heavy furniture....

k8blujay2

I am almost tempted to put my activity level down to sedentary and start logging all the inane things like cleaning and carrying around my 20 lb toddler and cooking... can't forget cooking.


edited for spelling... my fingers are moving faster than my brain again.

Kara_xxx

As does continually having to repeat myself because some *kitten* didn't really take my perfectly valid point into consideration before making said snarky, condescending remark.

In terms of attempting to change opinion, I'm not ENTIRELY sure whether referring to "the opposition" as a-holes will endear them to your views, add cudos to your argument or add validity to your points?

lisasch67

I don't get why it matters to anyone what I log. Be it calories, exercise, whatever. People are so critical, as they SIT behind their little computer, telling everyone else how it's supposed to be done. I'm here for myself, first and foremost. If I find a few like-minded "friends" to support/ get support from...great! If not...great! If I have a problem with the way people log, and it bothers me, I unfriend them...pretty simple concept. No need to make a person feel bad about themself. I don't "call people out". If they are "lying" on their log, or logging something you wouldn't, how does that affect you? Answer...it doesn't.

well said!

Not well said - it DOES affect me!

If you chose to share what you are doing and how it works/doesn't work for you then it affects me. It affects me because I don't know as much as I would like to about nutrician/exercise/metabolism, so i come on here for support and to learn

If you say "I eat cream cakes all day but drink 2 litres of rose water to offset the cream cake calories, and I've lost 30 lbs" I will question it - it DOES affect me

You should come on here for support and ideas to change up your routine. Everyone's body is different so if something someone suggested isn't working for you then you should change things up. As for learning about metabolism and nutrition, I take suggestions I see on here and follow up with real research either in books at a library (so old school) or on legitimate websites. The MFP forums are filled with great suggestions and information, but also a lot of crap. You should take the time to educate yourself with legitimate materials if this is going to be a serious lifestyle change for yourself. And like I said before, if logging every little activity works for you, then do it. If it doesn't then don't log it... To each their own. If you're eating back the calories your burned walking to the bathroom and not losing weight and wondering why you're still fat, then that's something you have to deal with, but if you log all your activity and it gets you to take the stairs over the elevator, then keep on keepin' on.

jcstanton

As does continually having to repeat myself because some *kitten* didn't really take my perfectly valid point into consideration before making said snarky, condescending remark.

In terms of attempting to change opinion, I'm not ENTIRELY sure whether referring to "the opposition" as a-holes will endear them to your views, add cudos to your argument or add validity to your points?

I'm not calling them buttholes because they disagree, I'm calling them buttholes because they obviously are not willing to listen to what I, or anyone else who happens to be of the opposite opinion, have to say. If they were actually taking my arguments into consideration, they would see that I have some very valid and logical reasons for logging my "chores", and they wouldn't be so quick to judge. It's not the differing opinion I have a problem with. It's the snarky, condescending manner in which the opinion is stated that gets under my skin. Nothing gets my BP to spike faster than having to reapeat myself because someone isn't listening.

MzTat2slim

People should be allowed to log what they want as exercise. The purpose of this site is to help us keep track of our meals and exercise to aid in our fitness management. Why does anyone care how other people manage their own fitness?

Kara_xxx

Nothing gets my BP to spike faster than having to reapeat myself because someone isn't listening.

In that case just be grateful that they're elevating your heart rate and log it as training.

lizziebeth1028

I was reading another forum post where everyone was bashing the OP for wanting to log an activity that no one else seemed to deem as exercise. Am I one of the few on here that realizes that llllooooonnnnnggggg before there were gyms, people did chores to keep themselves fit?!? There was no such thing as an eliptical and people seemed to do just fine so why the heck shouldn't I log doing chores as exercise????

And, let the bloodbath begin....

The post you are referring to had the 'unfortunate' title "how many calories do you burn standing". By just reading the title 99 percent will probably think off the bat.......in what universe is standing consider a physical activity. There is a lot more to this thread and let's not get into that again.

However in regards to what to consider what to log as exercise....I think you really have to be honest with yourself. Did you exert your self, get your heart rate up for a sustained period of time?? Is my profile already set to lightly active, active....this all comes into play on a case be case basis. If you are logging small exertions here and there and NOT losing weight or hit a plateau...well maybe your over estimating. As it is MFP over estimates calories burned so unless you have a HRM your only guessing anyway.

Anyway.........I think we all know that there are many viable forms of exercise that you SHOULD log that are not performed in a gym!!!! That's just commonsense!

Wonderob

You should come on here for support and ideas to change up your routine. Everyone's body is different so if something someone suggested isn't working for you then you should change things up. As for learning about metabolism and nutrition, I take suggestions I see on here and follow up with real research either in books at a library (so old school) or on legitimate websites. The MFP forums are filled with great suggestions and information, but also a lot of crap.

I do research, I see what others are doing

Everyone's body's are really not that different. the majority of things are golden rules, and there's a big list of deffinate do's and don't with regard to dieting and keeping fit

jcstanton

Nothing gets my BP to spike faster than having to reapeat myself because someone isn't listening.

In that case just be grateful that they're elevating your heart rate and log it as training.

Like I've said repeatedly, I DON'T LOG MUNDANE THINGS LIKE SITTING AT MY DESK ARGUING ON A FORUM THREAD! (I thought maybe I needed to "shout" it, since you obviously didn't get it before.) I couldn't care less what my calorie burn is, because MFP esimates WAAAY above what is accurate in most cases. I'm more focused on just staying active for extended periods of time (extended meaning at least 30 minutes per activity), and if I haven't broken a sweat AND elevated my HR doing it, I don't log it...period. In other words, deep cleaning my house for three hours on Saturday morning breaks a sweat, gets my HR above 130bpm, and it's more than thirty minutes of continuous activity, so I log it. Sitting at my kitchen table catching up on scrapbooking for three hours, not so much.


I should also add that, most of the time, I'm not the raving lunatic I appear to be here in this particular thread. There's just certain things that get me fired up, and when that happens, I'm like a dog with a bone....I just can't let it go. Which is probably one of the reasons I have a problem with high BP in the first place.

jcstanton

I was reading another forum post where everyone was bashing the OP for wanting to log an activity that no one else seemed to deem as exercise. Am I one of the few on here that realizes that llllooooonnnnnggggg before there were gyms, people did chores to keep themselves fit?!? There was no such thing as an eliptical and people seemed to do just fine so why the heck shouldn't I log doing chores as exercise????

And, let the bloodbath begin....

The post you are referring to had the 'unfortunate' title "how many calories do you burn standing". By just reading the title 99 percent will probably think off the bat.......in what universe is standing consider a physical activity. There is a lot more to this thread and let's not get into that again.

However in regards to what to consider what to log as exercise....I think you really have to be honest with yourself. Did you exert your self, get your heart rate up for a sustained period of time?? Is my profile already set to lightly active, active....this all comes into play on a case be case basis. If you are logging small exertions here and there and NOT losing weight or hit a plateau...well maybe your over estimating. As it is MFP over estimates calories burned so unless you have a HRM your only guessing anyway.

Anyway.........I think we all know that there are many viable forms of exercise that you SHOULD log that are not performed in a gym!!!! That's just commonsense!

^^^EXACTLY!!! This is what I have been saying repeatedly all morning, but some people just don't want to acknowledge that there are some exceptions to logging chores as exercise.

bfitnbfab

Let's take the emotion of being a homebody vs. a career vs. younger vs. older out of this whole discussion.

Let's get scientific for a moment. The tab clearly says exercise and is broken down into cardio & strength training.

Exercise is defined as planned, structured, and progressive process by which a significant exertion is applied to stimulate a specific desired and positive bodily change.

Given that, I don't see how work around the house can be considered exercise. Walking the dog can qualify if there is significant exertion applied, obviously based upon your physical conditioning.

Work around the house can burn a great deal more calories and bring up your heart rate a lot higher than walking the dog. One poster mentioned their HRM showed an 1100 calorie burn for mowing her lawn. Another poster said 700 calories for giving the house a scrub down. So the physical exertion is there. I don't do a scrub down of my house daily, but when I do I sweat much more than I do from a half hour on the elliptical. Exercise has a very broad definition and does not have to be just want you do in the gym. Chores are included in the MFP database as well as other sites like Fitday. BTW Fitday also includes sex for exercise and you can log it based on length and intensity. Personally, I think MFP should follow suit.

The average person's definition of exercise is vague. But I don't see where mowing the lawn or scrubbing a house is progressive. I'm sure there are people that will argue that it's structured and planned.

If you sweat more doing house work than on an elliptical, then my observation would be that the intensity should be picked up on the elliptical.

Based on your observation, It seems that you don't do any housework

Actually, I do a lot of the housework (our laundry washer and dryer is next door so I have to carry all the laundry out the front door then into the basement next door) and cooking around the house. On the weekends I'm working on my motorcycle and going to sporting events. None of that physical activity gets logged because it's not exercise, its physical activity.

bfitnbfab

Let's take the emotion of being a homebody vs. a career vs. younger vs. older out of this whole discussion.

Let's get scientific for a moment. The tab clearly says exercise and is broken down into cardio & strength training.

Exercise is defined as planned, structured, and progressive process by which a significant exertion is applied to stimulate a specific desired and positive bodily change.

Given that, I don't see how work around the house can be considered exercise. Walking the dog can qualify if there is significant exertion applied, obviously based upon your physical conditioning.

Work around the house can burn a great deal more calories and bring up your heart rate a lot higher than walking the dog. One poster mentioned their HRM showed an 1100 calorie burn for mowing her lawn. Another poster said 700 calories for giving the house a scrub down. So the physical exertion is there. I don't do a scrub down of my house daily, but when I do I sweat much more than I do from a half hour on the elliptical. Exercise has a very broad definition and does not have to be just want you do in the gym. Chores are included in the MFP database as well as other sites like Fitday. BTW Fitday also includes sex for exercise and you can log it based on length and intensity. Personally, I think MFP should follow suit.

The average person's definition of exercise is vague. But I don't see where mowing the lawn or scrubbing a house is progressive. I'm sure there are people that will argue that it's structured and planned.

If you sweat more doing house work than on an elliptical, then my observation would be that the intensity should be picked up on the elliptical.

I would argue that, if you're not working up a sweat and getting your HR up by doing deep house cleaning (for several hours, not a few minutes) and/or mowing your lawn (with a push mower), you're not doing THAT properly. As I said before, you've apparently never deep cleaned a house from top to bottom, nor have you ever seen what I look like after thirty minutes on the elliptical. I'm doing BOTH the way they should be done, and I'm here to tell you, I burn WAY more calories and get my HR MUCH higher doing three hours of deep cleaning than I do in thirty minutes to an hour on the elliptical.

I'm sorry but house work is not exercise. So it doesn't matter at what intensity you do it. Enjoy you're lil jog on the elliptical. If you want to be rude, then expect rude back.

jcstanton

Let's take the emotion of being a homebody vs. a career vs. younger vs. older out of this whole discussion.

Let's get scientific for a moment. The tab clearly says exercise and is broken down into cardio & strength training.

Exercise is defined as planned, structured, and progressive process by which a significant exertion is applied to stimulate a specific desired and positive bodily change.

Given that, I don't see how work around the house can be considered exercise. Walking the dog can qualify if there is significant exertion applied, obviously based upon your physical conditioning.

Work around the house can burn a great deal more calories and bring up your heart rate a lot higher than walking the dog. One poster mentioned their HRM showed an 1100 calorie burn for mowing her lawn. Another poster said 700 calories for giving the house a scrub down. So the physical exertion is there. I don't do a scrub down of my house daily, but when I do I sweat much more than I do from a half hour on the elliptical. Exercise has a very broad definition and does not have to be just want you do in the gym. Chores are included in the MFP database as well as other sites like Fitday. BTW Fitday also includes sex for exercise and you can log it based on length and intensity. Personally, I think MFP should follow suit.

The average person's definition of exercise is vague. But I don't see where mowing the lawn or scrubbing a house is progressive. I'm sure there are people that will argue that it's structured and planned.

If you sweat more doing house work than on an elliptical, then my observation would be that the intensity should be picked up on the elliptical.

Based on your observation, It seems that you don't do any housework

Actually, I do a lot of the housework (our laundry washer and dryer is next door so I have to carry all the laundry out the front door then into the basement next door) and cooking around the house. On the weekends I'm working on my motorcycle and going to sporting events. None of that physical activity gets logged because it's not exercise, its physical activity.

I don't think anyone has a problem with you choosing not to log those things as exercise. What we do have a problem with is being verbally bullied (not by you, you've been pretty nice in your comments) because we do choose to log them. I don't choose to log fifteen minutes of standing at the sink hand wasing my dishes because I don't break a sweat, I don't elevate my HR, and it's not a long enough period of time to make it worth my while. However, when I do my Saturday morning deep cleaning, it is 2-3hrs of continuous, vigorous activity, during which my HR is elevated to at least 130bpm, my shirt gets soaked with sweat, and it's not something I do EVERY day. So, yes, I log it. Just as I would if I decided to go for a five mile hike in the mountains on a Saturday morning, but no one would treat me like I'm an idiot for logging that particular activity.

AmyS1975

If your settings are "sedentary" and you don't normally break out a sweat/increase your heart rate similarly as you would with other forms of exercises, then log it.

If you're logging it so you feel better about eating more, than you probably shouldn't log it.

Agreed!