Women and Body Shaming

PikaKnight

I really dislike "generalizations." How can you say more women do this or more men do that, or why do all women say these things, or all men do these types of things. It's ridiculous! Men and women are people. Period.

They are individuals that like what they like, act how they act, and should not be blamed because one or two others of the same gender, height, weight, heritage, or hobbies decided to say or do something that wasn't nice or what you thought was "right".

People bash on each other for various reasons and that's that. No one gender, race, etc is more to blame than another...is more right than another...is nice, meaner, etc than another.

You'd think we'd learn this by now..lol.

BinaryPulsar

Pudadough is just sharing her own personal feelings and experiences. No need to take it personally or as an attack on men. There are some things she is saying that I can very much understand how she feels (from the perspective of my younger self). I am happily married to a very wonderful man that I have known for 16 years and am not male bashing.

Just my personal opinion...Pudadough you are a very beautiful and attractive young woman. Possibly when the men say the things they say, they don't realize it is affecting you because they would never see you the way you are seeing yourself. They are not reflective upon that.

pudadough

I really dislike "generalizations." How can you say more women do this or more men do that, or why do all women say these things, or all men do these types of things. It's ridiculous! Men and women are people. Period.

They are individuals that like what they like, act how they act, and should not be blamed because one or two others of the same gender, height, weight, heritage, or hobbies decided to say or do something that wasn't nice or what you thought was "right".

People bash on each other for various reasons and that's that. No one gender, race, etc is more to blame than another...is more right than another...is nice, meaner, etc than another.

You'd think we'd learn this by now..lol.

Cool deal. Was just stating my own opinion and life experience. Not declaring it absolute truth forevermore.

PikaKnight

I really dislike "generalizations." How can you say more women do this or more men do that, or why do all women say these things, or all men do these types of things. It's ridiculous! Men and women are people. Period.

They are individuals that like what they like, act how they act, and should not be blamed because one or two others of the same gender, height, weight, heritage, or hobbies decided to say or do something that wasn't nice or what you thought was "right".

People bash on each other for various reasons and that's that. No one gender, race, etc is more to blame than another...is more right than another...is nice, meaner, etc than another.

You'd think we'd learn this by now..lol.

Cool deal. Was just stating my own opinion and life experience. Not declaring it absolute truth forevermore.

And I wasn't saying you were. This was me just putting out there about people generalizing things. Sorry you thought it was pointed at you.

halobender

Women do it too, a girl just told me a few seconds ago. 'I can't date a guy shorter than me." Women do the exact same thing, they have their own preferences just like anyone else. There was a girl i liked in high school, she said, "he's cute, but too big."

I don't think anyone's saying that women don't ever do it—and if they do say that, they're wrong, because yeah, everyone has their own preferences and people are always openly stating them, and most people don't give a damn to hear it.

that is generalization right there good sir. I am going back to asking her if everything is ok, purely because this person seem to be having some trouble with the male gender in her life. I mean, even the kids are considered women bashing now?

Yes, that is, and it's also conveniently after my statement wherein I had said, up to that point, that she'd not done so. Shucks.

And let's remember that children are awful, especially teenagers, so it's not surprising that she would hear teenage boys saying mean things, and I think it's disingenuous to assert that she must have some issue with men.

Anyway, I'm pretty much over analyzing another person's statements as though they're not here, so I think I'll probably back out of this thread now with a white flag.

pudadough

Women do it too, a girl just told me a few seconds ago. 'I can't date a guy shorter than me." Women do the exact same thing, they have their own preferences just like anyone else. There was a girl i liked in high school, she said, "he's cute, but too big."

I don't think anyone's saying that women don't ever do it—and if they do say that, they're wrong, because yeah, everyone has their own preferences and people are always openly stating them, and most people don't give a damn to hear it.

that is generalization right there good sir. I am going back to asking her if everything is ok, purely because this person seem to be having some trouble with the male gender in her life. I mean, even the kids are considered women bashing now?

Yes, that is, and it's also conveniently after my statement wherein I had said, up to that point, that she'd not done so. Shucks.

And let's remember that children are awful, especially teenagers, so it's not surprising that she would hear teenage boys saying mean things, and I think it's disingenuous to assert that she must have some issue with men.

Anyway, I'm pretty much over analyzing another person's statements as though they're not here, so I think I'll probably back out of this thread now with a white flag.

I did actually edit my statement so that it was not so sweeping, because "a lot" rather than "all" does more accurately sum up my thoughts on it. But Taunto was so eager to tear my response apart that he quoted it while I was editing and never looked back.

Also, I like your beard.

halobender

Also, I like your beard.

Thanks.

You're quite pretty.

This is now a pick-up thread.

RECowgill

How did this get so out of control?

Oh I know. Because its a topic about Women's bodies. Duh.

brevislux

Real women have no penises.

RECowgill

Real women have no penises.

I've heard that might be true.

ironanimal

I feel far more body shame from mens' comments and actions than I ever have from women. Because I'm not stupid and can read between the lines. You can say "Oh you're beautiful just the way you are" all day but I still see the women that make the covers of men's magazines and the ones that turn heads the most and I know I'll never ever look even remotely close to that while still eating solid food. Men's reactions to me have shaped my body image, not women. And that's the damn truth.

Yes, cosmopolitan etc are totally mens magazines...

PS. Men aren't looking your way because you are blaming them just because you don't feel confident about your own figure. Men can tell when we see somebody hating them for their own faults ya know

PPS. Men look at somebody, they're called perverts. We DON'T look at someone, we're called body shaming

First, I don't know an actual *woman* who reads Cosmopolitan. As far as I knew, only teenage girls cracked the cover on that.

I don't let men hear me say anything like this in real life, so they really have no idea I'm "blaming" them, do they?

And you would lack confidence in your body if you constantly heard it picked apart, not even by the media, but by people you know.

You think I'm placing too much blame on men, I think you're completely ignoring the big impact they can have. I wouldn't care what I looked like if men didn't place an absolute premium on how their partner looks. Even moreso than how intelligent or ethical she is. Men say it openly on this site every single day. How can you possibly be missing that?

4 things.

1. Your figure is fine; maybe you wouldn't be on the cover of a magazine, but then most guys I know wouldn't want one of the chicks off the front of a magazine. Some prefer larger, some prefer smaller, some prefer fitter. It's all personal preference and there will always be a demographic that finds you attractive at any size.
2. You're hanging out with the wrong people if they're passing comment on your body without your prompt.
3. Big thighs were mentioned - I can't speak for everyone, but coming from me, that would be a compliment.
4. None of the above should even matter to you. If a guy is talking down to you for how you look, consider it a dodged bullet. It's about the best way to find out someone isn't worth your time.

I never stated anywhere that women aren't fed images of the 'ideal' by men. Specifically to MFP however, most of the mudslinging is done by women to other women.

alexbusnello

I guess this means women come in all different types of shapes and sizes.

You're body is going to be with you the rest of your life, so you better like it, or it's going to be a long miserable road.

If you don't like it, you can change some things about through fitness and eating right. Muscle can and has changed people's shape. But for the things you can't change naturally? Yeah....going to be unhappy.

alexbusnello

Thank you! Love this post. I totally agree 100%.

"Real women have curves."
Real this and real that......

What IS real anyway? Tall and thin or tall and chubby....all are real. Just because a woman is tall and skinny, doesn't make her imaginary. Oh, that girl over there has wider hips and bigger thighs than this girl....she must be real and the thin girl must be fake!

*rolls eyes*

harlanJEN

I feel far more body shame from mens' comments and actions than I ever have from women. Because I'm not stupid and can read between the lines. You can say "Oh you're beautiful just the way you are" all day but I still see the women that make the covers of men's magazines and the ones that turn heads the most and I know I'll never ever look even remotely close to that while still eating solid food. Men's reactions to me have shaped my body image, not women. And that's the damn truth.

WHOAH!

the one and only example you gave as to HOW men make you feel shamed is perceived reactions to the women on the cover of Men's magazines?? PLEASE tell me your self-esteem , your body confidence is NOT based on magazine covers?

Do you judge real life men based on pics of men on magazine covers?

WOMEN. ... we totally could rule the world if we could collectively quit letting other people's opinions or perceived opinions of us consume so much of US. it's YOUR body, you've got to ROCK IT OUT! it starts with you ..others will follow. TRULY.

crisanderson27

Pudadough is just sharing her own personal feelings and experiences. No need to take it personally or as an attack on men. There are some things she is saying that I can very much understand how she feels (from the perspective of my younger self). I am happily married to a very wonderful man that I have known for 16 years and am not male bashing.

Just my personal opinion...Pudadough you are a very beautiful and attractive young woman. Possibly when the men say the things they say, they don't realize it is affecting you because they would never see you the way you are seeing yourself. They are not reflective upon that.

She isn't just very beautiful and attractive, she's stunning (I've always thought so). And while I don't always agree with what she says (we have some fundamental differences of opinion on most things that touch on feminism lol)...the level of intelligence, consideration, and general thought she puts into her commentary has earned her my respect in thread after thread in the past. (and just so it's clear after my next comment, the above statements are 100% genuine).

But wait, does that mean I'm shaming anyone who isn't Pudadough?

Hmm...

Oh, and anyone who thinks men aren't held up to a STUPIDLY huge amount of expectations, requirements, and standards, needs to go make a male profile on an online dating site.

Go ahead, try it...I dare you.

Also, using the same example in reverse...I have a somewhat overweight female friend who uses dating sites to troll for sex (I don't judge her, and you shouldn't either). She isn't obvious about what she's looking for...yet gets stupid amounts of attention from men of all types.

Funny how that works.

FlaxMilk

"Oh, and anyone who thinks men aren't held up to a STUPIDLY huge amount of expectations, requirements, and standards, needs to go make a male profile on an online dating site."

Men have unfair double standards and expectations, for sure. They may be more subtle in some cases (for instance, you suggest going to a dating site, whereas to find tons of examples of ridiculous expectations for women, you can just go to the supermarket and find them in a 20:1 ratio. 99% of all numbers on the internet are made up.) My pet peeve on this are: we can make jokes about hitting or killing men (I don't think the answer is making these jokes fair game on women, just doing away with them), men are expected to pay on the first date.

But on the women body shaming, I believe it comes from really mixed messages to everyone about what is expected of them. Men are told to be respectful of women while societal messages are that real men are overly invested in female sex characteristics. Women are taught not to be ashamed of puberty while being taught to cover it up while at the same time societal messages imply that you won't catch the eye of a mate without flaunting it a bit and edging out your competition.

Most eventually mature out of this and realize that men don't have to be rude or degrading to be masculine, and women don't have to exhaust themselves trying to fit a double bind. But it can cause a lot of pain and heartache and for people who don't come close to fitting the mold of "ideal" it can take a lot more time and effort.

ironanimal

Bumpizzle mah dizzle

MireyGal76

Perhaps I'm oversimplifying it... but isn't this a matter of just being respectful to one another?

I'm very tall (6'1") and muscular. I have some curves, but am not overly 'curvy' (I tend to lean toward a more boxy frame. THAT IS NOT GOING TO CHANGE. (Well, the muscles may fade in time - though I hope not!)

There are men who simply would NOT want to date me. They may not like my height, or may want someone softer and with less musculature. Maybe they prefer redheads over blondes. That is their right to feel that way.

There are women who wouldn't want to look like me. Some would think my physique is unattractive. But that's ok. That is THEIR viewpoint and they are entitled to it.

All I ask is that we treat each other with respect. Respectful behavior chooses not to say things like
- you're manly
- I'd never date a sasquatch
- you're too tall
- muscles are gross.

I'm entitled to my opinion, you are entitled to yours. If you ask me mine, I will provide it, but will attempt to do so in a way that does not MAKE YOU FEEL LIKE YOU ARE INADEQUATE. All I ask is the same in return.

That's where the body shaming comes in.

There are people here who WANT to lose weight, who want to change. That is their desire, and they're working on it. They may not be happy with every aspect of their physical bodies. Some of us hurt when others tear down the areas that people see as flawed.

I support each person's right to change, and I support each person's right to stay the same. In my mind... a person is to be valued by their heart and soul and spirit. Not their weight, stature or size. We shouldn't need surgical intervention in order to feel good about ourselves, but if someone chooses to do it, then all the power to them.

Basically, all I ask is that we TRY to remember that people are sensitive creatures, and that kindness goes a long way...
We should be ok if we do that.

BinaryPulsar

^^^I like that MireyGal!!!

Oops, I got bumped over to the next page.

MireyGal76

^^^I like that MireyGal!!!

Oops, I got bumped over to the next page.

Thanks hun! You're pretty freakin awesome yourself!!