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Negative Net

wstephens87wstephens87 Posts: 156Member Member Posts: 156Member Member
In your opinion, is it ok to have a negative net if you are reaching the negative net but still eating your suggested calorie and nutrition goal? Ie... the negative net is from burning more calories exercising than you do from eating for the day?

This will be a rare occurance in the busy day to day hustle and bustle. But I think this is going to happen today since it's getting to be almost 5 and I'm at -111 and have guitar playing to do later and still a good amount of food to eat for dinner.

Wondering if a person needs to eat a ton of food to make up for it when this happens or is this a good accomplishment?

Thanks and happy weekend!!!
edited April 2016
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Replies

  • DorkothyParkerDorkothyParker Posts: 618Member Member Posts: 618Member Member
    I think this would be super duper difficult assuming you are truly meeting calorie goals.

    Most calculators over-estimate calorie burn for exercise.

    I think whether it has a lot of negative consequences would depend on how much excess fat your body has to begin with. If you are getting sufficient protein, and have fat to burn, I think it's fine. But I would be keen to listen to your body tomorrow and not freak if it wants you to make up some of the calories it missed from the day prior.
  • moe0303moe0303 Posts: 933Member Member Posts: 933Member Member
    Great question, OP. I was thinking about creating a similar debate. The community in general comes down pretty hard on anybody eating less than 1200 calories. I'm questioning if a person that burns more to make up for the 1200 calorie requirement is any better off. All things being equal, their deficit would be the same.

    Concerning you and your negative net. What is your total deficit for the day? I doubt it will do much lasting harm. There are people on here who do intermittent fasting for a day here or there and I doubt they have experienced any long term negative affects. Since you still have dinner, do you think you will finish the day in the negative?
    edited April 2016
  • LivingtheLeanDreamLivingtheLeanDream Posts: 12,404Member Member Posts: 12,404Member Member
    I doubt that anyone would have enough energy to burn enough to be in negative calories....?

    I don't know why anyone would want to even try?
    Sounds like torture. *shrugs shoulders* :smiley:
  • cwolfman13cwolfman13 Posts: 36,911Member Member Posts: 36,911Member Member
    No...because you not giving your body any energy for basic functions...good luck with that...your hair shall be falling out soon enough, among other things if this were to be a regular occurrence...you should go check out all of the "lost my period" threads around here...they're pretty awesome.
  • wstephens87wstephens87 Posts: 156Member Member Posts: 156Member Member
    moe0303 wrote: »
    Great question, OP. I was thinking about creating a similar debate. The community in general comes down pretty hard on anybody eating less than 1200 calories. I'm questioning if a person that burns more to make up for the 1200 calorie requirement is any better off. All things being equal, their deficit would be the same.

    Concerning you and your negative net. What is your total deficit for the day? I doubt it will do much lasting harm. There are people on here who do intermittent fasting for a day here or there and I doubt they have experienced any long term negative affects. Since you still have dinner, do you think you will finish the day in the negative?

    I went ahead and prelogged my dinner for tonight since a friend is cooking and I know what I'll be having (the maximum amount of it I will be eating) and the minimum amount of time I'll be burning calories playing guitar and singing and litterally drinking two beers to meet my calorie goal, I'll be at -53!!! I have really pushed myself today working out before work and on my lunch break!
  • The_EnginerdThe_Enginerd Posts: 3,924Member Member Posts: 3,924Member Member
    April fools?

    Taking a quick peek at your exercise diary, you are vastly overestimating the net calories burned for those activities. And you are logging things like guitar playing and singing, which aren't really exercises and are already included in your normal daily activity, even if you are "sedentary".

    Realistically, you aren't netting anywhere below zero calories. And that's assuming your food diary is accurate, which it is likely not given many things look estimated.
    edited April 2016
  • lemurcat12lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886Member Member Posts: 30,886Member Member
    Definitely not good as in something you should be aiming for or something inherently beneficial. If it's just a one day thing, or fits into your overall week (like with someone doing TDEE method with a extra long workout day or someone doing 5:2), not a big deal, though. I've done it, and was far from net negative for the week as a whole. Anyone who has fasted for a day has done it, of course.

    On the whole, however, I think the 1200 calorie goal is considered a net goal by most around here.
    edited April 2016
  • wstephens87wstephens87 Posts: 156Member Member Posts: 156Member Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    No...because you not giving your body any energy for basic functions...good luck with that...your hair shall be falling out soon enough, among other things if this were to be a regular occurrence...you should go check out all of the "lost my period" threads around here...they're pretty awesome.

    Wow The title was "Negative net" not Negative Nancy! Lort. Anyway, are you sure? Because if I'm eating the right amount of protein and unsaturated fat and fiber, vitamins etc.... I'm not sure how my body would not have enough energy. But that is why I started this forum. Just to be sure. And also if this only happens occasionally is it ok? Geeze! Your comment is terrifying!
  • wstephens87wstephens87 Posts: 156Member Member Posts: 156Member Member
    April fools?

    Taking a quick peek at your exercise diary, you are vastly overestimating the net calories burned for those activities. And you are logging things like guitar playing and singing, which aren't really exercises and are already included in your normal daily activity, even if you are "sedentary".

    Realistically, you aren't netting anywhere below zero calories. And that's assuming your food diary is accurate, which it is likely not given many things look estimated.

    I've read articles and used a calorie calculator that say the opposite. Also I am not sedentary when I play. We get pretty active.

    edited April 2016
  • wstephens87wstephens87 Posts: 156Member Member Posts: 156Member Member
    lemurcat12 wrote: »
    Definitely not good as in something you should be aiming for or something inherently beneficial. If it's just a one day thing, or fits into your overall week (like with someone doing TDEE method with a extra long workout day or someone doing 5:2), not a big deal, though. I've done it, and was far from net negative for the week as a whole. Anyone who has fasted for a day has done it, of course.

    On the whole, however, I think the 1200 calorie goal is considered a net goal by most around here.


    Sweet! Glad to hear your hair didn't fall out or you lost your period! I am barely over 1200 on exercise so I don't see anything to be afraid of but do want to take precautions.
  • rileysownerrileysowner Posts: 7,848Member Member Posts: 7,848Member Member
    I doubt that anyone would have enough energy to burn enough to be in negative calories....?

    I don't know why anyone would want to even try?
    Sounds like torture. *shrugs shoulders* :smiley:

    I could do so with a 2.5 to 3 hour bike ride, and go much further negative if I go longer. Seeing as I have done a 3 hour ride fasted, it is possible. However, I don't think I would be a happy camper only eating my calorie goal excluding exercise calories. Would it be horrible once in a while, not really, but even then it would likely hinder recovery.
  • DorkothyParkerDorkothyParker Posts: 618Member Member Posts: 618Member Member
    I agree that 1200 total can be plenty depending on your size and how you are coming to that (protein!!).
    If you don't intend to eat back your calories, maybe don't log those items that aren't intentional exercise.

    If you do find yourself eating back the calories, maybe make some observations on weight loss/gain over a period of time to determine whether you should eat them back or continue to log lifestyle activities.
  • cwolfman13cwolfman13 Posts: 36,911Member Member Posts: 36,911Member Member

    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    No...because you not giving your body any energy for basic functions...good luck with that...your hair shall be falling out soon enough, among other things if this were to be a regular occurrence...you should go check out all of the "lost my period" threads around here...they're pretty awesome.

    Wow The title was "Negative net" not Negative Nancy! Lort. Anyway, are you sure? Because if I'm eating the right amount of protein and unsaturated fat and fiber, vitamins etc.... I'm not sure how my body would not have enough energy. But that is why I started this forum. Just to be sure. And also if this only happens occasionally is it ok? Geeze! Your comment is terrifying!

    Yeah, I'm sure...

    If you're just fasting once in awhile, not a big deal...netting negative calories (as per the way MFP is designed) on a regular basis will destroy your body from the inside out.

    You already "burn" more than 1200 calories per day simply existing...probably somewhere in the neighborhood of 1400 calories or so...do you even BMR bro? So even eating 1200 calories without any exercise at all, you are not quite giving your body what it needs just for basal functions...on top of that you're burning calories doing all of your other stuff you do in a day...so, ya know you have to provide energy for that...then exercise on top of that.

    With MFP you're supposed to net to your GOAL...1200 is a fine calorie goal to net to...meaning if you eat 1200 and then exercise off 500, you should eat an additional 500 to net to your GOAL.

    I will never understand why this basic concept is so lost on so many people...
  • rileysownerrileysowner Posts: 7,848Member Member Posts: 7,848Member Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    No...because you not giving your body any energy for basic functions...good luck with that...your hair shall be falling out soon enough, among other things if this were to be a regular occurrence...you should go check out all of the "lost my period" threads around here...they're pretty awesome.

    Wow The title was "Negative net" not Negative Nancy! Lort. Anyway, are you sure? Because if I'm eating the right amount of protein and unsaturated fat and fiber, vitamins etc.... I'm not sure how my body would not have enough energy. But that is why I started this forum. Just to be sure. And also if this only happens occasionally is it ok? Geeze! Your comment is terrifying!

    Yeah, I'm sure...

    If you're just fasting once in awhile, not a big deal...netting negative calories (as per the way MFP is designed) on a regular basis will destroy your body from the inside out.

    You already "burn" more than 1200 calories per day simply existing...probably somewhere in the neighborhood of 1400 calories or so...do you even BMR bro? So even eating 1200 calories without any exercise at all, you are not quite giving your body what it needs just for basal functions...on top of that you're burning calories doing all of your other stuff you do in a day...so, ya know you have to provide energy for that...then exercise on top of that.

    With MFP you're supposed to net to your GOAL...1200 is a fine calorie goal to net to...meaning if you eat 1200 and then exercise off 500, you should eat an additional 500 to net to your GOAL.

    I will never understand why this basic concept is so lost on so many people...

    Because people don't understand the long term effect of that sort of energy deficit. They don't realize that just because they are feeling fine right now, that malnutrition is a cumulative thing, and when it shows up in visible effects difficulty sleeping, weakness, fatigue, brittle nails, losing hair, etc. the effect internally are already far progressed. For that matter, the whole concept of that weigh loss they see on the scale being mainly lean mass made up of muscles and organs seems difficult for them to believe because the scale is going down.
  • T1DCarnivoreRunnerT1DCarnivoreRunner Posts: 9,785Member Member Posts: 9,785Member Member
    I've done it, on rare occasions. It hasn't hurt me, but it is only a few times a year anyway, so not like I'm doing it all the time.
  • Christine_72Christine_72 Posts: 16,074Member Member Posts: 16,074Member Member
    I hit negative net sometimes when I was doing alternate day fasting, never saw any deleterious consequences . But I only did IF for 4mths, and I didn't get a negative regularly.

    ETA: This is assuming my fitbit is accurate, which I still have reservations about.. I think it over estimates slightly. Like yesterday i did 21,000 steps (walking, not running), 16kms, and I got an extra 909 calories.
    edited April 2016
  • wstephens87wstephens87 Posts: 156Member Member Posts: 156Member Member
    Thank you guys so much! I'm glad I asked! Otherwise I would have made it my goal each day to be close to negative not knowing the consequences! But I might fast occasionally for like a day or two if at all. Thanks again! Clocking out for the weekend!
  • NorthCascadesNorthCascades Posts: 9,355Member Member Posts: 9,355Member Member
    I doubt that anyone would have enough energy to burn enough to be in negative calories....?

    I don't know why anyone would want to even try?
    Sounds like torture. *shrugs shoulders* :smiley:

    When I go backpacking, the American kind not the European kind, meaning a hike that lasts several days, carrying your tent, sleeping bag, clothing, food, a stove, a water purifier, and everything else you need in your backpack while you hike ... the food is usually freeze dried slop. It's hard enough to hike up a mountain pass when you're not carrying a 50 pound backpack; you try to reduce weight as much as you can when you are. Including food. So, I do this sometimes for 4 or 5 days at a time in the summer. That slop, it's nasty. You lose your appetite real quick. I don't know how many calories I burn hiking 10 mountainous miles with a heavy pack, but I know by the third day I just can't stomach more than one meal.

    I had plans to hike from Easy Pass to Stehekin, but changed them on day four because I couldn't eat any more of that stuff. Decided to bail via the Thunder Creek trail which required me to hitch hike back to my car.

    So yes, it can be done. And yes, it's unpleasant. I wouldn't recommend it, but I'll do it again several times this summer. You asked "why would you even try," and my answer to that is there's a lot of beauty and not all of it is right near the road.

    Humor: Lose Weight Now With The 10,000-Foot Diet (Semi-Rad)
    edited April 2016
  • ndj1979ndj1979 Posts: 29,021Member Member Posts: 29,021Member Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    No...because you not giving your body any energy for basic functions...good luck with that...your hair shall be falling out soon enough, among other things if this were to be a regular occurrence...you should go check out all of the "lost my period" threads around here...they're pretty awesome.

    Wow The title was "Negative net" not Negative Nancy! Lort. Anyway, are you sure? Because if I'm eating the right amount of protein and unsaturated fat and fiber, vitamins etc.... I'm not sure how my body would not have enough energy. But that is why I started this forum. Just to be sure. And also if this only happens occasionally is it ok? Geeze! Your comment is terrifying!

    you won't have any energy because you are at negative calories...

  • ndj1979ndj1979 Posts: 29,021Member Member Posts: 29,021Member Member
    what did you do today to burn 1400 calories?
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