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Can diet affect your mental health?
Replies
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nokanjaijo wrote: »
Depression really just boils down to outlook. The same is true of anxiety. It's a severe dysfunction in outlook but it is outlook. In fact, a great many therapists only use medication to ease the symptoms of depression during the actual treatment which is generally something more along the lines of CBT or DBT, which are meticulous attempts to change your own ways of looking at things. Then, once you get that worked out, they can take you off the meds.
This is true for situational depression. Clinical depression, which is an issue in brain chemistry not outlook, is a completely different animal.
Therapy can help create coping mechanisms that help prevent major depressive episodes in clinical depression, but the brain chemistry still needs to be adjusted in most who have it.
11 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »Mental health is a bit broad...maybe depression. Does a bad diet contribute to Schizophrenia? BPD? Othello Syndrome? No it doesn't
@Panda8ach do you have any links to support there being any medical validity to your quoted personal opinion about diet relationship to mental health concerns that you mentioned?
You really think schizophrenia and bp can be cured by diet?
Not sure why you are asking a question about "curing" any health condition because that is a loaded word that can never be proven. I know some medical professionals and patients view one's diet may have an impact on most any health condition.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3004718/
Dietary Intake of Patients with Schizophrenia
"From a physical health perspective, the observed pattern of above-average caloric intake from a diet rich in saturated fat and sugar seems worrisome. Health burdens of such a constellation are apparent. High fat intake per se, for example, has been linked to a variety of medical problems such as coronary artery disease, hypertension, and cancer.27 It may also predispose schizophrenia patients to premature death from complications of these disorders.28 They already have a decreased life expectancy,29 and the overtly high total fat intake together with a pattern of low fruit and vegetable consumption may only accelerate this trend.
From the mental health perspective, the patients' subjective assessment of quality of life is considered to be a critical outcome variable in the care of individuals with schizophrenia.30 Patients already suffer from low quality of life inherent to the chronic nature of their illness.31 Overweight only further impairs quality of life.17 Distress related to high body weight is a modifiable factor, and the quality of life of schizophrenic patients can be improved substantially by proper weight management, apart from obvious advantages for physical health.15"
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2652467/
Schizophrenia, gluten, and low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diets: a case report and review of the literature
"Abstract
We report the unexpected resolution of longstanding schizophrenic symptoms after starting a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet. After a review of the literature, possible reasons for this include the metabolic consequences from the elimination of gluten from the diet, and the modulation of the disease of schizophrenia at the cellular level.
Conclusion
While more research is needed to confirm the association between gluten intake and schizophrenia and whether dietary change can ameliorate schizophrenic symptoms, health care providers could consider screening patients with schizophrenia for celiac disease and/or augment the medical regimen with a gluten-free or low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet."
ibpf.org/blog/how-food-changed-bipolar-disorder-me
How Food Changed Bipolar Disorder For Me
"Controlling our Bipolar Disorder is a full time job, even during the good times. We have meds, psychotherapy, and other standard treatments. However, have you considered food as a form of treatment? I've discovered there are certain foods that help me keep the Bipolar roller coaster on the up side."
Do you read the links you post? That person still takes medication and a careful read of the foods list pretty much shows a whole foods diet full of whole grains, proteins, and vegetables so he's got stable blood sugar that doesn't affect his mood. That's what he attributes his dietary intervention effectiveness to.
He's paid attention to his reactions (like headaches and brain fog) to certain things and eliminated them.
These are things any sensible person with any chronic condition who takes a proactive stance on managing their health does to better their quality of life.
It doesn't make the case for food as medicine. It might make the case for the importance of self-care and engagement in the process of such for people suffering from mental illness.
Thankfully it does make a case that food like Rx meds can help or hurt a pre existing physical and/or medical conditions.
Not necessarily. A proper diet can affect mood in anyone. I see that in my children, for pity's sake. It's more important in people with chronic conditions to be on point with diet and weight management, though. I'd agree with that.
Again, this is completely true of prescription medication.
That's not the point in question, though.
I don't know what you think the point is, then.
Not medication, certainly.
Mood isn't the sum total of mental health.
The efficacy of self-care only goes so far in having an impact on one's outlook, but that is true of people who don't struggle with mental health issues.
Thus, the thrust of the thread is really a non-starter since just about everyone feels better when they are eating a nutritious diet and getting proper sleep and exercise.
The heavy lifting in dealing with mental health issues is always going to be done with medication.
I agree that medications trump diet. I would include therapy as another strong factor. Although many may find that mood improves with diet and exercise, I knew it was time to try something different when neither of those were helping me like they had in the past. That was when I entered into counseling, and stayed with it for year. Did it fix everything, no. But it did give me strategies to cope in a different manner, and it helped to desensitize many of my raw spots. These are things that certainly wouldn't be done with food and exercise alone.
Are food and mental health related? Yes, I strongly believe this. In what manner, I'm uncertain. I think it's cyclical, and which is the precipitating factor is unclear. When I'm stressed I'm more inclined to eat less than optimal choices. At least now I don't beat myself up for it, or sit her feeling guilt and shame; perpetuating the cycle.
I think @earlnabby raised the issue earlier, and you're echoing it here. There's a chicken and egg scenario here that maybe is tangential to what some of the other posters are driving at, though.
Some of us (I'll include myself in this since I've suffered with depression in the past) have seen our mental health issue affect our ability to make optimal choices. We just don't care enough.
The other posters seem to be driving at the point that the choices affect the mental health.
I'm not sure that's entirely accurate or can be entirely entirely sorted. Again. Chicken/egg.
Some illnesses maybe related to the prenatal diet of the mother
7 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »Mental health is a bit broad...maybe depression. Does a bad diet contribute to Schizophrenia? BPD? Othello Syndrome? No it doesn't
@Panda8ach do you have any links to support there being any medical validity to your quoted personal opinion about diet relationship to mental health concerns that you mentioned?
You really think schizophrenia and bp can be cured by diet?
Not sure why you are asking a question about "curing" any health condition because that is a loaded word that can never be proven. I know some medical professionals and patients view one's diet may have an impact on most any health condition.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3004718/
Dietary Intake of Patients with Schizophrenia
"From a physical health perspective, the observed pattern of above-average caloric intake from a diet rich in saturated fat and sugar seems worrisome. Health burdens of such a constellation are apparent. High fat intake per se, for example, has been linked to a variety of medical problems such as coronary artery disease, hypertension, and cancer.27 It may also predispose schizophrenia patients to premature death from complications of these disorders.28 They already have a decreased life expectancy,29 and the overtly high total fat intake together with a pattern of low fruit and vegetable consumption may only accelerate this trend.
From the mental health perspective, the patients' subjective assessment of quality of life is considered to be a critical outcome variable in the care of individuals with schizophrenia.30 Patients already suffer from low quality of life inherent to the chronic nature of their illness.31 Overweight only further impairs quality of life.17 Distress related to high body weight is a modifiable factor, and the quality of life of schizophrenic patients can be improved substantially by proper weight management, apart from obvious advantages for physical health.15"
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2652467/
Schizophrenia, gluten, and low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diets: a case report and review of the literature
"Abstract
We report the unexpected resolution of longstanding schizophrenic symptoms after starting a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet. After a review of the literature, possible reasons for this include the metabolic consequences from the elimination of gluten from the diet, and the modulation of the disease of schizophrenia at the cellular level.
Conclusion
While more research is needed to confirm the association between gluten intake and schizophrenia and whether dietary change can ameliorate schizophrenic symptoms, health care providers could consider screening patients with schizophrenia for celiac disease and/or augment the medical regimen with a gluten-free or low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet."
ibpf.org/blog/how-food-changed-bipolar-disorder-me
How Food Changed Bipolar Disorder For Me
"Controlling our Bipolar Disorder is a full time job, even during the good times. We have meds, psychotherapy, and other standard treatments. However, have you considered food as a form of treatment? I've discovered there are certain foods that help me keep the Bipolar roller coaster on the up side."
Do you read the links you post? That person still takes medication and a careful read of the foods list pretty much shows a whole foods diet full of whole grains, proteins, and vegetables so he's got stable blood sugar that doesn't affect his mood. That's what he attributes his dietary intervention effectiveness to.
He's paid attention to his reactions (like headaches and brain fog) to certain things and eliminated them.
These are things any sensible person with any chronic condition who takes a proactive stance on managing their health does to better their quality of life.
It doesn't make the case for food as medicine. It might make the case for the importance of self-care and engagement in the process of such for people suffering from mental illness.
Thankfully it does make a case that food like Rx meds can help or hurt a pre existing physical and/or medical conditions.
Not necessarily. A proper diet can affect mood in anyone. I see that in my children, for pity's sake. It's more important in people with chronic conditions to be on point with diet and weight management, though. I'd agree with that.
Again, this is completely true of prescription medication.
That's not the point in question, though.
I don't know what you think the point is, then.
Not medication, certainly.
Mood isn't the sum total of mental health.
The efficacy of self-care only goes so far in having an impact on one's outlook, but that is true of people who don't struggle with mental health issues.
Thus, the thrust of the thread is really a non-starter since just about everyone feels better when they are eating a nutritious diet and getting proper sleep and exercise.
The heavy lifting in dealing with mental health issues is always going to be done with medication.
I agree that medications trump diet. I would include therapy as another strong factor. Although many may find that mood improves with diet and exercise, I knew it was time to try something different when neither of those were helping me like they had in the past. That was when I entered into counseling, and stayed with it for year. Did it fix everything, no. But it did give me strategies to cope in a different manner, and it helped to desensitize many of my raw spots. These are things that certainly wouldn't be done with food and exercise alone.
Are food and mental health related? Yes, I strongly believe this. In what manner, I'm uncertain. I think it's cyclical, and which is the precipitating factor is unclear. When I'm stressed I'm more inclined to eat less than optimal choices. At least now I don't beat myself up for it, or sit her feeling guilt and shame; perpetuating the cycle.
I think @earlnabby raised the issue earlier, and you're echoing it here. There's a chicken and egg scenario here that maybe is tangential to what some of the other posters are driving at, though.
Some of us (I'll include myself in this since I've suffered with depression in the past) have seen our mental health issue affect our ability to make optimal choices. We just don't care enough.
The other posters seem to be driving at the point that the choices affect the mental health.
I'm not sure that's entirely accurate or can be entirely entirely sorted. Again. Chicken/egg.
Some illnesses maybe related to the prenatal diet of the mother
Needs citation.4 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »Mental health is a bit broad...maybe depression. Does a bad diet contribute to Schizophrenia? BPD? Othello Syndrome? No it doesn't
@Panda8ach do you have any links to support there being any medical validity to your quoted personal opinion about diet relationship to mental health concerns that you mentioned?
You really think schizophrenia and bp can be cured by diet?
Not sure why you are asking a question about "curing" any health condition because that is a loaded word that can never be proven. I know some medical professionals and patients view one's diet may have an impact on most any health condition.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3004718/
Dietary Intake of Patients with Schizophrenia
"From a physical health perspective, the observed pattern of above-average caloric intake from a diet rich in saturated fat and sugar seems worrisome. Health burdens of such a constellation are apparent. High fat intake per se, for example, has been linked to a variety of medical problems such as coronary artery disease, hypertension, and cancer.27 It may also predispose schizophrenia patients to premature death from complications of these disorders.28 They already have a decreased life expectancy,29 and the overtly high total fat intake together with a pattern of low fruit and vegetable consumption may only accelerate this trend.
From the mental health perspective, the patients' subjective assessment of quality of life is considered to be a critical outcome variable in the care of individuals with schizophrenia.30 Patients already suffer from low quality of life inherent to the chronic nature of their illness.31 Overweight only further impairs quality of life.17 Distress related to high body weight is a modifiable factor, and the quality of life of schizophrenic patients can be improved substantially by proper weight management, apart from obvious advantages for physical health.15"
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2652467/
Schizophrenia, gluten, and low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diets: a case report and review of the literature
"Abstract
We report the unexpected resolution of longstanding schizophrenic symptoms after starting a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet. After a review of the literature, possible reasons for this include the metabolic consequences from the elimination of gluten from the diet, and the modulation of the disease of schizophrenia at the cellular level.
Conclusion
While more research is needed to confirm the association between gluten intake and schizophrenia and whether dietary change can ameliorate schizophrenic symptoms, health care providers could consider screening patients with schizophrenia for celiac disease and/or augment the medical regimen with a gluten-free or low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet."
ibpf.org/blog/how-food-changed-bipolar-disorder-me
How Food Changed Bipolar Disorder For Me
"Controlling our Bipolar Disorder is a full time job, even during the good times. We have meds, psychotherapy, and other standard treatments. However, have you considered food as a form of treatment? I've discovered there are certain foods that help me keep the Bipolar roller coaster on the up side."
Do you read the links you post? That person still takes medication and a careful read of the foods list pretty much shows a whole foods diet full of whole grains, proteins, and vegetables so he's got stable blood sugar that doesn't affect his mood. That's what he attributes his dietary intervention effectiveness to.
He's paid attention to his reactions (like headaches and brain fog) to certain things and eliminated them.
These are things any sensible person with any chronic condition who takes a proactive stance on managing their health does to better their quality of life.
It doesn't make the case for food as medicine. It might make the case for the importance of self-care and engagement in the process of such for people suffering from mental illness.
Thankfully it does make a case that food like Rx meds can help or hurt a pre existing physical and/or medical conditions.
Not necessarily. A proper diet can affect mood in anyone. I see that in my children, for pity's sake. It's more important in people with chronic conditions to be on point with diet and weight management, though. I'd agree with that.
Again, this is completely true of prescription medication.
That's not the point in question, though.
I don't know what you think the point is, then.
Not medication, certainly.
Mood isn't the sum total of mental health.
The efficacy of self-care only goes so far in having an impact on one's outlook, but that is true of people who don't struggle with mental health issues.
Thus, the thrust of the thread is really a non-starter since just about everyone feels better when they are eating a nutritious diet and getting proper sleep and exercise.
The heavy lifting in dealing with mental health issues is always going to be done with medication.
I agree that medications trump diet. I would include therapy as another strong factor. Although many may find that mood improves with diet and exercise, I knew it was time to try something different when neither of those were helping me like they had in the past. That was when I entered into counseling, and stayed with it for year. Did it fix everything, no. But it did give me strategies to cope in a different manner, and it helped to desensitize many of my raw spots. These are things that certainly wouldn't be done with food and exercise alone.
Are food and mental health related? Yes, I strongly believe this. In what manner, I'm uncertain. I think it's cyclical, and which is the precipitating factor is unclear. When I'm stressed I'm more inclined to eat less than optimal choices. At least now I don't beat myself up for it, or sit her feeling guilt and shame; perpetuating the cycle.
I think @earlnabby raised the issue earlier, and you're echoing it here. There's a chicken and egg scenario here that maybe is tangential to what some of the other posters are driving at, though.
Some of us (I'll include myself in this since I've suffered with depression in the past) have seen our mental health issue affect our ability to make optimal choices. We just don't care enough.
The other posters seem to be driving at the point that the choices affect the mental health.
I'm not sure that's entirely accurate or can be entirely entirely sorted. Again. Chicken/egg.
Some illnesses maybe related to the prenatal diet of the mother
Needs citation.
You mean rather than just vague woman shaming? As if pregnant women don't have enough to worry about with you know, growing a baby. Now we are going to get some dubious examples with no causative links which will no doubt suggest that a disease that crops up in adulthood can be attributed to something that was consumed (or not consumed) by the mother during pregnancy?8 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »Mental health is a bit broad...maybe depression. Does a bad diet contribute to Schizophrenia? BPD? Othello Syndrome? No it doesn't
@Panda8ach do you have any links to support there being any medical validity to your quoted personal opinion about diet relationship to mental health concerns that you mentioned?
You really think schizophrenia and bp can be cured by diet?
Not sure why you are asking a question about "curing" any health condition because that is a loaded word that can never be proven. I know some medical professionals and patients view one's diet may have an impact on most any health condition.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3004718/
Dietary Intake of Patients with Schizophrenia
"From a physical health perspective, the observed pattern of above-average caloric intake from a diet rich in saturated fat and sugar seems worrisome. Health burdens of such a constellation are apparent. High fat intake per se, for example, has been linked to a variety of medical problems such as coronary artery disease, hypertension, and cancer.27 It may also predispose schizophrenia patients to premature death from complications of these disorders.28 They already have a decreased life expectancy,29 and the overtly high total fat intake together with a pattern of low fruit and vegetable consumption may only accelerate this trend.
From the mental health perspective, the patients' subjective assessment of quality of life is considered to be a critical outcome variable in the care of individuals with schizophrenia.30 Patients already suffer from low quality of life inherent to the chronic nature of their illness.31 Overweight only further impairs quality of life.17 Distress related to high body weight is a modifiable factor, and the quality of life of schizophrenic patients can be improved substantially by proper weight management, apart from obvious advantages for physical health.15"
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2652467/
Schizophrenia, gluten, and low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diets: a case report and review of the literature
"Abstract
We report the unexpected resolution of longstanding schizophrenic symptoms after starting a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet. After a review of the literature, possible reasons for this include the metabolic consequences from the elimination of gluten from the diet, and the modulation of the disease of schizophrenia at the cellular level.
Conclusion
While more research is needed to confirm the association between gluten intake and schizophrenia and whether dietary change can ameliorate schizophrenic symptoms, health care providers could consider screening patients with schizophrenia for celiac disease and/or augment the medical regimen with a gluten-free or low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet."
ibpf.org/blog/how-food-changed-bipolar-disorder-me
How Food Changed Bipolar Disorder For Me
"Controlling our Bipolar Disorder is a full time job, even during the good times. We have meds, psychotherapy, and other standard treatments. However, have you considered food as a form of treatment? I've discovered there are certain foods that help me keep the Bipolar roller coaster on the up side."
Do you read the links you post? That person still takes medication and a careful read of the foods list pretty much shows a whole foods diet full of whole grains, proteins, and vegetables so he's got stable blood sugar that doesn't affect his mood. That's what he attributes his dietary intervention effectiveness to.
He's paid attention to his reactions (like headaches and brain fog) to certain things and eliminated them.
These are things any sensible person with any chronic condition who takes a proactive stance on managing their health does to better their quality of life.
It doesn't make the case for food as medicine. It might make the case for the importance of self-care and engagement in the process of such for people suffering from mental illness.
Thankfully it does make a case that food like Rx meds can help or hurt a pre existing physical and/or medical conditions.
Not necessarily. A proper diet can affect mood in anyone. I see that in my children, for pity's sake. It's more important in people with chronic conditions to be on point with diet and weight management, though. I'd agree with that.
Again, this is completely true of prescription medication.
That's not the point in question, though.
I don't know what you think the point is, then.
Not medication, certainly.
Mood isn't the sum total of mental health.
The efficacy of self-care only goes so far in having an impact on one's outlook, but that is true of people who don't struggle with mental health issues.
Thus, the thrust of the thread is really a non-starter since just about everyone feels better when they are eating a nutritious diet and getting proper sleep and exercise.
The heavy lifting in dealing with mental health issues is always going to be done with medication.
I agree that medications trump diet. I would include therapy as another strong factor. Although many may find that mood improves with diet and exercise, I knew it was time to try something different when neither of those were helping me like they had in the past. That was when I entered into counseling, and stayed with it for year. Did it fix everything, no. But it did give me strategies to cope in a different manner, and it helped to desensitize many of my raw spots. These are things that certainly wouldn't be done with food and exercise alone.
Are food and mental health related? Yes, I strongly believe this. In what manner, I'm uncertain. I think it's cyclical, and which is the precipitating factor is unclear. When I'm stressed I'm more inclined to eat less than optimal choices. At least now I don't beat myself up for it, or sit her feeling guilt and shame; perpetuating the cycle.
I think @earlnabby raised the issue earlier, and you're echoing it here. There's a chicken and egg scenario here that maybe is tangential to what some of the other posters are driving at, though.
Some of us (I'll include myself in this since I've suffered with depression in the past) have seen our mental health issue affect our ability to make optimal choices. We just don't care enough.
The other posters seem to be driving at the point that the choices affect the mental health.
I'm not sure that's entirely accurate or can be entirely entirely sorted. Again. Chicken/egg.
Some illnesses maybe related to the prenatal diet of the mother
Needs citation.
Probably lectins or something.16 -
WinoGelato wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »Mental health is a bit broad...maybe depression. Does a bad diet contribute to Schizophrenia? BPD? Othello Syndrome? No it doesn't
@Panda8ach do you have any links to support there being any medical validity to your quoted personal opinion about diet relationship to mental health concerns that you mentioned?
You really think schizophrenia and bp can be cured by diet?
Not sure why you are asking a question about "curing" any health condition because that is a loaded word that can never be proven. I know some medical professionals and patients view one's diet may have an impact on most any health condition.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3004718/
Dietary Intake of Patients with Schizophrenia
"From a physical health perspective, the observed pattern of above-average caloric intake from a diet rich in saturated fat and sugar seems worrisome. Health burdens of such a constellation are apparent. High fat intake per se, for example, has been linked to a variety of medical problems such as coronary artery disease, hypertension, and cancer.27 It may also predispose schizophrenia patients to premature death from complications of these disorders.28 They already have a decreased life expectancy,29 and the overtly high total fat intake together with a pattern of low fruit and vegetable consumption may only accelerate this trend.
From the mental health perspective, the patients' subjective assessment of quality of life is considered to be a critical outcome variable in the care of individuals with schizophrenia.30 Patients already suffer from low quality of life inherent to the chronic nature of their illness.31 Overweight only further impairs quality of life.17 Distress related to high body weight is a modifiable factor, and the quality of life of schizophrenic patients can be improved substantially by proper weight management, apart from obvious advantages for physical health.15"
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2652467/
Schizophrenia, gluten, and low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diets: a case report and review of the literature
"Abstract
We report the unexpected resolution of longstanding schizophrenic symptoms after starting a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet. After a review of the literature, possible reasons for this include the metabolic consequences from the elimination of gluten from the diet, and the modulation of the disease of schizophrenia at the cellular level.
Conclusion
While more research is needed to confirm the association between gluten intake and schizophrenia and whether dietary change can ameliorate schizophrenic symptoms, health care providers could consider screening patients with schizophrenia for celiac disease and/or augment the medical regimen with a gluten-free or low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet."
ibpf.org/blog/how-food-changed-bipolar-disorder-me
How Food Changed Bipolar Disorder For Me
"Controlling our Bipolar Disorder is a full time job, even during the good times. We have meds, psychotherapy, and other standard treatments. However, have you considered food as a form of treatment? I've discovered there are certain foods that help me keep the Bipolar roller coaster on the up side."
Do you read the links you post? That person still takes medication and a careful read of the foods list pretty much shows a whole foods diet full of whole grains, proteins, and vegetables so he's got stable blood sugar that doesn't affect his mood. That's what he attributes his dietary intervention effectiveness to.
He's paid attention to his reactions (like headaches and brain fog) to certain things and eliminated them.
These are things any sensible person with any chronic condition who takes a proactive stance on managing their health does to better their quality of life.
It doesn't make the case for food as medicine. It might make the case for the importance of self-care and engagement in the process of such for people suffering from mental illness.
Thankfully it does make a case that food like Rx meds can help or hurt a pre existing physical and/or medical conditions.
Not necessarily. A proper diet can affect mood in anyone. I see that in my children, for pity's sake. It's more important in people with chronic conditions to be on point with diet and weight management, though. I'd agree with that.
Again, this is completely true of prescription medication.
That's not the point in question, though.
I don't know what you think the point is, then.
Not medication, certainly.
Mood isn't the sum total of mental health.
The efficacy of self-care only goes so far in having an impact on one's outlook, but that is true of people who don't struggle with mental health issues.
Thus, the thrust of the thread is really a non-starter since just about everyone feels better when they are eating a nutritious diet and getting proper sleep and exercise.
The heavy lifting in dealing with mental health issues is always going to be done with medication.
I agree that medications trump diet. I would include therapy as another strong factor. Although many may find that mood improves with diet and exercise, I knew it was time to try something different when neither of those were helping me like they had in the past. That was when I entered into counseling, and stayed with it for year. Did it fix everything, no. But it did give me strategies to cope in a different manner, and it helped to desensitize many of my raw spots. These are things that certainly wouldn't be done with food and exercise alone.
Are food and mental health related? Yes, I strongly believe this. In what manner, I'm uncertain. I think it's cyclical, and which is the precipitating factor is unclear. When I'm stressed I'm more inclined to eat less than optimal choices. At least now I don't beat myself up for it, or sit her feeling guilt and shame; perpetuating the cycle.
I think @earlnabby raised the issue earlier, and you're echoing it here. There's a chicken and egg scenario here that maybe is tangential to what some of the other posters are driving at, though.
Some of us (I'll include myself in this since I've suffered with depression in the past) have seen our mental health issue affect our ability to make optimal choices. We just don't care enough.
The other posters seem to be driving at the point that the choices affect the mental health.
I'm not sure that's entirely accurate or can be entirely entirely sorted. Again. Chicken/egg.
Some illnesses maybe related to the prenatal diet of the mother
Needs citation.
You mean rather than just vague woman shaming? As if pregnant women don't have enough to worry about with you know, growing a baby. Now we are going to get some dubious examples with no causative links which will no doubt suggest that a disease that crops up in adulthood can be attributed to something that was consumed (or not consumed) by the mother during pregnancy?
Yeah, but I was going to wait for the no doubt dubious links to see just how egregious they were before making these points.
Thanks for starting the ball rolling.
You have alluded, with your comment about woman shaming, with my favorite argument against the food-as-medicine crowd, and that is the inherent victim-blaming in their position. I find it appalling.8 -
What some females are saying in peer reviewed papers today with training and knowledge on the subject of the impact of prenatal diet on future mental illnesses!
This is not a male vs. female issue but a human race concern were prevention may change the future of our children for the better as one can read in the full peer reviewed article or clips from it below. I think it is time to stop playing the blame game and start preventing as much future mental illness as possible by diet and other means. The dark past is in the past but humans should work to insure our dark past does not become the dark future for our future kids.
Preventing mental health problems in offspring by targeting dietary intake of pregnant women.
https://bmcmedicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12916-014-0208-0
"The role of maternal dietary intake, specifically, has been highlighted after recent studies have shown maternal diet quality to predict mental health problems in offspring......"
Discussion
Here, we consider these findings in the context of the primary prevention of mental disorders and argue that interventions that target maternal diet could be of significant value.
Summary
It is clear that, in order to reduce the burden of mental health issues across the lifespan, urgent action is required, particularly in the field of prevention. We thus call for the application and evaluation of targeted, primary prevention strategies that focus on dietary intake with the view to improve mental health outcomes of mothers and offspring during the postnatal period and beyond.
The role of habitual diet and mental disorders
Recent evidence from observational studies suggests that habitual dietary intake can play a fundamental role in the risk for and progression of common mental disorders [12],[13].
Habitual diet is linked to mental health problems in children and adolescents......A number of studies in this area have demonstrated that `unhealthy’ childhood dietary patterns are linked to poorer mental health........A consistent trend was observed for the relationship between good diet quality and better mental health, and some evidence for poor diet quality being related to worse mental health.......
Maternal diet is a predictor of poor mental health of offspring
There is an established link between maternal diet and neurological, immunological, and central nervous system development of offspring, all of which can play a crucial role in the subsequent development of mental disorders......
Discussion
Primary prevention of mental health problems in offspring requires effective prevention and treatment of symptoms in mothers
We first need to acknowledge that maternal depression exacerbates a child’s risk of developing a mental disorder later in life. The presence of antenatal depression equates to a five-fold increase in offspring developing the condition by the time they are a teenager [2]. The reasons for this are multifaceted and likely have an epigenetic and behavioral basis [28]. For example, the evidence suggests that maternal depression is linked to being non-responsive to infant needs [29] and to compromised postnatal behaviors, including inadequate or absence of breastfeeding [30]. Breastfeeding is considered optimal nutrition in the first six months of life [31] for the infant due to its ability to support and develop a baby’s immune system [32], as well as prevention of later obesity, metabolic syndrome, cardiovascular disease, and behavioral and emotional problems in the child [14]......
`Whole-diet’ approach may be effective for the primary prevention of mental disorders'
Summary
Diet is a key modifiable risk factor for the development of non-communicable diseases, yet its role in the onset of mental disorders has received much less attention until very recently. There is now consistent evidence providing support for diet quality as a risk factor for depression. Evidence highlighting the potency of maternal diet on the mental health of offspring is emerging and is likely driven by diet-induced phenotypic changes at periconception and/or perinatally. This suggests that there may be great potential to target dietary intake during these pivotal times of fetal development. This paper has focused on the role of the perinatal and the `true’ postnatal period in which dietary intake has been demonstrated to be so important and which provides an accessible inflection point for intervention with women. That said, however, the importance of good quality dietary intake during early childhood and adolescence should not be ignored in the context of ameliorating risk of onset of a mental disorder. It is clear that in order to reduce the burden of mental health issues across the lifespan, urgent action is required, particularly in the field of prevention. We thus call for the application and evaluation of targeted, primary prevention strategies that focus on dietary intake with the view to improve mental health outcomes of mothers and offspring during the postnatal period and beyond.
9 -
Jeffagner2 wrote: »For me, eliminating sugar and eating unrefined, unprocessed whole foods has been nothing short of a miracle cure for the clinical depression I have battled since childhood. Way more effective than Zoloft.
@Jeffagner2 thanks for sharing your awesome success story by changing your diet. Many of us have experience both physical and mental health improvements when we found the right diet at works for us. Welcome to MFP and best of continued success.2 -
While what we eat can help/worsen certain issues, I believe people over-emphasise its importance and build unrealistic expectations. This is understandable since it's one of the few things that can affect health that we can actually control, and in some way it turns into this source of moral value and personal pride, but words like "prevent" and "cure" are dangerous, and we risk developing a narrow vision with the tendency to cherry pick whatever agrees with our views to make ourselves feel we made the right choices on something as essential as health. Not every health issue is our doing and not every health issue can be solved with personal effort. It's okay to admit that sometimes things just happen and we are not responsible for them.8
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I really wish that going gluten-free/low carb had any affect on my ex-husband's paranoid schizophrenia.
Unfortuantely, I saw no positive changes in him when he changed his diet to this. I did, however, discover that his condition worsened considerably when he quit taking his medications and attending regular therapy sessions. I was never able to decide if he made those decisions becuase the mental illness was manifesting in more drastic manners or the disease became worse because of the decisions. Most likely it was a positive feedback loop and both were true.
This is not an exhaustive study. It is the experience of one woman who lived with a paranoid schizophrenic man for 4 years and had 7 total years involvement with that man. For him, dietary changes had no observable effect.5 -
Tankiscool wrote: »Diet as what meaning? What someone eats? Or when someone is in a calorie deficit. Either way one could argue there is a very likely chance. When you go on a "diet" meaning you are eating less to loose weight you put stress on your body, top that with a moderate exercise regimen and your stressing it even more. We all know how stress can affect us mentally. The other way of what someones diet is when they eat *kitten*, they feel like *kitten*.
Interestingly, I am far more stressed when I eat like s.h.i.t and don't exercise than when I manage my caloric intake and exercise almost daily.
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Mental health is not one simple issue. For those who have issues there is an individual reason, it may well share factors from this or that wider umbrella but it comes down to what that single person needs.
I find it frightening that here in the UK, NICE, the committee who stays what is and what is not good practice here, goes against what most of the rest of the world sees as good practice. My pet peve is their refusal to permit the testing of a full panel of thyroid hormones. Particullarly the t3 levels. I can't remember the full title of this hormone. In many medical texts t3 is referred to as, the brain hormone, the brain needs it almost more than any other of our organs. Part of the problem is this hormone comes in two variants, t3 as mentioned and revere t3, reversion happens when someone is lacking vitamins and minerals to facilitate conversion of t4 the first stage thyroid hormone into the t3 or if there are any reverse t3 which will not fit into the receptors in each cell. If you read the literature, thyroid support sites, medical papers you can read all this for yourself. Many other illnesses encompass symptoms like those experienced by the hypo person, hyper brings its own issues but I've not researched these.
(being hypothyroid is sub divided into those who are iodine deficient, dietary and those who are experiencing an autoimmune attack on the thyroid and potentially other organs. The general medical principal is not to address thyroid antibodies, in the hypothyroid situation, their causes are complex, when in all other conditions this is the first line of action)
A couple of years ago a London hospital did research into anorexia, one of the outcomes was that where a person is given t3 supplementation their symptoms decreased and many recovered. This was part of a radio programme. I wonder now how those person are getting on now because t3 here is, according to those who know, totally irrelevant. It only has significance in PCOS, Diabetes, liver dysfunction and many more life limiting issues including mental health. I know they are throwing the baby out with the bath water here.
To take up Gale's input on the impact of prenatal maternal health. It is frightening. I consider I was born with a perfectly functioning body, you reading this are of the same opinion, your body a birth was perfect and worked to perfection. Only now scientific research is revealing that we as a species have reduced the microbes in our diet by being selective in our choice of foods and having the species we eat selected for us. One, I hate to call them, Tribe, I have no preferable word, these people are still living in their natural way and have many times the digestive microbes than we do. One of the scientific researchers took it on himself to do a faecal transplant from one from the group. His volume of Microbes were tested daily before and after and it took 3 months for the additional species to reduce because he was not eating the roots the tribe does. The theory behind this is our lack of microbes contributes to IBS and similar health issues. (The food programme, one in 2016 and others 17)
There is research out there which cites the difference in health between C-section and virginal birth children. I doubt any woman would opt for a c-section without strong medical advice, so please, not criticising any one, I'd have done it for mine had it been necessary. Children born by C-section have fewer digestive microbes than the others. It is simply a fact of the situation. Lacking different microbes causes health issues, there are substantial differences one to another. Even mothers who have taken even a few rounds of antibiotics, or used large amounts of over the counter pain relief or even had a restricted diet are also at risk of passing on fewer microbes than our great grandmothers did.
Another thing I have come across in my search for my own health salvation is the role mitochondria plays in our health, tucked away doing their own thing they can be diminished by too little of this or that essential substance. It is such a broad subject. In the UK there has been discussion, replacement of a mothers mitochondria with another's can, in vitro, save the much wanted child from some disabling problem which has devastated the lives of many in that family.
I think someone earlier mentioned vitamin b 12 deficiency. B 12 requires the presence of what the identifying scientists called "the intrinsic factor" because without it, a body is unable to transport this vital vitamin to its point of absorption. Many in the medical profession see a good haemoglobin count and never test the ferritin levels. Many are low in b12 and ferritin, left to suffer. Recent investigations have linked low b12 to dementure in the elderly.
If you add the role chemicals play in our modern lives. All these things can put pressure on the liver and other organs in our elimination systems. At my worst I could not go out for the smells in my environment of others laundry residues, cleaning products, I gave up cosmetics a life time ago. It took me a long time to realise it was the polluted air, from perfumes, laundry residues, news print and more on a bus which was making me ill not the movement of the bus. Many consider sick building syndrome to be fake, the build up of moulds in our buildings can cause a wide spectrum of health issues, (I include mental health problems)
Western medicine separates the systems of our bodies by function it does not consider the interactions of our organs. The growing movement identify these interaction and solutions is improving peoples health, be it general health or mental health.
There will never be one simple answer to mental health conditions. I hope there will be additions and alternatives to the prescribed chemicals which are being give to people with limited effect in some/many cases.
It is surprising how many of these problems I have identified are possibly present in autistic people. We are personal health jigsaw puzzles.
I look forward to the woo button being used, if you have read me, an elderly biddy who has gone out to search for her own answers to a broad spectrum of issues, who is in better health than at the age of 40, I've at least given you food for thought.8 -
Tankiscool wrote: »Diet as what meaning? What someone eats? Or when someone is in a calorie deficit. Either way one could argue there is a very likely chance. When you go on a "diet" meaning you are eating less to loose weight you put stress on your body, top that with a moderate exercise regimen and your stressing it even more. We all know how stress can affect us mentally. The other way of what someones diet is when they eat *kitten*, they feel like *kitten*.
Interestingly, I am far more stressed when I eat like s.h.i.t and don't exercise than when I manage my caloric intake and exercise almost daily.
I feel the same, but I would attribute it more to exercise than to diet. The exception might be diet extremes, such as when I haven't been getting adequate nutrition and/or when I severely overeat/binge.
1 -
goldthistime wrote: »Tankiscool wrote: »Diet as what meaning? What someone eats? Or when someone is in a calorie deficit. Either way one could argue there is a very likely chance. When you go on a "diet" meaning you are eating less to loose weight you put stress on your body, top that with a moderate exercise regimen and your stressing it even more. We all know how stress can affect us mentally. The other way of what someones diet is when they eat *kitten*, they feel like *kitten*.
Interestingly, I am far more stressed when I eat like s.h.i.t and don't exercise than when I manage my caloric intake and exercise almost daily.
I feel the same, but I would attribute it more to exercise than to diet. The exception might be diet extremes, such as when I haven't been getting adequate nutrition and/or when I severely overeat/binge.
This is exactly the same for me.
Another factor is that when I'm super stressed or life feels unmanageable and overwhelming my (dysfunctional) response tends to be to let things go. When I stop thinking that the stressful things mean that I cannot live my normal life at all and make room for the things I normally do -- morning prayer or meditation, exercise, doing the dishes, making dinner, so on, I feel way less stressed. I'd include eating decent meals/healthfully as part of that. Basically a minimum of self care and routine and taking control of what can be controlled.
Nothing to do with specific foods making a difference.
Another thought I have is that when I first started I'd been super stressed and anxious and very down (not what I think of as the darkest times, but definitely lots of bad days). I put together a weight loss plan, forced myself to get on the scale (which I'd been scared to do for ages), deal with the number, started including some more activity in my days, journaling some related to my plan, and eating much better in that I was eating regular meals, no snacking, AND cut out added sugar (experiment) and grains (more than that really, as I tried a paleo thing). I was probably low-ish carb (around 100 g), and I was low cal (1200 or so).
I felt immediately great, which I at first attributed to no sugar or lower carbs.
After about a month I added back some grains (more legumes -- I don't care that much about grains) and some added sugar (indeed, I started having dessert occasionally after dinner). I kept up with everything else, and I felt as good or better.
Much, much later, after I had lost most of the weight (and NOT eaten low carb to get there, more like 40%, and not kept added sugar out of my diet, although -- as before I lost weight -- I wasn't really a sugar monster and also always ate lots of vegetables), I started feeling down (the dark days) and anxious and angry and various old bugaboos again (related to past trauma plus the fact I do think I'm just genetically inclined toward depression in that it's common in my family). I actually went through a very bad time about a year (bit more) ago. I tried (among other things) cutting out added sugar and grains again, even though I no longer thought it was really the reason for my positive change before and it did no good. Ultimately I decided to deal with some stuff through therapy.
Once again I find that when I take control of small things I can, which include eating well and exercising, it helps. But the idea that a specific diet makes all the difference, no, and my attribution of the change back when I started this weight loss to the diet change was clearly, in retrospect, a misattribution.1 -
The study that Gale posted was indeed interesting, however, it shouldn't be viewed as he's thinking it should.
You won't eradicate "the dark days of the past" with good maternal nutrition.
My mother had perfectly fine maternal nutrition while she was pregnant with me.
Mental illness has existed for millennia. Granted, there were times of poverty and people had poor diets then. But wealthy people whose mothers had access to perfectly fine diets have had fallen victim to it.
Those of you who think the answer to it is to be found in proper diet really, really have no clue.
Perhaps there might be fewer people dealing with it, but then maybe, just maybe, the root cause of their issues is nutritional and the symptoms are those usually displayed by those having mental illness. In other words, it's not the same disease pathology.
I can give a personal example where I had the symptoms of one disease, but the cause was one of my autoimmune conditions, for example.
Depression, for example, is a side-effect of some diseases like chronic migraine.
It can become pretty bad. That doesn't mean that a person with chronic migraines is clinically depressed.
Clinical depression is its own disease state. The root cause of a person suffering from clinical depression is different from someone suffering from depression due to chronic pain.
Likewise, someone who has nutritional deficiencies that bring on depression would be suffering from a different disease state than someone who has genuine clinical depression.9 -
I've had an additional thought I'd like to add. I didn't go looking at the linked studies, but I'd be interested to see the confounding factors in the women who had poor diets while pregnant.
Correlation doesn't necessarily mean causation, and those confounders could just as likely play a role.
Given that the main thrust of the argument was built on a cohort study, all you have are correlative findings, and there will be a whole host of confounding variables at play.
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Tankiscool wrote: »Diet as what meaning? What someone eats? Or when someone is in a calorie deficit. Either way one could argue there is a very likely chance. When you go on a "diet" meaning you are eating less to loose weight you put stress on your body, top that with a moderate exercise regimen and your stressing it even more. We all know how stress can affect us mentally. The other way of what someones diet is when they eat *kitten*, they feel like *kitten*.
Interestingly, I am far more stressed when I eat like s.h.i.t and don't exercise than when I manage my caloric intake and exercise almost daily.
I am just the opposite. I eat like *kitten* when I am stressed, not the other way around.3 -
As someone who has struggled with mental health issues AND with weight issues I firmly believe that my depression causes me to eat poorly and too much, not the other way around. I was at a healthy weight and ate well before the depression first hit in college. After that, I have struggled with both.
I have my own depression scale:- Even keel. Doing well, in control, able to just glide over whatever waves come my way.
- My eating habits go south. This is the first indicator that I am at the top of a spiral. If I can get my eating back on track, I often am able to halt an oncoming depressive episode
- My housekeeping goes south
- My personal care (showering, getting dressed, etc) goes bad
- I spend all day in bed with books and food.
Yes, my eating and exercise habits are firmly entwined with my mental health but it is a symptom, not a cause of depression.
Yup, this is me. I still haven't learned to catch it when the eating habits go south. It's usually about the time I go looking for a clean dish and notice the sink is full and I have a slice of pizza in my hand that I realize all is not well in Siegfriedland5 -
So someone was telling me the other day about how mentally unwell people tend to have bad diets and a higher risk for obesity. I looked this up and it's somewhat true. However, this person claimed that these people were mentally unwell BECAUSE they had a bad diet. This didn't make sense to me. I always thought that the mental illness came first and because of the illness, the person then has zero energy or motivation to shop, cook, etc and so often just eats crisps, microwave meals, takeaways/fast food etc which then leads to comorbid factors like obesity. What do you think?
I haven't read through all the pages of comments, so I don't know if someone mentioned Vitamin D.
Low Vitamin D can result in many problems, including depression or a down in the dumps mood. Here's one article, but there are thousands more online: http://www.prevention.com/health/symptoms-of-vitamin-d-deficiency/slide/5
(Low Vitamin D also increases the risk of colon polyps, the major cause of colon cancer, plus a higher risk of fractures and many other problems. A simple blood test can tell whether you have the deficiency).3 -
I'm schizophrenic. Diet doesn't affect that at all. I also suffer from anxiety and depression, which gets WAY better when I am eating healthier and not overeating, and exercising.
So some mental illnesses are 100% how the brain is wired, and anxiety and depression can very much be affected or brought on by what and how much food you eat. That's just from my personal experience and from others who have been hospitalized and in treatment with me. 6
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