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What the Health?
Replies
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cwolfman13 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
.
I always present a challenge to my meat eating friends. Let's take a blood test and compare results. Then we can go from there. Nevertheless, I remember the days when I used to bash on vegans. In fact, I thought it was a satanic cult when I first heard about it.
I eat meat...all of my blood work is in the optimal range.
I'm not bashing vegans...it's a fine way to eat...but to suggest that people who eat meat can't be healthy is ridiculous. Some of the healthiest populations in the world eat meat. I also eat a ton of veg...for whatever reason it seems vegans and vegetarians think that because you eat meat automatically means you don't eat veg...I eat more veg than my wife's vegan girlfriend who is obese af...
And give me a break...sauteing cigarettes and saying that is the same as eating meat is over the top absurd and makes you and anyone who thinks this crockumentary is factual a fool...
Also, the China Study has many critics within the scientific community who have looked at what Campbell published vs the studies actual findings...they are critical, because they don't jive...
I'll put it more succinctly than that: The China Study has been scientifically shown to be a steaming pile of poo, based upon pseudoscience and cherry-picked study facts. It's about as credible as the "research" presented by Flat Earthers.
What the Health is an agenda-driven, hype-laden, fearmongering mockumentary which has been repeatedly dismantled (even by multiple pro-vegan authorities/sources) in the short span of its existence.9 -
rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
.
I always present a challenge to my meat eating friends. Let's take a blood test and compare results. Then we can go from there. Nevertheless, I remember the days when I used to bash on vegans. In fact, I thought it was a satanic cult when I first heard about it.
My blood work panel actually got worse while I was doing my low fat/higher carb plant based experiment. I went in expecting to see improvements on my already good numbers and instead saw my numbers go in a negative direction-the first time this has happened in 5 years, (and I get blood work panels done twice a year). Going LFHC plant based did nothing beneficial for my health and instead I had some pretty crappy side affects from it. Ended up ditching it and reintroduced dairy and meat and I feel a lot better now. I go in for my next blood work in October and it will be interesting to see how that panel compares to the one I had while I was doing my plant based experiment, from earlier this year....2 -
rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
What specific claims?3 -
rashadlc1980 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
It's T. Colin Campbell, by the way, not Thomas M. Campbell. Neither man has an unchallenged claim to non-bias, there are serious concerns about claims made by both.
The film itself is receiving criticism from science-based vegans, including RD Virginia Messina. Making claims that aren't backed by the facts is actually a poor form of vegan advocacy. If people know we're lying or being deceptive about the health risks of meat or the benefits of veganism, they will (legitimately) wonder if vegans are lying about other things as well. Here is a link to Messina's recent critique: https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Thanks for the correction. I'm sure there are claims that are against it. Isn't that with everything? So sometimes I have to put the tests to myself. A group of friends started this high carb low fat. 1 was diabetic, Myself, suffered from gout. 8 out of 9 were able to improve every health area of their low, from low t, (my gout) , and diabetes. This was months before the documentary came out. The one that wasn't successful, actually tried, but had also suffered from other health issues, that are probably best with pharmeceutical drugs. We are all plant based now and haven't turned back. The biggest benefits was high energy. Most of us work office jobs.
The point of this all: There's always going to be criticism, There's always going to be a new study that will debunk something, including the vegan lifestyle. It's always best to try and test for yourself instead of using another mans claim. I put it to the test and it's the best lifestyle. I can't speak for anyone else. just me!
You hear exactly the same claims from the people who do the exact opposite of you. Those extremely low carb keto eaters whose diets are mostly meat based.
It's all confirmation bias.
However, do you know what is proven to make you healthier? Getting to a normal weight range and eating an overall healthy diet, regardless the amount of carbs or fat you're eating.7 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
.
I always present a challenge to my meat eating friends. Let's take a blood test and compare results. Then we can go from there. Nevertheless, I remember the days when I used to bash on vegans. In fact, I thought it was a satanic cult when I first heard about it.
I eat meat...all of my blood work is in the optimal range.
I'm not bashing vegans...it's a fine way to eat...but to suggest that people who eat meat can't be healthy is ridiculous. Some of the healthiest populations in the world eat meat. I also eat a ton of veg...for whatever reason it seems vegans and vegetarians think that because you eat meat automatically means you don't eat veg...I eat more veg than my wife's vegan girlfriend who is obese af...
And give me a break...sauteing cigarettes and saying that is the same as eating meat is over the top absurd and makes you and anyone who thinks this crockumentary is factual a fool...
wouldn't cigarettes technically qualify as vegan?2 -
[/quote]
Not sure what you think that would prove? It sounds like you think a meat-eating friend with your stats would automatically have a less healthy blood panel.
eta: Have you ever actually done this?[/quote]
Only to myself, the before and after. I have presented a comparison with a couple of friends of mine but none have taken their blood test.
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stanmann571 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
.
I always present a challenge to my meat eating friends. Let's take a blood test and compare results. Then we can go from there. Nevertheless, I remember the days when I used to bash on vegans. In fact, I thought it was a satanic cult when I first heard about it.
I eat meat...all of my blood work is in the optimal range.
I'm not bashing vegans...it's a fine way to eat...but to suggest that people who eat meat can't be healthy is ridiculous. Some of the healthiest populations in the world eat meat. I also eat a ton of veg...for whatever reason it seems vegans and vegetarians think that because you eat meat automatically means you don't eat veg...I eat more veg than my wife's vegan girlfriend who is obese af...
And give me a break...sauteing cigarettes and saying that is the same as eating meat is over the top absurd and makes you and anyone who thinks this crockumentary is factual a fool...
wouldn't cigarettes technically qualify as vegan?
Just because it's vegan, doesn't mean it's healthy. I can load up on vegan junk food all day and saturated oils, but doesn't mean it's a wise choice.
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lemurcat12 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
What specific claims?
The scientific claims from the China Study. Not just a film or a blog I read, but the actually 300 + page book that I picked up from the book store. It's backed by scientific studies.14 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
It's T. Colin Campbell, by the way, not Thomas M. Campbell. Neither man has an unchallenged claim to non-bias, there are serious concerns about claims made by both.
The film itself is receiving criticism from science-based vegans, including RD Virginia Messina. Making claims that aren't backed by the facts is actually a poor form of vegan advocacy. If people know we're lying or being deceptive about the health risks of meat or the benefits of veganism, they will (legitimately) wonder if vegans are lying about other things as well. Here is a link to Messina's recent critique: https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Thanks for the correction. I'm sure there are claims that are against it. Isn't that with everything? So sometimes I have to put the tests to myself. A group of friends started this high carb low fat. 1 was diabetic, Myself, suffered from gout. 8 out of 9 were able to improve every health area of their low, from low t, (my gout) , and diabetes. This was months before the documentary came out. The one that wasn't successful, actually tried, but had also suffered from other health issues, that are probably best with pharmeceutical drugs. We are all plant based now and haven't turned back. The biggest benefits was high energy. Most of us work office jobs.
The point of this all: There's always going to be criticism, There's always going to be a new study that will debunk something, including the vegan lifestyle. It's always best to try and test for yourself instead of using another mans claim. I put it to the test and it's the best lifestyle. I can't speak for anyone else. just me!
Pretty much anyone who moves away from the SAD is going to experience improved health and improved health markers...I eat a balanced diet consisting mostly of whole foods...lots of veg and fruit, some whole grains, legumes, lentils, etc....i also eat quite a bit of fish and other lean sourced protein and beef about once per week...all of my health markers went from my doctor telling me I'd probably be sick if not dead by 60 if I didn't get it together to being optimal...and I eat meat.
Nobody is saying a plant based/vegan diet isn't healthy...it's just that there are many ways of eating healthy and the preachy thing gets a bit old and crockumentaries like this are big time on fear mongering propaganda to further an agenda.
One of my wife's very good friends is a vegan...she is obese...she has about zero fitness. Both my wife and I are carnivores that eat an overall healthy and balanced diet consisting of mostly whole foods...we are both lean and fit and have optimal health markers...
I know plenty of vegans that are unhealthy. The ones I came across just eats a bunch of Oreo cookies and low activity.4 -
rashadlc1980 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
What specific claims?
The scientific claims from the China Study. Not just a film or a blog I read, but the actually 300 + page book that I picked up from the book store. It's backed by scientific studies.
Yes, the China Study is Equally flawed, alas.
https://deniseminger.com/2010/07/07/the-china-study-fact-or-fallac/
http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html
https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-china-study-revisited/
I'm HEAVILY plant based. But I thought What the Health played way way way too loose with the "facts".11 -
janejellyroll wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
It's T. Colin Campbell, by the way, not Thomas M. Campbell. Neither man has an unchallenged claim to non-bias, there are serious concerns about claims made by both.
The film itself is receiving criticism from science-based vegans, including RD Virginia Messina. Making claims that aren't backed by the facts is actually a poor form of vegan advocacy. If people know we're lying or being deceptive about the health risks of meat or the benefits of veganism, they will (legitimately) wonder if vegans are lying about other things as well. Here is a link to Messina's recent critique: https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Isn't the book actually T. Colin AND Thomas M Campbell? Just for the record.0 -
rashadlc1980 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
What specific claims?
The scientific claims from the China Study. Not just a film or a blog I read, but the actually 300 + page book that I picked up from the book store. It's backed by scientific studies.
I've read the book, as well as over 50 others on diet/nutrition. The China Study is flawed and has been picked apart pretty thoroughly.7 -
rashadlc1980 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
Really?!? Here's a vegan's take on that pile of crap...
https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Let me add that I think it is great that you have found a WOE that works for you, but please don't support over-hyped propaganda and pseudo-science as a reason for choosing that WOE.
Um okay... I've read plenty of books before this film came out that scientifically support this claims.
What specific claims?
The scientific claims from the China Study. Not just a film or a blog I read, but the actually 300 + page book that I picked up from the book store. It's backed by scientific studies.
I've read that book too. I am not so convinced (would be happy to talk about why). However, I was talking about the movie specifically, as my understanding (have not seen it) is that it makes claims about the dangers of eating meat that are not supported. So I was curious which particular claims in the movie were compelling in your mind, as so many knowledgeable vegans I know have been rather dismissive of it or embarrassed by it.
I guess it cites to the China Study (some other Campbell-related flick I saw on Netflix did too, but they all run together in my mind now, maybe FoK?), so is that what you meant by the claims? The claims in the China study book?
I understand that improving your diet by going vegan and losing weight has improved your test results, but that doesn't say if it's the removing animal products bit that did it.3 -
Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
It's T. Colin Campbell, by the way, not Thomas M. Campbell. Neither man has an unchallenged claim to non-bias, there are serious concerns about claims made by both.
The film itself is receiving criticism from science-based vegans, including RD Virginia Messina. Making claims that aren't backed by the facts is actually a poor form of vegan advocacy. If people know we're lying or being deceptive about the health risks of meat or the benefits of veganism, they will (legitimately) wonder if vegans are lying about other things as well. Here is a link to Messina's recent critique: https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Isn't the book actually T. Colin AND Thomas M Campbell? Just for the record.
I believe the study was T Colin's (and others working with him), but Thomas (his son) helped him with the book. I think janejellyroll was talking about the study, which was being attributed to Thomas (who has his own diet stuff now, probably affiliated with his dad's).2 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
It's T. Colin Campbell, by the way, not Thomas M. Campbell. Neither man has an unchallenged claim to non-bias, there are serious concerns about claims made by both.
The film itself is receiving criticism from science-based vegans, including RD Virginia Messina. Making claims that aren't backed by the facts is actually a poor form of vegan advocacy. If people know we're lying or being deceptive about the health risks of meat or the benefits of veganism, they will (legitimately) wonder if vegans are lying about other things as well. Here is a link to Messina's recent critique: https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Isn't the book actually T. Colin AND Thomas M Campbell? Just for the record.
I believe the study was T Colin's (and others working with him), but Thomas (his son) helped him with the book. I think janejellyroll was talking about the study, which was being attributed to Thomas (who has his own diet stuff now, probably affiliated with his dad's).
Precise as always. Thanks Lemurcat.2 -
Okay, So I can only speak of myself from my own experience. I suffered for over a period of 5 years with severe gout. When I first had my gout attack I though I had broken my foot or fractured it. After some time of studying I realized that the Red meat is what caused the high uric acid in my body. So I went on and off of it. Every time I started eating red meat at a high rate, I felt the attack coming. I went off for about 6 months. Then started it back again, then boom, it was there. Not only that, I also experience heavy allergies during the season with servere red and itchy eyes. The allergies I had all my life and I would break out in hives just about every year. Also I had to get an allergy shot every year between August and October in order to just breathe. I live in the Dallas, TX area. Ragweed and pollen was high. I did hear claims that Plant based foods can revere all this.
So when I first started, and about 3 years of going on and off, My gout did not come back... However, my allergies did not go away. Well I was really confused about Vegan and Vegetarian and realized that I was still eating some dairy, especially in sweets since that's my weakness.
So I started the High Carb low Fat, no dairy, etc.. vegan. My allergies improved about 90%. Not all the way gone, but I haven't been to the doctor for shots in 2 years.
My mother also is a type II diabetic and she's been to the doctor for years, tried other diets, etc.. She has thyroid disease and severe knee pain. She recently started the HCLF vegan diet for about a month and I can honestly say, I've seen tremendous results. No blood test as of yet, but her energy is coming back and she is shredding pounds.
So about the Film. Is it a Propaganda? Yes I believe so. Just like with many other films out there. However, just like with any other film or study, it's best to do your due diligence to determine what's true and what's not.
I highly doubt that we can determine Absolute Truth to anything when it comes to health and scientific studies. I've heard and read some testimonies where a HCLF vegan didn't provide any benefits. I believe the point of the film is to get people to start talking and thinking and taking control over their health. Rather it's a 80% plant base and some meat or 100% plant based. I've seen people, for the first time in their lives, started to take control over their health. Will they stay on this vegan diet? I'm not sure, but the film caused some awareness that there is an epidemic problem with our society and culture.
Can we truly find 100% truth and facts from the best diet to eat? I'm not sure, but I want to believe that we can be pretty close to it. Obviously something has NOT been working right in the past 50 years, if obesity, diabetes, cancer, heart disease is on the rise.
Some things I can't tell you want I don't know, but I can surely tell you what I do know. I do know that the American culture has strayed away from plant and fiber foods and has consumed more meat and dairy than ever before. Is that a fact? Yes. Let that be the starting point. Now what I don't know is that Meat and Dairy is the main cause for every single disease. That for sure, I don't know. Could it be that we can have meat but need to increase our fiber and plants? Maybe.
What's the correlation between the them?
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Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »rashadlc1980 wrote: »The film is excellent. It's backed by science from studies of Dr. Neal Barnard and the China study with Dr. Thomas M. Cambell. You will always have a debate of which is the right diet and there will always be something with a bias research study showing that a plant base lifestyle is wrong. Both of these doctors that I mentioned came from meat eating farming and was unbiased with their studies.
The Documentary "what the health" is shedding light on the issue but I would encourage to do further reading with The china study and with Dr. Neal barnard studies.
Personally, I've done most of the popular diets, from high protein low carb, all fruit, High protein MEAT, etc... and the only one that worked for me is High carb low fat plant/vegan diet.
I don't count calories like I used to, and I have more energy than ever as well as losing body fat...
There comes a time where you got to set aside all the blogs, reviews, etc.. and just try for yourself.
It's T. Colin Campbell, by the way, not Thomas M. Campbell. Neither man has an unchallenged claim to non-bias, there are serious concerns about claims made by both.
The film itself is receiving criticism from science-based vegans, including RD Virginia Messina. Making claims that aren't backed by the facts is actually a poor form of vegan advocacy. If people know we're lying or being deceptive about the health risks of meat or the benefits of veganism, they will (legitimately) wonder if vegans are lying about other things as well. Here is a link to Messina's recent critique: https://www.vegan.com/posts/vegan-dietitian-review-what-the-health/
Isn't the book actually T. Colin AND Thomas M Campbell? Just for the record.
Thanks for the correction. I was thinking of the study, but I was unaware that there was a co-author on the book with that name.1 -
I'm going to make a documentary as to why meat is awesome. I can make up lies and say that Kale causes osteoporosis and pancreatic cancer and people would believe me just because its in a documentary.
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TheWJordinWJordin wrote: »I'm going to make a documentary as to why meat is awesome. I can make up lies and say that Kale causes osteoporosis and pancreatic cancer and people would believe me just because its in a documentary.
You'll need to get some lab coats, and offices with lots of books for your interviews.10 -
TheWJordinWJordin wrote: »I'm going to make a documentary as to why meat is awesome. I can make up lies and say that Kale causes osteoporosis and pancreatic cancer and people would believe me just because its in a documentary.
Also make some blog posts so you can point to them as your scientific sources to back up your claims.5
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