Logging Homemade Stocks and Braises
OldHobo
Posts: 647 Member
I'm making turnip greens with smoked ham hock today. I make a ham stock first by simmering the hock for several hours. Then remove and reserve the meat, throw away the remaining hock, and cool and defat the broth. Finally, the dish comes together by simmering the greens, root, and other vegetables, herbs, and spices in the stock adding the reserved meat at the end.
For years I've looked for a satisfactory answer on how to account for the calories from that ham hock or chicken carcass or whatever the stock was made from. Of course, I weigh the reserved meat but a lot of delicious stuff ends up in the stock from skin, fat, collagen, marrow, etc. It's worse if the temperature gets away from you a bit and the stock boils instead of simmers. Then the fat gets absorbed into the stock the same way oil is emulsified in mayonnaise.
I assume the macro and micronutrients added to the stock are impossible to calculate but in order to manage weight, the calories must be accounted for. So the problem is how to log the calories from all the stuff that was left behind in the stock. Today I added one tablespoon of lard, 115 calories, to the ingredients. That probably more than covers it for only one hock but I'm wondering how other folks who routinely cook with homemade stocks and braises deal with this question.
For years I've looked for a satisfactory answer on how to account for the calories from that ham hock or chicken carcass or whatever the stock was made from. Of course, I weigh the reserved meat but a lot of delicious stuff ends up in the stock from skin, fat, collagen, marrow, etc. It's worse if the temperature gets away from you a bit and the stock boils instead of simmers. Then the fat gets absorbed into the stock the same way oil is emulsified in mayonnaise.
I assume the macro and micronutrients added to the stock are impossible to calculate but in order to manage weight, the calories must be accounted for. So the problem is how to log the calories from all the stuff that was left behind in the stock. Today I added one tablespoon of lard, 115 calories, to the ingredients. That probably more than covers it for only one hock but I'm wondering how other folks who routinely cook with homemade stocks and braises deal with this question.
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Replies
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It’s a problem. I just made pot roast, added celery juice, seasonings, a little flour, garlic, etc. to the pan for a good au jus. I just add 50 quick add calories when I have a serving of roast with juices. So I’m in it to find out what everyone else does.2
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For chicken stock I use "Soup, stock, chicken, home-prepared" from the USDA database.
Interestingly, "Soup, stock, beef, home-prepared" has a lot less calories, so I wouldn't use it for ham hock stock.
I see in my pea soup recipe I have "Seasoned Uncured Ham Shank". What I probably did was weigh it prior to cooking and then subtracted the weight of the bone after cooking.
I don't defat, so don't have to subtract that
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I make my own soups / stocks etc. with bones / meat off cuts, vegetables - leave it in the fridge overnight and lift the solidified fat next day. Fat is a flavour carrier but the left over liquid still carries a lot of flavour. I do consider calculating red and white wine if added and def. cream as well. There are some carbs, minerals, base elements, a tiny amount of protein and I don't think it is worth adding to my daily list. You could also take an average amount of calories for every cup / 250 ml / 8 ounces used, 50 calories per portion sounds about right.
Question: do you ever use a thickener agent for your sauces - and if so: what do you use? Thank you.0 -
neugebauer52 wrote: »I make my own soups / stocks etc. with bones / meat off cuts, vegetables - leave it in the fridge overnight and lift the solidified fat next day. Fat is a flavour carrier but the left over liquid still carries a lot of flavour. I do consider calculating red and white wine if added and def. cream as well. There are some carbs, minerals, base elements, a tiny amount of protein and I don't think it is worth adding to my daily list. You could also take an average amount of calories for every cup / 250 ml / 8 ounces used, 50 calories per portion sounds about right.
Question: do you ever use a thickener agent for your sauces - and if so: what do you use? Thank you.
Usually, if thickening will be needed I begin with a roux. Occasionally make a slurry of flour, cornstarch, or masa harina. Of course, a well-made stock becomes as thick as set jello in the refrigerator. Thins when heated but still coats the mouth. It comes in part from all those gristly bits breaking down into collagen and gelatin; very rich in calories and nutrition.
Like most people I think, I don't have good home-made stock on hand all the time. When I first started logging food for weight management and recording my weight daily, I noticed that when I did have stock on hand I was consistently gaining more or losing less than would be expected from the caloric arithmetic.0 -
Like most people I think, I don't have good home-made stock on hand all the time. When I first started logging food for weight management and recording my weight daily, I noticed that when I did have stock on hand I was consistently gaining more or losing less than would be expected from the caloric arithmetic.
Good to know.
Then technically when I make soup with hamburger meat and defat it, I should subtract those fat calories. Hmmm.0 -
neugebauer52 wrote: »I make my own soups / stocks etc. with bones / meat off cuts, vegetables - leave it in the fridge overnight and lift the solidified fat next day. Fat is a flavour carrier but the left over liquid still carries a lot of flavour. I do consider calculating red and white wine if added and def. cream as well. There are some carbs, minerals, base elements, a tiny amount of protein and I don't think it is worth adding to my daily list. You could also take an average amount of calories for every cup / 250 ml / 8 ounces used, 50 calories per portion sounds about right.
Question: do you ever use a thickener agent for your sauces - and if so: what do you use? Thank you.
Usually, if thickening will be needed I begin with a roux. Occasionally make a slurry of flour, cornstarch, or masa harina. Of course, a well-made stock becomes as thick as set jello in the refrigerator. Thins when heated but still coats the mouth. It comes in part from all those gristly bits breaking down into collagen and gelatin; very rich in calories and nutrition.
Like most people I think, I don't have good home-made stock on hand all the time. When I first started logging food for weight management and recording my weight daily, I noticed that when I did have stock on hand I was consistently gaining more or losing less than would be expected from the caloric arithmetic.
I always have good home-made stock on hand at all times. I keep bones in the freezer, and when I get low on stock, make another batch and freeze what I'm not going to use within a week. I freeze in 2C, 1C, and 1/4 C containers (2C = cottage cheese containers and 1C and 1/4 C = take out containers).0
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