m_a_b Member

Well, if I'd known that's all it took...

That's what I love about biking. You're completely involved with the environment around you. The problem with car drivers is that they're cushioned and totally isolated from the real world.

Here, in the UK, it is meant to be illegal but is never enforced. It should an automatic ban.

Or Endomondo. I don't know about runtastic but Endomono syncs direct to myfitnesspal.

So what you're saying is that if you do a good deed then it's not actually to help another human being, it's just for the reward that you're hoping for.

Wow, the world turns and I come back to this: This is the kind of Christian I truly detest. It's the big bully's mate with the "I'm alright, Jack" attitude with a bit of "Yah boo - you're going to hell and I'm not". Well sod you mate and your pathetic, spiteful little god. If I met your god I'd spit in his eye and tell him…

Apologies - maybe I should have added a :wink: or a :devil:

You know us atheist - no morals whatsoever. Now where's that baby? I haven't had my lunch yet. However, I do believe that it is morally wrong to prevent women from having simple protection from one of the most common cancers. I know there's the argument that it's a woman's choice whether or not she has sex, but we both…

Good point. There are, of course, women who have prayed not to get cancer and have, indeed, not got cancer. However, there is no statistical link between the prayer being done and the cancer developing or not developing. Statistically prayer makes no difference to the chances of getting cancer. What does make a difference…

No - I would ensure that no belief was enforced. It's either that or allow all. So as well as Christian prayers taking place in schools the children should also attend Muslim prayers. Again - no. I'm saying that Catholic employers are not above the law. And surely what they'd want anyway is a healthy work force. Here's a…

I agree with that - religion has no place in schools or the workplace. Again religion has no place in the workplace. Good health and hygiene does.

I agree that no-one should be allowed to push their beliefs on other people. However, I have ask - replacement for what?

Conversations such as this are interesting. In this short time I've come to respect what you've got to say even though our world view is radically different. Or is it? I read somewhere (on t'internet probably) that there are an estimated 28 million gods. The only real difference between us is that you're an atheist when it…

Because that's real life.

It's quite simple - if the Gospel mentions the destruction of the Temple (whether or not it is dressed up as a prediction) then the date of the Gospel is post-70 CE.

Again, it's back to the date of the document. Accept a pre-70CE date (as you have have to) then it's a prophesy. Since I don't believe in prophesy then a post-70CE date is acceptable. The author of the original document was simply writing about something that had already occurred. They did that to give additional weight to…

Problem is that the existence of Christianity relies on this type of "apocalyptic" study. Without it Jesus was just another guy making unfulfilled prophesies and Christianity would have died in the 2nd Century CE.

In my opinion the term "Apocalyptic" is a cop out. There are an number of places in the New Testament that Jesus refers quite specifically to the timing his second coming such as Matthew 24:34 (repeated in Luke 21:32 and Mark 13:30) and Matthew 10:23. The modern Christian sidelines these by labeling them "Apocalyptic". The…

Exactly. Except that I'd have said "backpedaling".

How? Jesus clearly stated that he was returning (Matthew 24:30) and within the lifetime of people alive at the time (Matthew 24:34). Also the prophetic part only works if you accept a pre 70CE date. I don't.

Matthew 24:30 - And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. Matthew 24:34 - Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be…

To add to what Brunner said: Jesus referred to many events in the Old Testament as if they were real events (Creation, Lot and his wife, Noah and the Flood). How do you reconcile the fact that he took events that we would say are allegorical to be literal?

Why? What you seem to be saying is just ignore what it says in the Old Testament just go with the New. Surely they're both the word of God. If they're both the word of God then surely you should obey all of it. Don't all the things that you say about the reliability of the New Testament apply to the Old Testament? If the…

Problem I have is that it appears to be highly subjective. One thing is literal another is allegorical apparently just on the whim of the reader. The Bible says Eve was created from Adam's Rib and Jesus feed 5000 with a handful of fish. One is supposedly fact the other isn't - depending on who you talk to. Prawns are OK…

You asked for my option. I don't believe in the empty tomb in the same way that I don't believe that Muhammad rode on a flying horse.

If we accept that Jesus was a real person (except, of course that his name could not have been Jesus) and that he was executed by the Romans then we must consider the miracles and the empty tomb. The most obvious answer, for me, is that they were embellishments added later to add credence to the Son of God aspect to the…

I think I see what you're saying now. You're not talking about what an atheist is, you're talking about how someone starts to become an atheist. Someone may start believing in God but, for whatever reason, they reject that belief system. At that point they're not an atheist because they still believe in God. However, at…

It was tempting :wink: And vice versa for me - even if I was brought up by Christian parents, I would hope my curiosity about the world around me would still lead me to realizing God does not exist. However, if you look at the majority of the world - those raised by Christians remain Christian. Those raised by Muslims…

The interesting thing is that given different upbringings then our roles in this conversation could well have been reversed. There may be an alternative universe where I am arguing for the existence of God and winey is the atheist.