First Time (Rock N Roll Marathon DC)

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Good morning All,

I've been a runner for years but never anything over 8 miles. I've been wanting to do the Rock N Roll Half Marathon in Va Beach for years but it seems something always get in the way. (Surgeries, deliveries, surgeries, etc) I knew I was going to miss it again this year and I haven't been running, but I have set my mind on the DC race in March. I am just starting my training after being out of the running scene for about a year and am very excited. I can't wait! (of course, I may not feel so enthusiastic during a long run :) ) Last night was my jumping off point and I was fairly pleased with the results. It wasn't great but it made me feel a little better that I am not completely out of shape.

I have a few concerns about my diet and fuel for long runs. Any suggestions or tips for what works for you would be greatly appreciated. I know that everyone is different and what may work great for others may not be great for me but it would be awesome to hear what you all have to say. Thanks in advance!

Replies

  • blgerig
    blgerig Posts: 174 Member
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    I am doing the Rock N Roll half in DC in March! I did it last year as well. I followed a Hal Higdon training plan last year and this year am doing a group training program (I did it for the fall Army 10 Miler and liked it). For me, I like to make sure I am running at least 3 times/ week during training: 1 easy run, 1 long run, 1 speed work. I try to do more than that, but that is my base. I use RunKeeper (free) on my iPhone to track my runs.

    Before a long run, I like to have toast with nut butter and banana. If I am running more than 8 miles I like to take a gel (I like the honey stinger ones, organic and taste just like honey, some of the fruit flavors and such gross me out. It is highly personal what works!). I get crampy or stomach pain if I have caffeine before, so I wait for my morning coffee until after my run. Feel free to add me! Oh, and when I signed up for my first half I had never done more than 3-4 miles at a time, so you are way better off, you'll do great!
  • dorianaldyn
    dorianaldyn Posts: 611 Member
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    I usually run on an empty stomach if going 8 miles or fewer. For runs of 8+ miles, I'll have something like steel cut oatmeal or a whole wheat pita w/hummus for breakfast. For a half marathon distance, I find that I do fine without eating anything during the race; for marathons, I force myself to start eating some sport beans by around the 10 mile mark.
  • CarsonRuns
    CarsonRuns Posts: 3,039 Member
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    You are going to get a lot of different answers to this question. Some will be opinion, some will be fact, some will be personal experience. I also guarantee that there will be somebody that disagrees with what I am about to say and tell you that it's different for everyone, but I'm going to give you factual information.

    The human body does not need to be fueled or hydrated during the course of any run that is up to around 4 hours. As long as the runner is properly fueled and hydrated in the days leading up to the long run, the body can handle a run of that length with no additional food or nutrition. As anecdotal evidence, how long can a human being survive in the desert with no food or water? At least 4 hours of course. Typically 2 to 4 days.

    Now, for my experience. I use deprivation training, where you don't fuel or hydrate during the course of a run to train the body to perform with the fluids it already has in the system and also to train the body to use a higher percentage of fat to glycogen for energy (this is the main goal of a long run, so you may as well maximize it). I've done runs up to 22 miles without a drop of water or a crumb of food (about 3.5 hours). Now, I didn't just go out from 6 miles up to 22. I run a lot of miles and have been running for a long time. I had to build up to that level. Gradual increases in mileage over time is how you improve at distance running. There is no quick fix. I read post of people looking for that magic pill, gu of jelly bean to "get them over the hump" of that 10 mile run, but it just doesn't exist. Yes, you may get some short term gains from using a fuel source during a run, but you aren't getting everything you can out of it. Save the fuel for race day when you really need it.

    So, my recommendation to anyone that asks is, train without that stuff. Pick a few training runs in you cycle to try out the fuel source you want to use on race day, but other that that, eschew them. It will make you a better runner in the long run (pun intended).
  • jturnerx
    jturnerx Posts: 325 Member
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    Less than an hour nothing. Two or three hours a little bit more than nothing. Maybe a gel. Maybe a chew or 3 (not packages, individual pieces). I bite them in half and tuck them inside a cheek to dissolve. A few sips of water from an available water fountain. I just drink when I'm thirsty. Longer than three hours I take in a little bit more and introduce some electrolytes if I need it. That's training. During a race I definitely take onboard more calories.
  • essjay76
    essjay76 Posts: 465 Member
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    Yes, you'll get varying advice. I tend to agree with Carson on fueling, though.

    I am no expert, but this is from my personal experience: I think the more you run, the more your body gets used to running without fuel. I think if you're eating well regularly and before your long runs or races, you won't need to fuel too much during your actual workout.

    Before a long run (14 or more miles for me) or a race (half marathon or longer), I usually just eat a bagel, coffee, water. During the run or race is a different story. I've gone on 20 mile runs without any GU's, chews, etc. - just water. I've run half marathons without fueling during the race - maybe just having Gatorade or water. Before I used to pop gels every 4 miles or so but found I didn't really need them anymore. This is from gradually building up my running base though. It's all relative, so you have to find what your body agrees with. If you can run your long training runs without fuel, it'll help tremendously come race day when you actually need it.
  • climberchic
    climberchic Posts: 83 Member
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    The longest race I've ran was 8miles (several years ago) and I think I may have had a small amount of water mid way and that was it. My diet was terrible back then too so I think I will definitely take this all into consideration. Last year when I was running pretty regularly 4 a day I would usually only eat an egg white prior and then eat lunch after. I've got a few weeks to play with it. I really appreciate all the feedback, from everyone. Thanks!!
  • vmclach
    vmclach Posts: 670 Member
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    I read post of people looking for that magic pill, gu of jelly bean to "get them over the hump" of that 10 mile run, but it just doesn't exist.

    lol... This is true. Fueling is the most minor part of the race that people tend to make into such a big deal. Personally- I just put 4 salt pills and 4 cliff shot gummies in my little race belt before the marathon and take one every ~6 miles. It just gives me something to look forward to or think about. I take water or gaterade at every single stop even if I just splash it in my face.

    During training runs, I bring fuel with me, but I don't typically use it. I might use a salt pill & a cliff shot if i'm going over 2 hours~ 13 miles or so... I would probably take it at 1 hour in to hold me over for the second hour...

    Make sense? I feel like it's a fitual that doesn't really make a difference. I would suggest buying some calf compressions and just get used to the pain :)
  • RenewedRunner
    RenewedRunner Posts: 423 Member
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    I am also running that race, even though Competitor is not my favorite, but I love DC more than I dislike Competitor :)

    As for the "hump," I will tell you that when I was new (and I might as well be since it has been 3 years since I ran anything over 10 miles), I didn't really have a fueling problem during the race. I made sure I had hydrated well for the months prior, had paid attention to my carb and protein intake for the month (I read a study that says it takes about 30 days to fix a discrepancy and notice the difference), and then ate a banana and half a toasted bagel with peanut butter for breakfast. I ate one or two orange slices during the race (I just wanted to get the dry taste out of my mouth lol) and stopped for water when I needed it.

    Be healthy consistently before the race and you should be okay. It wont be deathly hot in DC during that time and the course is relatively flat so overall this should be a great experience for you!! Good luck!!!!
  • Cheval13
    Cheval13 Posts: 392 Member
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    I agree with Carson et al. about fueling. I don't have nearly as many miles under my belt as Carson does, but I have done 20 mile runs without any fuel. A lot of it is the pre-run fueling and whether is on a fasted stomach or not. You'll get varying advice for this.
    However, I think most would agree that water is important, and the temps make a difference. Running in south Florida, winter is the "on season" because the summers are too hot and humid to train for a marathon... even if you run at 3 AM (I mean, some do it... but it's very uncomfortable). The temperature also rarely dips below 60 for more than a few days at a time. Hence, staying hydrated is an issue here and I always make sure to take water with me on runs more than 13 miles if I want my run to be worth a cuss at the end. VA can be warm or freezing depending on the length of the winter... Be prepared for both. Whatever you decide to do for the half you will want to practice while doing training runs now. You may find that the higher your mileage gets, the more efficient your body will get and the less fuel you'll use during a run.
  • sjohnny
    sjohnny Posts: 56,142 Member
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    I also agree with Carson - even though my longest run ever was last weekend's 14 mile. I don't eat before running and don't take water. I do drink water/gatorade during half marathons at the water stops and in each of the two I've run I've eaten one gu at around the 8ish mile point. I like to make my long training runs tougher than I think the race will be. If your body is accustomed to doing without extra fuel and hydration then it will be like a shot of nitrous during the race.

    When I get to a point where I'm working toward a full marathon some of this may change but that won't be for another year so we'll see how it's going then.
  • climberchic
    climberchic Posts: 83 Member
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    Great advice! Thanks everyone. The training is going decent so far. My time isn't what I would like it to be but I'm finishing my goals each day. I did have a question about Paleo and marathon training. Anybody have anything to comment on that?
  • CarsonRuns
    CarsonRuns Posts: 3,039 Member
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    Great advice! Thanks everyone. The training is going decent so far. My time isn't what I would like it to be but I'm finishing my goals each day. I did have a question about Paleo and marathon training. Anybody have anything to comment on that?

    Runners need carbs. Marathon runners need even more. Carbs are your friend.
  • sjp_511
    sjp_511 Posts: 476 Member
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    I am also doing a the Rock n Roll DC Half! Good luck to you for your training!

    I don't eat too differently before a long run, except avoid certain foods that upset my stomach. While I don't think it is necessary to carb load before a long run, I still tend to eat pasta the night before a race or long run. It is tasty and doesn't give me any stomach problems while I run. I have had steak for dinner the night before a long run and my belly hated me for it!

    I typically have a granola bar or 2 before a race (something that travels well because I travel for many races). I tend to Gu during any runs that are 8 miles or longer. I feel better with a bit of fuel before and during.

    I am still working on taking off weight and becoming a better runner, so I do burn a lot of calories per mile (120ish, 150 if I am really pushing myself) and I get myself into a large deficit during long runs. Maybe that is why I feel the need for fuel? People far more fit than I will burn less than 100 calories per mile and probably don't need as much fuel as I do.