Hydration...Again
HappyRunner34
Posts: 394 Member
I know this topic has been done but I couldn't find a recent thread. I've read tons on this topic...and tried water, Cytomax (sports drink) and coconut water. I've read the do's and don'ts (don't drink sports drink and eat gels etc.).
I have a marathon coming on June 1st and just came off a horrible collapse over the last 7k of a 30k two days ago in which I was pacing perfectly. I was drinking coconut water and sipping some water every other station...and I have no idea how much I drank. It was so damn windy and raining (so was wearing a jacket which was soaked from the inside), but decently warm, that I think I lost way more fluid than I thought. After drinking at least 20 ounces of sports drink following the finish..I stepped up to the porcelain and ice tea colour fluid came out of me. So my questions are....am I correct to assume that I was dehydrated? And, rather than hydration advice, my second question is....how did you know, when you got it right? Thanks!
I have a marathon coming on June 1st and just came off a horrible collapse over the last 7k of a 30k two days ago in which I was pacing perfectly. I was drinking coconut water and sipping some water every other station...and I have no idea how much I drank. It was so damn windy and raining (so was wearing a jacket which was soaked from the inside), but decently warm, that I think I lost way more fluid than I thought. After drinking at least 20 ounces of sports drink following the finish..I stepped up to the porcelain and ice tea colour fluid came out of me. So my questions are....am I correct to assume that I was dehydrated? And, rather than hydration advice, my second question is....how did you know, when you got it right? Thanks!
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Replies
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The human body is designed to dehydrate during work bouts and then to replenish when it's finished. Studies have shown that the top performers in a marathon are the most dehydrated, some by as much as 7% of their body weight. For a lithe male runner of 130 pounds, that means losing over 9 pounds in water weight.
I think that it is very unlikely that you bonk was the result of dehydration. Unless you are running in Death Valley and losing a 3 to 4 pounds an hour in sweat, dehydration is not going to be a concern for any race lasting less than 4 hours, longer in cool temperatures.
The rule of thumb is to "drink to thirst". A couple of ounce at each aid station is all you need. Ive run many a race, and PR'd and my urine has been extremely dark. There are times when I won't even have the urge to pee for several hours. It's not a concern. It's just how the body works.0 -
The human body is designed to dehydrate during work bouts and then to replenish when it's finished. Studies have shown that the top performers in a marathon are the most dehydrated, some by as much as 7% of their body weight. For a lithe male runner of 130 pounds, that means losing over 9 pounds in water weight.
I think that it is very unlikely that you bonk was the result of dehydration. Unless you are running in Death Valley and losing a 3 to 4 pounds an hour in sweat, dehydration is not going to be a concern for any race lasting less than 4 hours, longer in cool temperatures.
The rule of thumb is to "drink to thirst". A couple of ounce at each aid station is all you need. Ive run many a race, and PR'd and my urine has been extremely dark. There are times when I won't even have the urge to pee for several hours. It's not a concern. It's just how the body works.
I don't disagree necessarily with this...not all bodies are created equal however and people sweat and drop sodium at different levels. I know I need more miles to be ready for the marathon and have 8 weeks left, and I'm at the point where I need to pick a hydration/fuelling plan for runs over three hours and stick with it. A couple of ounces every station simply wont do it for me...I know this from experience on good and bad runs.0 -
You were dehydrated, because that's what happens when you lose water, but it doesn't sound like you were at the point of medical emergency or anything. That being said...one of the symptoms of dehydration is weakness/light-headedness and that can certainly make it more difficult to run.
As you stated, hydration is a personal matter and affects people differently so the only way you are to figure out what works for you is through good old trial and error. Sounds like you have got 8 weeks to figure it out. I would start by making sure you are fully hydrated the 2-3 days leading up to your race. If you start out with less than a full tank and start depleting it once the race starts, you will never catch up at the water stations. As far as "getting it right"...I'm not sure what you mean by that. You will always end a run dehydrated. You would never be able to replace all of the water you lost during a run while you are running. As Carson said...your body is made to dehydrate while you are exercising. The best you can do is find your balance, enough water/electrolytes (or whatever) so you don't feel weak, but not so much that you get sick. (again, trial and error)
I know you said you didn't want hydration advice, but I'm giving it anyway
. I was introduced to a new electrolyte drink last week at a test run. It is called skratch. Apparently it was created for cyclists, but it is all natural and lower sugar/milder flavor...therefore easier to drink more of it while running without really upsetting your stomach. At least that was my experience. You might want to try it out. I think you can only get it online or in some specialy bike shops currently, but I will be ordering some soon as it was amazing! Good luck to you! 0 -
I know this topic has been done but I couldn't find a recent thread. I've read tons on this topic...and tried water, Cytomax (sports drink) and coconut water. I've read the do's and don'ts (don't drink sports drink and eat gels etc.).
I have a marathon coming on June 1st and just came off a horrible collapse over the last 7k of a 30k two days ago in which I was pacing perfectly. I was drinking coconut water and sipping some water every other station...and I have no idea how much I drank. It was so damn windy and raining (so was wearing a jacket which was soaked from the inside), but decently warm, that I think I lost way more fluid than I thought. After drinking at least 20 ounces of sports drink following the finish..I stepped up to the porcelain and ice tea colour fluid came out of me. So my questions are....am I correct to assume that I was dehydrated? And, rather than hydration advice, my second question is....how did you know, when you got it right? Thanks!
Perhaps the results that you saw were self-inflicted?
The reason I raise the issue is that you state that the jacket was "soaked from the inside". Assuming that is true, that indicates that you're wearing a fabric that didn't allow the water vapor to evaporate. As a result, you did not benefit from the cooling effect and your body continued to sweat as it tried to cool off.
It could well be that you were, in effect, running inside a"sauna suit".
To deal with your posting more directly, I think the good folks here are trying to tell you that this is not a significant issue. You know that you were perspiring very heavily and you were only drinking small amounts of water. Under those conditions, it's not at all surprising that your urine was dark.0 -
Thanks for your responses; I really appreciate them and truly helpful. Lesson learned for me; an in that sense my 30k race debacle will be very well worth it as I prep for marathon day. Thanks again...this is why I love this site!!0
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I know this topic has been done but I couldn't find a recent thread. I've read tons on this topic...and tried water, Cytomax (sports drink) and coconut water. I've read the do's and don'ts (don't drink sports drink and eat gels etc.).
I have a marathon coming on June 1st and just came off a horrible collapse over the last 7k of a 30k two days ago in which I was pacing perfectly. I was drinking coconut water and sipping some water every other station...and I have no idea how much I drank. It was so damn windy and raining (so was wearing a jacket which was soaked from the inside), but decently warm, that I think I lost way more fluid than I thought. After drinking at least 20 ounces of sports drink following the finish..I stepped up to the porcelain and ice tea colour fluid came out of me. So my questions are....am I correct to assume that I was dehydrated? And, rather than hydration advice, my second question is....how did you know, when you got it right? Thanks!
As others have said, yeah, you were probably dehydrated.... but that's unlikely to be the cause of your difficulty. Did you get a headache? Were you insanely thirsty? When you got to the finish line, were you all, "OMG! WATER GIVE ME MOAR PLEEEZE!" Did you go through a phase where you just wanted to camp at an aid station, say eff this noise about the race, and steal the volunteer's pitcher? If the answer is no, you just weren't really out there long enough to start genuinely suffering due to dehydration.
I used to be a backpacker - I was a backpacker when all the runners were being told to "hydrate or die". This happened all the time to us when we were backpacking and had difficulty finding water. We'd be crazy thirsty for an hour or two. Then comes the headache. Then the headache gets worse. But the body still works pretty well. Then you drink and you feel fine again.
Also very much agree with lorieren that the days leading up to your long run are very important - moreso than what you take in WHILE running.0 -
The human body is designed to dehydrate during work bouts and then to replenish when it's finished. Studies have shown that the top performers in a marathon are the most dehydrated, some by as much as 7% of their body weight. For a lithe male runner of 130 pounds, that means losing over 9 pounds in water weight.
I think that it is very unlikely that you bonk was the result of dehydration. Unless you are running in Death Valley and losing a 3 to 4 pounds an hour in sweat, dehydration is not going to be a concern for any race lasting less than 4 hours, longer in cool temperatures.
The rule of thumb is to "drink to thirst". A couple of ounce at each aid station is all you need. Ive run many a race, and PR'd and my urine has been extremely dark. There are times when I won't even have the urge to pee for several hours. It's not a concern. It's just how the body works.
I agree with you, however, I think there are those who need to be more mindful of their hydration than others. Here's what I mean: you are referring to the elite, not the back of the packer. The elite are in and out in a few hours. Dehydration and it's counterpart hypotremia are much more likely the longer you are out there. So a person who clocks in at 5 1/2 hours on their marathon run should be careful not to over hydrate and of course make sure that they intake adequate fluids. I think of the two, back of the pack runners need to be more careful of hypotremia than dehydration. Many times they are the less experienced and have had it drilled into them to drink a lot of fluid and can easily over do it and find themselves in deadly trouble. But your point is well taken!
ETA: fixed a typo0 -
The human body is designed to dehydrate during work bouts and then to replenish when it's finished. Studies have shown that the top performers in a marathon are the most dehydrated, some by as much as 7% of their body weight. For a lithe male runner of 130 pounds, that means losing over 9 pounds in water weight.
I think that it is very unlikely that you bonk was the result of dehydration. Unless you are running in Death Valley and losing a 3 to 4 pounds an hour in sweat, dehydration is not going to be a concern for any race lasting less than 4 hours, longer in cool temperatures.
The rule of thumb is to "drink to thirst". A couple of ounce at each aid station is all you need. Ive run many a race, and PR'd and my urine has been extremely dark. There are times when I won't even have the urge to pee for several hours. It's not a concern. It's just how the body works.
I agree with you, however, I think there are those who need to be more mindful of their hydration than others. Here's what I mean: you are referring to the elite, not the back of the packer. The elite are in and out in a few hours. Dehydration and it's counterpart hypotremia are much more likely the longer you are out there. So a person who clocks in at 5 1/2 hours on their marathon run should be careful not to over hydrate and of course make sure that they intake adequate fluids. I think of the two, back of the pack runners need to be more careful of hypotremia than dehydration. Many times they are the less experienced and have had it drilled into them to drink a lot of fluid and can easily over do it and find themselves in deadly trouble. But your point is well taken!
ETA: fixed a typo
Hypotremia, yes. The longer the runner is on the course, the greater the danger. Especially if they are wearing a camelback and drinking 5 cups of water at every water station.
Dehydration, not as much. Humans can survive in the desert for 3 days without food and water. They can surely get through a 5 hour race with as little as 10 ounces of water or less.0 -
The human body is designed to dehydrate during work bouts and then to replenish when it's finished. Studies have shown that the top performers in a marathon are the most dehydrated, some by as much as 7% of their body weight. For a lithe male runner of 130 pounds, that means losing over 9 pounds in water weight.
I think that it is very unlikely that you bonk was the result of dehydration. Unless you are running in Death Valley and losing a 3 to 4 pounds an hour in sweat, dehydration is not going to be a concern for any race lasting less than 4 hours, longer in cool temperatures.
The rule of thumb is to "drink to thirst". A couple of ounce at each aid station is all you need. Ive run many a race, and PR'd and my urine has been extremely dark. There are times when I won't even have the urge to pee for several hours. It's not a concern. It's just how the body works.
I agree with you, however, I think there are those who need to be more mindful of their hydration than others. Here's what I mean: you are referring to the elite, not the back of the packer. The elite are in and out in a few hours. Dehydration and it's counterpart hypotremia are much more likely the longer you are out there. So a person who clocks in at 5 1/2 hours on their marathon run should be careful not to over hydrate and of course make sure that they intake adequate fluids. I think of the two, back of the pack runners need to be more careful of hypotremia than dehydration. Many times they are the less experienced and have had it drilled into them to drink a lot of fluid and can easily over do it and find themselves in deadly trouble. But your point is well taken!
ETA: fixed a typo
Hypotremia, yes. The longer the runner is on the course, the greater the danger. Especially if they are wearing a camelback and drinking 5 cups of water at every water station.
Dehydration, not as much. Humans can survive in the desert for 3 days without food and water. They can surely get through a 5 hour race with as little as 10 ounces of water or less.
Oh yes!
Agreed that hyponatremia is a WAY bigger issue than dehydration.
Though I know people that have been pulled from a race due to honest-to-goodness dehydration. But in those cases, it was again what happened the day BEFORE the race, not day of. In one case, the person was getting over a GI infection. Apparently, the intestines can't absorb water as readily if they are inflamed.
I hate being thirsty, though. I'll drink when I'm thirsty. Even if it's a 5k.0 -
The human body is designed to dehydrate during work bouts and then to replenish when it's finished. Studies have shown that the top performers in a marathon are the most dehydrated, some by as much as 7% of their body weight. For a lithe male runner of 130 pounds, that means losing over 9 pounds in water weight.
I think that it is very unlikely that you bonk was the result of dehydration. Unless you are running in Death Valley and losing a 3 to 4 pounds an hour in sweat, dehydration is not going to be a concern for any race lasting less than 4 hours, longer in cool temperatures.
The rule of thumb is to "drink to thirst". A couple of ounce at each aid station is all you need. Ive run many a race, and PR'd and my urine has been extremely dark. There are times when I won't even have the urge to pee for several hours. It's not a concern. It's just how the body works.
I agree with you, however, I think there are those who need to be more mindful of their hydration than others. Here's what I mean: you are referring to the elite, not the back of the packer. The elite are in and out in a few hours. Dehydration and it's counterpart hypotremia are much more likely the longer you are out there. So a person who clocks in at 5 1/2 hours on their marathon run should be careful not to over hydrate and of course make sure that they intake adequate fluids. I think of the two, back of the pack runners need to be more careful of hypotremia than dehydration. Many times they are the less experienced and have had it drilled into them to drink a lot of fluid and can easily over do it and find themselves in deadly trouble. But your point is well taken!
ETA: fixed a typo
Hypotremia, yes. The longer the runner is on the course, the greater the danger. Especially if they are wearing a camelback and drinking 5 cups of water at every water station.
Dehydration, not as much. Humans can survive in the desert for 3 days without food and water. They can surely get through a 5 hour race with as little as 10 ounces of water or less.
Oh yes!
Agreed that hyponatremia is a WAY bigger issue than dehydration.
Though I know people that have been pulled from a race due to honest-to-goodness dehydration. But in those cases, it was again what happened the day BEFORE the race, not day of. In one case, the person was getting over a GI infection. Apparently, the intestines can't absorb water as readily if they are inflamed.
I hate being thirsty, though. I'll drink when I'm thirsty. Even if it's a 5k.
I'm much more likely to dump water on my head in a 5K.
I totally agree. Hydration is an everyday thing, not a race day thing. If you are getting your fluids in all the time, you have nothing to worry about...unless you are running Badwater or something.0 -
The human body is designed to dehydrate during work bouts and then to replenish when it's finished. Studies have shown that the top performers in a marathon are the most dehydrated, some by as much as 7% of their body weight. For a lithe male runner of 130 pounds, that means losing over 9 pounds in water weight.
I think that it is very unlikely that you bonk was the result of dehydration. Unless you are running in Death Valley and losing a 3 to 4 pounds an hour in sweat, dehydration is not going to be a concern for any race lasting less than 4 hours, longer in cool temperatures.
The rule of thumb is to "drink to thirst". A couple of ounce at each aid station is all you need. Ive run many a race, and PR'd and my urine has been extremely dark. There are times when I won't even have the urge to pee for several hours. It's not a concern. It's just how the body works.
I agree with you, however, I think there are those who need to be more mindful of their hydration than others. Here's what I mean: you are referring to the elite, not the back of the packer. The elite are in and out in a few hours. Dehydration and it's counterpart hypotremia are much more likely the longer you are out there. So a person who clocks in at 5 1/2 hours on their marathon run should be careful not to over hydrate and of course make sure that they intake adequate fluids. I think of the two, back of the pack runners need to be more careful of hypotremia than dehydration. Many times they are the less experienced and have had it drilled into them to drink a lot of fluid and can easily over do it and find themselves in deadly trouble. But your point is well taken!
ETA: fixed a typo
Hypotremia, yes. The longer the runner is on the course, the greater the danger. Especially if they are wearing a camelback and drinking 5 cups of water at every water station.
Dehydration, not as much. Humans can survive in the desert for 3 days without food and water. They can surely get through a 5 hour race with as little as 10 ounces of water or less.
Oh yes!
Agreed that hyponatremia is a WAY bigger issue than dehydration.
Though I know people that have been pulled from a race due to honest-to-goodness dehydration. But in those cases, it was again what happened the day BEFORE the race, not day of. In one case, the person was getting over a GI infection. Apparently, the intestines can't absorb water as readily if they are inflamed.
I hate being thirsty, though. I'll drink when I'm thirsty. Even if it's a 5k.
I'm much more likely to dump water on my head in a 5K.
I totally agree. Hydration is an everyday thing, not a race day thing. If you are getting your fluids in all the time, you have nothing to worry about...unless you are running Badwater or something.
OK, I accept that! I usually don't carry a water bottle at all unless I'm going out for at least 90 minutes. Unless it's summer heat, then maybe 60 minutes. I think for performance in race, you don't need all of the water. But for me for training purposes, I try to stay hydrated. I used to get vicious headaches when I went 20+ on the trails. I found out it was dehydration. I was fine when running and then the headache came later. I learned to keep pushing the fluid post fun for a couple of hours after at least and I would be fine.
ETA: fixed typo0 -
Yeah - my cutoffs are nine miles in winter and over six in the summer. OR dehydrated going in. I've had that happen before.0
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The reason I raise the issue is that you state that the jacket was "soaked from the inside". Assuming that is true, that indicates that you're wearing a fabric that didn't allow the water vapor to evaporate. As a result, you did not benefit from the cooling effect and your body continued to sweat as it tried to cool off.
It could well be that you were, in effect, running inside a"sauna suit".
This could be it. If you go hyperthermic you'll dehydrate more, and if you're also dealing with salt depletion more water won't help much. Maybe try a lighter outer layer, and cold towels on your head and neck, and see if that helps.0
