Keto results on the scale
IslandSneezerooo
Posts: 268 Member
Weigh in day is Thursday but since I started eating Keto a week ago today, did an early weigh in... Started at 290.1 lbs, was 286.7 this morning... Lost 3.4 lbs in one week on Keto!!
Took me 10 weeks to lose 1.9 lbs following the default MFP macros, then gained that back in 1 week of PMS'ing... Loving these results and hoping it's not just water weight... Let's see how week 2 goes!
Also upped my metformin to 500 mg 2x/day to treat PCOS related insulin resistance this week. Last time I took metformin for PCOS I gained 50 lbs over a year, but didn't change my diet... This is a good sign I'm on the right track!! Digestive issues aren't so bad now that I cut carbs WAY back too...
My macros are set to 1980 cals, 100 g carbs (ate around 50-85 g), 100 g protein (ate around 130 g) and the rest was fat... If my weight loss stalls I'll lower my carbs and protein... My diary is open if anyone wants to see what I ate...
Took me 10 weeks to lose 1.9 lbs following the default MFP macros, then gained that back in 1 week of PMS'ing... Loving these results and hoping it's not just water weight... Let's see how week 2 goes!
Also upped my metformin to 500 mg 2x/day to treat PCOS related insulin resistance this week. Last time I took metformin for PCOS I gained 50 lbs over a year, but didn't change my diet... This is a good sign I'm on the right track!! Digestive issues aren't so bad now that I cut carbs WAY back too...
My macros are set to 1980 cals, 100 g carbs (ate around 50-85 g), 100 g protein (ate around 130 g) and the rest was fat... If my weight loss stalls I'll lower my carbs and protein... My diary is open if anyone wants to see what I ate...
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What's Keto ?0
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Keto is low carb, high fat, moderate protein.0
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lolita1982 wrote: »What's Keto ?
The lower carber group has a good overview of keto (see "ketosis plans" section) -- http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10039486/what-is-low-carb-an-overview-and-guideIslandSneezerooo wrote: »My macros are set to 1980 cals, 100 g carbs (ate around 50-85 g), 100 g protein (ate around 130 g) and the rest was fat... If my weight loss stalls I'll lower my carbs and protein... My diary is open if anyone wants to see what I ate...
Hate to burst your bubble, but that's not keto. It's LCHF, certainly (or at least getting there, depending on one's definition), but your carbs aren't low enough to get into ketosis, which is the goal of a keto diet.
Congrats on the improvements, though! That's what matters most, and here's to at least part of it being fat loss (though less water retention isn't a bad thing, either, really). :drinker:0 -
@Dragonwolf, my understanding is that keto is LCHF?
Went and looked at my stats and my daily macros last week averaged out to 1986 calories, 114 g fat, 60 g net carbs, 117 g protein.0 -
IslandSneezerooo wrote: »@Dragonwolf, my understanding is that keto is LCHF?
Went and looked at my stats and my daily macros last week averaged out to 1986 calories, 114 g fat, 60 g net carbs, 117 g protein.
Keto is LCHF, but LCHF isn't necessarily keto. LCHF is the rectangle, Keto is the square, basically.0 -
Dragonwolf wrote: »IslandSneezerooo wrote: »@Dragonwolf, my understanding is that keto is LCHF?
Went and looked at my stats and my daily macros last week averaged out to 1986 calories, 114 g fat, 60 g net carbs, 117 g protein.
Keto is LCHF, but LCHF isn't necessarily keto. LCHF is the rectangle, Keto is the square, basically.
HEHE good analogy.
Keto is typically under 20g of carbs a day, but it means your body has switched from using carbs to using fat for fuel. It is a state of being in ketosis. If you eat too many carbs, even for one day it will kick you out of ketosis for a bit.0 -
So if I pee on a keto stick it should be where on the scale? The darkest?0
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When I switched from LCHF to keto, my carb limit went from <25 to <20, and I had to up my fats significantly. Some here will say that ketostix don't/won't measure ketosis accurately, but I still use them daily. Yes, when I'm in full burn mode, I'm hitting the highest level on the ketostix daily.
One day of 50 carbs, and I'll be out of ketosis, and for me, that means NO weight losses.
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IslandSneezerooo wrote: »So if I pee on a keto stick it should be where on the scale? The darkest?
It seems to depend on the person and the sticks are not overly accurate, but many people like to use them and see the color change. If you are burning ketones because you are in ketosis, you wont usually see much on the sticks. The only way to tell daily would be if you got a meter that measured them. There are a couple of blood glucose meters you can buy that take ketone strips that test blood not urine. But if you want to test, go for it! Knowledge isnt a bad thing ever.0 -
I plugged my stats into the keto calculator here: http://keto-calculator.ankerl.com/ and used that to set my macros:
Here are your personal macros:
1980 kcal Daily Calorie Intake
100 g Carbohydrates (20%, 400 kcal)
100 g Protein (20%, 400 kcal)
131 g Fat (60%, 1180 kcal)
All the info I read online says keto is LCHF... can you explain in better detail what the difference is?0 -
When I switched from LCHF to keto, my carb limit went from <25 to <20, and I had to up my fats significantly. Some here will say that ketostix don't/won't measure ketosis accurately, but I still use them daily. Yes, when I'm in full burn mode, I'm hitting the highest level on the ketostix daily.
One day of 50 carbs, and I'll be out of ketosis, and for me, that means NO weight losses.
Before doing this week I was eating an average of 150-200 g carbs/day... I'm guessing eating 60 g/day put me in ketosis... If I stall out, I'll adjust my carbs/protein/fat macros till I start losing again... another piece of info I left out is that I'm currently in the process of getting WLS so just trying to lose some weight before I have the surgery...
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IslandSneezerooo wrote: »I plugged my stats into the keto calculator here: http://keto-calculator.ankerl.com/ and used that to set my macros:
Here are your personal macros:
1980 kcal Daily Calorie Intake
100 g Carbohydrates (20%, 400 kcal)
100 g Protein (20%, 400 kcal)
131 g Fat (60%, 1180 kcal)
All the info I read online says keto is LCHF... can you explain in better detail what the difference is?
yes, Keto IS Low Carb High Fat or LCHF. But LCHF is not necessarily Keto. Keto is a specific process I've explained above:Dragonwolf wrote: »IslandSneezerooo wrote: »@Dragonwolf, my understanding is that keto is LCHF?
Went and looked at my stats and my daily macros last week averaged out to 1986 calories, 114 g fat, 60 g net carbs, 117 g protein.
Keto is LCHF, but LCHF isn't necessarily keto. LCHF is the rectangle, Keto is the square, basically.
HEHE good analogy.
Keto is typically under 20g of carbs a day, but it means your body has switched from using carbs to using fat for fuel. It is a state of being in ketosis. If you eat too many carbs, even for one day it will kick you out of ketosis for a bit.
It is a specific state of being, being in Ketosis, where your body uses fat and not carbs for fuel and uses the ketones you produce from this process. It is typically under 20g carbs a day but if you've been in Ketosis for awhile you might be able to get up to 50g total a day and still be there, but most people will get kicked out of Ketosis at that level.
With Keto, it isnt so much about your percentage, alto most Keto resources and Keto dieters are on 5% carbs and you are at 20%, but most keep it under 20g of carbs a day, everyday. That is how your body knows to go from using the 100g of carbs you are eating now to using the 80% fats you should be eating.0 -
IslandSneezerooo wrote: »When I switched from LCHF to keto, my carb limit went from <25 to <20, and I had to up my fats significantly. Some here will say that ketostix don't/won't measure ketosis accurately, but I still use them daily. Yes, when I'm in full burn mode, I'm hitting the highest level on the ketostix daily.
One day of 50 carbs, and I'll be out of ketosis, and for me, that means NO weight losses.
Before doing this week I was eating an average of 150-200 g carbs/day... I'm guessing eating 60 g/day put me in ketosis... If I stall out, I'll adjust my carbs/protein/fat macros till I start losing again... another piece of info I left out is that I'm currently in the process of getting WLS so just trying to lose some weight before I have the surgery...
It probably did not put you into ketosis as the carbs are not low enough. The good news is, many PCOS women respond to lower carbs without it having to be Keto level. You seem to be one of them so if you like your macros as they are, keep going.
It isnt about a label. Keto dieters arent any more cool than LCHF dieters and if LCHF works for you do it!0 -
@Alliwan I don't care about the label or coolness factor, hehe, just don't want to be using incorrect terminology so trying to understand the difference...
Thanks for explaining further!
So without a proper keto meter I won't know if I'm in FULL ketosis and the ketosis sticks only measure if you have SOME? Is that right? I think LCHF is definitely the better terminology for what I'm doing...0 -
IslandSneezerooo wrote: »@Alliwan I don't care about the label or coolness factor, hehe, just don't want to be using incorrect terminology so trying to understand the difference... Thanks for explaining further!
So without a proper keto meter I won't know if I'm in FULL ketosis and the ketosis sticks only measure if you have SOME? Is that right? I think LCHF is definitely the better terminology for what I'm doing...
LCHF is the perfect terminology for what you are doing, and you are doing it well it seems. With out some sort of meter or blood test you wont know for sure, that is correct. You can guess by knowing if you went thru the Keto flu, if you are at 20g carbs or less a day, etc but you cant know for proof positive unless you test.
But if LCHF is working for you then you might not have or want to go Keto, it can be more difficult to sustain for some people than LCHF.
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Feel free to get a blood ketone meter if you wish, but be aware that it ranges from $3-5 a test. I'm diabetic on top of PCOS and insulin resistant, so I know how expensive all the testing equipment can get. I chose to use ketostix until the point in the future when they no longer show color. I've been ketogenic for months, and I still spill ketones in my urine, so I will continue to use ketostix instead of paying the high price for the blood ketone strips.
There are arguments that they are inaccurate, but I don't care how high my blood ketone level is if I'm still spilling ketones at the highest levels according to the ketostix. That purple proves my body is using the fat, and that is the only proof I need. There are many of us still using the sticks, and will continue to do so because our budget demands it.
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@ldmoor thanks for the heads up on that...0
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Feel free to get a blood ketone meter if you wish, but be aware that it ranges from $3-5 a test. I'm diabetic on top of PCOS and insulin resistant, so I know how expensive all the testing equipment can get. I chose to use ketostix until the point in the future when they no longer show color. I've been ketogenic for months, and I still spill ketones in my urine, so I will continue to use ketostix instead of paying the high price for the blood ketone strips.
There are arguments that they are inaccurate, but I don't care how high my blood ketone level is if I'm still spilling ketones at the highest levels according to the ketostix. That purple proves my body is using the fat, and that is the only proof I need. There are many of us still using the sticks, and will continue to do so because our budget demands it.
Actually, if you're getting waste ketones (which is what the ketostix measure), your body isn't using the ketones. The ketostix measure acetoacetate, which is the ketone that the muscles use. The longer you're in ketosis, the better they get at using them and the less the kidneys excrete, resulting in lighter shades on the strips, not darker. (For details, check out this post: http://ketopia.com/why-you-need-to-stop-worrying-about-the-color-of-your-ketostix/)
As for ketone test strips, they're more expensive, because you don't need to test it as often. Once a day is generally sufficient (and as you get the hang of the way of eating, you don't even need it that often). NovaMax has as sale right now, where you can get a meter and 2 boxes of your choice of strips for $40, and the ketone strips are $20 per box of 10. It's still a little pricey at $2/strip, but definitely on the lower end of cost. https://storefront.novacares.com/storefront/specials.html
If you're okay with the ketostix -- and you know what you're looking for and what the color suggests at a given point in your way of eating -- and don't care about exact numbers, by all means, go for it.0 -
Feel free to get a blood ketone meter if you wish, but be aware that it ranges from $3-5 a test. I'm diabetic on top of PCOS and insulin resistant, so I know how expensive all the testing equipment can get. I chose to use ketostix until the point in the future when they no longer show color. I've been ketogenic for months, and I still spill ketones in my urine, so I will continue to use ketostix instead of paying the high price for the blood ketone strips.
There are arguments that they are inaccurate, but I don't care how high my blood ketone level is if I'm still spilling ketones at the highest levels according to the ketostix. That purple proves my body is using the fat, and that is the only proof I need. There are many of us still using the sticks, and will continue to do so because our budget demands it.
I appreciate the cost reasoning here, but I wanted to say that you assumption that your body spilling ketones means you're using the fat is wrong. Everything that shows in your urine is WASTED ketones. It means your body is NOT using what you produce, that you are not adapted nor efficient at energy changes. You should actually be dropping the levels in the urine as your body gets keto adapted and functions better by using the ketones. If you are "dumping" all the ketones in your waste, there is no guarantee that you are using anything.
I believe that if your levels are low enough that you are creating ketones that your body is also using at least some of them, but I wanted to be sure you understood that your reasoning on the color of your Stix was backwards as far as actual information...0 -
http://ketodietapp.com/Blog/post/2013/11/30/Ketosis-Measuring-Ketones
from the text......
"Don't Focus Just on Ketones, See the Big Picture
Recently, I've noticed a growing obsession when it comes to measuring ketones precisely. Although urine detection strips may not be accurate for keto-adapted people, they work for most of those that have just started the ketogenic diet. By the time they become keto-adapted, which takes 3-4 weeks, most of them understand what to eat and what to avoid without any real need to measure the precise level of ketone bodies.
I've been in nutritional ketosis on and off for almost two years and can't really complain about urine strips. I still see low readings but I know the reason is that I'm not in ketosis every single day. I don't personally need to track the exact level because it won't make a difference to me. When I started, I used Ketostix to find out when I was in ketosis and what my net carbs limit should be. These days, my daily net carbs intake varies from 30 to 60 grams depending on how active I am.
My advice is that you should give Ketostix a try and if they don't work for you, use a blood ketone meter or simply listen to your body's signals. In the end, what really matters is not ketones but the effects of ketosis: weight loss and improved health."
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There is a lot of information in this link about the differences between blood ketones and urine ketones, so feel free to read. The fact remains that for those beginning the diet, ketostix is still a valid tool. They should not be discounted out of hand just because the newest theories state that blood ketones are superior. I've been using them for years on low carb as well, to tell whether or not I was in ketosis, which is the main concern here. Keto adaptation comes to those that follow the plan long term, but it takes everyone a different amount of time to get there.
With all the studies and new tech on measuring ketones with a breath meter, the blood meter will be come a thing of the past soon. New tech always comes to the forefront, but it doesn't eliminate the positive uses of the tools from previous tech. I expect that ketostix will still be used long after people get tired of poking their fingers every day and buy the breath analyzers. As a diabetic, I got tired of sore fingertips real fast.
Being a long term low carber of 15 years, I've seen a lot of things come and go. The basics are still the same, and the new programs built upon the research of the past pioneers. I'm not going discount tools that have worked for over a decade because there is a new tool in the workbox. We can quibble about which is a superior measurement, and what should actually be measured, but in the meantime, beginners need a tool that will gives them the encouragement to stay on plan.
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http://ketodietapp.com/Blog/post/2013/11/30/Ketosis-Measuring-Ketones
from the text......
"Don't Focus Just on Ketones, See the Big Picture
Recently, I've noticed a growing obsession when it comes to measuring ketones precisely. Although urine detection strips may not be accurate for keto-adapted people, they work for most of those that have just started the ketogenic diet. By the time they become keto-adapted, which takes 3-4 weeks, most of them understand what to eat and what to avoid without any real need to measure the precise level of ketone bodies.
I've been in nutritional ketosis on and off for almost two years and can't really complain about urine strips. I still see low readings but I know the reason is that I'm not in ketosis every single day. I don't personally need to track the exact level because it won't make a difference to me. When I started, I used Ketostix to find out when I was in ketosis and what my net carbs limit should be. These days, my daily net carbs intake varies from 30 to 60 grams depending on how active I am.
My advice is that you should give Ketostix a try and if they don't work for you, use a blood ketone meter or simply listen to your body's signals. In the end, what really matters is not ketones but the effects of ketosis: weight loss and improved health."
__________________________
There is a lot of information in this link about the differences between blood ketones and urine ketones, so feel free to read. The fact remains that for those beginning the diet, ketostix is still a valid tool. They should not be discounted out of hand just because the newest theories state that blood ketones are superior. I've been using them for years on low carb as well, to tell whether or not I was in ketosis, which is the main concern here. Keto adaptation comes to those that follow the plan long term, but it takes everyone a different amount of time to get there.
With all the studies and new tech on measuring ketones with a breath meter, the blood meter will be come a thing of the past soon. New tech always comes to the forefront, but it doesn't eliminate the positive uses of the tools from previous tech. I expect that ketostix will still be used long after people get tired of poking their fingers every day and buy the breath analyzers. As a diabetic, I got tired of sore fingertips real fast.
Being a long term low carber of 15 years, I've seen a lot of things come and go. The basics are still the same, and the new programs built upon the research of the past pioneers. I'm not going discount tools that have worked for over a decade because there is a new tool in the workbox. We can quibble about which is a superior measurement, and what should actually be measured, but in the meantime, beginners need a tool that will gives them the encouragement to stay on plan.
I'm not arguing for those just entering ketosis, but as the article/link you quoted states, they are primarily used for determining when you enter ketosis. And I wholeheartedly agree that the best indicators of anything are health/weight loss and all that... There is a whole host of benefits to one's health that come from doing Low Carb, High Fat, and Moderate protein, which is what you are doing if you bounce up to 60 grams of carbs semi-regularly, not Keto. Keto is a form of LCHFMP, but all LCHFMP is not Keto.
My personal experience is that "bouncing in and out of Keto" is harder on my and my body, so I either need to buckle up and stay fully Keto or I need to adjust and stay LCHFMP, but not aim for nutritional ketosis. As a diabetic, if you can slide back and forth more readily between the two, I'm thrilled for you, but for me, it is not a viable long term solution.
Ketogenic eating plans are LONG TERM eating plans. It isn't something you do for a month, then take a month off. Optimal health benefits are obtained after becoming keto adapted, which as you said takes different times for different people The 3-4 weeks the article references is not the general experience of anyone I know. I've hear 6-12 weeks plus. But, most of the people I know doing any form of LC have some form of metabolic disorder.
I'm glad that the way you use the Keto sticks works for you, but please understand that they will not work that way for anyone. I was not trying to tout the perfection of any one system. I was just saying that for Keto-adaption, which is the goal for most folks I know who do ketosis in general, the sticks are not the best tool one can use. I was not arguing that they have zero use.0 -
I appreciate your clarification. I went keto mid-Feb, and feel better than I did on LCHF. I know its working well, because my labwork supports it, and now my doctor does too. However, if it wasn't for the ketostix showing me I was in ketosis day after day, I might have given up low carbing over a decade ago. It was because of those little pink and purple squares lighting up day after day, that I gained the confidence to keep walking the path when the scale wasn't going down. I knew that because of the ketostix that the plan was working, and I was making progress even though I couldn't see it on the scale.
There are a lot of people putting down the usefulness of urine ketone measurement on these boards, and I'd hate for the new person to give up because they couldn't afford the blood ketone meter, and they couldn't tell what their body was doing. Even though I've been on keto since mid-Feb, I'm still dumping ketones in the urine to a high degree, and while I know that doesn't tell the level of ketones I'm truly burning, it gives me the mental boost to stay the course. It has been especially helpful during the three week stall my body decided to take recently. Until I start seeing momentum on the scale again, I need to see that purple or that chocolate chip cookie might get the better of me.
So... I'm a firm advocate of using ketostix for beginners!0 -
I appreciate your clarification. I went keto mid-Feb, and feel better than I did on LCHF. I know its working well, because my labwork supports it, and now my doctor does too. However, if it wasn't for the ketostix showing me I was in ketosis day after day, I might have given up low carbing over a decade ago. It was because of those little pink and purple squares lighting up day after day, that I gained the confidence to keep walking the path when the scale wasn't going down. I knew that because of the ketostix that the plan was working, and I was making progress even though I couldn't see it on the scale.
There are a lot of people putting down the usefulness of urine ketone measurement on these boards, and I'd hate for the new person to give up because they couldn't afford the blood ketone meter, and they couldn't tell what their body was doing. Even though I've been on keto since mid-Feb, I'm still dumping ketones in the urine to a high degree, and while I know that doesn't tell the level of ketones I'm truly burning, it gives me the mental boost to stay the course. It has been especially helpful during the three week stall my body decided to take recently. Until I start seeing momentum on the scale again, I need to see that purple or that chocolate chip cookie might get the better of me.
So... I'm a firm advocate of using ketostix for beginners!
No one's putting down the usefulness. We're clarifying the misconceptions around them. They can be useful, but when they're misunderstood, they cause great confusion.
What would you have done had the color started fading when you were first starting out? Sounds like that would have discouraged you, even though it would have just as likely meant you adapting, and not falling out of ketosis.0 -
Dragonwolf wrote: »I appreciate your clarification. I went keto mid-Feb, and feel better than I did on LCHF. I know its working well, because my labwork supports it, and now my doctor does too. However, if it wasn't for the ketostix showing me I was in ketosis day after day, I might have given up low carbing over a decade ago. It was because of those little pink and purple squares lighting up day after day, that I gained the confidence to keep walking the path when the scale wasn't going down. I knew that because of the ketostix that the plan was working, and I was making progress even though I couldn't see it on the scale.
There are a lot of people putting down the usefulness of urine ketone measurement on these boards, and I'd hate for the new person to give up because they couldn't afford the blood ketone meter, and they couldn't tell what their body was doing. Even though I've been on keto since mid-Feb, I'm still dumping ketones in the urine to a high degree, and while I know that doesn't tell the level of ketones I'm truly burning, it gives me the mental boost to stay the course. It has been especially helpful during the three week stall my body decided to take recently. Until I start seeing momentum on the scale again, I need to see that purple or that chocolate chip cookie might get the better of me.
So... I'm a firm advocate of using ketostix for beginners!
No one's putting down the usefulness. We're clarifying the misconceptions around them. They can be useful, but when they're misunderstood, they cause great confusion.
What would you have done had the color started fading when you were first starting out? Sounds like that would have discouraged you, even though it would have just as likely meant you adapting, and not falling out of ketosis.
Ironically, I've gotten utterly lazy about testing. My current indicator is that as long as I don't get the headache from any indulging, and I don't get any aspect of the flu from reentering keto and my health factors stay positive, I'm good. I know it is a lazy health approach, but for now it works. When it stops working, I'll reevaluate.
And for me, watching the ketones drop on the sticks without understanding why would have been hugely demoralizing, particularly if I knew I was sticking to my plan like glue. UNDERSTANDING is key to success, no matter what plan and tools you use.0 -
I wouldn't have gotten discouraged if the color changed, because I had done the research. However, I'm one of those people that research the crap out of things before I start, and most people take someone's advice and give it a go. If they read that blood ketone is the only accurate tool, and the cost is $3-5 per test, they may not even give ketosis a real try.
I'm still waiting for a color change, and once it starts to fade, I'll make the investment in either the blood meter or the breath version, because so far the results are promising. I'd rather go for breath, and spend less over the long term.
It doesn't matter to me right now if I'm adapted and the strips aren't as accurate, because I can 'feel' it working and my recent bloodwork proved it. I'm planning on being keto for life, but maybe not at <20 carbs permanently.
Education is the most important part of any eating plan, but we all know people that dive in without being fully aware of all the pros and cons. A good number of them end up doing well, but they are still researching weeks in, and in many cases, had no real idea of what they were doing in the beginning.
Even those of us on low carb plans for decades keep researching constantly, and try new things. If I hadn't kept trying to find something to help me lose weight, I wouldn't be on MFP right now. I was vehemently against tracking for well over a decade because I couldn't believe that I'd be one of the unlucky ones that couldn't just eat under my carb allowance and lose. Ten full years later, and the scale slowly climbing in spite of all the good that low carb was doing, I bit the bullet and started tracking macros. PCOS and insulin resistance sucks.
It was then I started using ketostix every day again, only because I needed the motivation to keep counting calories and forcing myself to eat an extra 500 calories a day. I kept thinking I was going to drop out of ketosis regularly because of all that food, and seeing the purple keeps me on track. Knowing I'm burning fats is enough motivation to keep forcing myself to eat extra food.0 -
Education and learning never ends, until we do. I find the people who never want to learn anything new quite dull! LOL0
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As for keto Macros. If you get to that point and want to give it a try I found recommended ranges were 70-75 fat, 20-25 protein, 5-10 carb.0
This discussion has been closed.