Negative adjustments?
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Angierae75 wrote: »I eat back most of mine. During the first six months of my weight loss I lost 25 pounds, which was pretty much exactly on target with the 1# per week I was shooting for.
Wow, that's awesome!
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So....what happens if you decide to "eat back" those calories? What if one decided to do so every. single. day? Just curious...
Then you would be eating at exactly the deficit you selected in MFP for losing weight.
If you selected 1 lb weekly, or 500 cal deficit - then eating those adjustments means you are getting a 500 cal deficit daily.
And don't imagine bigger is better, it's not consistently.
Odd day not bad, but then be willing to go over the odd day too - without remorse.
And now that you've set MFP from Active to Sedentary - you too should be getting big calorie adjustments. But guess what - the eating goal is probably going to be about the same, it's merely how the numbers are displayed.
And now that you understand what is being talked about, reread many of the posts above that specifically answer what happens if you eat your adjustments.
You just didn't get what they were talking about.0 -
So....what happens if you decide to "eat back" those calories? What if one decided to do so every. single. day? Just curious...
Your Fitbit burn is TDEE (your maintenance calories). Your default MFP calorie goal is activity level minus deficit. Adjustments are the difference between your Fitbit burn & your MFP activity level.
If (and only if) you enable negative calorie adjustments in your diary settings, eating back your adjustments means you're eating TDEE minus deficit.0 -
So....what happens if you decide to "eat back" those calories? What if one decided to do so every. single. day? Just curious...
Theoretically, you would lose weight at exactly the rate you have set in MFP. However...- Logging food accurately enough to achieve that is insanely hard (for me, anyway).
- If you've set too high a rate of weight loss in MFP then you'll lose muscle, not fat.
- If you've done too much restrictive dieting in the past (see previous item) you may not burn calories as fast as Fitbit estimates.
- There could be other factors throwing things off.
If you trust your Fitbit for 30 days, while logging your food as accurately as possible, then you can get a good feel for how accurate it is for you. You can look on your Fitbit profile page (website, not phone app) to get average calories out and calories in for the past 30 days (I don't know if this info can be gotten on the phone app). Do the math to get expected loss:
((Average calories burned per day - Average calories consumed per day) * 30)/3500 = expected weight loss
Then, look at your MFP "report" to see your weight loss for the last 30 days. Is it higher than expected? Congratulations, either your Fitbit underestimates or your food logging errors are on the high side. Is is lower than expected? Then either your Fitbit overestimates or (most likely in my case) you're underestimating what you eat.
Last time I evaluated it, I seemed to be off by about 80 calories a day. So, I've been adding 100 "quick add" calories every day in MFP to compensate. But, I haven't been obsessive about logging, so we'll see if it is adequate to make my expected loss match my actual loss.0 -
^^^ ^^^^
Yep, that's the thing... If you're going to 100% trust the calories fitbit is giving you, then your food logging has to be on point.
I've seen posts from people questioning fitbits calorie adjustments because they're not losing, but 9 times out of 10 their food logging is not accurate.0 -
I pretty much log everything I eat. Today I did a bit of snacking throughout the afternoon and evening, and with my dessert already logged in, meals, and snacking, I wound up with 28 calories left. But I figured it really wouldn't hurt to skip that 200-something calorie dessert, so I removed that, so now I get to add those calories that would have been eaten to my deficit. I think maybe I'm getting the hang of this. I so appreciate everyone helping me to understand this, thank you so much
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I pretty much log everything I eat. Today I did a bit of snacking throughout the afternoon and evening, and with my dessert already logged in, meals, and snacking, I wound up with 28 calories left. But I figured it really wouldn't hurt to skip that 200-something calorie dessert, so I removed that, so now I get to add those calories that would have been eaten to my deficit. I think maybe I'm getting the hang of this. I so appreciate everyone helping me to understand this, thank you so much
I have two weaknesses when it comes to logging. One is casual snacking - a nut here, a bite of chocolate there - that doesn't get recorded. I've gotten better about that but it is still a problem. The other is not weighing every single bite. For instance, tonight, I didn't weigh the components of my salad. Not just the lettuce, cucumber, tomato, and jicama, but I also didn't weigh the bacon, cheese or salad dressing. Now, I've gotten pretty good at eyeballing those, so I probably wasn't too far off, but I know that if I let myself do that too often then the amounts will start to creep up without my awareness.
I know that accurate logging is key to my weight loss. However, I also don't want to become obsessive about my eating, so I'd rather log those 100 "quick add" calories every morning and allow myself a little sloppiness in my logging.0 -
@angelz23 - notice the difference in what the Nancy and Christine are talking about, and the words you used.
Log everything I eat does not mean accurate - possibly by a long shot.
They both used the word "weigh" - probably purposely - because calories is per gram, not per spoon or cupful.
Accurate logging is per weight.
You could log a ton of fruit - medium apples, medium oranges, small carrots, ect - and be 500 calories off.
Because your idea of medium and what that entry means are not related.
But you ate 350 g apple and log 3.5 servings of 100 g serving size - now you got accurate logging, as you can get anyway.0 -
Interesting reading all this. I don't have negative calories set - it discouraged me and since I'm maintaining okay with it this way, I'll continue for now.0
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@angelz23 - notice the difference in what the Nancy and Christine are talking about, and the words you used.
Log everything I eat does not mean accurate - possibly by a long shot.
They both used the word "weigh" - probably purposely - because calories is per gram, not per spoon or cupful.
Accurate logging is per weight.
You could log a ton of fruit - medium apples, medium oranges, small carrots, ect - and be 500 calories off.
Because your idea of medium and what that entry means are not related.
But you ate 350 g apple and log 3.5 servings of 100 g serving size - now you got accurate logging, as you can get anyway.
True, I understand that. BUT I find myself NOT snacking on something if it's something I don't know how to track, so it's usually something like 14 Special K cracker chips, 1/2 fiber one bar, 22 green grapes, etc. Y'know?
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A digital scale is cheap and can really help with accuracy.
The grams for fruits, meat and veggies is the most accurate. I keep a conversion chart bookmarked so I can easily convert grams/oz.
I have measuring spoons, cups and some bowls that I use regularly because I have checked out the accuracy of them. So the liquids are easier to track since I can trust those tools.
Also looking for usda (name of fruit, veg, seed, nut) helps to log quicker.
If you have something you tend to eat often make it a My Meal, the my foods function gets messed up too often. I have a problem ticket in with MFP support for my foods, I had one page of info, currently, I have over 450 pages coming up.0 -
This isn't really a thread about how to log foods, I've pretty much got that down, but thanks.0
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I'm still confused on what to do, as I am set at sedentary , and am eating my extra calories. But I've also put it in mfp to gain1lb a week ( I don't wAnt to I just felt I need that so as by my pass weeks without my Fitbit) so why if my mfp is set for 500 kcal a day extra am I not putting on weight?0
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Why if my mfp is set for 500 kcal a day extra am I not putting on weight?
Open your diary for personalized advice, but you're overestimating your food &/or Fitbit is underestimating your burn.
Food is fuel, and we should all be looking for the maximum number of calories at which we lose weight, maintain, or gain—never the minimum.0 -
editorgrrl wrote: »Why if my mfp is set for 500 kcal a day extra am I not putting on weight?
Open your diary for personalized advice, but you're overestimating your food &/or Fitbit is underestimating your burn.
Food is fuel, and we should all be looking for the maximum number of calories at which we lose weight, maintain, or gain—never the minimum.
I'm quite good with food, I log everything and weigh it. So how can Fitbit underestimate my burn? I don't do exercise to log. Just day to day and I do walk a lot so my steps are correct?0 -
All the burns & calorie counts are nothing but estimates. That's why it takes trial & error to find what works for you.0
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Ok thanks can I ask, you said you do a whole days calories over in a week ( and still not gained) do u do that in one day ( binge day) or over a week? 0
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I'm still confused on what to do, as I am set at sedentary , and am eating my extra calories. But I've also put it in mfp to gain1lb a week ( I don't wAnt to I just felt I need that so as by my pass weeks without my Fitbit) so why if my mfp is set for 500 kcal a day extra am I not putting on weight?
You are probably finding like many that go from maintaining to attempted weight gain while lifting.
They keep increasing calories but not gaining weight - because a healthy body can speed up decently to burn the extra.
Eventually you'll gain though, just keep it up, since you mention not doing much extra exercise.
Also, the Fitbit underestimates daily burn for several reasons, so the stat MFP is getting to add 500 to may not be giving you a whole 500 extra anyway.
Might also confirm you are getting correct calorie burn for the walking.
Ever tested your stride length by comparing a known distance to Fitbit reported distance, say on treadmill?
The FAQ in the stickies in this group tells how to do it best.0 -
Let me start off by saying that I did NOT have negative adjustments enabled and I lost 40lbs in 4 months just fine
Having that said, I'm in maintenance mode now (I actually lost 10lbs more than I meant to, so I have ample wiggle room) & I decided to experiment with negative adjustments on starting yesterday. It feels like it's giving me too generous a burn for my step activity, but then again it hasn't failed me yet so I have no idea why I'm second guessing it. I suppose maybe now my activity level is really coming into play, huh? I have had it set to Lightly Active, even though TBH I'm pretty straight up Active. Anyone else think that's why it seems high? Or would that not make sense?0 -
Never claimed you wouldn't lose weight, but you might not get the deficit you thought you had, and weight loss would go slower, potentially.
Enabling negative does nothing to the calorie burn from Fitbit, or calories assigned to steps, or anything like that.
The ONLY place it comes in to play is if you are less active than the MFP activity level you selected.
So with default disabled - if MFP thought you'd burn 2000 on non-exercise day and you took 500 deficit, you'd eat 1500.
If Fitbit corrected MFP to an actual 2500 burned, then less 500 is 2000 eating goal.
But if Fitbit reported you burned 1800, MFP would stick with 2000 less 500 is 1500 eating goal.
But in actuality you only had a 300 cal deficit.
With negative enabled, MFP would correct to 1800 less 500 makes 1300 eating goal - same deficit.
So either you never had enough days of being less active than MFP first estimated, or you had enough balance between days it didn't matter, or you never had the full deficit but of course weight loss happens anyway.
And of course the calorie adjustment is going to be higher if you decrease the activity level.0 -
I have negative adjustments enabled and I do like it. I guess my only concern is that with non-HR systems, when lifting, you get almost nothing from fitbit. So when I log my activities and fitbit deducts that from its adjustment measurement, it is adjusting to something it never counted in the first place. Or am I wrong about this? I use it anyways because I'd rather my estimate of calories burned be low rather than high, but was curious if I had the wrong impression.0
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I have negative adjustments enabled and I do like it. I guess my only concern is that with non-HR systems, when lifting, you get almost nothing from fitbit. So when I log my activities and fitbit deducts that from its adjustment measurement, it is adjusting to something it never counted in the first place. Or am I wrong about this? I use it anyways because I'd rather my estimate of calories burned be low rather than high, but was curious if I had the wrong impression.
That is correct effect, and wrong impression.
Log your lifting - because ya - you are burning a whole lot more than sleeping calorie burn rate which you are getting for all the non-steps seen.
But Fitbit doesn't do the adjustment - MFP does. Fitbit merely reports total daily calorie burn for that math to MFP - that's all.
Fitbit underestimates anyway - don't make it worse by thinking you are playing it on the safe side.0 -
TI'm still confused on what to do, as I am set at sedentary , and am eating my extra calories. But I've also put it in mfp to gain1lb a week ( I don't wAnt to I just felt I need that so as by my pass weeks without my Fitbit) so why if my mfp is set for 500 kcal a day extra am I not putting on weight?
You are probably finding like many that go from maintaining to attempted weight gain while lifting.
They keep increasing calories but not gaining weight - because a healthy body can speed up decently to burn the extra.
Eventually you'll gain though, just keep it up, since you mention not doing much extra exercise.
Also, the Fitbit underestimates daily burn for several reasons, so the stat MFP is getting to add 500 to may not be giving you a whole 500 extra anyway.
Might also confirm you are getting correct calorie burn for the walking.
Ever tested your stride length by comparing a known distance to Fitbit reported distance, say on treadmill?
The FAQ in the stickies in this group tells how to do it best.
Thankyou0 -
I have negative adjustments enabled and I do like it. I guess my only concern is that with non-HR systems, when lifting, you get almost nothing from fitbit. So when I log my activities and fitbit deducts that from its adjustment measurement, it is adjusting to something it never counted in the first place. Or am I wrong about this? I use it anyways because I'd rather my estimate of calories burned be low rather than high, but was curious if I had the wrong impression.
That is correct effect, and wrong impression.
Log your lifting - because ya - you are burning a whole lot more than sleeping calorie burn rate which you are getting for all the non-steps seen.
But Fitbit doesn't do the adjustment - MFP does. Fitbit merely reports total daily calorie burn for that math to MFP - that's all.
Fitbit underestimates anyway - don't make it worse by thinking you are playing it on the safe side.
Maybe that's also a thing effecting my calorie burn estimate. I push a heavy wheelchair when at work sometimes for long periods of time. But my fit bit zip only counts the steps, but I can't log it as an exercise either0 -
I have negative adjustments enabled and I do like it. I guess my only concern is that with non-HR systems, when lifting, you get almost nothing from fitbit. So when I log my activities and fitbit deducts that from its adjustment measurement, it is adjusting to something it never counted in the first place. Or am I wrong about this? I use it anyways because I'd rather my estimate of calories burned be low rather than high, but was curious if I had the wrong impression.
That is correct effect, and wrong impression.
Log your lifting - because ya - you are burning a whole lot more than sleeping calorie burn rate which you are getting for all the non-steps seen.
But Fitbit doesn't do the adjustment - MFP does. Fitbit merely reports total daily calorie burn for that math to MFP - that's all.
Fitbit underestimates anyway - don't make it worse by thinking you are playing it on the safe side.
Maybe that's also a thing effecting my calorie burn estimate. I push a heavy wheelchair when at work sometimes for long periods of time. But my fit bit zip only counts the steps, but I can't log it as an exercise either
You are absolutely correct that the extra effort will be missed.
Now - flat surface at slower speeds and low rolling resistance (unless feet are hanging dragging) - I don't think you are missing out on too much.
Now, baby stroller up and down hills fast for an hour daily - ya, that's missing a lot.0 -
Mmmm maybe I shud find a way to add it as an exerciseI have negative adjustments enabled and I do like it. I guess my only concern is that with non-HR systems, when lifting, you get almost nothing from fitbit. So when I log my activities and fitbit deducts that from its adjustment measurement, it is adjusting to something it never counted in the first place. Or am I wrong about this? I use it anyways because I'd rather my estimate of calories burned be low rather than high, but was curious if I had the wrong impression.
That is correct effect, and wrong impression.
Log your lifting - because ya - you are burning a whole lot more than sleeping calorie burn rate which you are getting for all the non-steps seen.
But Fitbit doesn't do the adjustment - MFP does. Fitbit merely reports total daily calorie burn for that math to MFP - that's all.
Fitbit underestimates anyway - don't make it worse by thinking you are playing it on the safe side.
Maybe that's also a thing effecting my calorie burn estimate. I push a heavy wheelchair when at work sometimes for long periods of time. But my fit bit zip only counts the steps, but I can't log it as an exercise either
You are absolutely correct that the extra effort will be missed.
Now - flat surface at slower speeds and low rolling resistance (unless feet are hanging dragging) - I don't think you are missing out on too much.
Now, baby stroller up and down hills fast for an hour daily - ya, that's missing a lot.0 -
Got a HRM for exercise use?
Use it one day and during an example pushing time see what the avgHR is, especially compared to normal walking around time without wheelchair.
If above 90, then do a treadmill test sometime and see what flat pace is required to hit the same HR.
Also some average day, use a stopwatch to time all the sessions of that pushing that you do, to see just how long it is.
So now you have average time, and average effort.
Use this calculator, which is using same formula that Fitbit uses with pace and weight.
But select the Gross option, because you are going to replace what Fitbit came up with.
http://www.exrx.net/Calculators/WalkRunMETs.html
Now, the kicker will be - how do you log this during the day when you must pick a start and duration time?
I don't think you'll even want to attempt replacing the calorie burn for all the separate moments it happened - so I'd say pick a chunk of time that starts around time of first pushing and just replace a chunk.
Then again, you may discover the amount of time isn't that great in total, combined with not much difference in calorie burn over what is being seen already. Or HR never gets above 90 so no valid walk test possible.0 -
Got a HRM for exercise use?
Use it one day and during an example pushing time see what the avgHR is, especially compared to normal walking around time without wheelchair.
If above 90, then do a treadmill test sometime and see what flat pace is required to hit the same HR.
Also some average day, use a stopwatch to time all the sessions of that pushing that you do, to see just how long it is.
So now you have average time, and average effort.
Use this calculator, which is using same formula that Fitbit uses with pace and weight.
But select the Gross option, because you are going to replace what Fitbit came up with.
http://www.exrx.net/Calculators/WalkRunMETs.html
Now, the kicker will be - how do you log this during the day when you must pick a start and duration time?
I don't think you'll even want to attempt replacing the calorie burn for all the separate moments it happened - so I'd say pick a chunk of time that starts around time of first pushing and just replace a chunk.
Then again, you may discover the amount of time isn't that great in total, combined with not much difference in calorie burn over what is being seen already. Or HR never gets above 90 so no valid walk test possible.
No hrm.
. Well at moment , just a zip 0
