1.5 months to my marathon: HELP

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kirstengeffen
kirstengeffen Posts: 103 Member
So I'm running my first marathon 24th April... my question is such; I've run 3 half's leading up to it, and I'm currently up to 28km per week... I'm increasing my "long run" by 2km per week and I'm trying to run about 80 km per week... my question is what distance should I max out at with my long run and how long before the marathon should i start tapering and how important is tapering? What's the point?? Is 80km per week enough for training or should I try boost it to around 100km?

I'm worried because on my long runs I run about 7 min per km and the marathon cut off time is 5 hours, so I'm cutting it pretty fine..

Any last min advice to up my game in the next month and a bit??

Replies

  • eldamiano
    eldamiano Posts: 2,667 Member
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    No point doing more than 21 miles really in training. Too much more pain for little gain. Work your way up gradually to this then try and do 2 runs of around this distance in advance, 2 weeks rest before the race minimum.
  • jmcowan42
    jmcowan42 Posts: 89 Member
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    Tapering is extremely necessary, especially for the first marathon. The normal suggested tapering period for a full marathon is 2-3 weeks. It gives your body and mind plenty of time to recover. Studies actually prove that proper tapering increases your finish time and overall experience of the race.

    Jumping from 28km to 80km a week in 1 months time (with 3 weeks to taper) is pretty drastic. But don't worry, you are not behind schedule. I'd suggest working up to a long run of 20 miles about 3 weeks before. This gives your body plenty of time to heal and your mind plenty of time to recover because 20 milers are probably more mentally exhausting than anything. Once you run 20 miles you can tackle 26.2.

    Good luck!

  • lporter229
    lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
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    Just to clarify, is your current long run 28 km, or is that your weekly total? For your first marathon, I do not personally think it is necessary to run 100 km per week, even 80 km might be a bit more than necessary, so don't worry if you don't get there. I agree with @jmcowan42 and @eldamiano , your focus at this point should be to get your long run up to 20 miles (ideally you want to get two runs in at this distance), with two weeks left to taper before the race. The more weekly miles you can get in to supplement, the better, but you also have to be careful not to increase your mileage too drastically or you will risk injury and burn out. If you are currently not near 80km per week total, then I would not push it. Adding too many miles too fast is likely to hurt you rather than help you.

    Best of luck!!!
  • trswallow
    trswallow Posts: 116 Member
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    I would recommend that you start using a training plan. Based on the questions you have been asking over the past several weeks it is obvious that you are feeling anxious about being prepared for your marathon. A training plan will take care of a lot of the guesswork that you are currently doing and allow you to concentrate on training and recovery, instead worrying about how much distance, how often, and how fast.

    Personally I have always used Hal Higdon's plans and I have no complaints. Since this is your first marathon use a novice plan and count back from the end to figure where you should be in the plan.

    I am currently training for a marathon in April using an intermediate plan and my biggest mile weeks have a total of 43 miles (<70km), so hitting 80 or 100 km is not necessary. Also you say that you are adding more distance each week, but you should be building up your distance and then every 3 to 4 weeks have a step back week where you drop your distances for your long run and intermediate long run. The purpose of a step back week is to allow your body to recover from the pounding and fatigue that you have been accumulating.

    Most training plans will have you maxing out with a long run of 20 miles (32 km), because this is the tipping point where the training benefit still outweighs the damage and fatigue created by running that distance.

    The purpose of tapering as you approach race day is so that your body can recover, eliminate the built up fatigue, and be fresh for race day. If your body is not ready to cover the distance two weeks out, then trying to cram in extra miles during those final two weeks is not going to get you to the start line any more prepared. Being rested and recovered on race day will help you stay under the cut off time.

    So my advice is:
    1) Find a plan and follow it. Just remember it is a guide and if you need to shift which day you do the long run or which day(s) are your rest day then go ahead and make the adjustments.
    2) Run smarter not farther or faster.
    a) Running extra distance is just junk miles and increases your chance of developing an injury and not being in top condition at the start line.
    b) Follow the 80/20 rule. 80% of your training runs should be at an low intensity/easy pace and only 20% should be at moderate or high intensity (http://www.runnersworld.com/rt-web-exclusive/train-at-the-right-intensity-ratio). In training plans this might be stated as running at 60-90 seconds/mi slower than your planned race pace. I think that works out to 35-56 seconds/km slower.
    3) Get plenty of rest. If your plan says it is a rest day then rest. You can do light activities like walking, yoga, and stretching. However don't use it as a day to squeeze in a spin sessions or an extra run.
    4) Use some of your long runs as a race day simulation. Get up when you will for your race, have breakfast, go for your run. Figuring out what you can stand to eat before a long run can make or break your race day experience.
    5) On race day start toward the back and start slow. If you start in the front half of the pack you will be sucked along and end up running too fast too soon. This will only set you up to have a bad second half. Psychologically it is better to start toward the back and pass other people during the race, than to start toward the front and watch the pack stream by you.
  • dsg2000
    dsg2000 Posts: 38 Member
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    I agree with everyone above. Most training plans will have a long run that maxes at around 20 miles (32 km); you don't need a long run further than that. 80km a week also sounds like plenty for a first marathon. Mostly, you simply don't have the time to make any drastic changes to your training now - it's much too late.

    Taper is *super* important. Most plans will have you taper for two weeks. I remember I tried to shorten the taper to one week (that is, I was doing my 20mile run two weeks before the marathon instead of three) and I completely crashed and burned that race. There may have been other factors at work there of course too, but it's important to enter the race feeling fresh. The marathon distance is a lot harder on your body than a 30km run.

    The general rule of thumb is that you should increase your weekly mileage no more than 10% percent any given week.

    I agree with trswallow that you should look into a marathon plan for next time - it gets rid of a lot of the "shoulds/woulds" when you know you're following a plan that many, many people have successfully used before you. I used Higdon's plans (you can find them online for free) for my first few races and they certainly worked just fine.
  • 5512bf
    5512bf Posts: 389 Member
    edited March 2016
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    If you want to add more miles make sure they have a purpose. That is why everyone is giving your the advise to get a training plan and stick to it. Those plans typically have the runs set up so each one has a purpose. Adding 20k (12 miles) to where you are at at this point in time would be difficult but not impossible. A few ways to add some miles with purpose would be something similar to these runs if you currently do not do them. If you already do them then ignore the following.

    If you do not do a recovery run the day following your long run, one that is 4-6 miles at a super easy pace, you could easily add there. Make sure it is at least 75-90 seconds per mile, or more slower than your goal pace. Recovery runs are a good way to get some blood flowing to your stiff legs before continuing with some harder training in the form of tempo's or intervals the following day.

    If you do not do an easy pace run the day before your long run you could add some miles there as well. Those miles would help put some fatigue in the legs on your long run and help simulate those last few miles of a marathon. All the plans I've ever done have you doing half the distance of the long run the day prior. If you don't do that now it wouldn't be wise to add 10 miles the day before your 20, but doing a 5-6 mile run would still have a purpose. Just make sure it is at an easy pace.

    Adding in short 2-3 miles run would be what one poster described as junk miles so avoid the temptation to just go for a quick jog just to add a couple miles to you total. Adding miles is not always a bad thing, just make sure they have a purpose in your training. I personally don't think that a peak of 60-62 miles is a bad thing, just make sure that you do it gradually and make those miles easy runs.
  • alikonda
    alikonda Posts: 2,358 Member
    edited March 2016
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    So I'm running my first marathon 24th April... my question is such; I've run 3 half's leading up to it, and I'm currently up to 28km per week... I'm increasing my "long run" by 2km per week and I'm trying to run about 80 km per week... my question is what distance should I max out at with my long run
    32-35 km for a long run is more than plenty for your first marathon
    and how long before the marathon should i start tapering and how important is tapering? What's the point??
    As everyone else has stated, tapering is super important; give it 2-3 weeks to let your body recover from the training and be ready to perform. That rest time is what will allow your muscles to carry you those extra miles to the full marathon distance.
    Is 80km per week enough for training or should I try boost it to around 100km?
    80 km/week is fine, so don't stress about adding mileage unless you're sure your body can handle it. My highest mileage week before my first marathon was only 86 km (and that was only ONE week, most - after build up - were around 77.)
  • kristinegift
    kristinegift Posts: 2,406 Member
    edited March 2016
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    There's not really any reason to go above 20 miles in training, nor above 80km for a weekly total. You're doing a lot all at once: you're putting more stress on your body by running the longer long run as well as adding on more and more mileage to get to that 80 km each week. At this point in your training, run 20 miles/32km at least once, and then start tapering the first weekend in April.

    Honestly, I think your focus should be getting to the starting line healthy considering what you're putting your body through in training up so quickly from HM to full marathon distance. You're trying to do in two months what most people would build up to over 4-6 months, or even longer. My best advice to you would be to make sure you get in an 18 miler, a 20 miler, and a solid taper, then get to the starting line and finishing line in one piece.

    Edit to add: Wait are you running 28km TOTAL for the week or is that your long run currently? If that's how far you are running over the whole week, that does not bode well. You are not going to be able to almost triple your mileage in the next 6 weeks without incurring injury. If that is your long run and you are building up to 80km from maybe 60, then you could maybe do it. Carefully.
  • kirstengeffen
    kirstengeffen Posts: 103 Member
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    Hi guys,

    Thank you all so much for the input!

    Just to clarify... haha... my long run is 28km. My weekly total is currently between 50 km and 60km.

    I know I seem anxious....... its because I am.
    It's not really because I feel under prepared, but because of my personality type, I want to feel over prepared.

    You guys are right about a training program. I use a Nike plus watch and I think I'm going to follow a program on there. They have a nice one... I should ve done that from the start!!!

    Also, with regards to build up.... I've been running consistently for about 6 months and was probably fit enough to do a HM a while ages ago, but the same anxiety I have about the marathon put me off entering a HM and when I finally did it, I wish I did it sooner!! Which is why I immediately booked the marathon and made a commitment. So I ran my first HM about 2 months ago... so its been a while since then that I've been "marathon training"

    Again, thanks for all the input, I really value the opinions...

    You guys are serious inspirations... running a marathon is a HUGE deal to me... The dedication and time it takes is crazy.. so we'll done to you all. I can't wait to join the "I did it!!" Club!
  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
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    Good luck! My opinions below...

    Your long run right now is appropriate for a full marathon distance. As others have mentioned a 32km once can help, but do an honest check with yourself that you are ready to try that first. You would be better served having done long runs of 28k and making it to race day healthy than feeling you must reach 32k and hurt yourself. Some believe the 32k is not even necessary, but I believe it provides some mental preparation for race day. It's clearly not an absolute necessity, but a nice to have in your case.

    Your weekly mileage is a bit low, but not low enough to panic. Considering you only have about 3 more weeks of training before you start your taper you cant build up much higher, but might finish these last 2-3 weeks before the taper with more than 60k, perhaps 65 or even 70 at the very most. As much as you can do feeling quite safe about it. Bring healthy is most important this close to the start.

    Don't change your training now by taking up a training plan this close to the race, there is not enough time to benefit from it, but plenty of opportunities to try something you're not physically ready for that the plan suggests you do. That could cause injury and all of your efforts could be lost.

    You mentioned you have only been running for 6 months, yet have come so far. Clearly you were in great shape starting out. I think your maun focus should be avoiding injury because your tendons and bones have only been adapting to 6 months of extended pounding from running. So don't worry about speed, just run comfortably and get the kilometers you can ahead of the taper. Run the race similarly because that will be the most demanding effort you have asked if your body, so no sense pushing or straining at any point of it unnecessarily. Taper appropriately and eat healthy, load up on carbs ahead appropriately (don't assume just a plate of pasta the night before is proper marathon carb loading).

    Most of all...have fun. Even if you feel miserable and think you want to die, put on a smile and try to laugh, even if it seems impossible at least try to push yourself to finish happy. Because when you finish you WILL be very happy.

    Please update us with how things go!
  • kristinegift
    kristinegift Posts: 2,406 Member
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    @findingkirst Phew, ok! Your LR is 28k, so you're in pretty good shape. I'm looking forward to hearing about the race next month when you join the marathon club!
  • lporter229
    lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
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    Yes. Glad to hear that 28km is your long run and not your weekly total. I suspected as much, but you never know. You would be surprised at the posts that show up on here! Anyway, I agree that it sounds like you are in pretty good shape and have prepared well. Now you just have to trust in your training. As simple and cliche as that sounds, it's probably the number one piece of advice for anyone going into a marathon, be it their first or their 20th. If you trained sufficiently, you will do fine.
  • trswallow
    trswallow Posts: 116 Member
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    Hi guys,

    Thank you all so much for the input!

    Just to clarify... haha... my long run is 28km. My weekly total is currently between 50 km and 60km.

    I know I seem anxious....... its because I am.
    It's not really because I feel under prepared, but because of my personality type, I want to feel over prepared.

    You guys are right about a training program. I use a Nike plus watch and I think I'm going to follow a program on there. They have a nice one... I should ve done that from the start!!!

    Also, with regards to build up.... I've been running consistently for about 6 months and was probably fit enough to do a HM a while ages ago, but the same anxiety I have about the marathon put me off entering a HM and when I finally did it, I wish I did it sooner!! Which is why I immediately booked the marathon and made a commitment. So I ran my first HM about 2 months ago... so its been a while since then that I've been "marathon training"

    Again, thanks for all the input, I really value the opinions...

    You guys are serious inspirations... running a marathon is a HUGE deal to me... The dedication and time it takes is crazy.. so we'll done to you all. I can't wait to join the "I did it!!" Club!

    I think following a plan will help calm your nerves to some extent. However as previously stated you should make sure that the plan you are using is a novice plan. If your plan has tempo, hill repeats, or interval runs then it is more of an intermediate or advanced plan, and should be avoided. You probably should also avoid pace runs, because I am guessing that so far most of your training runs have probably been pace runs.

    The important thing is to make it to the start line in good shape and feeling that you are prepared, and then making it from the start line to the finish line. For that you just need to cover distances on your training runs. You don't need to be doing any of the more advanced types of runs, that some of suggested. Those advanced runs are intended to improve speed. This is your first marathon, you will automatically get a PR.

    If you need to find a different plan I would recommend this one (http://www.halhigdon.com/training/51137/Marathon-Novice-1-Training-Program) because the 12/13 week distances look like they align well with what you say your current distances are. If nothing else at least read Hal's descriptions of the various elements of the training plan so that you have an idea of how you should be approaching the different runs during the week.

    You might also see if you can find some mid distance races (10 - 15K) in the next couple of weeks that you could run. This could possibly help some with race day anxiety, since it would allow you to do a full dress rehearsal for race day. If the race distance is less than what your training distance is supposed to be for the day, then run the race plus additional distance to hit your training distance. Just make sure that you do not race all-out. If you run the race faster than what you would have run your training run at, then make sure that you take it easier when you are finishing off your training distance.
  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
    edited March 2016
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    You know, it is kind of interesting to see how this thread with 1.5 months of training before a full varies from another with 6 weeks left before a half. The main difference is in the current training condition of the runners. Doesn't help the OP and hope this is not considered a hijack, but I thought it was interesting reading my advice and others here again after some thoughts yesterday in the other thread. I know it is apples and oranges in a number of respects, but this one is more cautious and the other one much more bold. :smile:
  • lporter229
    lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
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    @WhatMeRunning Interesting observation. For me, the biggest difference is less about the current condition of the runners and more about the race distance. As you stated, apples and oranges. I would never have given the same advice I gave on the other thread if she had been talking about a full marathon. Two completely different beasts.
  • MobyCarp
    MobyCarp Posts: 2,927 Member
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    @WhatMeRunning @lporter229 - I didn't offer advice on either thread, because a) others had already covered the most important points, and b) the situations and conditioning of the posters are enough different than mine that I'm not sure how relevant my experience is to them.

    THBS, there are two considerations that jump out at me. As @lporter229 observes, a full marathon and a half are different beasts. The half is much more attainable in terms of time required to prepare and how well it forgives a runner for being light on the training. The other thing is, the runner asking about a half has already done one, and the runner asking about the marathon is doing her first one. There is a huge difference between preparing for the first half or full marathon and preparing for a half or full marathon with the experience of having already completed one. Particularly for the full marathon, conservatism is indicated for the first time. No amount of reading and conversation with marathon runners can totally prepare you for how miles 22 to 26 of a marathon will feel. And there's always that nagging doubt about the ability to actually run 26.2 miles, until you do it for the first time.

    The first vs. second thing struck me yesterday evening. Before my first marathon, I talked to the man who would later be my coach. When he heard it would be my first, he said things like, "The first 10K is a warmup," and, "Don't pass the pacer." Now I'm following his training plan for my second marathon, which happens to be Boston. Now he's saying things like, "Run the first 10K at 10 seconds per mile faster than your average marathon pace for goal time, then slow down to MP and try to hold on." The coaching for the first was coaching to finish; the coaching for the second is coaching to finish well and hit a goal time on a challenging course with the easy part early and the hard part starting at mile 16.
  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
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    I agree with both of you that the race distance vs. experience at that distance is a big difference in the two situations. I just happened to notice the same time frame and that made me want to comment. :smile: