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Cursed is the man who dies, but the evil done by him survive

dexter11233
dexter11233 Posts: 19 Member
edited October 4 in Social Groups
Hopefully another hot one:

Should the death penalty be abolished in the United States?

Replies

  • Grimmerick
    Grimmerick Posts: 3,342 Member
    No, some people don't deserve to be on this planet and I am not religious so yes I will make that judgement on someone. Just as long as you are sure they are guilty of whatever horrific crime they have done. No room in the world for those kind of people.
  • BrettPGH
    BrettPGH Posts: 4,716 Member
    Nope. I'm generally a pacifist. But I think there are some monsters in this world. Namely pedophiles. I'd line 'em up and throw the switch myself if I could. And I try not to kill bugs!
  • dexter11233
    dexter11233 Posts: 19 Member
    Just as long as you are sure they are guilty of whatever horrific crime they have done.

    Reassurance of guilt is one of the many issues that plague the current system in place. Legally, you can be convicted of a crime, but realistically be innocent and wrongfully put to death. (Ellis Wayne Felker, Colin Campbell Ross, George Kelly) But even with that in mind, do you think that execution is still a viable solution for these "dangerous" inmates?
  • mikajoanow
    mikajoanow Posts: 584 Member
    I am okay with the death penalty IF there is DNA evidence that proves beyond anything that the person in question did it. We have actually killed many innocent people in the US.
  • kendernau
    kendernau Posts: 155 Member
    I agree - the death penalty should not be abolished. However, it should not be looked at as a deterrent - it should only be a solution for someone who cannot be redeemed.

    Much like wild animals, if they become too dependent on humans and become an active threat, the best thing to do is to relocate them to an area where the interaction is minimized, and if they return or continue their actions, we kill them.

    In almost every case, I do not believe someone should be sentenced to death for a single crime - no matter how heinous. Life in prison - maybe. It should be reserved those who show a systemic lack of regard for others, as shown by repeated actions.

    I do think most states that still have the death penalty generally do a good job of this.
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,412 Member
    I am okay with the death penalty IF there is DNA evidence that proves beyond anything that the person in question did it. We have actually killed many innocent people in the US.

    I worked in a DNA testing lab. These labs are run by people. People who do not have their own lives hanging in the balance. There are lots of mistakes made in DNA labs. There better be results from twenty labs that say exactly the same thing before you start going all DNA on it.

    I also know police procedures. They are also human.

    (This is what I think gets me out of jury duty.)

    There are some who do absolutely deserve to be put to death by a civilized society. But there better be a lot more than DNA evidence and its flawed collection and testing procedures.
  • JustEllieK
    JustEllieK Posts: 423 Member
    I think that the death penalty is harsh but i am generally people loving and hate to think of death as a way to solve anything. Even for murderers i find it hard.

    I have facts or as some would say merely reasons for my belief, however they all rely on my belief in the bible and God, so i will not state them here. I simply wanted to give my opinion.
  • iAMaPhoenix
    iAMaPhoenix Posts: 1,038 Member
    Abolished? I think not. But I do think it needs some tweaking. I do not think anyone should be given the death penalty based on evidence collected and processed by a criminal justice system that is as corrupt as ours. The amount of innocent people put to death are just too high(more than 1 is too high). Even in cases where there are eyewitness testimony, I do not think it should be used. I myself think all white people look alike, so I will pick the first one and call it a day. I am going to venture out to say that there are confessions that are beaten or threatened out of suspects that end up in someone getting the needle. If you threaten me with saying you will make my family's life a living hell, I will confess to whatever you want me to. Heck, even DNA is not a proof of guilt as I could have spat or rubbed some sweat on the victim in the club the night before.
    Now, who are clear cut death penalty candidates in my opinion are Charles Manson, Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, Anders Behring Breivik(Norway shooter), Timothy McVeigh, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, the Fort Hood Shooter, and of course it goes without saying that any cop killer must die, but not from the chair, but on sight. Oh, and some people probably want to give Mike the needle because he got rid of signatures, but don't you guys think that is a little extreme...lol!!!
  • Grimmerick
    Grimmerick Posts: 3,342 Member
    Just out of morbid curiousity. Does anyone on here know of a person that was innocently put to death that had never done anything else wrong legally? I am sure there has got to be one or two. I have to say all of the people I have seen put to death had rap sheets 10 pages long of violent crimes against others, I guess thats why when people say we have put an innocent person to death I am always thinking in the back of my head, How innocent were they really?
  • mikajoanow
    mikajoanow Posts: 584 Member
    I am okay with the death penalty IF there is DNA evidence that proves beyond anything that the person in question did it. We have actually killed many innocent people in the US.

    I worked in a DNA testing lab. These labs are run by people. People who do not have their own lives hanging in the balance. There are lots of mistakes made in DNA labs. There better be results from twenty labs that say exactly the same thing before you start going all DNA on it.

    I also know police procedures. They are also human.

    (This is what I think gets me out of jury duty.)

    There are some who do absolutely deserve to be put to death by a civilized society. But there better be a lot more than DNA evidence and its flawed collection and testing procedures.

    ITA I meant to imply that.
  • VeganInTraining
    VeganInTraining Posts: 1,319 Member
    Abolished? I think not. But I do think it needs some tweaking. I do not think anyone should be given the death penalty based on evidence collected and processed by a criminal justice system that is as corrupt as ours. The amount of innocent people put to death are just too high(more than 1 is too high). Even in cases where there are eyewitness testimony, I do not think it should be used. I myself think all white people look alike, so I will pick the first one and call it a day. I am going to venture out to say that there are confessions that are beaten or threatened out of suspects that end up in someone getting the needle. If you threaten me with saying you will make my family's life a living hell, I will confess to whatever you want me to. Heck, even DNA is not a proof of guilt as I could have spat or rubbed some sweat on the victim in the club the night before.
    Now, who are clear cut death penalty candidates in my opinion are Charles Manson, Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, Anders Behring Breivik(Norway shooter), Timothy McVeigh, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, the Fort Hood Shooter, and of course it goes without saying that any cop killer must die, but not from the chair, but on sight. Oh, and some people probably want to give Mike the needle because he got rid of signatures, but don't you guys think that is a little extreme...lol!!!

    I definitely agree. I wouldn't want it abolished but i think it must be refined. Just as an on the fly judgement I would say the death penalty shouldn't be something that can be decided on first trial. those stated above, I certainly think would be great candidates, and why not clear up the prisions by putting them to death? Rather than having that as a sentence when first tried, give them "life in prison" with a reaccessment after x amount of years. Then after the reaccessment possibly give them the needle
  • ♥Faerie♥
    ♥Faerie♥ Posts: 14,053 Member
    Nope, but I think that there should be no doubt what so ever....there have been plenty of people that have died for crimes they did not commit, and then it was found out after the fact....
  • california_peach
    california_peach Posts: 1,809 Member
    I am very torn on this issue. I do not personally believe in the death penalty. Honestly it sickens me to give the state the right to take a life. BUT, I totally get why people want it to not end. And this is why I am glad it is different from state to state. So each state can decide what to do within that state.
  • glypta
    glypta Posts: 440 Member
    I'm against it (though I'm in the UK where we don't do it anymore). I know if someone killed someone I loved, I'd want them dead, but I don't believe two wrongs make a right. No-one has the right to take a life, and although that person doesn't have the right to kill someone, I don't believe we have the right to take life either, no matter how 'justified' we think it is. And for sure, what if the 'irrefutable' evidence is wrong/tampered with? Morally killing is wrong and I think killing the wrongdo-er makes society as bad as them, and almost condones it.

    And I also think that a lifetime in jail would be worse than death, although another topic for me would be whether jail is strict enough...
  • VeganGal84
    VeganGal84 Posts: 938 Member
    YES. It is ridiculous that we still kill people for killing people.
  • Grimmerick
    Grimmerick Posts: 3,342 Member
    YES. It is ridiculous that we still kill people for killing people.

    So we shouldn't put down rabid dogs either right?

    I have a perfect example of a rabid dog that needs to be put down, she is crazy, we know she brutally murdered someone, and we can never know for sure that she won't go crazy and murder again for no good reason whatsoever. Thats pretty rabid to me, put her down. Lululemon trial's Brittany Norwood.
  • VeganGal84
    VeganGal84 Posts: 938 Member
    YES. It is ridiculous that we still kill people for killing people.

    So we shouldn't put down rabid dogs either right?

    This is such a silly comparison. The rabid dog was doomed to die from the disease and is suffering terribly, so YES they should be put down.

    The inmate on death row is only doomed to die because of terrible death penalty laws. There is a big difference.
  • Grimmerick
    Grimmerick Posts: 3,342 Member
    It's not a silly comparison, just like there can be a rabid dog that is dangerous to others and you can never guarantee that they won't go crazy and kill. There are people that have continually showed violence and committed horrific murders that you can't ever trust them with anyone without guaranteeing they won't harm or kill again. Whats the point of their life and them being here and sitting rotting in a jail for the rest of their lives taking up space and money. I am not religious so I have no problem passing judgement, and it wouldn't be a long time before execution, one bullet one brain is all I would need. Send them on to the next level.
  • VeganGal84
    VeganGal84 Posts: 938 Member
    I'm not religious either, but I do believe that murder is wrong, no matter who does it. A homicidal maniac or the government.
  • Grimmerick
    Grimmerick Posts: 3,342 Member
    I would be ok with not killing a murderer as long as the rest of their life is the most miserable possible life we could make it. Total solitary confinement, food with no taste, no tv, internet, contact with others. They literally sit in a very small(don't want them taking up too much space) cell with nothing else to do but think. Maybe books but only educational boring ones. Bernie Medoff isn't a murderer but he states he has settled into life in prison and he said he doesn't mind it at all. He entertains himself with tv and books, everything is taken care of he has no worries, just has to live day to day in the routine. That is not enough punishment to me for murder.
  • VeganGal84
    VeganGal84 Posts: 938 Member
    I would be ok with not killing a murderer as long as the rest of their life is the most miserable possible life we could make it. Total solitary confinement, food with no taste, no tv, internet, contact with others. They literally sit in a very small(don't want them taking up too much space) cell with nothing else to do but think. Maybe books but only educational boring ones. Bernie Medoff isn't a murderer but he states he has settled into life in prison and he said he doesn't mind it at all. He entertains himself with tv and books, everything is taken care of he has no worries, just has to live day to day in the routine. That is not enough punishment to me for murder.

    I totally agree with this!
  • Grimmerick
    Grimmerick Posts: 3,342 Member
    haha Then it's a deal.
  • VeganInTraining
    VeganInTraining Posts: 1,319 Member
    YES. It is ridiculous that we still kill people for killing people.

    So we shouldn't put down rabid dogs either right?

    I have a perfect example of a rabid dog that needs to be put down, she is crazy, we know she brutally murdered someone, and we can never know for sure that she won't go crazy and murder again for no good reason whatsoever. Thats pretty rabid to me, put her down. Lululemon trial's Brittany Norwood.

    I agree that she's nuts and we don't know if she will kill again, but this is a situation where I would disagree with the death penalty. Perhaps life in prison or something like that. Yes, it's murder but it's a first time offence and she is clearly nuts! She should be in a jail or the criminally insane where they try to rehab her (but not necessarily allow her back into society)

    I agree that most prisons should not be so comfortable but that the are some people (perhaps Brittany Norwood) who need rehabilitation and a safe place to exist. I guess I'm one of the people who believes there SOME good in everyone....

    After you were posting this I was thinking about my brother who is a corrections officer. He works in the jail that Edmond Kemper is in...after seeing the movie "Kemper" my bro asked Kemper if he knew there was a movie about him. Edmond, went on about how it's totally inaccurate and the guy in the movie is short and the only reason he got away with it so long is because he is tall so he would carry his victims so that there wouldn't be drag marks....this is an example of someone I would definitely say needs to be shot.
  • sarah_ep
    sarah_ep Posts: 580 Member
    I do not think we can always be 100% sure that someone is guilty in every case, therefore, I do not believe in the death penalty.

    At the Death House Door is a pretty good doc about someone who was executed but innocent.
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