Are you married to or in a relationship with a relatve?
kapeluza
Posts: 3,434 Member
Are you married to or in a relationship with a relative.? Do you think incestuous relationships recieve a bad rap unfairly? Do you think people should be able to marry and procreate with whoever they want to.
Go.
Personally, I think incestuous relationships should be illegal.
Go.
Personally, I think incestuous relationships should be illegal.
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Replies
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We have a lot of "to each his own" people in this group, but I do not subscribe to that. I do not believe people should be able to marry and procreate with whomever they want. I'm afraid it's where we're headed because it's going to be hard to draw the line anymore.0
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My Aunt and Uncle are first cousins. My parents helped them to elope in the early 1950's. It split the family and caused quite a controversey.
My Aunt and Uncle have now been married for over 60 years and are still deeply in love. They have 3 great children that I grew up with. In fact, my cousin, Debbie, was my best man when I got married.
So...personally, I don't really care what the opinions are in this case. I hope that my relationship with my wife has the happiness and longevity as my Aunt and Uncle.0 -
I'm torn on this. I don't care who wants to date who as long as all parties are human, over the age of 18 and fully consent. Now procreation from those relationships is another matter. Incestuous relationships have a tendency to cause some birth defects if the people are closely related, from what I understand. That's where I'm torn. Should they be allowed to have a relationship but not procreate? Who would police that? But if somebody wants to be a polygamist or date their cousin/sibling, I don't personally care. I'm a big fan of live and let live.0
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According to the National Society of Genetic Counselors, birth defects are 2 to 3 percent more common in children born to first cousins than among the general population — a real risk, but not enough to justify the bans.0
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I'm not a fan, but I don't think it should be banned either.0
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Depends on how hot my cousin is.0
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Not sure how I feel. The only real argument against incest that I keep hearing are potential problems if they do decide to have kids. Here's the problem, though. It's not illegal for carriers of Tay Sachs disease to marry. I kind of doubt it's illegal for them to try to procreate. I think it's probably horribly unwise and potentially cruel and tragic, but it's not illegal as far as I'm aware of. We don't keep women over 40 from marrying, or even trying to have kids, even though the risks of Downs increases significantly. We just don't know what the results will really be until they happen.
Banning such relationships for those reasons seems like an overreach of government authority to me because the "good of the public" is left to such a chance. I can't imagine0 -
I am not related in any way to my husband. I don't care who marries who though. As long as they are both (or however many) adults they should be free to marry.0
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^^ Evan said it well. There are lots of people whose choices will increase their risk of birth defects, but we don't prevent them from marrying or attempting to procreate.
Smokers
alcoholics
drug users
Women whose age increases the chance of Down's
people with low IQ
people whose jobs expose them to contaminants/chemicals/diseases0 -
It is not illegal? Maybe just in Missouri... but my husband and I had to swear before we were able to marry that we were not related in any way.0
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As long as they're consenting adults, I don't really care. Road Dog, Evan, and Lucky already presented what I wanted to say on the "birth defects" area, also. :flowerforyou:
kapeluza and Patti--may I ask why either of you feel it should be illegal?0 -
kapeluza and Patti--may I ask why either of you feel it should be illegal?
I think we have to be careful with incestual relationships. Where do you draw the line? Is it okay for first cousins to marry, but not brother and sister? Or is it okay for either to marry and if they have kids, they'll just have to deal with birth defects (as with the other types of people who have kids with birth defects already mentioned here)? If incestual relationships are okay, what if a father wants to marry his 18 year old daughter? She's an adult, no? Don't you think there might be some psychological issues there? If we allow incestual marriages, do we still tell children that having sex with your sibling is wrong; or is it okay, too?0 -
Why walk down the street when you can walk down the hall.
Yea I've been waiting for the right time to pull that out haha
Although I thought the more people inbred the more problems that developed, you know like first cousins marry, then their childrens first cousins, and so on until you have inbred the problems, but the liklihood of that anymore is much slimmer. I thought the royal families back in the day had problems with this. But I think just once in a while having first cousins marry wouldn't create a problem.
I think Keel makes a good point0 -
As long as they're consenting adults, I don't really care. Road Dog, Evan, and Lucky already presented what I wanted to say on the "birth defects" area, also. :flowerforyou:
Aren't the risks of deformities, mental challenges, etc greater for inbreeds than the others mentioned? I'm just thinking that's why it was outlawed in the first place. Perhaps I'm wrong.0 -
Although I thought the more people inbred the more problems that developed, you know like first cousins marry, then their childrens first cousins, and so on until you have inbred the problems, but the liklihood of that anymore is much slimmer. I thought the royal families back in the day had problems with this. But I think just once in a while having first cousins marry wouldn't create a problem.
I agree with this. And, as for birth defects, should I not be able to procreate with my boyfriend because he has MD? And, what happens if we do get married and I *gasp* get pregnant? Does that mean I should have an abortion, because we wouldn't want that child to pass MD, too, now would we?0 -
As long as they're consenting adults, I don't really care. Road Dog, Evan, and Lucky already presented what I wanted to say on the "birth defects" area, also. :flowerforyou:
Aren't the risks of deformities, mental challenges, etc greater for inbreeds than the others mentioned? I'm just thinking that's why it was outlawed in the first place. Perhaps I'm wrong.
I think it would depend on how many generations the incest goes back for and how closely related the couple is.0 -
According to the National Society of Genetic Counselors, birth defects are 2 to 3 percent more common in children born to first cousins than among the general population — a real risk, but not enough to justify the bans.
First cousin marriages are legal in more states than same sex marriage...where there is *no* risk of birth defects.
I think the risk of abuse is much more likely in (immediately family) incestuous relationships. I say this as a person who knows a few people who have been in incestuous relationships, none of which where actually consensual and all of them were born out abuse, either at the hand of the partner or because of outside abuse that forced them together to survive.0 -
In the UK it's legal to marry your first cousin, but nothing 'closer'. And I believe this is because Queen Victoria wishes to marry hers. Live and let live, love and let love, long's no-one gets hurt.0
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kapeluza and Patti--may I ask why either of you feel it should be illegal?
I think we have to be careful with incestual relationships. Where do you draw the line? Is it okay for first cousins to marry, but not brother and sister? Or is it okay for either to marry and if they have kids, they'll just have to deal with birth defects (as with the other types of people who have kids with birth defects already mentioned here)? If incestual relationships are okay, what if a father wants to marry his 18 year old daughter? She's an adult, no? Don't you think there might be some psychological issues there? If we allow incestual marriages, do we still tell children that having sex with your sibling is wrong; or is it okay, too?
That's a slippery slope argument that may or may not ever come around.
If it DOES come around, and a brother and sister wish to marry...well, honestly, it isn't my business. If they're consenting adults and that's what they wish to do, then that's their business. Honestly, I can't imagine a lot of siblings jumping at the chance to ever do this.
Why any parent would say to their children "It's okay to have sex with this person, but NOT this person" is beyond me. Why even make it an issue?
ilookthetype--your keywords: not consensual and abuse. That's not okay in ANY situation.0 -
Why any parent would say to their children "It's okay to have sex with this person, but NOT this person" is beyond me. Why even make it an issue?
So you think it's okay for teenage brother and sister to have sex together if they want to? And a parent should just keep quiet? I know you're in the "help your teen get birth control camp" so you'd be okay with getting your son condoms knowing it was his sister he was with?
If you have an 18 year old daughter and a 40 yer old man is hitting in her, you're not going to speak up? You'd just be quiet and let her choose who she loves?
Parents don't say "Hey, daughter, here's a list of people you can and can't have sex with". Our conversations and guidance don't happen like that. But, yes, I believe it is a parent's responsibility to teach their children about loving and sexual relationships. Nd that means speaking up when you feel one is not healthy for them.0 -
Why any parent would say to their children "It's okay to have sex with this person, but NOT this person" is beyond me. Why even make it an issue?
So you think it's okay for teenage brother and sister to have sex together if they want to? And a parent should just keep quiet? I know you're in the "help your teen get birth control camp" so you'd be okay with getting your son condoms knowing it was his sister he was with?
If you have an 18 year old daughter and a 40 yer old man is hitting in her, you're not going to speak up? You'd just be quiet and let her choose who she loves?
Parents don't say "Hey, daughter, here's a list of people you can and can't have sex with". Our conversations and guidance don't happen like that. But, yes, I believe it is a parent's responsibility to teach their children about loving and sexual relationships. Nd that means speaking up when you feel one is not healthy for them.
I can't speak for Kimmy, but I think the point I take away is that it's important to understand why we're saying some sexual relationships are appropriate and others aren't. If we look at teenage siblings, is the fact that they're siblings that's really the problem? It's absolutely taboo in our culture, but I'm not sure we can really think of a good reason for it being taboo (apart from the possibility for genetic defects of the potential offspring).
By the same token, if I were a parent, I don't think I would let my teenager have a live-in boyfriend/girlfriend because that's a fairly adult relationship to have and they're not adults yet; my objection ends up having more to do with age along with the emotional baggage of having that kind of relationship, and less to do with incest--though I would be lying if I said I were immune to resisting the idea of automatically accepting incestuous relationships as being valid. I'm still affected by cultural taboos even if I recognize the need to question them.0 -
So you think it's okay for teenage brother and sister to have sex together if they want to? And a parent should just keep quiet? I know you're in the "help your teen get birth control camp" so you'd be okay with getting your son condoms knowing it was his sister he was with?
I don't think it's okay for teens to have sex with ANYONE unless they understand the implications of their actions (STI's/STD's, pregnancy, etc.). Which most of them don't.
BTW--I hate birth control. So no, I'm not a part of that camp. I'm a part of the "teens should have access to birth control if they want it" camp, however.If you have an 18 year old daughter and a 40 yer old man is hitting in her, you're not going to speak up? You'd just be quiet and let her choose who she loves?
Well, if I was RIGHT THERE, I'd probably have a gut reaction and speak up, yes. Whether I'd like it or not, in the eyes of the law, she'd be 18 years old, therefore a legal adult, and if she really wanted to sleep with a 40-year-old man, there isn't anything I can do about it.Parents don't say "Hey, daughter, here's a list of people you can and can't have sex with". Our conversations and guidance don't happen like that. But, yes, I believe it is a parent's responsibility to teach their children about loving and sexual relationships. Nd that means speaking up when you feel one is not healthy for them.
My parents, in the past, told me my relationship with my current boyfriend wasn't "healthy." Except they used some not-so-nice phrases and insults towards us to let us know their feelings. Yet now they love him like a son and he is part of the family. Things change. Point is, people aren't all carbon copies, and while they're minors, you can control who they date, sleep with, etc....but not when they're adults. "Speaking up" is then all you can do, and they can choose to listen and make a decision on their own about their lives.0 -
I can't speak for Kimmy, but I think the point I take away is that it's important to understand why we're saying some sexual relationships are appropriate and others aren't. If we look at teenage siblings, is the fact that they're siblings that's really the problem? It's absolutely taboo in our culture, but I'm not sure we can really think of a good reason for it being taboo (apart from the possibility for genetic defects of the potential offspring).
By the same token, if I were a parent, I don't think I would let my teenager have a live-in boyfriend/girlfriend because that's a fairly adult relationship to have and they're not adults yet; my objection ends up having more to do with age along with the emotional baggage of having that kind of relationship, and less to do with incest--though I would be lying if I said I were immune to resisting the idea of automatically accepting incestuous relationships as being valid. I'm still affected by cultural taboos even if I recognize the need to question them.
That's actually not what I was trying to say,:laugh: but that is a side I never even looked at before--if a child were to ask me why "incest is bad" I really couldn't give a logical answer.0 -
Two consenting adults should be allowed to marry, even if they are related, it grosses me out but logically I know there's nothing wrong with it.
The two main problems I see (since birth defects have been covered), are
Abuse. Incest is often linked to abuse. Perhaps cousins or even siblings can have a perfectly healthy relationships, but I do believe there is something very wrong with a parent/child relationship. Parents are meant to be an authoritative role - even in adulthood. And you can't have a healthy relationship with someone who is "in charge" of you. As well as this, they are in a position of trust. It's the same reason why teachers aren't allowed to sleep with students even if they are of age and consenting; they are abusing their position of trust and power.
Second problem links to birth defects, but on a bigger scale. Evolution. We see in animals all the time that species with a small gene pool suffer because of it, for healthy procreation through the generations, as well as advancing and evolving, we need to procreate with people far away from us genetically.
So basically, if incestuous relationships were allowed and legal, I don't think it should be between parent and child, and I think there would have to be some psychological and possibly legal investigation to make sure it is a true consenting relationship and not abuse.
As for the gene pool thing? I don't know how to solve that, perhaps by making sure doesn't become a social norm, even if it's legal. Most people are grossed out by the idea even in countries where marrying cousins is legal - this is definitely my experience in the UK. Just because people can doesn't mean they will. Incest IS unnatural, for most people growing up closely with people naturally gives them a sexual aversion to them. It would probably always only be the minority that wanted to marry family.0 -
Because of the genetic implications, as well as the (non-exclusive) tendency for such relationships to have an element of coercion and/or abuse of the more vulnerable party, I support the continued illegality of sexual relationships within immediate blood-related families (parent/child, sibling/sibling etc).
Step-parents/step-children and step-sibling relationships I find concerning in relation to possible coercion, but the same medical risks apply as in any other relationship, so I don't believe there's a case for prohibiting sexual relationships between non-genetically-related members of mixed family units, provided they are consensual and non-abusive.
Relationships with cousins are less concerning, medically, though it's still not the best of choices to procreate with a close blood relation, so, though I'd personally advocate only second cousins and beyond, from a genetic perspective, I don't see any valid reason for a legal prohibition of relationships between cousins - the risks are only very slightly higher than with any other member of the population with a genetically-communicable disease or disorder.0 -
I'm glad I live in a country we don't need to have serious debates about getting married to relatives.0
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I didn't even bring up the subject of "parent to child" sexual relationships, since I figured that any parent with some common sense would see how wrong that is on so many levels. To me, that is a common sense "You just don't do that."0
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I didn't even bring up the subject of "parent to child" sexual relationships, since I figured that any parent with some common sense would see how wrong that is on so many levels. To me, that is a common sense "You just don't do that."
But, where do you draw the line? What if the "child" is an adult and claims to be in love and is consenting?0 -
I didn't even bring up the subject of "parent to child" sexual relationships, since I figured that any parent with some common sense would see how wrong that is on so many levels. To me, that is a common sense "You just don't do that."
But, where do you draw the line? What if the "child" is an adult and claims to be in love and is consenting?
Well, then, that's their deal. Though to me, the legality of a marriage between the two is beyond confusing...I don't think a marriage should be legal between them, since legally they are already parent and child. Would they then have to disown their child in order to marry them? Now THAT, to me, is really gross and creepy, because of the mentality one would have to have in order to want to have sex with or marry their own child. But, again, it doesn't concern me.0 -
I had a good friend that had a long drawn out incestuous relationship with her uncle. It was her father's brother. Although it grossed me out, I could not tell her what to do. However, I can say, in the long run, all it did was mess her up, and make things awkward in her family. To this day, I have a hard time being around him, she is deceased.
I guess overall it is none of my business as it does not affect me, but if it was someone in my close family, like my children, I would have a serious problem with it. There are SO many people in this world, why choose someone in your own gene pool? Does not make any sense to me. Or even if you are not blood related, like my children, they share no blood at all, but I would NOT be ok with them having a sexual relationship.0
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