Marathon crash and burn
kkramey1970
Posts: 82 Member
This past Sunday I "ran" my third marathon. I'm not fast and my times for the other two were 5.5 hours and 5 hours. I was shooting for 4.5 for this year. As far as I know I did everything "right" to be able to reach my goal. On marathon day, I didn't do anything different - same shoes, shorts, shirt, socks, food, gels, drinks, hydrated exactly like I trained. Before the half way point I was pretty much done. I had nothing left. I was not running too fast. After the half way I changed to a walk/run to try and regroup. By mile 19 I was able to get my dad to join me at mile 20 to walk with me to the finish. Half way though the walk we stopped for him to take a bathroom break and I thought I was going to die. Hands and knees on the side of the road about to pass out. Dad helped me up and made me drink a lot of water and soon I felt fine. Stranges day of all my runnung. I've never had a blister but had them before I was half way done. Onle thing we can think is I developed a pretty good sinus cold the week before. Could it be something that easy drained me that easily? Anybody else ever bonk that bad? My finishing time was 5:53. So far from where I trained to be...
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First, sorry for the bonk. Alas yes I have been there. And I know others than have too. Sometimes it is just not your day. Sucks. Hang in there!0
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It does sound like you were not 100% well on the day. Bloody unlucky timing. Must have been very disappointing after all the hard work.
As you have put in all the work for training and nutrition and are race-ready, is there another race coming up in the next few weeks you can do?0 -
If the blisters heal I plan an running a half marathon next weekend.0
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You say that you were not running too fast. But is there a chance that, although you were not running too fast for a 4:30 finish time, you were running too fast for you?0
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All my training runs put me at that time. Maybe just a little slower. I've got really good excuses for the first two marathon times
Those were also supposed to be close to the 4:30 finish time. All my long runs averaged around 10:15-10:30 pace and the short week runs were around 10:00 pace. I've just never ran out of gas so bad. 0 -
Okay, so you've been doing all your long training runs at target race pace - that was more likely to just wear you out. I'd expect a person whose long runs were that pace to be racing at more like 9:30-9:45 pace. I think you'd want to slow down the training a bit to maybe 11:00 pace and build your aerobic base up.0
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Okay, so you've been doing all your long training runs at target race pace - that was more likely to just wear you out. I'd expect a person whose long runs were that pace to be racing at more like 9:30-9:45 pace. I think you'd want to slow down the training a bit to maybe 11:00 pace and build your aerobic base up.
I agree.
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Training2BeFast wrote: »Okay, so you've been doing all your long training runs at target race pace - that was more likely to just wear you out. I'd expect a person whose long runs were that pace to be racing at more like 9:30-9:45 pace. I think you'd want to slow down the training a bit to maybe 11:00 pace and build your aerobic base up.
I agree.
Yep.
You can't determine marathon pace based on training runs. You shouldn't be doing all your long runs at the projected marathon pace either.
Use a calculator to determine what you marathon pace *might* be based on a previous race of a shorter distance. And even then, the calculator will be inaccurate for marathon pace UNLESS you have years of high mileage training under you belt. I'm talking about 2000+ miles per year. Then and only then will the prediction of a marathon finish time be closer to accurate. It's very hard to predict because it a distance that can (and often does) completely deplete the body of fuel that is stored in the form of glycogen.
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Sounds good. Still baffled at why I ran out of juice half way instead of maybe my longest training run.0
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kkramey1970 wrote: »Sounds good. Still baffled at why I ran out of juice half way instead of maybe my longest training run.
Could have been the illness, could have been that your glycogen stores weren't topped off, could have been that you used more energy in that first half than you thought you did because of temperature, terrain or other factors. I bonked at mile 17 on my last marathon which was 6 months after the previous one and I was running the same pace that I was in the previous one. It was a little hillier, it was a little warmer and I was a little heavier. All these things come into play.0 -
THanks everyone for the words. Guess it just happens. Maybe I'll attempt it again someday. Until then...0
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kkramey1970 wrote: »Sounds good. Still baffled at why I ran out of juice half way instead of maybe my longest training run.
I think being exhausted from having done all that training too hard might have contributed. I wouldn't be running a half next weekend if it was me! Recover first.
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kkramey1970 wrote: »Sounds good. Still baffled at why I ran out of juice half way instead of maybe my longest training run.
I think being exhausted from having done all that training too hard might have contributed. I wouldn't be running a half next weekend if it was me! Recover first.
First of all, sorry to hear about your problems. But...there is always another race!
I agree with the above poster! I am at the process of recovering from an overuse injury and what I have learned is that giving your body time to recover is a must, at least for me!
I did a 10k trail race on a Saturday, ran 18.7 km three days later and then around 8km for three consecutive days right after that. Suddenly my fibula or the tendons around it, below my knee started hurting on the lateral side and for the last two weeks I was in pain. I will not do this again...
Anyhow, whatever you decide, best of luck
Stef.0 -
Thanks again. Going to do the half anyway. Not worried about time or pace. Its a local run that I've done the last two years so I'm trying to make it an annual event. After that I'll be done for the year. Thanks 0
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kkramey1970 wrote: »Thanks again. Going to do the half anyway. Not worried about time or pace. Its a local run that I've done the last two years so I'm trying to make it an annual event. After that I'll be done for the year. Thanks
Sorry to hear about the bonk..
I can't agree enough with all of the advice above. If you are determine to do this half without a full recovery, I would highly recommend not trying to race it. At all. Take it at a VERY slow recovery effort (or slower) and just enjoy the experience. If there's any sign of pain, walk.0 -
Exactly my plan 0
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CarsonRuns wrote: »kkramey1970 wrote: »Sounds good. Still baffled at why I ran out of juice half way instead of maybe my longest training run.
Could have been the illness, could have been that your glycogen stores weren't topped off, could have been that you used more energy in that first half than you thought you did because of temperature, terrain or other factors. I bonked at mile 17 on my last marathon which was 6 months after the previous one and I was running the same pace that I was in the previous one. It was a little hillier, it was a little warmer and I was a little heavier. All these things come into play.
Carson is nailing it right on the head! So many factors go into race day, only some of which do we actually have control over. Even if all factors were the same, course, terrain, training, diet, overall health, etc.... you're still likely to get different results. Bonking sucks, but it's all part of the experience if you run more than one marathon. This past year I've changed my training a tad so that my long runs are slower and my fast (pace, speed) runs are faster. I have been following the Jack Daniels running formula. He believes many runners run their long slow runs too fast, and their speed word too slow. I saw an improvement in my times this year by following this.
Good luck on your next race! Can't wait to hear how it goes!
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I recommend picking up a copy of Matt Fitzgerald's book "80/20". It explains the physiology and psychology behind everything that is being said here. I have been following his training advice and it's working well. I understand now why I need to run more long, slower miles and I am also getting more out of my tempo runs and speed work. It's very hard to grasp (or trust in) the concept at first, but I have definitely seen its benefits.0
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Will definitely check out the book. As far as the race Saturday - went great. Didn't beat my previous times but enjoyed myself and finished with a 2:20:12 or something like that. Also got to run across the finish line with my 5 year old daughter so it was a great way to end my running year. Now its time to relax and fix all my aches and pains. Until next year...0
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kkramey1970 wrote: »Will definitely check out the book. As far as the race Saturday - went great. Didn't beat my previous times but enjoyed myself and finished with a 2:20:12 or something like that. Also got to run across the finish line with my 5 year old daughter so it was a great way to end my running year. Now its time to relax and fix all my aches and pains. Until next year...
That's what it's all about
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Ha, sorry I can't help but laugh. Bonking is something completely different at this end of the planet. I'm sorry your race didn't go according to plan. My half last weekend was blighted by a head cold so I understand your frustration.0
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kkramey1970 wrote: »Will definitely check out the book. As far as the race Saturday - went great. Didn't beat my previous times but enjoyed myself and finished with a 2:20:12 or something like that. Also got to run across the finish line with my 5 year old daughter so it was a great way to end my running year. Now its time to relax and fix all my aches and pains. Until next year...
Well, that's the thing about racing...for all the training, sometimes the wheels come off. My race day was cold and windy and at mile 15 my hamstrings started to cramp because of the cold. I know that feeling from skiing in conditions where the temperature is -25°F to -35°F and the muscles just don't fire so efficiently. I managed to get the legs warmed back up and working again for a few more miles but on the long, cold return loop they were cramping once again. It was interesting to the end because they were on the edge of cramping whether I walked or ran. It was all about NOT having an asphalt faceplant!
The calculators were all over the place based upon various training runs...from 4:07 up to about 4:27. I thought a 4:30 was much more doable than the faster times. I used the 80/20 approach to the last third of my training and my long training runs were really slow distance runs in a Zone 1-Zone 2 (I use a HRM to help measure that).
On the plus side, I did not miss my goal by much, as I ran a 4:42 marathon. But clearly it didn't break my way to a really fast race. You might consider slowing down to speed up.
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