When is the 'honeymoon stage' really over?

murphyraven

A lot of what I have seen/read is that you have 1 year to 18 months of 'honeymoon stage' where you lose most of your excess weight. How can you identify when the honeymoon stage is over for you?

As I understand a successful surgery is defined as a patient who loses 40-60% of their excess weight and that only about 5% lose all of their excess weight. I'm at about 50% excess weight lost in 4 months but this last month has felt like a snails pace to me (6lbs total since april 22nd)

I realize I've lost an incredible amount of weight for the time period (59 lbs since the beginning of this year, 45 lbs since surgery) and I AM grateful. But I want to know if my honeymoon stage is over. Will I only be losing 4-6 lbs a month (or less) from here on out? Yes I realize there are factors like upping my exercise and making sure to eat super clean and on plan.

What has been your experience? I don't think I am in a stall but I was hoping to not have it slow down this early on.

garber6th

I have lost about 90% of my excess weight, based on a goal I set for myself which might need to be adjusted. I am about 20 months out from surgery. I think after about a year is when I noticed a significant slowdown, almost a standstill. Part of that is, I started strength training and I know I have built muscle and changed my body composition. I still want to lose another 20 lbs, but according to my surgeon, I might be done losing. He said my body just might not lose more because of my extremely high starting BMI. I will still try though, but I am going through some trial and error to see what will work - lowering calories, raising calories, changing my physical activity, etc. Also after about a year is when I started to actually feel hungry again too, so I had to learn how to live with that. I expect that I will still be making a lot of adjustments for a while!

5BeautifulDays

I think it varies a lot from person to person, but 50% of excess weight gone at 4 months is terrific! That's about exactly where I was at 4 months, as well. Now I'm 9 months out and 30 lbs from goal (just at the top of "normal weight" for my height, although my personal goal is about 5 lbs less than that at the moment).

Even if you "only" loose 4-6 lbs a month, that's still moving in the right direction.

aylajane

Honestly, the honeymoon stage ends usually right about the time people start sliding back into old habits and realizing they can eat more (and do) and that most foods do not cause them distress. They push the limits of their sleeve, using restriction to guide them (which is a mistake). THis is also about the time your body has adjusted to the very low calories and lowered your metabolism... which means you are essentially eating at your "new" maintenance...

Dont want the honeymoon to end? Dont do that. Stick with your plan, adjusting as needed. Lift weights or do weight bearing exercises to build muscle (that most people lose due to rapid weight loss). Slowly *INCREASE* your calories to a human level, raising your activity to compensate. in theory, eating 1200 and burning 1700 every day should result in a pound a week of weight loss... so should eating 2000 calories a day and burning 2500... which would you rather do?! I would rather eat more! Not to mention, then if I stall, I have somewhere to go... eating 1200 calories, its pretty hard to drop any lower if your loss stalls. The game is to eat the most you can while losing weight. Your body is amazing - the more you give it, the easier it lets go it seems.

It is not a "rule" of VSG that people average only 40-60% of excess weight loss... It is the average because the average person tends to get less vigilant about their diet and exercise as they get farther out in time from surgery and life moves on, which corresponds to a lowered BMR from eating a VLCD for an extended time. If you dont want to end up with the average results, do not do what average people do

I am 4 years out now. I lost about 60% of my excess weight after a year. I plateaued for a year. Then I *gained* 20 pounds back. Then I got mad at myself for being stupid, and picked up where I should have in the first place - got serious about tracking food, protein rules everything, and exercise is more important than my actual job in life. I got a trainer and started serious progressive weight training. I am no body builder, but I am the strongest I have ever been. I am also working on flexibility, general health, etc too. My body has a long time left to carry me, I intend to feel younger every year. I look at working out like I do my job - rule number one of any job is to SHOW UP (never miss a workout, no "I dont feel like it today" stuff. Rule number two if you want to keep your job is DO WHAT YOU ARE TOLD (by my trainer, or whatever program I set out for myself). Rule number three is to try your best every day (recognizing that my best will vary some days I will be tired, etc. I have to try really hard that day - I dont have to beat anyone else or compare myself). Rule number 4 - no looking at the clock (literally and figuratively) - this is not something I am doing for a month or two... I have 20 years until I retire from my real job, and I still show up every day despite how long it seems and how defeating to know that. My body needs to last longer than the year I retire... So exercise is not somehting I will ever be "done" with. If I get bored I can change it (same as my job). But if I dont show up, I cant complain if I dont get my paycheck (my body doesnt improve).

Anyway, long winded way of saying - there is no real "honeymoon", there is just continual adjustment. You will be able to eat more over time, how you handle that is completely in your control.

ETA: Since weight training and making myself serious about all this, I went from 40% body fat (skinny fat) to 17% body fat, while losing the 20 I gained plus another 15 pounds. During that time (about a year), I went from eating 1200 calories a day to 2200 calories a day.

In the 6 months since then, I have PURPOSELY gained about 7 pounds in the hopes that some of it is muscle by eating about 2500 calories a day and scaling back on some of my cardio. I had a scan and found that 2 pounds of that was muscle, so I am now switching gears to lose the 5 pounds of fat I gained (and hopefully keep my 2 extra muscle!). So now picking up the cardio again, and scaling back to *only* 2000 calories I eat ALL day and I will lose those 5 pounds within 2 months, no problem (as long as I keep up my scheduled exercise!).

5BeautifulDays

I can't agree enough about the exercise. I was "able" to eat about 1000 calories max at 4-5 mos out. Now, at 9 mos out, I regularly eat 1200. But I burn around 2000 a day. The trick at this point is getting my calories from the healthiest sources--no mean feat, and one I fail at frequently (although I don't count a once a day, measured sweet a failure. It's my insurance that I'll do this for life)--and tracking those calories is a necessity.

Thaeda

aylajane wrote: »

Slowly *INCREASE* your calories to a human level, raising your activity to compensate. in theory, eating 1200 and burning 1700 every day should result in a pound a week of weight loss... so should eating 2000 calories a day and burning 2500... which would you rather do?! I would rather eat more! Not to mention, then if I stall, I have somewhere to go... eating 1200 calories, its pretty hard to drop any lower if your loss stalls. The game is to eat the most you can while losing weight.

I totally agree with this. For me, the "game" of maintaining is all about finding ways to keep my body from deciding that at 1200 cals per day I will GAIN-- that is effin CRAZY. I do NOT want to have to live eating only 1200 cals a day for LIFE. Yuck. So I am lifting weights and doing cardio and mixing it up with regard to my calorie levels each day to keep my body guessing. Seems to be working so far.

PaulaKro

I started thinking about eating again about 6-8 months out. I think that's when the ghrelin started working again.

Also I didn't eat many high-glycemic-index (processed) starches originally. And when I did, my cravings started coming back. That's really what I have to avoid.

That said, I'm two years out and have lost 100% of my excess weight. I actually lost too much (lost my appetite for 3 months on pain meds for an operation) and had to gain ten back. It was scary to be all bones and sharp edges.

I thought I was done several times, about 185#, 168#, 155#. I'm now hovering at 145 and that's perfect (I'm 5'9"). Each time it was possible to buckle down and start losing again. But it was never as fast later as in the beginning.

And I agree with AylaJane that "Honestly, the honeymoon stage ends usually right about the time people start sliding back into old habits and realizing they can eat more (and do) and that most foods do not cause them distress."

One of my best motivations is to not blow this advantage. I know people can gain it all back. I'll always have to stay away from cookies and eat lots of delicious satisfying savory foods instead. But it's not a hardship. There are so many good foods that are safe. Learning good eating habits (protein, veggies, vitamins, water) is just as important to success as the operation.

You're doing fabulous!!! Best wishes!

bikrchk

I think it has a lot to do with how far you have to go. I started at 235lbs (I'm 5'6") with a goal of 135 I decided to stop at 145 when I hit a size 4 about 10 months post op. I intentionally entered maintenance and maintained well for the last year. I'll put on a little and then take it off, but taking it off is much harder now. The honeymoon, for me is over. That said, I've taken off and maintain 100% of my weight loss! At 135 or 145 I'm still in the middle of healthy as far as BMI goes. This is a GOOD place to be! I decided I'd like a bit more wiggle room so I've reset my range down to 135-145. I'm at the top of that now and working to get to 135 but its 2 steps forward and one back. I wish now I'd taken off that last 10 a year ago while it was still relatively easy. I'll get it done, but work much harder at it now!

authorwriter

My honeymoon stage of rapid weight loss ended about 6 months post surgery. Actually, more like 5 months. Since then weight loss has been slow and torturous, but it does continue, albeit at an almost nonexistent pace. I am nowhere near my excess weight goal. My small stomach does not allow me to eat too many calories and I'm careful to keep it filled with healthy foods and plenty of protein powder. No grains. Not even a smidgen or my weight loss stops dead. I was in a six month stall and lost about five pounds. Since then I've dropped another 2. I've learned to not measure by the scale. I check it every day and I'm aware of what I eat every day. I find I don't really like the foods I used to like. Sometimes I think it looks good and will have a bite, but I honestly don't like it anymore. That also helps me keep it under control. A day when I feel like I ate everything in the fridge and beyond will top out at about 1300 calories. Usually, I eat under 1000.

So its about your food choices. Go for the proteins, avoid grains, only occasional fruit and a little green leafy everyday and you will lose weight. maybe not fast, but you will lose. Be aware of your water intake. Keep it high. And if you are physically able. Move around. That's my big issue. I just can't move around like other people.

I'm spending a summer at the seashore with no food distractions and nobody else to feed. It's a tiny house with a tiny kitchen and there's no 'contraband' here. I expect to lose 20 pounds this summer. That's my goal. Good luck to you. And take your vitamins.

authorwriter

By the way, the bariatric surgeons at my hospital have support groups for various issues. They started a new one for people who weren't losing weight or starting to gain back. I attended, thinking there were others like me, doing the right things and stalled. Everybody at the group, without fail, however, were eating all the wrong things - donuts and other sweets and bread and what not. I was disappointed to find out this wasn't some kind of typical thing, to just stop, despite a proper diet. They suggested I eat more real food and I said I would, but what I found worked was going back to only protein shakes for a few days. It seemed to jog my body. So I do better when I stick to the protein powders. I also allow myself yogurt, sometimes cottage cheese and eggs. Occasionally some meat. There's a 'pancake' I like to make with a banana and two eggs (mash and mix and cook like a pancake in nonstick pan) which I top with cottage cheese. That's a treat.

I also find the slightest deviation, like eating a small amount of grain will not just stall me, I'll pack on the water weight for some reason and it takes a while to clear. So get to know your body and how it reacts to things. You're not like anybody else and what works for one person doesn't work for others. You now have a small stomach. Honor that and resolve to fill it only with what will serve you and leave the rest.

rpyle111

I am only about 6 weeks into maintenance, and 8 months out from surgery. I think the honeymoon period tends to be over when the body has found enough alternate pathways for the ghrelin production (so you will feel hunger again) and the surgery-related motivation is likely waning. I believe I am right about there, and need to make conscious efforts to continue the habits and behaviors I have developed over the past year.

I have chosen to approach this maintenance as if the surgery is only one bullet point in the description of myself. Essentially, treating myself as a 'normal' MFP member who needs to control calories through logging and appropriate food choices, be active and exercise with the goal of both calorie burn and strength/muscle maintenance and gain, and set myself up for a lifetime where my health is a higher priority than it has been for the past 30 years.

I see the surgery as a useful backstop in terms of restriction, but hope to follow the lead of aylajane and not use the restriction as the means of controlling my intake. My mind and conscious choices are what I need to use to control my input. I will use weight as data and as a signal to potentially tighten up on my choices, but hope to get into a routine of healthy behaviors which will make a 6 month DEXA scan the number I am really looking to improve, rather than the number on the scale.

Which brings me back to my advice to those of you pre-surgery (especially). Use the time to act as you will want to post surgery, lose as much as you can especially if you have more than 120ish pounds to lose. I lost 100 of my 180 prior to surgery and truly believe that I would not have hit my goal had I not done this. Do what you can to make hitting your goal within the first 9 months post surgery a reality.

Rob

Qbaimee

WOW!! This is a great thread! Thank you everyone for commenting. I will be 4 mths out tomorrow and my weight loss I feel is starting to get slower. I lost 10#'s last mth and my scale is just stuck right now. I think I may not be eating enough. I am in the gym 6 days a week and eat about 800-1000 calories a day.

mycatsnameisbug

Qbaimee- I am so totally in your shoes on the stall at 4 months. I think stalling at this point is totally normal as I have seen others in the same boat. My nutritionist has me eating 1200 cals/day so depending on your gym activity you might need more? I would talk to your doc/nutritionist/support system

BringingSherriBack

I found the "honeymoon" stage to be over at about 6 months. That was when I could physically eat more but also when the weightloss really slowed down and I had to really start working at it.
I lost 147 initially (in about 14 months) then was pretty happy where I was and really couldn't make my body lose anymore without eating at the 600 calorie a day level which I can't function at that level at let alone exercise. I was happy there even though I wasn't in the normal weight range, I still felt amazing and looked pretty good.
I maintained within a 5 pound range for about 15 months, but then slowly I let old habits creep up on me and here at 3 years and 7 months out I am 30 pounds heavier than my lowest weight.
I started eating more starches and snacking on more junk and exercising less and the weight has come back.
So here I am busting my butt to get these 30 pounds back off and would like to continue my journey to get an additional 20 pounds off (if I can without killing myself), but if not I will be happy to get back to my -147 pounds. At the rate I lose weight now, I will figure it will take me until January to get these 30 pounds back off (I lose at appx 1-1.5 pounds per week now max) and that is eating at about 1000 calories and exercising regularly. But I am determined to get back to where I was when I let old habits creep back in.
Lesson learned: kick it hard in weightloss mode, but be very mindful even in maintenance mode.

spfldpam

I do think there is a "honeymoon" period where the weight comes off pretty easy. I had Sleeve done in June 2012. I made my personal goal by April 2013. I added cals back into my diet to quit loosing. I did gain back some which is typical as most WLS people gain 5 to 10% back when quit loosing. For the first year or so I thnk it is a honeymoon period. Please take advantage of that also! The weight pretty much falls off you. I was hungry or even wanted to eat but did cause I was told to get so many cals and grams of protein in a day. After the first year it gets tougher. Luckily I hit my personal goal before my year was up.
I have gained some back and have been trying to get it off. It isn't easy. I eat around 1200 cals a day track all my food and water and other stuff here on MFP and worked out 3-4 times a week burning off 300 cals a workout but weren't loosing nothing from mid Jan till around April of this year. After I cancelled my gym membership in mid April I started loosing weight!?!? How can that be? Crazy! I still need to loose a few pounds to get back where I want to be.
You have to remember where you came from also. What weight you started out at. How much did you loose before surgery. Things like that can make a difference and everyone looses differently and don't compare yourself to anyone else although it is hard not to.
You have done great so far! Congrats!

mae7365

I'm almost 8 months post-op and my "honeymoon" period was over about a month ago when I made the fatal mistake of buying myself a pastry - that I intended to spread over multiple days - and ended up eating it in one evening. I ate sweets instead of a healthy dinner and realized how easy it is to slip back into old habits - especially when you can eat a lot more "sliders" with your small stomach than healthy protein! I also think that my "honeymoon" ended the day I had my 6 month post op visit with my surgeon. I had lost 58 of the 67 pounds that I wanted to loose to get to the "normal" BMI range, and my surgeon told me that he felt I didn't need to loose any more. His rationale - I am now healthy....no medications, no health problems, no sleep apnea, building muscle through exercise etc. So I'm now 6 pounds away from that "healthy" weight, and I've been up and down 5 pounds for the last month. I'm not sure I'll ever get to my goal of 145, but 151 still feels like I'm 10 years younger, 100X stronger and 100% healthier.
So my advise is to be happy with your progress, concentrate on exercise and fitness and realize that this is a lifetime journey.