Pete Pfitzinger 18/70 Marathon Plan
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Anyone tackled this plan? if so any advice and were you able to cut significant time off your PR? I stared it today and it's no joke with a week 1 long run of 15 miles and midweek run of 11.
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No, but I am familiar with it and it's definitely not for the faint of heart or the novice runner. I had an MFP friend that was doing it several years back and I believe she ended up injured, so I would just say to be flexible with your schedule and listen to your body. Since it is such an intense plan, even if you feel the need to cut back on some of the miles, you are still probably doing way more than most people, so you should be golden. Good luck! When is your race?1
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2nd weekend of October and it'll be my 3rd marathon. I've been working on nothing but base building for the past 3-4 months increasing from 40 to as high as 55 a couple of times. The past 4 weeks in anticipation of this i've done long runs of 15.8, 15, 13.4 & 15 with a 10 mile tempo run mid week. Hopefully the first 4 weeks will be golden, until you get your first 20 miler in week 5. I considered the 18/55 but thought I had been relatively happy in that 40-55 mile range with little to no fatigue. It'll be easy to switch to that plan or hybrid them together if it gets too bad.1
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After reading these, I'm wondering if the plan I am following is OK. I am in the second week of a 5 day a week rookie plan from Bobby McGee (about 30 - 35 miles/wk for the first 4 weeks). It doesn't have any long runs mid week, which seems to be a common aspect of many other plans in addition to the weekend LR.0
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@runbabarun -The mid-week long runs usually start with the intermediate plans. They are not necessary for marathon completion, but they definitely help if you are trying to finish strong. Even though you are a first time marathoner, it sounds as if you have the base and the experience required to run a pretty strong race. You might consider looking at how some of the more intermediate plans differ from yours and picking one or two aspects of these plans to form a hybrid with your current plan. Just a suggestion. I always use a training plan as a guideline, but I tailor it up or down to meet my level of fitness.
There are so many different types of plans out there. I think being familiar with the philosophy of the author and understanding what the goal is of the plan are pretty important keys in deciding which plan is best for you.1 -
I have been sticking with the plan religiously, due to fear of injury. I did add some recovery jogs because my mileage was already a bit over the plan. But I will see if I can stretch it a bit more midweek once I'm more comfortable with the mileage. Btw, you're right- in the plan I've been using he goes up to 90 min runs midweek in mid training. Intermediary and advancds versions go up to 120 mins. Very helpful, thanks again.0
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My first marathon plan started at 26 miles & peaked at 50 miles and only had maybe 6 runs outside the long run that were 10 miles. Everything else was 3-9 miles during the week and I finished. Probably would have even finished close to my goal time had I not opted for a hilly course that crushed my legs about mile 22. I wouldn't recommend running more than 5 days unless you've done it for a while, It took me about 6 months to get comfortable with adding that extra day of running.
This is a link to the plan I'm currently using but the complete plan including the instructions are from the book Advanced Marathoning. http://www.negativesplits.net/files/longbeach09.pdf
This plan is all about the mid distance, long runs & recovery runs. Most of the speed work is actually just working at staying just under threshold and in your aerobic zone. There are over 30 mid-distance runs of 10-15 miles plus the long run. Getting up and running at 5 am is going to be a habit I'll need to get comfortable with when I've got weeks with 3 half marathon distance or better runs.1 -
That's great! And wow, the mileage!
I hear you about the 5 day thing. I did a 6 day half marathon program 3 years ago that topped at 43 miles/wk. I ran that race at 1:31:00, my PR. I'll take it easy for a while nevertheless. All I did for the rest day was below easy run pace recovery jog for 3 miles, it helped with soreness quite a bit. I will hold off this week as I feel much better after my 8 mile run today.
Speed work comes easy to me and I enjoy it. Although I understand the importance of easy runs, those junk miles are still a tad difficult for me in terms of holding down the pace. So I looked for a plan that has a bit more variation from early on, that's why I picked this plan. It has fartleks and hills (once a week from week 4 on) starting relatively early even for beginners.
Thank you for your guidance (and I'm sorry if I hijacked the conversation)0 -
I gave it a serious look for the next training cycle (which starts on 6/20). It is a SERIOUS running schedule. My experience with Pfitzinger's 18/55 plan was good even though I lost a couple of weeks (total) due to weather, Christmas holidays, and a back spasm (not related to running). I ran the strongest marathon (missed a PR by 3:20) on an extremely hilly course in cold weather and had a 5-minute negative split using Pfitzinger's 18/55 for my last marathon. Decided that I was going to use it again since my next marathon is a vacation/destination marathon. I'll probably use the 18/70 plan after I complete the next marathon in October when I get serious about a BQ attempt in the spring of 2017.0
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It's certainly a serious commitment & if i can get a 5 minute negative split over my last 2 marathons I'd finish well below my goal pace. I've set the bar fairly low at 4 hours since I've really struggled with the last 4-5 miles the previous marathons at that pace. Course conditions deteriorated both times, once with a 10 MPH head wind on the back portion of an out & back after a 1:58 out & temps rising into the mid 70's the 2nd attempt after a 1:59 half split. With a 1:48 half time a few months back this should be well within reach.
I've finished week 1 and accidentally did an extra 5 miles since I forgot the plan started last Monday, which is a rest day, and I ran a 5 mile recovery from my Sunday long run. I'm a little OCD so I still followed the plan & finished with 58.2 miles, which made it real easy to remember today is a rest day. After some stretching & cross training this morning my legs feel good and I was still able to do a bunch of yard work yesterday after the first 15 miler. I like the structure of the plan and the short 5 mile runs after the weekly mid distance runs did a good job flushing the lead from the legs.0 -
I just finished putting the 18/70 plan into the runningahead.com training plan schedule starting in November 2016 just so I could get a visual view of it. To be honest, at my current level, I'm not sure I could sustain it (particularly with a single rest day per week).
Yes, the short recovery runs are quite a nice touch and the overall structure of the plans are really good. A couple of things I found really useful in his plans (seen it elsewhere, too): Those several long runs where a significant portion is run at marathon pace, the inclusion of the lactate threshold runs that are even faster (yet shorter), and the VO2Max repeat intervals. I realize (now) that when I got past mile 20 in my last race, that all those runs and the sensations behind them in training were exactly what I was experiencing in the marathon. To be able to say to yourself "Oh, I know what this is and I know how to handle it," is a real game changer. Certainly part of that was energy management in the first 20 miles. But that last six miles that many people "dread" and fade into survival mode was actually something that seemed much more manageable to me this past time.
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I agree with @STrooper about the importance of preparing for those last 6 miles in training. I think we both mentioned in another thread that after using the 80/20 plan we both had very pleasant marathon experiences in which the last 6 miles felt, dare I say, somewhat easy. For me, one of the best training runs that prepared me for that is the fast finish long run where I ran my long and and ran the last 2-3 miles at marathon pace or slightly faster. It taught me how to control my pace through the majority of a long run, to mentally anticipate the fatigue factor and also the feel of running faster on already tired legs.1
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lporter229 wrote: »I agree with @STrooper about the importance of preparing for those last 6 miles in training. I think we both mentioned in another thread that after using the 80/20 plan we both had very pleasant marathon experiences in which the last 6 miles felt, dare I say, somewhat easy.
Yes, we did!0
