My life just unraveled at mile 16
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ElliottTN
Posts: 1,614 Member
Pre-apology as this is a bit long. I am training alone and don't have any friends that run to really vent/discuss what went wrong here. This will be (hopefully) my first marathon.
I've read countless times about how so many people hit the wall around mile 20 so I am not sure if this is what happened. My training run for a marathon I have at the end of April called for an 18 miler on Saturday. I started out really strong. My 5k-10k pace is generally 7:30 minutes on a bad day. I am still trying to figure out my marathon pace but I thought I was being conservative at keeping up with training at a 9 minute pace thus far. The first 13 miles I felt strong. Very strong. Even the first 6 miles I had to continuously try to hold myself back to 9 minute pace even though my body felt like it was just walking. From 6-13 I started to feel it but it was no big deal. I still felt good and strong, I just had to push slightly to stay on pace. 14 to 16 I had to be a bit more cognoscente about my pace and I was happy because I felt like I had finally started to get a workout out of my training.
I had been carrying a camelbak for water and from what I can tell my hydration was good. I was also trying to consume some tasty (gross) gu packs every 6 miles. Pre-run I took a caffeine tablet for 200mg (I am a huge caffeine junkie) so I believed my nutrition was on point.
Then, just out of nowhere, I mentally just shat the bed. I could feel that my legs were tired, I am ok with this. I am ok with having to back off pace. I don't think my legs were the problem. There was just a seemingly endless flood of negative thoughts. How I can't do this. There is no way I could do this for 10 more miles when I need to do it. What am I even doing out here. I don't belong out here. It was enough for me to think that if I walk for a minute or two then I could collect myself and try to turn my head around. So I did....then crap really hit the fan in my head. My thoughts turned from more general negative thoughts about running to my overall self. Thinking about all the wonderful failures over the years. All the things I should have done and when I fell short. Just seemed like an endless assault of how big of a POS I was. This continued as I would periodically convince myself to run just a bit further...then would walk....kinda like crazy thought process of I think I can, I should, I can't, just give up....then worse over and over again until I reached my truck at mile 18...walking more than running the last 2 miles.
So..marathoners..what the hell was this dark place? Is this what boinking feels like or did I just let my head wander to far off base? I am not sure which as I thought that hitting the wall happened more around mile 20. I am still kinda carrying some negative thoughts from it a couple days later. Wasn't exactly prepared for this to happen yet. Do I need to drop my pace down even slower. I guess it may be a blessing to be able to feel like this during training but it just scares me I am feeling this way at mile 16.....ya know.....with 10 more miles to go. crap.....any input, words of wisdom? Is this what hitting the wall is or do I have an even more fun trip down the dark rabbit hole yet to come?
I've read countless times about how so many people hit the wall around mile 20 so I am not sure if this is what happened. My training run for a marathon I have at the end of April called for an 18 miler on Saturday. I started out really strong. My 5k-10k pace is generally 7:30 minutes on a bad day. I am still trying to figure out my marathon pace but I thought I was being conservative at keeping up with training at a 9 minute pace thus far. The first 13 miles I felt strong. Very strong. Even the first 6 miles I had to continuously try to hold myself back to 9 minute pace even though my body felt like it was just walking. From 6-13 I started to feel it but it was no big deal. I still felt good and strong, I just had to push slightly to stay on pace. 14 to 16 I had to be a bit more cognoscente about my pace and I was happy because I felt like I had finally started to get a workout out of my training.
I had been carrying a camelbak for water and from what I can tell my hydration was good. I was also trying to consume some tasty (gross) gu packs every 6 miles. Pre-run I took a caffeine tablet for 200mg (I am a huge caffeine junkie) so I believed my nutrition was on point.
Then, just out of nowhere, I mentally just shat the bed. I could feel that my legs were tired, I am ok with this. I am ok with having to back off pace. I don't think my legs were the problem. There was just a seemingly endless flood of negative thoughts. How I can't do this. There is no way I could do this for 10 more miles when I need to do it. What am I even doing out here. I don't belong out here. It was enough for me to think that if I walk for a minute or two then I could collect myself and try to turn my head around. So I did....then crap really hit the fan in my head. My thoughts turned from more general negative thoughts about running to my overall self. Thinking about all the wonderful failures over the years. All the things I should have done and when I fell short. Just seemed like an endless assault of how big of a POS I was. This continued as I would periodically convince myself to run just a bit further...then would walk....kinda like crazy thought process of I think I can, I should, I can't, just give up....then worse over and over again until I reached my truck at mile 18...walking more than running the last 2 miles.
So..marathoners..what the hell was this dark place? Is this what boinking feels like or did I just let my head wander to far off base? I am not sure which as I thought that hitting the wall happened more around mile 20. I am still kinda carrying some negative thoughts from it a couple days later. Wasn't exactly prepared for this to happen yet. Do I need to drop my pace down even slower. I guess it may be a blessing to be able to feel like this during training but it just scares me I am feeling this way at mile 16.....ya know.....with 10 more miles to go. crap.....any input, words of wisdom? Is this what hitting the wall is or do I have an even more fun trip down the dark rabbit hole yet to come?
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First, know that what you already ran is something most never can do. Most never even try. So you are already so far ahead of the game. And running for distance is a game, mental and physical. Sounds like your mental game got rattled, not your physical. You know you've put in the time and the mileage. Don't doubt that, I've seen your training blogs.
Could it be something as simple as needing distraction? You got caught in your head with negative thoughts, so what about filling your head with other thoughts? When I'm running shorter distances, under 8-10 miles, I listen to loud, heavy music to match my pace. But when I run long distances, I can't do music, because then I can still think and drive myself crazy. i've found an audio book is really helpful for overcoming that wall, because it's such a distraction. You can listen and process the words.
A few other friends swear by hypnotic words/music, and really just run in a trance. They do even longer distances, like the ultra marathons.
Don't let the head game screw with you. You've come way too far!0 -
I just finished my 2nd half marathon yesterday, only 21k. But a few years ago would never have imagined myself running leave alone a half marathon 2 years successively.
So, congrats on your training. Our mind is our biggest ally or biggest enemy. what you witnessed was one end and the other end is there too. I think of my long runs as meditations, whenever my mind goes astray I lead it on by saying I can do it till the next bend and then the next and so on, I count steps totalling how many thousands I have taken, I focus on my breath.inhale left foot exhale, inhale right foot, I say my prayers, I revel in Nature's beauty
I pat my thighs and thank my knees, muscles and bones for allowing me to live my dream. I hope you find something to help you.0 -
1. Most people only hit the wall in an actual marathon, so just remember that once you start pushing yourself harder and harder, like a long runs, emotions are known to more easily come to the surface. I have almost cried at mile 25 in 2 of my marathons.
2. You will have MANY times of self doubt, I ran 4 fulls last year and I still have feelings on 15 miles runs, "How the hell am I going to run another 11 miles?" How? Easy: adrenaline and excitement. Those two things will take over and take you all the way. When that day comes, you will be so hyped to start the race and you will know that you are ready to conquer it, and you will. We all go through negative thoughts, running just gives you too much time to think.
I wouldn't worry about it. Running puts me through a lot of highs and lows.0 -
I think you are over-reacting. That's why you do those training runs before actually running the race, so you gain experience and learn what it is like.
Next time you try it -- I believe your training has two more 18 milers (?) and a 20-miler -- you'll be a little bit stronger from having done this bad one, and you will know what to expect.
It is all about learning, and getting a little bit stronger, and a little bit stronger, and a little bit stronger.0 -
Thanks for all the responses everyone. I can't remember anytime a workout got into my head like that before so I have just been a bit lost since it happened trying to figure out where it went wrong. Looks like I need to stop being a puss and recommit...and try not to get lost in my head.
Gained a good deal of (humbling) respect for long distance runners over the past few months.
I've got 2 more long distances to go (20 and 22) before the big show. Hoping this comes together.0 -
I have not trained for a Marathon, but just recently completed my first Half Marathon. My last two long runs (11 and 12) were mentally hard. For my 11 mile run around mile 8 or 9 my brain started to play tricks on me. I had similar thoughts as you. What am I doing here, why am I doing this, my head kept telling me to stop but my legs keep telling me to go and finish the run.
I asked myself if I cannot run 11 miles and I am doubting myself how can I run 13.1. I wondered if I could do it, if I could finish that race.
My 12 mile run was again mentally tough, it is amazing what the brain can do to you. But I managed to finish and it felt good not to let my brain win.
During my Half Marathon I did not let my brain play that game with me, I somehow zoned out ( I run with music) my goal was to finish and when there was a time that my brain wanted to tell me that I could not do it. I just kept telling myself "believe in your training, you got this. You have run this distance before no big deal." somehow that helped to bring me back to the race and not get lost in my head.
Good luck on your Marathon, and great job on getting out there.0 -
I think this is part of the process. You develop physical strength and endurance on these long runs as well as mental. I think the mental toughness is what separates the winners from the losers. After I did my first 20 mile run I limped through my front door, barely able to walk, crying. Doubting my ability to ever go the distance. But I did another 20 and then another one after that. And they got better and better. And I had a great marathon. One bad run does not define you. Get out there, do it again. Remind yourself that you're strong. I have this little saying, that I stole from a fellow MFPer. "What you focus on expands". If you're focusing on how much you suck that's what's going to grow in your mind and take over. If you focus on the fact that you're running, you might be a little tired, but you doing it and you got this, that's what is going to carry you through. You can do this!0
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I'm just going to kind of echo what some others have said about mental toughness being at least as important (if not more important) as physical toughness. I have yet to run a full but I ran as far as 16 miles getting ready for my last half. I had some 12 mile runs where I just wanted to quit and felt like a big piece of *kitten* who shouldn't even be trying to run and I had some 15 milers that I felt like I could have sprinted another ten when I was finished. Hell I've had some 5 or 6 mile runs where I was doubting myself. I think it's good to have overcome these mental obstacles and remember that you did. So when they come up again you can tell them to eff off because you've done it already. About two or three weeks before my last half my long run buddy took me on an extremely hilly 14 mile run (he called it a "confidence builder"). And when we got to the top of the tallest hill he told me that I had done really well taking that hill and I should carry that in my back pocket during the race because there was nothing on the course as tough as that hill. Keeping your triumphs in mind is a huge help when doubt rears its head.
And despite having a number of 14 and 15 mile runs and one 16 in preparation for the half marathon there were still some unexpected conditions and at mile 8 of all places I got into my head too much and had pretty much decided that this race would be the last time I ever ran. But I was able to pull from my training and when I saw the sign for mile 10 I told myself "Hey, that's just 5K to go, no problem." And I was strong for the rest of the race and beat my goal.
The physical part is very often much easier than the mental but I think if you have a good base physically you can lean on that when the mental part starts fcking with you.0 -
Welcome to distance running, ElliotTN!
I'm not going to give you any tips on how to avoid this happening in the future, because, the truth is, THIS IS distance running.
One question - you make a lot of reference to crap in your post about what went wrong. Are those metaphors? Because we might also be able to help you if there was literal crap....0 -
One question - you make a lot of reference to crap in your post about what went wrong. Are those metaphors? Because we might also be able to help you if there was literal crap....
Fortunately I have never felt the need to poop myself mid stride. Afterwards may be a different story but I think I can usually blame that one on the sudden influx of booze and fast food combining forces and doing a death march through my system.0 -
Wow, what a bunch of solid advice. I agree with everyone else. I think half the battle with distance running is accepting that sometimes, we're going to feel really, really good and sometimes we're going to feel really, really bad. What matters is what you do with that. The best thing to do in both cases? Keep going.
My mantras:
1. "One foot in front of the other, relentless forward progress" (walk, crawl, run...just get to point
2. "Right here, right now." (Don't think about the next mile, don't think about the next long run, don't think about how the mile in the rear-view mirror felt. Focus on the mile you're getting through right now. Then the next. Then the next.)0 -
No bueno.I am still trying to figure out my marathon pace
You've put a lot of effort into running, is there some to not figure out your training/running paces?
Based on what Fitzgerald, and others, have written about caffeine, I would not use caffeine during a training run. Caffeine can be helpful for endurance athletes (the data I've seen shows that it extends the time to exhaustion more than increasing output) but, per Fitz, a "caffeine junky" would need to stop caffeine two weeks prior to the race and then ingest caffeine just prior to the race.I had been carrying a camelbak for water and from what I can tell my hydration was good. I was also trying to consume some tasty (gross) gu packs every 6 miles. Pre-run I took a caffeine tablet for 200mg (I am a huge caffeine junkie) so I believed my nutrition was on point.
The book by Fitz is about nutrition for the half and the full - it's about $10 for Kindle.
Based on the amount of carbs you were ingesting, you didn't bonk in the classic sense but, based on what you've written, something got "inside your head". Any chance it was the shot of caffeine? I ask that 'cause I used beetroot juice before a Half last month and, for the first time ever, I "daydreamed" for some of the early parts of the race.Is this what boinking feels like or did I just let my head wander to far off base?
Good luck with this and with your race.0 -
Well first, congrats on training for a marathon! Second, bad runs happen and this may be nothing more than that. The ELITES sometimes drop out during a race. Rare, but it happens.
I think your pace was probably good. You do NOT want to do all (or sometimes any) of a long run at marathon pace. Most should be at "conversation pace." That means is you cannot sing the Brady Bunch song (for example) without being winded you are going too fast. Another rule if thumb is 1:30-2:00 slower than 5k pace. It sounds like that is where you were BUT I would use conversation pace as more of a guide for your first marathon. You are better to go too slow than too fast. Really
You *could* try a little less. You really do not need a lot more fuel than sports drink for 16 miles but it is important to do some GU (or whatever you will fuel with during the race) to learn how to fuel as you run.
All in all if the rest of your training has been good, I'd just call it a rough day. And good luck on the next one!0 -
This was a good calculator for me too: http://www.mcmillanrunning.com
I took my best 5k time to figure out my pace for a half. And it was really pretty accurate.0 -
I mentally "shat the bed" the first 17 or 18 mile run I attempted when I returned to running as well.... I had Every.Single.One of those thoughts and MORE.
I did the walk, run, walk, hobble on home thing as well; although I'm guessing there were probably more tears, self recrimination, sniveling and general crying for mummy involved on my part. :blushing:
Despite the pain and subsequent flow of fluids from my face; that run has been one of the most important and dare I say beneficial things that has happened to my running since I decided to get back into it. Mentally I was smashed. I wanted to quit and in my mind at the time I had quit because I had had to walk (and yes I do know there are entire training plans based around walk run intervals; my brain is a horrible nasty thing).
On that day; somewhere in between the snot, the tears and the self hate my stubbornness kicked in and I refused to walk the entire way home. That I a) finished the planned distance and b) refused to walk the entire way home is something I take with me on every run now. I know, beyond a doubt; that when it all turns to *kitten*, when everything hurts and when my mind tells me I'm a big fat loser I CAN still keep going, even if it's slower than I want to go.
I guess what I'm trying to say is to take the bad from that run and treasure it. Next time you have a bad run (and I bet there will be a next time) the feelings won't blindside you and you will know that you can get through it, even if you are moving slower than you want to be!
Also I sometimes forget that in training for longer races it isn't always about the distances you run either, but the amount of time you spend on your feet (a MFP friend reminded me of this just the other day).
P.s. - Unfortunately Alice, I believe that extra fun trip down the rabbit hole (bonking) is yet to come :laugh:0 -
Great thread - some brilliant points made in here.
I only started running in July last year and have never ran farther than so I'm fairly softcore!
I was getting concerned by my duathlon this coming weekend but after reading this I am full of renewed motivation and vigour..it is "only" 12km run and 24km ride - offroad and to some this is a lot...in reality...I can do it..and I know I can. I need to just man up - see that other people are breaking barriers, taking mental beatings and coming back for more.
Go big or go home!
I'm going to get some time for a half and a full marathon before I am 40.
Keep at it people0 -
This happened to me during my first full marathon. I had done a training run of 22 miles, no problem. Then I get to the actual day, and right around mile 20, the brain decided I wasn't going to make it. It was scary at first, but I remembered I had already run 22 miles in training, so no need to panic yet. Then when I got to 22 miles, I told myself that I was strong and I could do anything/endure anything for 45 minutes. I just kept repeating "can't stop, won't stop" in my head. I definitely think that was me, "bonking", but it can be fought through. Then once you get to the last mile, euphoria takes over and everything becomes possible.
The most important part of training is getting used to time on your feet. You finished that 16 miler, walking or no. You actually spent even more time on your feet by walking a bit. At this point, your cardio fitness is up to where it needs to be, so don't worry if you have to slow down your feet a bit while training, so long as you stay upright on them for the prescribed amount of miles.
Having a mantra definitely helps- remember why you decided to run a marathon, and remind yourself why it's worth it.0 -
I heard this on the radio on the way to work this morning (it's a quote from a movie):
The hard is what makes it great.
I have the same negative thoughts when I am on a long run. I wonder what the hell I am doing this for and vow that in the future, I will just do shorter programs for shorter races. Then I wake up the next day ready to tackle whatever is on the schedule for the day. Give the negative thoughts their space, and then let them go. It's not normal to run 15, 20, 26.2, etc, etc. It's hard. And that's what makes it great. People who have never attempted it will never understand. I haven't run a marathon yet, but I have a new found respect for those that have. It's an amazing accomplishment.
Because it's hard.
And that's what makes it great.
Keep on, keeping on!0 -
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My head often gets the best of me, but usually not until race day. To prevent this in training when I'm conquering a new distance, I have a couple of tricks I try.
1. Lower my mileage. If I'm stressed about 14, I'll only go out for 10, take the pressure off. I'll keep it in the back of my mind that if i feel good, i'll keep going. On these days i generally make it the 14. Possibly even more.
2. Eat a good breakfast. I know a lot of people believe in fasted running. It doesn't really work for me for so many reasons. So i have oatmeal made with milk, fruit and coffee before heading out. If not I get distracted by my hunger early on and it ruins the run. My practice for runs over 13 miles is to have a snack at the one and two hour mark. Usually baby food pouches, banana and blueberry is my favorite. Powerbar makes one with more adult packaging, but with a steeper price tag. I have have the pouch at the first hour and the rest at the second.
3. New music. When conquering a new distance, I always treat myself to some new tunes that I've never listened to while running. Nice distraction.
4. Run slower than my long run pace. For long runs over 13, I lower my pace to la-ti-da, I could run all day pace. 10:30. For shorter long runs I'm usually 9:40 these days, in good conditions. My goal is to finish my extra long runs feeling like I could keep going and feeling like I don't need a nap after. A 10:30 pace works for me for this, but i do have to make a huge effort not to run my normal pace.
5. Positive thinking. I start telling myself I can do it 4 days before the big day. On my shorter runs during the week I tell myself "Of course you can run 16 miles! That's easy! Just take it slow and have fun!"
Of course my longest run at this point has only been 16 miles, with a 17th mile of walking up a very steep hill at the end. I won't be up to the 18-20 range until early may, but i plan to use these strategies then.
Training for a marathon is hard! So good for you for taking on the challenge! I'm not sure I'm going to be able to handle it myself with schedule constraints so that's why I'm currently trying out marathon training without a race on the calendar to see how it goes. I'm currently in week 8 of my 18 week plan.
Anyway, try and brush it off as one bad run and start looking ahead to the next one. You can do it!0
