Outside Magazine Article - am I eating enough?

SillyC2

Has anyone else seen this article?

http://www.outsideonline.com/fitness/bodywork/performance-plate/If-Youre-Not-Eating-Enough-You-Might-Gain-Weight.html


Um, so here's my story. Over the past 4 years, I took up ultrarunning and basically went from around 110 lbs to 125 lbs. Hungry all the time. Hungry all the time. Now, my training isn't particularly intense. I run about 40-60 miles per week, so about average for an ultrarunner.


At 125, my clothes started to get tight, and here I am on My Fitness Pal. Where I've been pulling a 200 calorie deficit since January and have proceeded to lose a spectacular 5 lbs. I'm usually even under my 200 calorie limit.

Is it possible I'm not eating enough?!?!?! My diary is open.

flsusi

I hit a plateau in my weight loss when I started running more.
After having read an article similar to the one you linked I tried eating more, but in the spirit of the whole 'anti carbs' craze I mostly avoided carbs and ate a lot of protein...and actually gained weight.

so then I continued to eat more, but made sure to get roughly 55% of my calories in carbs, 25 in protein and 25 in healthy fats. When I say roughly I mean VERY roughly. I don't count calories anymore, I try to eat what my body demands. that means: if Im craving pasta - I wait. if Im still craving pasta later in the day, Ill eat pasta.
Im NOT saying eat whatever you please no limits, but listen to what your body needs. it takes a little practice, but your body tells you what it needs.
ever since then my running/endurance has improved massively, and I have lost quite a few pounds!

suncluster

Thanks for posting this article. Although I am not an ultra runner, I have really been struggling with this lately.

I am running +/- 30 miles per week.
At first, I was maintaining the 1200net calories but was feeling like I needed more "fuel" so on 4/14 I increased to 1600. I was told that it would take my body about 3 weeks to get used to it.

Now, three weeks later, I have logged big weekly gains (luckily balanced by losses) but l am really wondering when I am going to see the scale go down again. :grumble:

@ Silly - After looking at your diary, if you are not eating enough maybe I am not either. I don't know

SillyC2

Thanks for posting this article. Although I am not an ultra runner, I have really been struggling with this lately.

I am running +/- 30 miles per week.
At first, I was maintaining the 1200net calories but was feeling like I needed more "fuel" so on 4/14 I increased to 1600. I was told that it would take my body about 3 weeks to get used to it.

Now, three weeks later, I have logged big weekly gains (luckily balanced by losses) but l am really wondering when I am going to see the scale go down again. :grumble:

@ Silly - After looking at your diary, if you are not eating enough maybe I am not either. I don't know

Yeah, this is kind of how I feel as well. I'm wondering if I was putting on pounds during my ultra training, in the first place, because I wasn't eating properly / enough / at the right times. I didn't put on a lot of weight and it came on very slowly - 12 or 15 lbs over three and a half years, and to be fair, maybe some is muscle? I was so hungry all the time. I wasn't binge eating, that's for sure.

So I'm not even pulling a big deficit here. 200 calories a day. I mostly make it and rarely go over (I ran 20 miles yesterday, I'm over today). But what's happened is that I've fallen off a few times. Three times I took a week break for a race, to make sure I went in with all the glycogen I could make. And I also had to take a few days off because I just.couldn't.take.it anymore. Just broke. I mean, I'm not even pulling a heavy deficit! At a 200 a day deficit - and I'm not losing much weight - I go to bed so hungry I want to cry.

AsellusReborn

I could never ever go to bed hungry, much less that hungry. I have no idea what your body needs, but I have to be honest, nothing is worth being hungry to me!

SillyC2

I could never ever go to bed hungry, much less that hungry. I have no idea what your body needs, but I have to be honest, nothing is worth being hungry to me!

Well, I started on here at MFP to see if I was making some big mistakes with my diet. Like, is there SOMETHING I'm eating way too much of? That I don't appreciate how many calories are in it? Because eating till I basically wasn't hungry anymore was causing me to gain weight. Slowly, but I was gaining weight.


Maybe I'll try eating something very small before running and eating something very small after? I dunno.

saskie78

I also gained training for my ultra. I think I was way under on long run days and then allowed myself to go way over too much. I "fell off the wagon" a lot and my life was just pretty chaotic trying to keep up with training and stuff. I mostly ate well, but I think that when I was indulging, I was indulging a lot.

Since I finished it, I've been doing things differently. I set my calories at 1600 (I'm 5'4" and 119 pounds) and stay under every single day. I'm running, but less miles, shorter distances and a little faster. I'm also doing more plyometric kinds of strength training a couple times a week, plus my usual runner maintenance kinds of things. The weight is starting to come off.

I don't know if your situation is the same or different, but I think I was just eating a lot on off days, which undid what the deficits I was seeing on long-run days. This seems almost impossible, because I was running up to 200 miles per month. But I do think this was the case.

Good luck with it all! It seems so complicated!

SillyC2

saskie - it sounds like it. I'm 5'2" and 123. I'm set to 1390 calories - maintenance should also be around 1600 for me.

I've gone over on my post-long run rest day. But I rarely go over 1390 on non-rest days.

I'm going to give this another month and then I think I might up it to 1600 for a few months just to see what happens.

davemunger

I think maybe part of the issue is that the burns for long runs get overestimated on MFP. When you are putting in back-to-back 20-milers at a relatively slow pace, you might be logging 4+ hour runs. But in marathon training your long run might be 3 hours. Since it measures burn in minutes, MFP would say the slower long run burns more calories, but in reality it might actually be burning the same or even fewer calories.

SillyC2

I think maybe part of the issue is that the burns for long runs get overestimated on MFP. When you are putting in back-to-back 20-milers at a relatively slow pace, you might be logging 4+ hour runs. But in marathon training your long run might be 3 hours. Since it measures burn in minutes, MFP would say the slower long run burns more calories, but in reality it might actually be burning the same or even fewer calories.

I don't think that's it, Dave. I'm pulling a HUGE deficit on long run days. Huge.

saskie78

I think maybe part of the issue is that the burns for long runs get overestimated on MFP. When you are putting in back-to-back 20-milers at a relatively slow pace, you might be logging 4+ hour runs. But in marathon training your long run might be 3 hours. Since it measures burn in minutes, MFP would say the slower long run burns more calories, but in reality it might actually be burning the same or even fewer calories.

I wear a heart rate monitor for almost everything and use those calorie counts. It is DEFINITELY lower than what MFP would give me. Even for faster runs, where my heart rate is up in the 160s. MFP overestimates like gangbusters if my heart rate monitor is right.

davemunger

I wear a heart rate monitor for almost everything and use those calorie counts. It is DEFINITELY lower than what MFP would give me. Even for faster runs, where my heart rate is up in the 160s. MFP overestimates like gangbusters if my heart rate monitor is right.

Even when I'm not training for ultras I take about 30 percent off of the MFP estimates. I don't think those estimates are designed for folks who are putting in 40, 50, 70 miles a week.

SillyC2

I wear a heart rate monitor for almost everything and use those calorie counts. It is DEFINITELY lower than what MFP would give me. Even for faster runs, where my heart rate is up in the 160s. MFP overestimates like gangbusters if my heart rate monitor is right.

Even when I'm not training for ultras I take about 30 percent off of the MFP estimates. I don't think those estimates are designed for folks who are putting in 40, 50, 70 miles a week.

So are you hungry all the time? That's what I'm wondering. When I finish lunch or dinner, I'm just as hungry as when I started eating. When I go to bed..... I'm sad..... I'm so hungry.

The week before a race, I'll eat until I'm not hungry - which isn't all that much more than what I'm eating pulling a defiicit..... maybe 250 calories more? And my body feels like it is singing. Not my stomach, like, all over. My mood, my energy, everything feels finally okay.

Yeah, so this article got me wondering if what's been happening this whole time - the whole 4 years that I've been slowly putting on weight - is "starvation mode" and messed up hormones rather than simply eating too much. I assumed I was just eating too much.

davemunger

So are you hungry all the time? That's what I'm wondering. When I finish lunch or dinner, I'm just as hungry as when I started eating. When I go to bed..... I'm sad..... I'm so hungry.

The week before a race, I'll eat until I'm not hungry - which isn't all that much more than what I'm eating pulling a defiicit..... maybe 250 calories more? And my body feels like it is singing. Not my stomach, like, all over. My mood, my energy, everything feels finally okay.

Yeah, so this article got me wondering if what's been happening this whole time - the whole 4 years that I've been slowly putting on weight - is "starvation mode" and messed up hormones rather than simply eating too much. I assumed I was just eating too much.

My understanding of how this works is not that "starvation mode" is real -- it is NOT true that you actually lose more weight when consuming more calories.

What is really going on is that when people get too hungry, they overeat to compensate. So the idea is to eat strategically to avoid this. You might actually be eating when you are not hungry, but this prevents feeling super-hungry later on. Most important is to consume some proteins and carbs right after your workout.

In the end, however, you still need to consume fewer calories than you burn, which means that getting a good estimate of how many calories you are burning is key.

http://www.drsharma.ca/five-sobering-facts-about-ghrelin-and-emotional-eating.html

vmclach

There may be truth to this. 900 & 1200 calories is a bit extreme.. I personally try to eat around 2,500 average per day to maintain ~130 at 5'8" but it is hard to lose weight.. Seems to just happen when I'm not trying/don't expect it.

For example... Left for Mexico weighing 133.. Did nothing but eat and drink myself silly with zero exercise... When I came back I weighed 128... :-/ I don't know how to explain things like that. It baffles me

saskie78

Left for Mexico weighing 133.. Did nothing but eat and drink myself silly with zero exercise... When I came back I weighed 128... :-/ I don't know how to explain things like that. It baffles me

I totally want to go on the Mexico diet. You should market it. It would be wildly popular!

SillyC2

Left for Mexico weighing 133.. Did nothing but eat and drink myself silly with zero exercise... When I came back I weighed 128... :-/ I don't know how to explain things like that. It baffles me

I totally want to go on the Mexico diet. You should market it. It would be wildly popular!

I need to go on the Mexico diet too! I'm not on a super low cal diet at this point, nothing like 900 or 1200. About 1700 most days? I have myself set to 1390 net.

I'll be falling off the wagon later this month. I'm having a wisdom tooth removed next week, and will then be going on the ice cream, vicodin, and no exercise diet. Followed immediately by a conference. Run a bit, then during early June I'm pacing someone at a 100 and running a 50k myself.

I think when I come back, I'm going to try 1600 net for a while and see what happens.

tfonz10

I thought it was my ultra running that made me gain my weight. I usually gain for anything marathon and up. It usually falls after going back to base mileage. Been at base for about a month now, not one pound loss despite eating at a deficit. I have also been on a no grain, low sugar diet for a medical reason. My cause is actually hormones! I am not sure if that is applicable to you or not.

SillyC2

My cause is actually hormones! I am not sure if that is applicable to you or not.

I guess it could be? I had PCOS in my early 20s (I'm 38 now), but it went away completely when I started running and cut back drastically on the sugar. It's gone and nobody knows it.

My PCP is amazing and great with athletes - when I got bloodwork done last year he took me through it and knew exactly what was going on. My thyroid was slightly on the low side.... but low in the way that is actually normal for endurance athletes.

MeanderingMammal

I wear a heart rate monitor for almost everything and use those calorie counts. It is DEFINITELY lower than what MFP would give me. Even for faster runs, where my heart rate is up in the 160s. MFP overestimates like gangbusters if my heart rate monitor is right.

Even when I'm not training for ultras I take about 30 percent off of the MFP estimates. I don't think those estimates are designed for folks who are putting in 40, 50, 70 miles a week.

So are you hungry all the time? That's what I'm wondering. When I finish lunch or dinner, I'm just as hungry as when I started eating. When I go to bed..... I'm sad..... I'm so hungry.

The week before a race, I'll eat until I'm not hungry - which isn't all that much more than what I'm eating pulling a defiicit..... maybe 250 calories more? And my body feels like it is singing. Not my stomach, like, all over. My mood, my energy, everything feels finally okay.

Yeah, so this article got me wondering if what's been happening this whole time - the whole 4 years that I've been slowly putting on weight - is "starvation mode" and messed up hormones rather than simply eating too much. I assumed I was just eating too much.

I'm in a very different situation, my mileage is only in the 30mpw range, but when I started trying to lose weight and get fitter last year I had to have a good look at what diet did to me.

Initially I set a fairly agressive loss rate objective, and as a result had quite a low calorie goal. For about 8 weeks I lost reasonably consistently, although at a lower rate than my objective. It then stalled.

Following some advice on here I increased my goal by about 300 calories and after another couple of weeks things started to improve again.

Reflecting back what I think happened was that when I was on the lower calorie goal, and having addded running to my life, I was so fatigued that my background activity level had reduced significantly. I was always uncomfortably hungry, and tired. I also really wasn't performing adequately at work as a result, and nearly gave up on the whole exercise.

I hit my weight loss goal about 2 months ago, then reset it to lose a bit more, although to be fair I'm ow a lot less worried about weight as such, given that my suits are now all a bit big for me.

SillyC2

Reflecting back what I think happened was that when I was on the lower calorie goal, and having addded running to my life, I was so fatigued that my background activity level had reduced significantly. I was always uncomfortably hungry, and tired. I also really wasn't performing adequately at work as a result, and nearly gave up on the whole exercise.

And this is why a simple calories-in, calories-out model doesn't work. I don't THINK background activity is suffering? I don't have a lot of options when it comes to my background activity. With a job that takes ~60 hours per week and two kids..... there is not too much background!