Suggestions on starting Mountain Biking

Archon2

Hey all,

Just recently joined MFP and this group.

A little background: I'm 48 years old. 6'4" tall and about 241 lbs as of today. I have high blood pressure and am on a beta blocker, which reduces my max heart rate a little.

I was an avid cyclist back in my teen and early adult years. I did mostly road biking. Then I stopped for a long time, and had no bicycle, until a few years ago when a friend at work gave me an old Fuji S12-S 18 speed (mfg 1982 or maybe 1983). So I figured, why not get back into it?

So I've been riding this old road bike now for health reasons the past few years and have upgraded some of the components. Put more than two thousand miles on it so far. The areas I ride are pretty hilly, and I sometimes struggle getting up them due to weight, on bad days sometimes going as slow as 6 mph using the smallest chain ring in the front and the granny gear in the back for steep inclines. However, on flat terrain, I can go all day long.

While I like road biking, the cars whizzing by always worry me a bit.

Thus. I now want to get into some casual mountain biking. I have been invited by both a friend and my brother-in-law, who are each about a 15 years younger than me. They are also very fit ... and I am still a work in progress. I expect (hope? lol) that they'll have to take it easy on me on the trails at first.

So...I have a budget limit of $500 for a MTB.

What should I look for? I'd prefer new, but will go for used if in good condition.

I think I want a beginner bike that will handle easy to medium trails, considering my current limits and body size and weight.

I'll need some low gearing too I suppose.

And, is a 29er a better choice nowadays for someone with my build?

I am not all that worried about bike weight, since I plan to drop about 40lbs this year, so saving a few pounds on something like a carbon frame isn't something I care about as it seems insignificant.

After the bike, any other #1 suggestion? Thanks!

yankeedownsouth

Do you have a bike shop nearby? If so, that should be your first stop. You can definitely get a decent entry-level mountain bike on your budget or just a bit more. Don't be tempted by the bikes you see at places like Academy; even though they look like a good deal, you'll soon be replacing whatever you buy (yes, I speak from experience). So, go by a bike shop, explain to them what you are wanting to do, how you will be riding the bike, and your budget, and let them guide you.

A couple months ago, I upgraded my 26" Trek to a Cannondale 29er to keep up with my son (I had just bought him a 29er). I LOVE the 29" wheels! The trails where I live are full of huge roots, and these wheels practically glide over them. Plus, I have a better chance of keeping up with a 15 year old boy...

Good luck, and enjoy your biking!!

Archon2

Yankeedownsou...

Yes, there are a couple bike shops about 10-30 miles away from me. I've gone in them from time to time to get parts for my Fuji (new seatpost, tires, brake pads, bar tape, and specialty tools like a spoke wrench).

Suggestions on particular bike/brand/model? Something like a Specialized Hardrock? Something from Giant? How useful is a full suspension? Too much to ask for $500 budget bike?

Also, anyone have luck with the BikesDirect Motobecane or Gravity line? Feature wise, they seem as comparable and for less money. I have a bike stand and am mechanically inclined and have no problems putting something together and making all the needed adjustments and most repairs. So a bike shop is only going to make that a little easier on me, for more cash outlay of course.

How much did the 29er Cannondale run you and what model?

yankeedownsouth

I only have personal experience with Trek and Cannondale mountain bikes. I had a Specialized, but it was a road bike (gave that up due to traffic, much like you); my husband had a Specialized Hardrock 29er, but he isn't really a rider, so we sold it.

I bought the Cannondale Trail 29 5; it ran me a bit over $800. My son's is a Cannondale Trail 29 7, which was about $200 cheaper. I am NOT mechanically inclined, so I'm lucky that I know how to change my tires. The bike shops are really helpful for me. I like that they properly fitted the bike to me, including shortening the seat post and narrowing the handlebars.

Archon2

Thanks Yankee! After your suggestions, I looked around a bit online, just trying to get a handle on the pricing for similar models.
Geez, that 700-1000 range is just too high! Now if I only could find something lightly used. So the 29s handle bumpiness and such better. And faster. I would imagine they are somewhat less maneuverable? I think I am going to go 29" though. A guy my size is probably proportionally just like some average guy on the smaller wheel size.

What about clipless pedals vs. platforms? Anyone have MTB advice here for this?

[I'm already "trained" and have been using clipless on my old road bike and it is instinctual getting out of them. But on the road, I unclip probably less than half a dozen times on a ride. Stop lights, or maybe a short water break..stuff like that.]

CycleCarolina

Hello Cyclists,

I practically work at a bike shop (sort of an exaggeration), but I would not buy new for $500. The quality will be lacking and your components will have issues.

I'm more fan of scouring CraigsList, etc., looking for a higher quality bike, that someone just isn't using anymore. Just make sure it fits your frame. My bike shop mechanics are always willing to give a quick look over a used bike, to let the potential buyer know if it's worth the asking price.

(That being said, I admit have purchased 3 new bikes over the past few years, but I spend significantly more than $500.)

Love to cycle - good luck with your purchases!

Archon2

CycleCarolina, I've seen this sentiment on some of the other biking boards I've been looking at today.

Can you recommend the minimum amount you would spend in a situation such as mine? Not a new cyclist, but new to MTB, wants to spend least amount for decent bike for easy to medium level trails. An simple example brand and model would be a huge help to me! Such as the Cannondale Trail 29 5 that Yankeedownsouth mentioned.

What I will do is look up the specs on these and compare to the components to some of the online bargins "house brand" bikes I see from Nashbar and BikesDirect. I imagine all the frames are probably from the same factory anyway for my price point, so it is a component thing.

If I can't find anything new that is comparable, then I will hold out and spend the time to search for a used one that meets the quality level I should be starting with.

yankeedownsouth

Yes, I've found the 29er to be a little less agile with handling. The trail I ride is really narrow at times with the trees, and I admit that I often come off to make it through those tight spots. However, I think that's more of a reflection of me then my bike; I'm not the bravest soul out there.

I rode clipless for years on my road bike with no issues, but no way am I clipping in on my mountain bike! I'm a wussy for sure, but I'm bruised after very ride as it is... I do wear mountain biking shoes tho, and they help.

patrickblo13

With your budget I would steer away from a full suspension bike. You will get more bang for your buck with getting a hard tail. That being said, if you do get a hard tail I would suggest a 29er. It will help absorb some of the shock and helps roll over obstacles a bit easier.

If you can afford it I would highly suggest upping your budget a bit. Say around $1,000. I know it is tough to justify spending that kind of money on a hobby you don't even know you like but it will save you in the long run from fixing/replacing cheap components.

TheBrolympus

With your budget I would steer away from a full suspension bike.

^^^^ This. You can get some much more hard tail bike for your money. Check out the 27.5 along with the 29er.

Pay attention to the wheels, around here (North Texas) running tubeless is a necessity unless you want to be changing tubes every ride. Some wheel sets are easier to setup tubeless than others, I had a set of WTB rims that I could not get to run tubeless for the life of me and eventually had to be replaced.

What about clipless pedals vs. platforms? Anyone have MTB advice here for this?

If you have already been riding clipless with your road bike, I would say go clipless with your MTB. It saves my shins a lot of pain and anguish.

yankeedownsouth

Pay attention to the wheels, around here (North Texas) running tubeless is a necessity unless you want to be changing tubes every ride. Some wheel sets are easier to setup tubeless than others, I had a set of WTB rims that I could not get to run tubeless for the life of me and eventually had to be replaced.

Isn't this the truth! I'm in North Texas too, and between my son and I, we go through WAY too many tubes. I was using the "puncture resistant" tubes on my 26" but can't find them for the 29er. Of course, they didn't solve all my puncture problems, but they definitely helped. Damned thorns!

ihadabadidea

What I will do is look up the specs on these and compare to the components to some of the online bargins "house brand" bikes I see from Nashbar and BikesDirect. I imagine all the frames are probably from the same factory anyway for my price point, so it is a component thing.

Exactly this. The bikes at BikesDirect cut a lot of corners to hit a price point and that means cheaper components than you'd find in a seemingly similar bike shop bike, usually in less noticed things like spokes or headsets. They're still much better than you'd get at a big box store, but you're getting a $500 bike for $500, not "list value $1,000" or whatever they put next to it. If you know what fit you need and are comfortable with setting up the bike yourself, it's still a good option.

Nashbar will occasionally have old overstock bikes that are a pretty good deal, and sometimes you can find a bike at a local shop discounted because it's been sitting around for a while. Like a car, a last year model bike can be a lot cheaper than a new one even if its replacement is nearly identical. It may be a little too late in the season to find a deal, but come September and October, they should be knocking down prices as the '15 models come in.

Archon2

Thanks for all the helpful advice.

I'm going to figure out what to do over the next week or two and then go for it; assuming my wife even agrees to the expense

Worst case I will ride my road bike a bit longer...don't want to slow down now that the weather around here is getting good!

allenhandley

You have already gotten some good advice, so I won't repeat a lot of it.

I'm more fan of scouring CraigsList, etc., looking for a higher quality bike, that someone just isn't using anymore. Just make sure it fits your frame. My bike shop mechanics are always willing to give a quick look over a used bike, to let the potential buyer know if it's worth the asking price.

You may have top pay a few bucks to have them check it out, but it will be a good investment in the long run. I bought a year old Trek 4300 for $350 from someone who thought they wanted to start mtn biking. They didn't like it.

I have no experience with the 29ers and have heard they have great ground clearance but are a bit sluggish.

Will need to stick to hardtail with your budget. Don't think you can go wrong with Specialized, Trek, Cannondale, Fuji, Ironhorse, Giant. Maybe try them out at LBS.

Archon2

Well, I talked with my wife about the budget and she was giving me "the look" even at the $500 mark (haha).

OK, after comparing many entry level name-brand models to the components on the BikesDirect and Nashbar lines, I decided to get the Motobecane Fantom 29er hardtail, 21" frame size. The components are either about the same or one step back; for example the derailer is a one of the mid-level Shimano's.b Eventually I'll want a new seat and pedals at least.

Once it gets here, it will go on the bike stand for a complete work-over, adjustments, wheel truing, etc, etc. Then OUTSIDE!
So, I will be sure to either regret OR be happy with the decision as I get started MTB-ing

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/mountain_bikes/fantom29_trail_xiv_blk-2100.jpg

yankeedownsouth

It's pretty!

I think once your wife sees how much you enjoy mountain biking, she'll give you the OK to upgrade when you're ready. My husband doesn't like biking, but he's totally supportive of the money I choose to spend on it because he sees how much I love it.

Archon2

It's pretty!

I think once your wife sees how much you enjoy mountain biking, she'll give you the OK to upgrade when you're ready. My husband doesn't like biking, but he's totally supportive of the money I choose to spend on it because he sees how much I love it.

We'll see Yankee

...at least now I'll have something for both kinds of biking...and I have about 40lbs to destroy so that'll be A#1 priority!

Archon2

If you have already been riding clipless with your road bike, I would say go clipless with your MTB. It saves my shins a lot of pain and anguish.

Going to try and start right out using clipless! If I get mangled, I'll report back, assuming I can type and stuff!

Archon2

The Moto MTB came yesterday and I put the frame on the bike stand and have been assembling/adjusting. I hate getting the derailleurs tuned in, but it is almost there after a couple tries. Brakes too...first time working with disk system...on a bike that is. Got them adjusted perfectly now. Might get a test ride in soon. Get some cable stretch in there and fine tune everything.

So far, my opinion is that the frame is quite well build and good quality.

The components all seem OK to me; entry/mid level Shimano stuff mostly.

I knew the crankset (Suntour) and the fork were a bit cheap; plan to swap those out pretty soon I think. Also, there is some damage on the large front chain ring. We'll see if BD will send me a new ring or not without much trouble. But I might just swap that out for something a little better straightaway so I'm not all that worried about it.

Can't wait to hit the local trails (Stewart State Forest in NY) and burn off more gut fat -- but I think I will be on my road bike more for a few weeks yet -- at least until I am happy with the setup!

By the way: keep the chainguard, a.k.a. the "dork disk?" I can probably bust it off without pulling the cassette, but I kind of like the idea of spoke protection for this kind of riding. My road bike doesn't have one, but that rear derailleur is not as likely to get hit by a passing log or stone and throw the chain into the spokes as is on a MTB

TheBrolympus

By the way: keep the chainguard, a.k.a. the "dork disk?" I can probably bust it off without pulling the cassette, but I kind of like the idea of spoke protection for this kind of riding. My road bike doesn't have one, but that rear derailleur is not as likely to get hit by a passing log or stone and throw the chain into the spokes as is on a MTB

I generally take anything off the bike that is likely to get broken off and litter the trails. The "dork disk" (LOL) usually gets removed along with any reflectors. That plastic disk won't last long and will be banging around back there making noise.

It's crazy when I do a night ride to see all the little reflectors littering the trail.

Archon2

Well, finished setting up the bike and that spoke protector disk kept making some spoke pining noise. I swear, it reminded me of when I was about six years old and put some baseball cards on the spokes and rode up and down the neighborhood street making "bicycle music."

Finally got frustrated and carefully cut the thing off with the trusty Dremel tool. Then I really went berserk and ran inside cutting off mattress tags.

Now all that remains is the maiden voyage on the local trails! Need one more thing tho -- cheapo bicycle rack for the car.

Archon2

Alright MTBers!

Its Friday and I worked today from the home office. Went out at lunch and just rode around my street and yard on the new MTB, trying to replicate some basic things I will see on the trails and not on the road.

My property has roads on two side of it. Along these sides is a pretty steep drop-off slope down into a drainage depression (drop or 3-4') which then rises a little to the road level, all happening across maybe a few yards width. So I decided to try hitting this drop-off from the top of the property at speed, and also the other way, from the road and suddenly going drastically up the short, sudden slope.

My road biking experience helped in at least one way: awareness of potential pedal strikes. So I careful about when that can happen and keep the inside pedal up when I have to. Although I can already tell that MTBing is going to require a LOT more awareness of this than when on the roads

However, it was funny when I tried to do a dropoff at speed. I felt like I was almost going to pitch over the bars. Experimented some more. What worked well was behind the seat and hang my butt over the rear tire, putting all the weight back there, and pedals neutral. Worked like a charm! Is this the right technique? I started hitting this faster and faster and gained a lot of confidence without any fear of falling after a while.

Now the other way was worse. First attempt failed. Oh, I was in a good gear, and I got right out of the saddle. Leaned forward to far over the bars and hammered up the slope; rear wheel spun out, lost momentum, and barely banged out of the pedal clips in time and caught myself.

OK, maybe don't lean so far forward!

Take two: I hit the slope out of the ditch, get up out of the saddle, but keep my weight back a bit. Bike hits slope, all speed dies. Need to hammer hard! Front wheel comes off the ground, wheelie! Again, barely unclip in time, but I bash my knee on the frame. Aluminum ping and bone thudding sound. Wave of pain follows.

Take three: I keep weight "just so," and make it up the slope. I hope this is how you do it...I guess you don't really "know" exactly how you should balance until you are in the middle of climbing such a short, steep hump. Also, I bet it sucks when it is muddy or wet.

I can tell there will be a lot to learn. But playing in this ditch and slope is good...don't want to be a total newb.

Any other basic tips will be appreciated!

(Edit: spelling fix)

krue1971

I don't know if it's "correct" but when going down steep inclines I tend to shift my weight back, on a few occasions my tire has gotten in the the way.

BusyRaeNOTBusty

So yes, going down hill on technical, you put your pedals perpendicular to the slope (some people tell you parallel to the ground but the last clinic I took said perpendicular to slope and that seems to work better for me). Elbows bent. All your weight should be on supported on your legs. Your belly button should be over the crank of your pedals so yes this might mean your *kitten* is behind your seat on really steep stuff. If you are doing an extended down hill you can lower your seat a few inches to make this easier. One finger on each break so you have the rest of your hand to control your bike.

Going up hill, don't get out of your seat. This is a big thing road bikers do when they try to mountain bike. If you have a full suspension bike it's even hard to make sure you are balanced between font and rear tire. Again, bend your elbows out, lower your shoulders toward the handlebars. Get in a lower gear (granny if it's really steep) and just keep pedaling (fast if it's really steep and short). Uphill obstacles are another thing. You will need to relax the pressure on the front right before in order to be able to "pop" your tire up over them.

Archon2

Ah, thanks BusyRae. :bigsmile: So going down into the ditch, it sounds like I was "doing it right" for the most part.

And going up a short hump I was doing it all wrong then! :embarassed: Haha, no wonder I messed up and bashed the knee! OK, so sit tight, and plan way ahead to get into a low or granny gear and keep my body down, relaxed, and weight forward, and spin. Almost like crawling up as I imagine from your description, and sit back a little bit when needing the front tire to pop over a root or something.

I "think" I have the idea down now. Going to test this out

KaktusJaque

Going up is definitely a balance act. Too far forward, and the back wheel spins out, too far back and the front wheel can come off the ground. The more riding you do the more you will know where to position yourself for the slope you are going up. I've gone down some real steep hills. So steep that my *kitten* was just about to touch the back wheel. If in doubt, I always go back far, because the alterative could be a endo over the front.

Yes off road does take a whole lot more concentration than the road. You always have to be looking ahead and selecting your line that you want to ride. That line may be to avoid a rut or some other obstacle or it could be to go over an obstacle for fun, whatever the case may be, you always want to be looking for that line.

Another bit of advice is to always keep your thumb under the handle bar to have a nice grip. There have been times where I had all my fingers over the top of the bar and the next thing I knew, is the handle bar just vanished into thin air, and then of course the “sack of potatoes” ie Me hitting the ground.

BTW your new bike looks like a real nice bike. Can't wait to get my rear shock back from the MFG so I can get back on the dirt. It's suppose to ship out tomorrow.

Archon2

KJ, thanks for the tip about keeping the thumbs under the bar. Again, that is something I just would not think to do coming from a road-biking background. If the ground "falls away" from you and you lose contact the the bars...bad :frown:

So far, I'm happy with the Moto, but it only has about a dozen miles on it from riding around my property and the local street. Still need a bike carrier for the car to get to the trail heads! Tried to pick one up at a couple stores but they are sold out. Will keep looking.