Ron Paul and honest rape

MikeSEA

MORGAN: You have two daughters. You have many granddaughters. If one of them was raped -- and I accept it's a very unlikely thing to happen -- but if they were, would you honestly look at them in the eye and say they had to have that child if they were impregnated?

PAUL: No. If it's an honest rape, that individual should go immediately to the emergency room. I would give them a shot of estrogen....

Now before anyone cries foul, it has been said that this taken out of context. Apparently what Mr. Paul was attempting to state was that there's a distinction between women who have been raped and women who come in at month 7 of pregnancy and demand an abortion, claiming they've been raped.

So, first if he didn't really mean to draw a distinction between honest rape and dishonest rape, then he probably shouldn't have used the word. Either someone is raped or they aren't. There is no "honest" rape. I don't really buy that it's just a minor phrasing that people are harping on. It really kind of speaks to a much larger potential problem for Mr. Paul; it indicates that he may be quite the misogynist.

Now let's give him the benefit of the doubt for a moment and say he's not a huge annoying misogynist who thinks that woman can't be trusted to determine when rape is honest or dishonest. I limit my discussion to women here because we are talking about abortion, after all. This notion of the pregnant woman in her 7th month who suddenly decides she doesn't want to raise the child is a fallacy. It doesn't exist. Even if it did, abortion at that stage isn't legal anywhere in the US unless the life of the mother is at risk. His attempt to qualify the discussion to make himself seem like less of a jerk doesn't really fly.

And as a throw-away third note, estrogen? Really? So, exactly how many decades has it been since you've practiced...Dr. Paul?

BrettPGH

"Oh uncle Ron! Why don't you go talk to aunt Sally some more!"

He's done anyway. Hasn't won a single state. He could run third party but he ain't winning that either.

I'd love a little more libertarianism in government. But not the full tilt Ronny is pushing. Sorry I like paved roads and educated children.

fbmandy55

I'm going to assume that he meant that it was rape and not a woman claiming she was raped as an excuse for an abortion. He clearly says "It is absolutely in limbo, because an hour after intercourse or a day afterwards, there is no legal or medical problem. If you talk about somebody coming in and they say, well, I was raped and I’m seven months pregnant and I don’t want to have anything to do with it, it’s a little bit different story."

I guess I don't really see the point of this post, even you said it was probably taken out of context. And this was taken from Rachel Maddow, The Glenn Beck of Liberal politics.

MikeSEA

Well he's all for a lack of government as long as we're talking about the federal government. He's fine with the states being as oppressive as they want to be.

MikeSEA

I'm going to assume that he meant that it was rape and not a woman claiming she was raped as an excuse for an abortion. He clearly says "It is absolutely in limbo, because an hour after intercourse or a day afterwards, there is no legal or medical problem. If you talk about somebody coming in and they say, well, I was raped and I’m seven months pregnant and I don’t want to have anything to do with it, it’s a little bit different story."

I guess I don't really see the point of this post, even you said it was probably taken out of context. And this was taken from Rachel Maddow, The Glenn Beck of Liberal politics.

Actually Rachel is quite rational. If we're going to call anyone the Glenn Beck of Liberal politics/media, I think Keith Olbermann is probably a better choice,

That said, I can only assume you didn't see the point because you didn't read it. I'll restate it though, Neither a doctor nor politician has a place in telling a woman they weren't raped. The 7month pregnancy example is crap.

KimmieBrie

Rape victims (any woman claiming to be raped) shouldn't have to explain anything to politicians - they don't need to be excused by them. Rapes go unreported because women already think they won't be believed or it can't be proved, therefore, no justice and just a humiliating experience awaits them.

Either you're pro-choice or not. If you're ok with an "honest" rape victim having an abortion then you're pro-choice.

BrettPGH

Rape victims (any woman claiming to be raped) shouldn't have to explain anything to politicians - they don't need to be excused by them. Rapes go unreported because women already think they won't be believed or it can't be proved, therefore, no justice and just a humiliating experience awaits them.

Either you're pro-choice or not. If you're ok with an "honest" rape victim having an abortion then you're pro-choice.

Exactly this. There's not a woman on this planet who needs Ron Paul deciding how "real" her rape was.

ffuunnnnyy__ggiirrll

It's a shame that there is still such a stigma attached to being raped. No woman should ever feel shamed or guilted into not coming forward by anyone, least of all a politician. If an environment is created where women are believed and made to feel safe, then it would eliminate someone waiting to "come forward" until their 7th month of pregnancy.

As with anything, there are always people who want to abuse the system and take advantage.

I do agree if you are pro-choice when it comes to a rape victim having an abortion than you are pro-choice. And I am pro-choice.

mikajoanow

Ron Paul is ridiculous. He more than likely has no idea what it is like to be raped, even less idea what it is like to be raped where the consequence of the pregnancy might be pregnancy. So him, to me, judging what an honest rape is by if a woman goes to the doctor or not directly after the rape is astounding. I'm not a fan of his anyway.

Azdak

Ron Paul is ridiculous. He more than likely has no idea what it is like to be raped, even less idea what it is like to be raped where the consequence of the pregnancy might be pregnancy. So him, to me, judging what an honest rape is by if a woman goes to the doctor or not directly after the rape is astounding. I'm not a fan of his anyway.

This is just another component of the overall republican war on women. This is not the first time it has come up--there was actually an attempt to write a more stringent definition of "forcible rape" by Rep Joe Pitts (R-PA) and Chris Smith (R-NJ) as an amendment to the Affordable Care Act in 2011. The purpose was to limit the definition of rape and would have had the effect of legally diminishing statutory rape and drug-induced rape, among others.

In 2011, a Georgia state representative tried to amend the state legal code to change the term "rape victim" to "rape accuser". (Because you know, you just can't trust those scheming, dishonest women).

There are still many men who just can't seem to acknowledge the seriousness of crimes against women (unless of course it's one of "their" women). I think this comes from some vestigial sense of seeing women as "property" of men, or of being subservient to men. Deep down, they consider sexually independent women as "*kitten*" who basically deserve what they have coming to them

NightOwl1

Rape victims (any woman claiming to be raped) shouldn't have to explain anything to politicians - they don't need to be excused by them. Rapes go unreported because women already think they won't be believed or it can't be proved, therefore, no justice and just a humiliating experience awaits them.

Either you're pro-choice or not. If you're ok with an "honest" rape victim having an abortion then you're pro-choice.

Exactly. He's clearly playing into the narrative that rape is something that women lie about all the time, which goes to discredit rape victims everywhere.

And I have a quibble with the host qualifying his statement with "and I accept it's a very unlikely thing to happen." Is he aware of how prevalent rape is in this country? There is an overwhelming likelihood that a close female member of Ron Paul has or will be raped in their lifetime. These are the statistics. Downplaying the prevalence with "and I accept it's a very unlikely thing to happen" is just another example of how people don't understand the problem in this country.