Dad uses Facebook to teach daughter a lesson...

KayteeBear

Have you seen the video? What do you think? Was he right or wrong?

http://www.litefm.com/cc-common/mainheadlines3.html?feed=421220&article=9738000&fb_comment_id=fbc_10150571400139633_21360374_10150575509224633#f4c36bc78f0c36

Azdak

I hate myself for even getting involved with this. But the hockey game sucks and I am waiting up for my stepdaughter to come home and I am frustrated with dog breeders who advertise for inquiries and then never respond.

Both the subject of the video and the content are guaranteed to bring out the worst in people--II am hoping that people in this group can do a better job.

I don't know the specifics of this family's situation. From the video, I would say that, regardless of the circumstances that led up to this, it's a pretty dysfunctional group. As self-indulgent as the girl seems to be, the father is even more immature.

BTW--nice cigarette, dumbass.

Newsflash: teenagers are whiny, selfish. self-indulgent, etc. I know, shocking news!

So dad goes snooping into his daughter's facebook account, which he shouldn't be doing in the first place, and sees a rant written by--again, here's a shock--a complaining teenager. So his mature, adult approach, is to throw a whining temper tantrum of his own.

Trust me, this lack of communication did not happen overnight. Without excusing any of the girl's activities, to me this just screams "little guy trying to make himself feel important" by lording it over everyone and home and expecting everyone to do his bidding.

Again, the girl does not come off in a positive way. But in any parent-child relationship you have to have at least one adult. In this case, you have two immature crybabies. No wonder she doesn't have any respect for him.

And I would bet $10,000 of Mitt Romney's money that he thinks Obama is a socialist.

Elizabeth_C34

Obviously Dad has "issues" and so does daughter.

Best to leave the nuts uncracked...

becoming_a_new_me

That man needs parenting lessons, the girl needs therapy, and the family needs family counseling.

Bahet

I commend him! I think actually shooting the laptop was OTT but it's about time there were a few more parents who didn't let their little precious act like a jerk and make excuses for it.

As for "snooping" 1, read the followup and 2, even if he was -- so what? It's not like she wrote it in her diary and he went searching her room for it. She posted it online to 400 of her closest "friends". There is no expectation of privacy to something posted online and obviously the only people she didn't want to see it was her parents. She learned a few good lessons. Don't post anything online that you don't want everyone to see. Don't think you can post something vulgar and disrespectful and have your parents do nothing. She has it pretty good overall.

mommared53

Well I applauded the dad. I think the girl got off easy. Growing up, I was scared to death of my mom. There's no way in this world I would have even THOUGHT in my mind about my mom what she wrote on Facebook about her dad! I think Dad should have reloaded and pumped a few more into the laptop. But I think maybe she got the messaage? As for snooping? Ask my two kids. They'll both tell you I snooped. You darn right! As long as they live in my home, I'll snoop if I think there's a reason to.

Azdak

I commend him! I think actually shooting the laptop was OTT but it's about time there were a few more parents who didn't let their little precious act like a jerk and make excuses for it.

As for "snooping" 1, read the followup and 2, even if he was -- so what? It's not like she wrote it in her diary and he went searching her room for it. She posted it online to 400 of her closest "friends". There is no expectation of privacy to something posted online and obviously the only people she didn't want to see it was her parents. She learned a few good lessons. Don't post anything online that you don't want everyone to see. Don't think you can post something vulgar and disrespectful and have your parents do nothing. She has it pretty good overall.

We don't disagree on general principles--e.g. "don't let kids act like a jerk and make excuses for it" and some other things. I think it is a trap, however, to think that ANY action is to be applauded. It seems like this falls into the category of "let some *kitten* dad act like a jerk and make excuses for it". I don't see where applauding his general douche-baggery accomplishes anything productive.

The only "lesson" she learned is that she has a narcissistic, emotionally stunted a-hole for a father.

SarahMorganP

I agree with you completely Azdak. Dad throwing a tantrum because his teen daughter is complaining about her life (I'm pretty sure 99% of teens do this) is not going to do any good.

Bahet

Read the follow-up.

What does a child learn if dad says "If you do it again the punishment will be worse" then does nothing? Sadly, they learn the lesson that far too many kids today learn - that they can get away with anything and parents have no authority and deserve no respect.

Azdak

Read the follow-up.

What does a child learn if dad says "If you do it again the punishment will be worse" then does nothing? Sadly, they learn the lesson that far too many kids today learn - that they can get away with anything and parents have no authority and deserve no respect.

There's a HUGE difference between "doing nothing" and carrying out a public act of reckless violence, don't you think? Do you have any limits to what you think would be acceptable? What if this wasn't enough? Is the next step public whipping? Waterboarding? I mean, you've already gotten out the handgun......maybe you shoot the family dog in front of her.

In this case, the follow up is irrelevant. As I said before, I think you are taking valid concerns--i.e. the need for people to have accountability for their actions, children to have respect for their parents--and using that to give a blanket endorsement without considering the specifics of the action. It perpetuates the dangerous myth that the only way to instill respect and "discipline"is through fear, authoritarianism, and violence.

The father admitted that he did it out of emotion and ego. Again--tell me how you teach "discipline", responsibility, respect and accountability by publicly acting emotionally, egotistically, recklessly, and disrespectfully? All while smoking a cigarette?

That's not "good parenting" or "tough love". That's LAZY parenting. That's "I'm too busy with my own life to be involved with my kids and now I can't understand why they are out of control" parenting. God forbid they should ever drag their lazy assess away from watching "American Idol" long enough to talk to their kids or help with homework.

Parenting is a full-time job but too many parents see it as just another inconvenient chore. I see it in my neighborhood every day and my wife sees it in her classroom. I've raised 3 teenagers now. Like with any kids, we had (and have) the usual ups and downs as kids test their limits and learn how to be adults. They aren't perfect (neither are their parents ;-), but they are reasonably respectful, responsible, and dependable. To date, I have never had to shoot any of their possessions to "teach them a lesson" or to work out my personal emotional problems.

It can be done. It means being a parent and taking it seriously.

mommared53

In this case, the follow up is irrelevant. As I said before, I think you are taking valid concerns--i.e. the need for people to have accountability for their actions, children to have respect for their parents--and using that to give a blanket endorsement without considering the specifics of the action. It perpetuates the dangerous myth that the only way to instill respect and "discipline"is through fear, authoritarianism, and violence.

It worked for my mom. I was scared to pieces of my mom when I was growing up. I never in the world would have back talked her or came anywhere near close to writing the type of letter that girl wrote on Facebook to her parents. My mom passed away years ago but I now have plenty of respect for her for not letting my brothers and sisters and I (6 of us) get away with the disrespect and other crap kids get away with nowadays because after all they're teenagers. My mom would have never accepted that excuse.

Bahet

Azdak, Of all the people who post here you have always been one of the most rational, intelligent, and well thought out. I've always had a lot of respect for you. So it almost pains me to see you stoop to such silly strawman arguments as "shoot the family dog." You're above that. Leave that sort of irrational overreaction for those I've come to expect it from. That's not you.

I do strongly disagree with shooting the laptop. That was OTT. I already said that though. If I were in his place I would have taken it away though and she would have had to earn it back. I don't see that as lazy parenting. Lazy parenting is sitting back, doing nothing and saying "Oh, all kids do that. It's no big deal." No, not all kids do that. Kids who were never taught to be respectful or were never given consequences for their actions do that. I never would have. I would have lost my laptop. It wouldn't have been shot. But it would have been just as gone from my life. (If laptops had been around when I were a teen.)

Azdak

Azdak, Of all the people who post here you have always been one of the most rational, intelligent, and well thought out. I've always had a lot of respect for you. So it almost pains me to see you stoop to such silly strawman arguments as "shoot the family dog." You're above that. Leave that sort of irrational overreaction for those I've come to expect it from. That's not you.

I do strongly disagree with shooting the laptop. That was OTT. I already said that though. If I were in his place I would have taken it away though and she would have had to earn it back. I don't see that as lazy parenting. Lazy parenting is sitting back, doing nothing and saying "Oh, all kids do that. It's no big deal." No, not all kids do that. Kids who were never taught to be respectful or were never given consequences for their actions do that. I never would have. I would have lost my laptop. It wouldn't have been shot. But it would have been just as gone from my life. (If laptops had been around when I were a teen.)

Part of me wants to let your first paragraph go, because I think we just misunderstood each other. The other part feels the need to respond in more detail. Angel...devil....angel....devil--which to choose?

I am having a problem with the whole "irrational overreaction" part.

Here's my point of view: A grown man, a supposed adult, reacts to his daughter's writing a nasty post on her Facebook page by taking her laptop, pulling out a .45 caliber handgun, shooting nine holes in the computer, and posts the video on Facebook.

You "commend him" (your words, not mine) and rationalize his actions not once, but twice.

And, somehow, I'M the one being "irrational" and making "strawman" arguments. Huh?

From my perspective when you said someone should be "commended" for shooting a computer, following up by calling it "OTT" seemed pretty trite.

Obviously, you feel you weren't defending those actions--I am certainly willing to accept that. Considering that I thought you seemed to approve (or at least minimize) the father's actions, I don't think I was going too far to find out exactly what you thought was unacceptable.

I also felt the need to express in the strongest terms possible that what this guy did was NOT acceptable under any circumstances--and it has nothing to do with "disciplining" your kids or holding them accountable. I think that minimizing the father's actions to make the point that "someone's got to do something about these kids" is not constructive either. To me, it's not an "either/or" question.

So, I am willing to concede to taking the argument too far, but I feel you were not very clear in expressing your disagreement with the father's actions. How's that for a compromise?

And from the rest of your remarks, it is obvious I am still not making that point clearly. So let me try again, because we are not in disagreement, even though your remarks seemed to be a continued rebuttal.

You seem to think that my use of the term "lazy parenting" meant that I thought parents should always be kind, supportive, and accommodating. (Again, maybe I was not clear in my remarks). Not hardly. What I refer to as "lazy parenting" is parents who do not actively engage their children, are absorbed in their own lives and activities, and, when things go wrong, lose control and lash out with anger, physical punishment, abusive language, etc. Too often, we accept these actions as signs of "good" parenting--that you have to be "tough" and aggressive and scream and yell and use force to make people do what you want.

The assumption is that, if you don't do these things, you are somehow "permissive".

That is a false assumption, IMO, but it permeates our culture. Just look at the positive responses to this guy's behavior. Look at the exalted status we give to cartoon characters like football coaches and a-holes like Donald Trump.

Here is the misunderstanding: I am 100% in favor of setting standards--strict, loose, or in between, enforcing those standards, and making sure there are clear consequences for disobeying those standards. I agree that too many parents want to be "buddies" to their children instead of parents. That is a clear abdication of parental responsibility--when you have kids, your job is to be their PARENT, not their friend. You can be friends when they become adults.

But that can be accomplished without physical abuse, humiliation, emotional tantrums by the adults, etc. Sometimes parents need to show their anger to make a point, and sometimes it just comes out because parents are human too--I'm not saying that everything has to be perfectly planned out. But I do think that parents have a responsibility to act proactively as parents. Sometimes that means you have to give up some outside activities and social events. Sometimes it means you have to resist the urge to lecture and you have to just sit back and listen without judging and without correcting every little thing.

Hopefully, I was a little clearer this time. We actually are pretty much in agreement. This is one of my "soapbox" subjects (ya think?) so I put a little more emotion into this topic than some others. So now that I have completely overanalyzed a stupid you tube video, I think I will retire for the evening.

Bahet

Azdak, Of all the people who post here you have always been one of the most rational, intelligent, and well thought out. I've always had a lot of respect for you. So it almost pains me to see you stoop to such silly strawman arguments as "shoot the family dog." You're above that. Leave that sort of irrational overreaction for those I've come to expect it from. That's not you.

I do strongly disagree with shooting the laptop. That was OTT. I already said that though. If I were in his place I would have taken it away though and she would have had to earn it back. I don't see that as lazy parenting. Lazy parenting is sitting back, doing nothing and saying "Oh, all kids do that. It's no big deal." No, not all kids do that. Kids who were never taught to be respectful or were never given consequences for their actions do that. I never would have. I would have lost my laptop. It wouldn't have been shot. But it would have been just as gone from my life. (If laptops had been around when I were a teen.)

Part of me wants to let your first paragraph go, because I think we just misunderstood each other. The other part feels the need to respond in more detail. Angel...devil....angel....devil--which to choose?

I am having a problem with the whole "irrational overreaction" part.

Here's my point of view: A grown man, a supposed adult, reacts to his daughter's writing a nasty post on her Facebook page by taking her laptop, pulling out a .45 caliber handgun, shooting nine holes in the computer, and posts the video on Facebook.

You "commend him" (your words, not mine) and rationalize his actions not once, but twice.

And, somehow, I'M the one being "irrational" and making "strawman" arguments. Huh?

From my perspective when you said someone should be "commended" for shooting a computer, following up by calling it "OTT" seemed pretty trite.

Obviously, you feel you weren't defending those actions--I am certainly willing to accept that. Considering that I thought you seemed to approve (or at least minimize) the father's actions, I don't think I was going too far to find out exactly what you thought was unacceptable.

I also felt the need to express in the strongest terms possible that what this guy did was NOT acceptable under any circumstances--and it has nothing to do with "disciplining" your kids or holding them accountable. I think that minimizing the father's actions to make the point that "someone's got to do something about these kids" is not constructive either. To me, it's not an "either/or" question.

So, I am willing to concede to taking the argument too far, but I feel you were not very clear in expressing your disagreement with the father's actions. How's that for a compromise?

And from the rest of your remarks, it is obvious I am still not making that point clearly. So let me try again, because we are not in disagreement, even though your remarks seemed to be a continued rebuttal.

You seem to think that my use of the term "lazy parenting" meant that I thought parents should always be kind, supportive, and accommodating. (Again, maybe I was not clear in my remarks). Not hardly. What I refer to as "lazy parenting" is parents who do not actively engage their children, are absorbed in their own lives and activities, and, when things go wrong, lose control and lash out with anger, physical punishment, abusive language, etc. Too often, we accept these actions as signs of "good" parenting--that you have to be "tough" and aggressive and scream and yell and use force to make people do what you want.

The assumption is that, if you don't do these things, you are somehow "permissive".

That is a false assumption, IMO, but it permeates our culture. Just look at the positive responses to this guy's behavior. Look at the exalted status we give to cartoon characters like football coaches and a-holes like Donald Trump.

Here is the misunderstanding: I am 100% in favor of setting standards--strict, loose, or in between, enforcing those standards, and making sure there are clear consequences for disobeying those standards. I agree that too many parents want to be "buddies" to their children instead of parents. That is a clear abdication of parental responsibility--when you have kids, your job is to be their PARENT, not their friend. You can be friends when they become adults.

But that can be accomplished without physical abuse, humiliation, emotional tantrums by the adults, etc. Sometimes parents need to show their anger to make a point, and sometimes it just comes out because parents are human too--I'm not saying that everything has to be perfectly planned out. But I do think that parents have a responsibility to act proactively as parents. Sometimes that means you have to give up some outside activities and social events. Sometimes it means you have to resist the urge to lecture and you have to just sit back and listen without judging and without correcting every little thing.

Hopefully, I was a little clearer this time. We actually are pretty much in agreement. This is one of my "soapbox" subjects (ya think?) so I put a little more emotion into this topic than some others. So now that I have completely overanalyzed a stupid you tube video, I think I will retire for the evening.

OK, I understand you now. We do actually agree more than disagree. (Although the follow up explains why he posted the video) I wouldn't have shot the laptop if it were my kid. I also wouldn't have made the "Oh she's just a teenager. All teenagers do that." rationale. I'm a bit disgusted by people like that. All too often those are the same ones who say "Oh, boys will be boys. He didn't mean to body slam that other kid on the playground. " and other such excuses for bad behaviour. I commend him for actually being a parent and doing something about her bad behaviour rather than excusing it, doing nothing, or pulling one of those "You're grounded forever! (*or until tomorrow afternoon, whichever comes first*)" sorts of things. She did it once and got grounded for 3 months. He told her if she ever did it again it would be much worse. She did it again. I'd be willing to bet she won't pull that sort of thing a 3rd time - not because she's afraid he'd shoot her or the dog or some other nonsense, but because she knows her parents aren't playing around and letting her get away with that stuff.

I don't think that's lazy parenting at all. Lazy parents are the ones who make excuses for their little precious's bad behaviour or don't follow through on threats of punishment. It's far easier to say "Now Susie, that wasn't very nice. Don't do it again." than it is to deal with a teenager daughter who now has no computer until she buys one herself.

fbmandy55

Read the follow-up.

What does a child learn if dad says "If you do it again the punishment will be worse" then does nothing? Sadly, they learn the lesson that far too many kids today learn - that they can get away with anything and parents have no authority and deserve no respect.

There's a HUGE difference between "doing nothing" and carrying out a public act of reckless violence, don't you think? Do you have any limits to what you think would be acceptable? What if this wasn't enough? Is the next step public whipping? Waterboarding? I mean, you've already gotten out the handgun......maybe you shoot the family dog in front of her.

You know, to some people, especially regionally, handguns do not mean an act of violence. MANY, MANY people in this country are perfectly comfortable around a gun. Judging by the video, the dad's cowboy hat, and accent I would assume this was a southern state, maybe Texas. Those kinds of places it is common to see people with guns or touching guns every single day. that is their way of life. Hell, my dad hung a bulletproof vest on the wall in our polebarn and shot at it one night. It was a fun memory and a good family bonding moment to me as an adult with my dad.

To compare him destroying his daughters computer to a public whipping, waterboarding or shoooting a dog? Really?! Are you serious? I don't think it's fair to call him 'reckless' because they shoot a gun in a safe way on their own proerty. It was a good lesson to me and I would have done the same. :drinker: If only I were that creative.

mommared53

Yeah, my mom would have chosen the public whipping. In other words she would have taken a belt to my butt right out in the open.

TheRoadDog

I wouldn't have handled it that way. Not saying his reaction was wrong, but my daughter's would never have done what his daughter has done.

He may be acting within some very loose boundaries of what is acceptable, but the real question is how were his parenting skills as she was growing up?