Boy Scouts reaffirm ban on gays
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I love the USA. Freedom is a double edge sword. It grants something to someone, while at the same time legally denying someone something else. I like hearing that people are standing up for their beliefs. Regardless of what they are. If the organization is doing something you don't like, don't support it. I was a boy scout until I was 15 and thought I was too cool for it. Second Class was my rank. I learned lots of good skills and ethics. If my boys want to be scouts, they have my support. If you don't like the organization, don't join it.
I agree. They are a private organization and have the right to make their rules/guidelines. If you disagree, don't join and don't support. If enough people stood strong for their beliefs the BSA would soon be no more. I think the bigger problem is people run off at the mouth about how terrible the BSA are then join and or buy their products. If they don't get the support they can't continue.0 -
I love the USA. Freedom is a double edge sword. It grants something to someone, while at the same time legally denying someone something else. I like hearing that people are standing up for their beliefs. Regardless of what they are. If the organization is doing something you don't like, don't support it. I was a boy scout until I was 15 and thought I was too cool for it. Second Class was my rank. I learned lots of good skills and ethics. If my boys want to be scouts, they have my support. If you don't like the organization, don't join it.
I agree. They are a private organization and have the right to make their rules/guidelines. If you disagree, don't join and don't support. If enough people stood strong for their beliefs the BSA would soon be no more. I think the bigger problem is people run off at the mouth about how terrible the BSA are then join and or buy their products. If they don't get the support they can't continue.
Oh I think there are plenty of wealthy people with an agenda who would swoop in and save them if only to prop them up as martyrs. Let's not over estimate the power the average joe compared to someone with effectively unlimited means.0 -
I love the USA. Freedom is a double edge sword. It grants something to someone, while at the same time legally denying someone something else. I like hearing that people are standing up for their beliefs. Regardless of what they are. If the organization is doing something you don't like, don't support it. I was a boy scout until I was 15 and thought I was too cool for it. Second Class was my rank. I learned lots of good skills and ethics. If my boys want to be scouts, they have my support. If you don't like the organization, don't join it.
I agree. They are a private organization and have the right to make their rules/guidelines. If you disagree, don't join and don't support. If enough people stood strong for their beliefs the BSA would soon be no more. I think the bigger problem is people run off at the mouth about how terrible the BSA are then join and or buy their products. If they don't get the support they can't continue.
Oh I think there are plenty of wealthy people with an agenda who would swoop in and save them if only to prop them up as martyrs. Let's not over estimate the power the average joe compared to someone with effectively unlimited means.
I'm not worried about that. That used to be true about racist organizations, too. What I'm worried about is advancing society's intolerance for discrimination a step further than it has already advanced, and it's happening. Shamefully slowly, but it's happening. Less and less people are willing to tolerate discrimination against gays, just as few now will tolerate it against ethnicities, races, and religions.0 -
It is a private organization so they get to make the choice, but it doesn't mean its the right choice, because it's not. I wish someone would start a boy scout program that did allow gays, that's what happened with girl scouts-they didn't exist and girls weren't allowed into boy scouts until someone created a seperate group. I would not put my son into boy scouts until the ban has been eradicated, I would not support a group that discriminates like that, it sickens me.0
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It is a private organization so they get to make the choice, but it doesn't mean its the right choice, because it's not. I wish someone would start a boy scout program that did allow gays, that's what happened with girl scouts-they didn't exist and girls weren't allowed into boy scouts until someone created a seperate group. I would not put my son into boy scouts until the ban has been eradicated, I would not support a group that discriminates like that, it sickens me.
It's funny that you mention that. Well, what about little boys who awnt to join girl scouts? I remember reading a story about a little Denver boy who wanted to join the girl scouts. They should just make a "Gay Scout" (litterally) and get it over with. People complain and complain. But if someone, with unlimited sources, and for the cause (like all these rich celeberties) would support or start something like this, the world will be a happier place for some. I say, those who agree with it should put their money where their mouth is, or it's all talk.0 -
It is a private organization so they get to make the choice, but it doesn't mean its the right choice, because it's not. I wish someone would start a boy scout program that did allow gays, that's what happened with girl scouts-they didn't exist and girls weren't allowed into boy scouts until someone created a seperate group. I would not put my son into boy scouts until the ban has been eradicated, I would not support a group that discriminates like that, it sickens me.
It's funny that you mention that. Well, what about little boys who awnt to join girl scouts? I remember reading a story about a little Denver boy who wanted to join the girl scouts. They should just make a "Gay Scout" (litterally) and get it over with. People complain and complain. But if someone, with unlimited sources, and for the cause (like all these rich celeberties) would support or start something like this, the world will be a happier place for some. I say, those who agree with it should put their money where their mouth is, or it's all talk.
How about simply "Scouts?" No gender bias whatsoever.
I agree with RoadDog--they're a private organization, and no matter how much I disagree with them, they're free to do what they want. However, if it is as others have said and that they receive public "Freebies"...then that's another issue. Reminds me of how in my town, the police stop traffic to let church members out of certain churches. Everyone else can be late for work, events, or be held up in traffic...but Baptist church members? Nah. Free reign of the road.0 -
My boys have been involved with Scouts for 9 and 6 years. The anti gay part is on the part of the organization top leadership but individual troops vary as much as 1 Catholic church can vary from another and can vary from the top ranks, more-so actually. My oldest had a pack leader in cub scouts who was an atheist. My youngest had a pack leader who was more agnostic but had no real use for organized religion. Their troop now is sponsored by an Episcopal church - you know, the ones who just decided to allow gays to marry in their church. Aside from being sponsored by them though there is no religious aspect to anything they do. They focus on skills and camping and activity and helping the community.
When we first moved here I looked into several different local troops. One was very religiously oriented to the point that they expected the entire troop to go to the church that sponsored them every week. When I said that we don't do church I was looked at like I had 2 heads. Needless to say we didn't join that troop. When we went to the current troop I asked about church involvement. They said that the church across the street helps sponsor them and they do some projects t help them in exchange. I asked "So will it be a problem if we don't go to church and aren't religious?" The scoutmaster just laughed and replied "I see you checked out Troop ____ before coming here! :laugh: No, we are about helping the boys become men, teaching them to help others, teaching them skills they just won't learn in school, and letting them have fun while doing it. No one cares if you are Christian or Muslim or Buddhist or atheist here."0 -
My boys have been involved with Scouts for 9 and 6 years. The anti gay part is on the part of the organization top leadership but individual troops vary as much as 1 Catholic church can vary from another and can vary from the top ranks, more-so actually. My oldest had a pack leader in cub scouts who was an atheist. My youngest had a pack leader who was more agnostic but had no real use for organized religion. Their troop now is sponsored by an Episcopal church - you know, the ones who just decided to allow gays to marry in their church. Aside from being sponsored by them though there is no religious aspect to anything they do. They focus on skills and camping and activity and helping the community.
When we first moved here I looked into several different local troops. One was very religiously oriented to the point that they expected the entire troop to go to the church that sponsored them every week. When I said that we don't do church I was looked at like I had 2 heads. Needless to say we didn't join that troop. When we went to the current troop I asked about church involvement. They said that the church across the street helps sponsor them and they do some projects t help them in exchange. I asked "So will it be a problem if we don't go to church and aren't religious?" The scoutmaster just laughed and replied "I see you checked out Troop ____ before coming here! :laugh: No, we are about helping the boys become men, teaching them to help others, teaching them skills they just won't learn in school, and letting them have fun while doing it. No one cares if you are Christian or Muslim or Buddhist or atheist here."
And the most liberal, accepting, open-minded troop could come knocking at my door trying to sell popcorn and I wouldn't purchase anything from them thanks to the organization's stance. If they don't like that, they can join another organization or stop coming around my door. I don't require their assistance with anything. Their good deeds don't shield them from the organization's failings.0 -
That's fine. I have absolutely no problem with that whatsoever. I only buy from my kids' troop and only because I know their personal views. I don't expect that anyone else would know that or that even if they did they would care.My boys have been involved with Scouts for 9 and 6 years. The anti gay part is on the part of the organization top leadership but individual troops vary as much as 1 Catholic church can vary from another and can vary from the top ranks, more-so actually. My oldest had a pack leader in cub scouts who was an atheist. My youngest had a pack leader who was more agnostic but had no real use for organized religion. Their troop now is sponsored by an Episcopal church - you know, the ones who just decided to allow gays to marry in their church. Aside from being sponsored by them though there is no religious aspect to anything they do. They focus on skills and camping and activity and helping the community.
When we first moved here I looked into several different local troops. One was very religiously oriented to the point that they expected the entire troop to go to the church that sponsored them every week. When I said that we don't do church I was looked at like I had 2 heads. Needless to say we didn't join that troop. When we went to the current troop I asked about church involvement. They said that the church across the street helps sponsor them and they do some projects t help them in exchange. I asked "So will it be a problem if we don't go to church and aren't religious?" The scoutmaster just laughed and replied "I see you checked out Troop ____ before coming here! :laugh: No, we are about helping the boys become men, teaching them to help others, teaching them skills they just won't learn in school, and letting them have fun while doing it. No one cares if you are Christian or Muslim or Buddhist or atheist here."
And the most liberal, accepting, open-minded troop could come knocking at my door trying to sell popcorn and I wouldn't purchase anything from them thanks to the organization's stance. If they don't like that, they can join another organization or stop coming around my door. I don't require their assistance with anything. Their good deeds don't shield them from the organization's failings.
My only real point was that just because the heads of the organization act a certain way that doesn't mean that the individuals or smaller units necessarily agree. I don't believe that every individual Catholic church thinks it's acceptable to cover up the priest scandals. I don't believe that every fraternity on Penn State thinks covering up those scandals is acceptable. And I don't believe that every individual troop agrees with the BSA stance against gays. I was lucky enough to find one such troop. I wish the BSA as a whole would come into the 21st century but until they do at least some individual troops are already there.0 -
That is just terrible all around.....0
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