The Sky Is Blue, No Matter How Red You Want It
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JanieJack
Posts: 3,830 Member
Got a newsletter from that Katz guy someone here told us about. His point was that a lot of people focus on what the opposite sex SHOULD be as opposed to how they ARE, and, that kind of wishing is no more useful than wishing the sky would be RED just because that’s your favorite color.
You can dream about a red sky, gripe to your BFF about the sky not being red, you can be hurt all day over the fact that the sky isn’t red but no matter what (excluding a red sunset, I suppose) the sky is gonna be blue.
I see that a lot (even in my own life, yikes). Wishing men would be this way or that way. And I listen to men wishing that women would be this way or that way. People are who they are. Take them as they are, accept that while there are always exceptions, there are some traits that go along with gender, and build your relationship on what *IS* not what *COULD BE.*
What do you think?
You can dream about a red sky, gripe to your BFF about the sky not being red, you can be hurt all day over the fact that the sky isn’t red but no matter what (excluding a red sunset, I suppose) the sky is gonna be blue.
I see that a lot (even in my own life, yikes). Wishing men would be this way or that way. And I listen to men wishing that women would be this way or that way. People are who they are. Take them as they are, accept that while there are always exceptions, there are some traits that go along with gender, and build your relationship on what *IS* not what *COULD BE.*
What do you think?
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I agree.
Have you ever read the book by Shaunti Felham (sp?) titled For Women Only? Of course, it is from a Christian perspective, but when I read it, it really did open my eyes to understanding, accepting, and appreciating the differences in men. I may need to re-read it. It's been a few years!
Honestly, do we really want men to be just like us? That was one reason I posted the thread "I LOVE when a man..." because often times we just tend to get frustrated and confused and aggravated with the opposite sex. I may not ever quite comprehend WHY this and WHY that about a man, but I can learn to appreciate the fact that we are just different, think differently, act differently, and look differently (thank the Lord).
Also, the book helped me to see what I could do to not only get along better with, but also to please my man. Ultimately, that's my goal anyway. If he is pleased, I am pleased. (not talking about being a doormat... but talking about compromise and acceptance)0 -
It's a good point. We can wish that men or women were whatever it is we personally want them to be until we're blue in the face, but it won't change the reality.
I'm not entirely sure how we go about reshaping our perspective/ideals without killing off hope though. If I accept that most men are intimidated by intelligent, competent women, for example (and in my experience this rings true for the majority), am I also bound, from a realist perspective, to accept that the chances are high that I may never meet a man who isn't, and who is also attracted and attractive to me?
Hope's kind of essential, I think, to keep us all from the abyss of despair, and my guess is that hope is where most of our unrealistic perspectives and ideals come from.0 -
I want to make the sky red. I'm thinking rockets with a ton of oxidized iron powder,0
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Have you ever read the book by Shaunti Felham (sp?) titled For Women Only?
It was one of the many books I read in an attempt to save my marriage. Unfortunately, like many Christian marriage books, this one reinforces the "just be more subservient and your man will come around" myth. Marriage fell apart, but I still highly recommend “His Needs, Her Needs,” by Dr. Harley and “Love Must Be Tough,” by Dr. Dobson- both of which share a common theme that the best relationships are built on mutual respect.
I will say that Shaunti does a good job of explaining that men and women are different and don’t try to turn your man into a girlfriend (yikes! I’ve been guilty of this). More women need to remember this- and I think we got a great reminder of how to appreciate men’s differences with your thread, so thanks for posting it!!
:flowerforyou: :flowerforyou:0 -
I am trying at this stage in my life to accept people the way that they are. Things that I used to judge or think .. really? why would they do that. It is something that I probably should have been doing all along, but I used to be very opinionated and now I just don't care that much.0
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It depends...yes there are probably traits that are somewhat gender unique as it relates to our emotional characteristics.
Should all be accepted as is?
To me no.
That doesn`t mean you hate a person but there are things that compatibility hinges on and they really are not going to be ignored over a long time.
Case in point is the pouting and then saying nothing is wrong all the while getting madder because the guy either cannot guess it or isn`t sufficiently trying to drag it out.
Not every woman does that but many confess to it too.
That would push me to the brink if a regular occurrence and no doubt my guy traits will be to a given lady.
Accepting them still doesn`t lead to a happy coexistence.
Perhaps I am getting too specific here so if so then need some clarification as to what the author is referring to.0 -
See, this is sorta what happened with me yesterday. I can wish all I want that men would value all the great things about me... that those friends who say they can't believe I'm single are right!
OR I can be honest and say I know that looks are 95% of it (as was just said in another post 5 minutes ago), especially online, and admit that I am not the right fit for online dating.
Insanity is doing the same thing over and expecting a different result. I, for one, am willing to recognize who I am and am learning that it's not a bad thing that men aren't interested... it's just reality... it sometimes sucks, but it's reality.
Face the truth of who we all are and stop stressing about wanting people to be different!0 -
Insanity is doing the same thing over and expecting a different result. I, for one, am willing to recognize who I am and am learning that it's not a bad thing that men aren't interested... it's just reality... it sometimes sucks, but it's reality.
I keep hearing that lately. That's just an Albert Einstein quote and was likely taken from a different context. If you look up "insanity" in the dictionary you won't see anything close to that. Sometimes you just have to keep trying.0 -
I will say that Shaunti does a good job of explaining that men and women are different and don’t try to turn your man into a girlfriend (yikes! I’ve been guilty of this). More women need to remember this-
That's what I took from the book. But I was single when I read it...and I think we got a great reminder of how to appreciate men’s differences with your thread, so thanks for posting it!!
:flowerforyou: :flowerforyou:
you're welcome!
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It depends...yes there are probably traits that are somewhat gender unique as it relates to our emotional characteristics.
Should all be accepted as is?
To me no.
That doesn`t mean you hate a person but there are things that compatibility hinges on and they really are not going to be ignored over a long time.
Case in point is the pouting and then saying nothing is wrong all the while getting madder because the guy either cannot guess it or isn`t sufficiently trying to drag it out.
Not every woman does that but many confess to it too.
That would push me to the brink if a regular occurrence and no doubt my guy traits will be to a given lady.
Accepting them still doesn`t lead to a happy coexistence.
Perhaps I am getting too specific here so if so then need some clarification as to what the author is referring to.
I agree, Carl, that there are certain characteristics that you may not be able to "accept". For instance, I do not want to be with a man who buries and hides his feelings all the time. My ex hated conflict and arguing so much that instead of being able to discuss problems and possible resolutions with me in a civil manner, he would sull up, pretend everything is okay, not tell me how he felt or what he wanted, go along with whatever I said, and then totally and completely resent me later. Well, how the heck did I know what to do or how to handle the situation if he didn't give me input?
So, while I can appreciate and accept the fact that most men will not be as emotional or maybe not even quite as open with their feelings as I am, I still desire to be with a man who will be open with me.
I don't think that we have to settle or just accept certain characteristics. But I do think we should learn to embrace the differences in each other. And instead of getting mad that my man can't just listen to me vent because he wants to fix every problem, maybe I can vent to my mom, if that's really all I want to do. Or if he wanted to be accepting, he could just listen and realize that I don't expect a solution from him. Compromise.0 -
Insanity is doing the same thing over and expecting a different result. I, for one, am willing to recognize who I am and am learning that it's not a bad thing that men aren't interested... it's just reality... it sometimes sucks, but it's reality.
I keep hearing that lately. That's just an Albert Einstein quote and was likely taken from a different context. If you look up "insanity" in the dictionary you won't see anything close to that. Sometimes you just have to keep trying.
I agree with Roadie. Sometimes you have to keep trying.0 -
I keep hearing that lately. That's just an Albert Einstein quote and was likely taken from a different context. If you look up "insanity" in the dictionary you won't see anything close to that. Sometimes you just have to keep trying.
:flowerforyou: Not that I'm assuming you're talking specifically to me, but I am just sharing to explain. I agree that's not what insanity means, but sometimes you need to know your limits. In my case, I hadn't gotten a message on Match in 1 month... literally! I looked and messaged men every day, so it wasn't like I was trying. That's insanity to keep going with that and feeling disappointed every day... I've worked hard to build my confidence up to where it is, but why keep beating my head...
Really, to the OP's opening post... acknowledge who people are and don't fight it, embrace it. I'm not someone men pay attention to online... I needed to let go of thinking that would change! Some of us just can't hang :sad:0 -
I keep hearing that lately. That's just an Albert Einstein quote and was likely taken from a different context. If you look up "insanity" in the dictionary you won't see anything close to that. Sometimes you just have to keep trying.
:flowerforyou: Not that I'm assuming you're talking specifically to me, but I am just sharing to explain. I agree that's not what insanity means, but sometimes you need to know your limits. In my case, I hadn't gotten a message on Match in 1 month... literally! I looked and messaged men every day, so it wasn't like I was trying. That's insanity to keep going with that and feeling disappointed every day... I've worked hard to build my confidence up to where it is, but why keep beating my head...
Really, to the OP's opening post... acknowledge who people are and don't fight it, embrace it. I'm not someone men pay attention to online... I needed to let go of thinking that would change! Some of us just can't hang :sad:
You know I have thought about this since last night and I really wish you would re up a profile and use as a description exactly who you are to the letter.
"I am tired of waiting for Mr right to find me and am sick of life as it was...living in fear of rejection.
Yes I am overweight and am working on that,would like to have a man that is with me in that mission.
Maybe this is too brassy for some but I don`t care it is who I am and proud of it!"
Include honest pictures,what you do for fun and in short don`t seem to be begging for attention but telling the right kind of guy why he wants you.
Maybe it won`t work any better but it is doing something different.
You see right here how much you impress people with what you are trying.:flowerforyou:0 -
Yeah I agree with the OP, you have to learn to make the most of what you have, and learn to accept people for who they are.
I like to compare online dating to looking for a job. I try not to take it personally if I'm not a good fit, they are just looking for something different. But there's nothing wrong with keeping your resume up and sending out applications, someday your dream job may have a vacancy and will be able to contact you.0 -
Insanity is doing the same thing over and expecting a different result. I, for one, am willing to recognize who I am and am learning that it's not a bad thing that men aren't interested... it's just reality... it sometimes sucks, but it's reality.
I keep hearing that lately. That's just an Albert Einstein quote and was likely taken from a different context. If you look up "insanity" in the dictionary you won't see anything close to that. Sometimes you just have to keep trying.
I agree with Roadie. Sometimes you have to keep trying.
It's fair if you're not into the online scene, although I do hope you reconsider at some point. But definitely keep trying SOMETHING, no matter what that route may be in real life. You are too great a catch to hide forever :flowerforyou:0 -
Case in point is the pouting and then saying nothing is wrong all the while getting madder because the guy either cannot guess it or isn`t sufficiently trying to drag it out.
Not every woman does that but many confess to it too.
That would push me to the brink if a regular occurrence and no doubt my guy traits will be to a given lady.
Accepting them still doesn`t lead to a happy coexistence.
Perhaps I am getting too specific here so if so then need some clarification as to what the author is referring to.
Actually, I think that’s a great example. If a man can’t stand pouting instead of addressing the problem, then he shouldn’t think that’s ever gonna change about her. You’re right: Accepting them doesn`t lead to a happy coexistence.
On the flip side, I hear men complain about that a lot, BUT at the same time men don’t tend toward honest women. They tend toward the pouty/say “nothing” kind of women. I think it’s because men fear conflict more than women do. I’m no expert, so I don’t really know. I just know my honest, face the problem head on kind of friends get less dates than my pouty/say “nothing” kind of friends. I could complain all day that men *say* they don’t like that kind of girl, but it’s no better than complaining that the sky isn’t red.0 -
In my case, I hadn't gotten a message on Match in 1 month... literally! I looked and messaged men every day, so it wasn't like I was trying. That's insanity to keep going with that and feeling disappointed every day... I've worked hard to build my confidence up to where it is, but why keep beating my head...
Really, to the OP's opening post... acknowledge who people are and don't fight it, embrace it. I'm not someone men pay attention to online... I needed to let go of thinking that would change! Some of us just can't hang :sad:
I really wish you would re up a profile and use as a description exactly who you are to the letter.
"I am tired of waiting for Mr right to find me and am sick of life as it was...living in fear of rejection.
Yes I am overweight and am working on that,would like to have a man that is with me in that mission.
Maybe this is too brassy for some but I don`t care it is who I am and proud of it!"
Include honest pictures,what you do for fun and in short don`t seem to be begging for attention but telling the right kind of guy why he wants you.
Maybe it won`t work any better but it is doing something different.
You see right here how much you impress people with what you are trying.:flowerforyou:
YES YES YES! And with Average for body type, lol!! And some good full body shots with you made up not hiding behind everyone. This is one of the ways lack of confidence comes out in your photos so even if you don’t feel confident, pretend you are for the photos (fake it til you make it). You look better than you think! Giiiirrrrrl if you were in Shreveport I would do up your profile for you, take the pics and even PAY the first month lol!0 -
On the flip side, I hear men complain about that a lot, BUT at the same time men don’t tend toward honest women. They tend toward the pouty/say “nothing” kind of women. I think it’s because men fear conflict more than women do. I’m no expert, so I don’t really know. I just know my honest, face the problem head on kind of friends get less dates than my pouty/say “nothing” kind of friends. I could complain all day that men *say* they don’t like that kind of girl, but it’s no better than complaining that the sky isn’t red.
JJ, so you are so right on with this!! I am by no means aggressive, by in my marriage I was a doormat and vowed to myself I was never going to be that way again. So I'm a much more assertive person now. When I see an issue, I voice my opinion on what I've seen. I am beginning to believe that while it is said that's what men want, they somehow can't connect that we aren't being overly emotional or controllilng. We see a problem, we want to address it so it doesn't happen again. How is that a bad thing?0 -
JJ, I didn't realize you were in Shreveport. You are not that far from me. I live in South Arkansas, about an hour and twenty minutes from Shreveport.
Of course, I know you're moving soon...0 -
I want to make the sky red. I'm thinking rockets with a ton of oxidized iron powder,
Do you think that would actually work?0 -
I keep hearing that lately. That's just an Albert Einstein quote and was likely taken from a different context. If you look up "insanity" in the dictionary you won't see anything close to that. Sometimes you just have to keep trying.
:flowerforyou: Not that I'm assuming you're talking specifically to me, but I am just sharing to explain. I agree that's not what insanity means, but sometimes you need to know your limits. In my case, I hadn't gotten a message on Match in 1 month... literally! I looked and messaged men every day, so it wasn't like I was trying. That's insanity to keep going with that and feeling disappointed every day... I've worked hard to build my confidence up to where it is, but why keep beating my head...
Really, to the OP's opening post... acknowledge who people are and don't fight it, embrace it. I'm not someone men pay attention to online... I needed to let go of thinking that would change! Some of us just can't hang :sad:
NC, I personally think you're adorable. I really want to see what is on your dating site profile, because I have a funny feeling that you're being a bit to a lot more self-sabotaging than you think. :flowerforyou:0 -
JJ, I didn't realize you were in Shreveport. You are not that far from me. I live in South Arkansas, about an hour and twenty minutes from Shreveport.
GIRRRRRLL!!! WE need to hang out!!!!
we can even go man-hunting together... lol... because we have such opposite looks we probably wn't be fighting over the same guy, lol!0 -
NC, I personally think you're adorable. I really want to see what is on your dating site profile, because I have a funny feeling that you're being a bit to a lot more self-sabotaging than you think. :flowerforyou:
I've seen it, and she is!! She's awesome and fun, but even in her pictures you get the same sense of "I'm not good enough" reflected in her posts here... but she IS good enough! She's absolutely delightful!!0 -
JJ, I didn't realize you were in Shreveport. You are not that far from me. I live in South Arkansas, about an hour and twenty minutes from Shreveport.
GIRRRRRLL!!! WE need to hang out!!!!
we can even go man-hunting together... lol... because we have such opposite looks we probably wn't be fighting over the same guy, lol!
Hanging out would be fun! Man-hunting would be even funner! LOL I don't know... we both like them husky men... LOL but I always defer to my friends, so I'd just be out for a good time!0 -
we can even go man-hunting together... lol... because we have such opposite looks we probably wn't be fighting over the same guy, lol!
Hanging out would be fun! Man-hunting would be even funner! LOL I don't know... we both like them husky men... LOL but I always defer to my friends, so I'd just be out for a good time!
Yeah, but the guys who are going for you miss blonde bombshell will not be after this exotic beauty so we should be able to cleanly divide the spoils. And around here, you’ll get 9 out of 10… but that’s ok, I only need 1, lol!0 -
we can even go man-hunting together... lol... because we have such opposite looks we probably wn't be fighting over the same guy, lol!
Hanging out would be fun! Man-hunting would be even funner! LOL I don't know... we both like them husky men... LOL but I always defer to my friends, so I'd just be out for a good time!
Yeah, but the guys who are going for you miss blonde bombshell will not be after this exotic beauty so we should be able to cleanly divide the spoils. And around here, you’ll get 9 out of 10… but that’s ok, I only need 1, lol!
you just made me laugh! You are so great for an ego boost! Men or no men, we need to hang out!0 -
You guys are absolutely hilarious and wonderful at the same time!
I so appreciate all the kind comments and great advice. I don't know what the future holds but do need to take a step back to re-evaluate.
I'm still not sure that online dating is for me! I realized JUST how gullible I still am by getting played right out of the gate. Online dating just caters to people looking for that. That combined with literally no messages on Match for a month, and only 4 messages after just two weeks on POF (30-35 the first two weeks, then 4-5 the last two weeks), it was apparent that it's just not right. Maybe that's right NOW but maybe it's just ever. Not sure, but at this point I've felt immeasureably better today not looking at those sites :happy:0
This discussion has been closed.