A question about clicker training.

Okapi42

So, after a lot of research, I started clicker training with Jack today. He got it amazingly quickly - he was deliberately targeting on a cone after only 4 tries! (And then dragged me clear across the barn later because he saw the cone and wanted to touch it, silly animal.)

The question is, how do you end a session positively? I was trying to get his rug back on afterward and he was *very* annoying, kept trying to bite me and snuffle in my pockets. I know you're meant to just ignore bad behaviour, but it was really excessive and I thought I'd cured him of that...

singer201

It may take a little while for him to realize the treats come only when he's been clicked, and you may have to not give any other goodies until he understands. A judicious bump on the nose with your elbow (oops, did you get your face in my way?) can discourage them from mugging you, without resorting to hitting or slapping--don't want them ducking our hands near their faces.

My girls and I use click/treat anytime we want cooperation--catching and haltering, blankets on and off (especially if doing a closed-front blanket over the head), standing at the mounting block, and, of course, for tricks (one bows, one smiles, one "ducks under the rope", they all give hugs).

You will LOVE having a clicker-trained horse; it makes learning happen faster and is much more fun for the horse.

Okapi42

Thanks. I never feed him out of hand normally (even now, I'm using a bowl, because he tends to be overly greedy), but he seems to think it'll be all treats all the time now!

Think I might go to trying this at liberty in the big paddock, rather than his stall. That way, if he barges, I can still send him away, like we've been doing in groundwork. It was too rainy for that today.

BellehavenfarmDawn

I am from the Alex Kurland School.

don't you love how quickly horses get it! they love working in clicker!

It is good if you can do your target work with Jack in the stall. Initially I have say 20 treats then do something which signals, the end. I give my horse a little jack pot, then wipe my hands together, like no more. Then walk away. think over what you are doing right and what wrong., load up, and target again. He will learn the all done cue. It takes a while, but you are right. Just ignore in the beginning.

You can see why we also teach foundation lesson 2, very soon, "Quiet why the grown ups are talking!" If you are following Alex Kurland. He will learn that in stage one, head forward or away from you gets the click. while you wait, hands are laid one over top of the other on your stomach. Over time he will learn this is the cue for Quiet. If you take your time on this lesson, until over time his head is where you want it.....straight a head or down or arched in the Pose always with ears forward (happy face), he will be rock solid on Quiet. And rock solid on not going shopping on his new vending machine!!!

and by the way you can change head position over time. I began with head down, to calm my TB. then I switched to The Pose which he loves and offers off cue! LOL I know that isn't a good thing. I don't treat but I give him a little scratch.

Hope this helps. a good contact and teacher online is Katie Bartlett, just google her if interested. she is a friend so feel free to mention my name. Her site is loaded with great articles.

BellehavenfarmDawn

Fixing the Gobbler...this is pretty easy but do it consistently. I get a treat, offer in the horses space, getting him to back. If he gobbles at my hand, I quickly flip my hand over, wait for him to back off. Keep the treat covered but turn my hand up. If I get nice lips, Click, I open my hand. I did this with a a horse at the barn and it only took a few tries. click nice lips.

I might be concerned about Sending Away. It feels not positive to me. clicker training generally stays away from anything that is negative as it "poisons the cue". Just keep things very simple and straight forward as you get your timing and food mechanics excellent. Horses can get frustrated early on. Find a nice rhythm.

I love using the stall because the horse backs up, comes forward over and over. Cha cha gets them very light but I know not every one does it. and it sets up for pick up the cone, hand me the cone.

but again, just putting it out there. I have fully trained one horse and played with a bunch of others so definitely not an expert just an avid student! Have fun and give Jack a big hug for me!

diazwoman

loved finding this discussion I just purchased clickers and a book to begin working with my horses.

Okapi42

Thanks, Dawn - I'll definitely keep that in mind. Alex Kurlands' is also the book I'm using. I was amazed how quickly Jack got it. But it's the same as with ground work - he's happy and cooperative during the "lesson", then tries to run all over me again afterward anyway. Still working on that.

"Sending away" isn't necessarily a bad thing for Jack. At the moment, he's in his stall a lot, fields are too wet for turn-out. So I bring him out and if he isn't cooperating, he's grateful to be sent off for a chance to get the bucks out. All I do is make him keep running just that little longer than he'd like. (Same with hacking. We have an agreement. He gets to trot anytime he wants when we're out alone, but has to do 10 paces more than he offers.)

Quiet sounds like a very useful lesson, will try working on that next.

Okapi42

Hmmm, today's session didn't go so well. It might be because there were too many distractions, but he wasn't paying attention and the mugging for food has gotten much worse - he was actually grabbing my jacket and scarf with his teeth!

BellehavenfarmDawn

Maybe you can set up some non stall situation where he can't get to you? And begin teaching Grown Ups. A nd with each treat. turn your fist over, aim it towards his chest and ask for a few steps back, reward in his space. (Don't push him, just push the energy...he will get vey light.) It takes a bit of repetition, but he will learn that mugging never gets rewarded.

If Sunny tries anything I do Tai Chi rope, Hold lead with hand close to horse, run outside hand up rope with a straightened elbow. It is in book. And in that case, I don't c/t....Just a nice way to say, here is your area.

Also you might use less exciting treats as it sounds like Jack likes to eat!

The foundation lessons are critical. Might be worth getting her DVD. If you want me to do a little one on target and GrownUps, I can grab our pushiest horse! let me know. There is someone at the barn who will help as she wants to learn about it too.

Have fun.

Dawn

Okapi42

Oh, he looooves his food. That's the problem. I hadn't fed him out of hand for three months just to avoid that. And I had him backing up, moving over, following, etc. reliably at liberty. Now he ignores me, tries to run over the top of me and demands food. Wish I'd never started this stupid clicker thing. Maybe it's something I'm doing wrong, but I just don't think it's the method for me!

I was trying to teach him to turn his head aside before he gets food on Friday. He seemed to get the idea that it's one way of getting food, but prefers the "easy" method of just biting.