Celebrating Mediocrity in Children
Options
Replies
-
This is a very interesting and worthwhile topic, Turtlehurtle. Congratulations on starting it. I'm proud of you!
I will enjoy the debate, no matter the outcome.0 -
No. Even my 5 year old knows better. He knows when he loses and it never feels good. Even if I tell him he did his best, he pouts back that his best didn't win. I like the fact that he hates losing, so I don't celebrate it or make it go away with a trophy or prize. I'm enjoying this test of fatherhood. My 7 year old, more competitive. I'm trying to teach this one not to brag so much. Awesome time.0
-
If we are talking about recreational sports for children, I am all for encouraging them. Not focussing so much on the competitive aspect, but more on the social aspects.
There's time enough to teach them about winning and losing as they get older.
I taught my children to give it their best shot and be proud when they did. Winning does not always have to be the goal.
I still play in a competitive indoor soccer league. Doing my best and still losing makes me feel better than winning when I didn't play well.
Over the years and countless softball, soccer, basketball and volleyball games that I have ferried kids to, I have found that the worst thing about children's sports are the parents.0 -
The way things are now, at least 80% of the population will have ample opportunity to learn what it feels like to get screwed over in life. I'm not going to begrudge some 8 year old a f*cking participation award.
As others have said, most kids are smart enough to make the distinction themselves. It's a self-delusion to think we are teaching them anything about this subject.0 -
My daughter's gifted in lots of areas - consequently, she's actually quite poor at sticking with the things that she's less brilliant at.
I don't think encouraging her to stick with these things is 'celebrating mediocrity'. It's encouraging her to engage in hard work, and to enjoy doing the best she can.
Some children will never excel at anything, they're always going to be middle of the road. There's a reason that average is average, after all! it's a good lesson to learn that there's pleasure in being ok at something. Nothing wrong with that0 -
I think there's a big difference between the 'prizes for all' mentality that is currently pervasive, and genuinely encouraging and praising individual achievement, even if it is at a less-than-stellar level. I believe it's very important to praise children (and adults!) who have tried their hardest, worked their behinds off, or struggled to overcome difficulties when they achieve their goal, even if that goal seems mediocre from an outside perspective. That doesn't necessarily mean rewarding them in the same way as the person who ran the fastest, figured out nuclear fission or won the competition, but acknowledging the achievement is fairly essential to building confidence and a willingness to keep trying.
Beyond the age of 6 or 7, the idea that "all must have prizes" does an immense disservice to kids and the community as a whole in the future, as well as underestimating, as others have said, kids' b.s. meter. Of course children know that someone won and someone else didn't. To pretend otherwise is an insult to their intelligence and to their efforts. Learning to handle that emotionally, and picking yourself up to start again and change your approach or try harder next time is a fundamental part of growing up.
By the way, meerkat - keep on encouraging your daughter to persevere with the things that don't come easily, and praise her when she achieves things that are more difficult for her. I was/still am less good at sticking with things that weren't 'natural' to me, and there are a good handful of things I rather wish I had stuck with! I sometimes think it's even more frustrating for the very bright when something doesn't immediately 'click' than it is for the less-intellectually-gifted, because the very bright are used to effortless comprehension. Learning to work for something can be quite hard when many things require little or no effort - I speak from experience, and wish I had learned sooner.
Back to our debate topic, learning to work for something can be hard, or seem pointless, when all are rewarded for simply participating. No-one wants (or needs) a room full of sobbing 3,4 or 5 year olds who have 'lost', but I don't think it's productive for a room full of 8, 10, 14 year olds to hear that all of them have 'won', when they know perfectly well that they haven't.0 -
In the 90s I got a trophy for every team I played in till the age of 11. I threw them all out but still have the trophies that I earned.
I coach age groups of under 10. I can find a positive for all these kids. I've got one kid that is slow as heck. To the point I have to tell him to remember to run really fast or he'll literally saddle to first base. Bt I'll celebrate his achievements when he gets there. By the end of the season I didn't need to tell him.
Or the boy who hit the ball, ran to the ball and picked it up, threw it to first and still got safe. Should I have told him he was doing it wrong? (well it was hard because all the parents, coaches and umpires were laughing too hard to do anything)0 -
I try really hard to base my praise off the 'effort' v the 'results'. If I know that hard work was put into something I will applaud it, point out what did work so we can talk about what didn't work and what could be better next time. Sometimes it is exhausting because you actually have to pay attention! If a kid just gets lucky then I call it 'lucky', not a 'good job.'
You know what I HATE? When people randomly write WTG in the comment of my food journal. I can come in with some crazy numbers at the end of the day and some *kitten* will say WTG for no reason.0 -
The way things are now, at least 80% of the population will have ample opportunity to learn what it feels like to get screwed over in life. I'm not going to begrudge some 8 year old a f*cking participation award.
As others have said, most kids are smart enough to make the distinction themselves. It's a self-delusion to think we are teaching them anything about this subject.
I kindof agree. I think my son was born competitive. He has wanted to 'win' at everything he does since he was 2 years old. I am the least competitive person on earth, sooo.
Is it possible though that participation awards are robbing the kids of an opportunity to learn coping skills while the stakes are low? I think yes.0 -
The way things are now, at least 80% of the population will have ample opportunity to learn what it feels like to get screwed over in life. I'm not going to begrudge some 8 year old a f*cking participation award.
As others have said, most kids are smart enough to make the distinction themselves. It's a self-delusion to think we are teaching them anything about this subject.
I kindof agree. I think my son was born competitive. He has wanted to 'win' at everything he does since he was 2 years old. I am the least competitive person on earth, sooo.
Is it possible though that participation awards are robbing the kids of an opportunity to learn coping skills while the stakes are low? I think yes.
I don't mind participation awards, on principle, as long as that's what they are, and that is made clear. It's when that mutates into the 'there are no winners and losers/everyone 'won'" approach that I think it becomes more a hidrance than a help after a certain age.0 -
The way things are now, at least 80% of the population will have ample opportunity to learn what it feels like to get screwed over in life. I'm not going to begrudge some 8 year old a f*cking participation award.
As others have said, most kids are smart enough to make the distinction themselves. It's a self-delusion to think we are teaching them anything about this subject.
Agree. One persons mediocrity is another's success. Like running a race and coming in last - if you're a person who's never run a race before - isn't it still successful you've accomplished something you never have before? You know you were last... but it's still better than sitting on your @$$ watching.0 -
If we are talking about recreational sports for children, I am all for encouraging them. Not focussing so much on the competitive aspect, but more on the social aspects.
This. My brothers, sister, and I were all involved in sports as kids, and we were encouraged to learn teamwork skills not so much win win win. It was a great experience for all of us.
Plus, watching my little brother play teeball at 4 years old was highly amusing!0 -
"If you're not 1st, you're last".0
-
"If you're not 1st, you're last".
I wanna go FAST!0 -
"If you're not 1st, you're last".I wanna go FAST!
"Oh hell, Son, I was high that day. That doesn't make any sense at all, you can be second, third, fourth... hell you can even be fifth".0 -
"If you're not 1st, you're last".I wanna go FAST!
"Oh hell, Son, I was high that day. That doesn't make any sense at all, you can be second, third, fourth... hell you can even be fifth".
"You don't understand. You don't understand because you don't understand liberty. You don't understand freedom. So you put a crack in my arm like the crack in the Liberty Bell! You hear me?"0 -
We celebrate success at the level it deserves. If one of the kids accomplishes something that is difficult for their skill level, or is something totally new to them, even if it isn't perfection by someone else's standards, yes, it is still acknowledged. If they half *kitten* something but it is at a level that someone outside may say is an incredible feat, no, that isn't celebrated, we talk about what they were capable of doing but didn't. So, depending on the situation, in someone else's eyes, yes and no.
^^THIS
I am blessed to be a part-time parent to a great step-son. Smart as a whip at 4 yrs old. We praise him when he does something new or hard for him but honestly once he has pooped on his own a few times it becomes part of his 'normal tasks'. We don't believe in rewarding him for things he should be doing normally and we're not going to tell him good job when it wasn't.I think there's a big difference between the 'prizes for all' mentality that is currently pervasive, and genuinely encouraging and praising individual achievement, even if it is at a less-than-stellar level. I believe it's very important to praise children (and adults!) who have tried their hardest, worked their behinds off, or struggled to overcome difficulties when they achieve their goal, even if that goal seems mediocre from an outside perspective. That doesn't necessarily mean rewarding them in the same way as the person who ran the fastest, figured out nuclear fission or won the competition, but acknowledging the achievement is fairly essential to building confidence and a willingness to keep trying.
Beyond the age of 6 or 7, the idea that "all must have prizes" does an immense disservice to kids and the community as a whole in the future, as well as underestimating, as others have said, kids' b.s. meter. Of course children know that someone won and someone else didn't. To pretend otherwise is an insult to their intelligence and to their efforts. Learning to handle that emotionally, and picking yourself up to start again and change your approach or try harder next time is a fundamental part of growing up.
Back to our debate topic, learning to work for something can be hard, or seem pointless, when all are rewarded for simply participating. No-one wants (or needs) a room full of sobbing 3,4 or 5 year olds who have 'lost', but I don't think it's productive for a room full of 8, 10, 14 year olds to hear that all of them have 'won', when they know perfectly well that they haven't.
I agree with this but I also think kids need to know how to handle losing. I will not tolerate kids who say they won when they didn't (seems to be a phase they go thru where everything is a competition and they always want to win and whine when they don't) We teach ours that you are not always going to win and that's life. It's not something to cry over or get upset about and none likes a whiner! :PYou know what I HATE? When people randomly write WTG in the comment of my food journal. I can come in with some crazy numbers at the end of the day and some *kitten* will say WTG for no reason.
Me too..at least read the darn thing..and that being said IF someone read it they wouldn't be writing WTG when the log shows something obviously wrong... that's such a HUGE peeve for me. I just don't say anything, I won't encourage people's crappy habits.0 -
I agree with this but I also think kids need to know how to handle losing.
Oh, absolutely! That's one of the reasons I think the current mentality of 'everyone won' is not a helpful one, at the end of the day. There are ways and ways of handling it, and I don't think it's particularly productive to be too harsh about it when kids are under 5 or 6 - hence my comments about no-one wanting a room of sobbing preschoolers - but from that age, or possibly a little earlier, depending on the child, I think it's very important to explain that no-one always wins, and that there are good and bad ways to handle defeat.0 -
I think our society is ultraviolent, competitive, and ruthless and that those are the traits that will eventually destroy our species. Therefore, yes, I will celebrate last place with a child (we're talking about a child here, for crying out loud!) with the same enthusiasm as if the child finished first.
That doesn't mean I let kids slack off. I teach my child to play chess (something I've done since he was 5 or 6). I don't let him win. That way, when he does win a game, it's because he learned well and then outplayed me.0 -
I think our society is ultraviolent, competitive, and ruthless and that those are the traits that will eventually destroy our species. Therefore, yes, I will celebrate last place with a child (we're talking about a child here, for crying out loud!) with the same enthusiasm as if the child finished first.
That doesn't mean I let kids slack off. I teach my child to play chess (something I've done since he was 5 or 6). I don't let him win. That way, when he does win a game, it's because he learned well and then outplayed me.
To me there is a difference between celebrating a last place finish when the child is just learning to do something vs celebrating last place after the child has been doing it for a while. I will absolutely cheer if its the first time (few times) or if the child is simply not capable of doing any better due to a physical condition or something but coming in last every single time without any improvement is not cause for celebration. To me it says 'lazy and not willing to work harder to get better'
There have been many studies published that say that a child's personality is fully developed at a very early age - 6 or 7. By then all the experiences that they have had in their early years are ingrained and all the issues with them. In my beliefs, a child that has not been encouraged to improve as they are growing up will be missing that skill later in life. Children that think that just showing up will guarantee them a prize (job, money, position) are going to be in for a rude awakening as they get older. I'd rather not encourage that way of thinking at all.0
