been debating changing routine - would like advice
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ndj1979
Posts: 29,136 Member
1) What's your current intake of calories, on average? This is TOTAL CALORIES EATEN so this would include anything you eat for exercise calories. In other words, how much are you eating?
typically eating within +/- 2300 calories per day.
2) What's your current average intake of protein, carbs, and fats, in grams?
protein - 190-200 grams per day. carbs - 125 grams per day; fats 90-100 grams per day.
3) Do you use a food scale and measure everything?
Most of the time yes...unless I am out to dinner or something, in those instances go with guestimate but still log what is eaten.
4) Do you track all of your intake, daily? (Everything?) - Yes
5) Do you take cheat days or days off? Sometimes but really not that much. Maybe once a month...
6) How much weight have you lost so far? Past three months I have maintained at around 170 to 175 but body fat has gone from about 16% to 13%...my goal now is to get to 10% body fat...
7) What is your activity like, both exercise and non-exercise? (big difference between a construction worker and a desk job) and did you change that activity withing the last couple of months. If so, what changed.
Currently work out five times a week Mon through Friday. Sometimes also get in a light run on Saturdays or just take Saturday and Sunday off...almost always take Sundays off...a brothers gotta rest right?
I work in an office job that has me sitting behind desk a lot - email, phone calls etc...Try to get up and move around every couple hours but that is short walks around building ..My office is upstairs so if I do walk up and down stairs quite a bit...
8) How long have you eaten at your previous amount and what happened in that time frame?
I have been eating at about 2300 calories for the past month or so. My weight has gone up from 170 to 174 but I have a feeling that is water retention as I have increased deadlift from 150 (three months ago) to 300..have also increased squat, bench press, etc.
9) What's your height, current weight and if you know it, bodyfat%?
5-10, 174, 13% body fat...as estimated on body fat estimation thread
10) If you're stalled, for how long and is it a complete stall (zero change in weight)?
I do not f eel like I have stalled, per say. I have gotten my body fat down to 13% and would like to get it down to 10%.
My current work out routine is this..
Monday - chest and arms typically consist of barbell bench press, incline dumbbell press, decline dumbbell press, weighted chin ups + 30#...
Tuesday - back/tris - weighted pull up + 25#, bent over rows, iso lateral row, low row, lat pulldown, tricep pulldown, overhead tricep extension...
Wens - Legs - barbell squat, sumo deadlift, calf raises, lunges, barbell split squat
thurs - shoulders - seated military press dumbbells, dumbbell shoulder shrug, barbell shoulder press, cable sword draw, 15 minutes plyo/abs ..
friday - total body - deadlift, front squat, clean and press...
been debating going to three day a week workout with monday being chest/arms/back; tues - light HIIT; wens legs; thursday rest; friday total body + shoulder work...was thinking of eating up to maintenance on heavy days (MWF) off days eat in about 25% deficit..
Oh I also do IF lean gains 18/6...was thinking if I changed routine i would eat regularly on heavy days and then do IF on non heavy days...
Really just curious to see if current regimen is sound to get me to 10% body fat or if the adjustment would do better to get me there..or any advice in between to get to 10% BF....
thanks in advance...
I will go make my diary public...
Please disregard this past weekend as I was in New Orleans for the super bowl..talk about a blowout! LOL
typically eating within +/- 2300 calories per day.
2) What's your current average intake of protein, carbs, and fats, in grams?
protein - 190-200 grams per day. carbs - 125 grams per day; fats 90-100 grams per day.
3) Do you use a food scale and measure everything?
Most of the time yes...unless I am out to dinner or something, in those instances go with guestimate but still log what is eaten.
4) Do you track all of your intake, daily? (Everything?) - Yes
5) Do you take cheat days or days off? Sometimes but really not that much. Maybe once a month...
6) How much weight have you lost so far? Past three months I have maintained at around 170 to 175 but body fat has gone from about 16% to 13%...my goal now is to get to 10% body fat...
7) What is your activity like, both exercise and non-exercise? (big difference between a construction worker and a desk job) and did you change that activity withing the last couple of months. If so, what changed.
Currently work out five times a week Mon through Friday. Sometimes also get in a light run on Saturdays or just take Saturday and Sunday off...almost always take Sundays off...a brothers gotta rest right?
I work in an office job that has me sitting behind desk a lot - email, phone calls etc...Try to get up and move around every couple hours but that is short walks around building ..My office is upstairs so if I do walk up and down stairs quite a bit...8) How long have you eaten at your previous amount and what happened in that time frame?
I have been eating at about 2300 calories for the past month or so. My weight has gone up from 170 to 174 but I have a feeling that is water retention as I have increased deadlift from 150 (three months ago) to 300..have also increased squat, bench press, etc.
9) What's your height, current weight and if you know it, bodyfat%?
5-10, 174, 13% body fat...as estimated on body fat estimation thread
10) If you're stalled, for how long and is it a complete stall (zero change in weight)?
I do not f eel like I have stalled, per say. I have gotten my body fat down to 13% and would like to get it down to 10%.
My current work out routine is this..
Monday - chest and arms typically consist of barbell bench press, incline dumbbell press, decline dumbbell press, weighted chin ups + 30#...
Tuesday - back/tris - weighted pull up + 25#, bent over rows, iso lateral row, low row, lat pulldown, tricep pulldown, overhead tricep extension...
Wens - Legs - barbell squat, sumo deadlift, calf raises, lunges, barbell split squat
thurs - shoulders - seated military press dumbbells, dumbbell shoulder shrug, barbell shoulder press, cable sword draw, 15 minutes plyo/abs ..
friday - total body - deadlift, front squat, clean and press...
been debating going to three day a week workout with monday being chest/arms/back; tues - light HIIT; wens legs; thursday rest; friday total body + shoulder work...was thinking of eating up to maintenance on heavy days (MWF) off days eat in about 25% deficit..
Oh I also do IF lean gains 18/6...was thinking if I changed routine i would eat regularly on heavy days and then do IF on non heavy days...
Really just curious to see if current regimen is sound to get me to 10% body fat or if the adjustment would do better to get me there..or any advice in between to get to 10% BF....
thanks in advance...
I will go make my diary public...
Please disregard this past weekend as I was in New Orleans for the super bowl..talk about a blowout! LOL
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Replies
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Just tagging so I do not 'lose it'. Myself or SideSteel will get back to you.0
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ok cool..thanks!0
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Where's the cardio in your routine? That would really shake things up. Take a spin class, do the Insanity DVD program. Your body should respond well to the confusion and change.0
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Where's the cardio in your routine? That would really shake things up. Take a spin class, do the Insanity DVD program. Your body should respond well to the confusion and change.
sorry but there is no such this as muscle/body confusion, just energy expended, weight lifted etcOh I also do IF lean gains 18/6...was thinking if I changed routine i would eat regularly on heavy days and then do IF on non heavy days...
I can't see what benefit that would offer really.
Sounds like you are doing a pretty decent job of recomping currently, it;s going to take longer to go from 13-10% than it did from 16-13%. Perhaps a slight tweak to your current routine would be better than starting from scratch, say 100 less calories a day or 200-300 calories worth of cardio twice a week for example.
With that new routine your are changing both your calorie expenditure and intake all at once, so the results are not really predictable.0 -
Will get back to you about intake, but I actually think trying to do an on/off IF is probably not a good idea. Your appetite needs to get into the habit of not eating breakfast. If you go back and forth, IF days will probably be harder on your hunger. There also is no real physiological benefit. When in the day do you workout?0
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Where's the cardio in your routine? That would really shake things up. Take a spin class, do the Insanity DVD program. Your body should respond well to the confusion and change.
You do not need cardio if you can maintain a deficit without it. He did mention he goes for a run also.0 -
With regard to your current routine, my concern would be you are actually hitting some muscle groups on back to back days. The chest/arms day has overlap with back/tri day as does shoulder day and the full body. Some overlap is inevitable when you do a 4 day split though. Could you workout on a Saturday?0
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To the cardio comment - three months ago I was doing WAY more cardio...six miles runs, HIIT, plyo etc, and I realized that I was losing muscle mass. So I totally backed off the cardio and went to my current regimen. I still do some HIIT or a run on Saturday or Sunday, but some weeks I do not do any cardio...
Sara - I pretty much always work out in the afternoon about 4:30 or 5 depending on how the work day goes...Yes, I could work out on Saturday..I belong to anytime fitness, hence I can get in there anytime
With regard to on again off again IF it was just a thought I had, but your response makes sense. I have been doing IF for three moths now so I am pretty used to skipping breakfast...0 -
We are (hopefully) getting caught up here so sorry for the delay.
Intake:
We would suggest that you cut to 2.000 calories (no eating your exercise calories back). For gym performance, you may want to have higher calories on lifting days and therefore lower on non lift days so you end up with the same average over the week, just spread differently - it really depends on how you gym performance is impacted by the calorie level (you had mentioned you were considering it). You may also want to play around with intra-day macro timing for gym performance - higher carbs before you workout.
Macros would be:
Protein: 150g - 30%
Fats: 60g - 30% (rounded up to nearest 5%)
The balance, where you like, but I would suggest most of it go to carbs.
If you did calorie cycle, keep protein and fats static and use the carbs as the variable.
Try to keep NEAT (non-exercise activity) up as much as possible.
Training:
We think it a good idea to cut back your lifting to 4 days a week. A 2 day split twice a week makes most sense at this stage - you can either do upper/lower or push/pull splits. So if you did upper/lower you would so, for example:
M: Upper
T: Lower
W: Active rest (low intensity cardio/walking)
Th: Upper
F: Lower
S/S: rest/cardio/HIIT - whichever you prefer
The individual lifts you are doing look fine.
We would like you to get back to us in a week or two to see how this appears to be doing - however, get back to us earlier if you start feeling crappy or your gym performance is suffering.
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thanks Sarah!
so with the upper/lower split would look something like this..
mon - chest/armts/tris
tues - barbell squats, sumo deadlift, lunges, calf raises
wens - HIIT
thurs - pull ups/over head press/dumbbell shrug/bent over row/etc
friday - deadlifts/front squat/clean and press - is this really considering lower or should I maybe do leg extensions or something else...?
Also, someone had mentioned to me that I may want to do a re-feed on rest days and eat up to 2800 calories and then during rest of week be at 2000 calories - what are your thoughts on this?0 -
oh one last thing -- do you think I should stick with IF/lean gains..? I read somewhere that eating high protein meal about every four hours is superior for muscle growth....
I do not have an issue with skipping breakfast...but it would not bother to me go back to having like 250 cals for breakfast 400 or so for lunch and then fill in rest post workout..or something like that...just curious...0 -
thanks Sarah!
so with the upper/lower split would look something like this..
mon - chest/armts/tris
tues - barbell squats, sumo deadlift, lunges, calf raises
wens - HIIT
thurs - pull ups/over head press/dumbbell shrug/bent over row/etc
friday - deadlifts/front squat/clean and press - is this really considering lower or should I maybe do leg extensions or something else...?
Also, someone had mentioned to me that I may want to do a re-feed on rest days and eat up to 2800 calories and then during rest of week be at 2000 calories - what are your thoughts on this?
Regarding the upper/lower, the idea is that you do less volume compared to a bodypart split but you are doing more frequency to compensate. So for each upper day you would ideally hit everything.
Example from a starting strength template:
Upper - Monday (heavy)
Bench Press - 3x5
Barbell row - 4x5
Standing push Press - 3x8
T-Bar Row 4x8
arms
Lower - Tuesday (light)
Squats - 2x10
SLDL - 3x10
leg extensions/curls - 2x15
calves
Upper - Thursday (light)
Incline DB press 2x10
BTN Pullups - 3x10
Seated DB press - 2x10
Chinups - 3x10
arms
Lower - Friday (Heavy)
Deadlifts - 3x3
Front squats 4x5
calves
This is just one example to give you an idea. Note that on both upper days you're pressing and pulling.
Regarding refeeds, I wouldn't eat at maintenance on every rest day and in a deficit on all training days. I would recommend you just eat at a steady deficit as Sara outlined and if you'd like, start with 1 maintenance/refeed day where you leave P/F the same and crank up the carbs to reach maintenance or a small surplus.0 -
oh one last thing -- do you think I should stick with IF/lean gains..? I read somewhere that eating high protein meal about every four hours is superior for muscle growth....
I do not have an issue with skipping breakfast...but it would not bother to me go back to having like 250 cals for breakfast 400 or so for lunch and then fill in rest post workout..or something like that...just curious...
I think your decisions about meal timing should strictly revolve around preferential and performance based metrics.0 -
thanks Sarah!
so with the upper/lower split would look something like this..
mon - chest/armts/tris
tues - barbell squats, sumo deadlift, lunges, calf raises
wens - HIIT
thurs - pull ups/over head press/dumbbell shrug/bent over row/etc
friday - deadlifts/front squat/clean and press - is this really considering lower or should I maybe do leg extensions or something else...?
Also, someone had mentioned to me that I may want to do a re-feed on rest days and eat up to 2800 calories and then during rest of week be at 2000 calories - what are your thoughts on this?
Regarding the upper/lower, the idea is that you do less volume compared to a bodypart split but you are doing more frequency to compensate. So for each upper day you would ideally hit everything.
Example from a starting strength template:
Upper - Monday (heavy)
Bench Press - 3x5
Barbell row - 4x5
Standing push Press - 3x8
T-Bar Row 4x8
arms
Lower - Tuesday (light)
Squats - 2x10
SLDL - 3x10
leg extensions/curls - 2x15
calves
Upper - Thursday (light)
Incline DB press 2x10
BTN Pullups - 3x10
Seated DB press - 2x10
Chinups - 3x10
arms
Lower - Friday (Heavy)
Deadlifts - 3x3
Front squats 4x5
calves
This is just one example to give you an idea. Note that on both upper days you're pressing and pulling.
Regarding refeeds, I wouldn't eat at maintenance on every rest day and in a deficit on all training days. I would recommend you just eat at a steady deficit as Sara outlined and if you'd like, start with 1 maintenance/refeed day where you leave P/F the same and crank up the carbs to reach maintenance or a small surplus.
thanks sidesteel this makes sense to me...I will adjust my diary to 2000 cals and adjust work out regimen starting this Monday and let you all know how it goes...0 -
thanks Sarah!
so with the upper/lower split would look something like this..
mon - chest/armts/tris
tues - barbell squats, sumo deadlift, lunges, calf raises
wens - HIIT
thurs - pull ups/over head press/dumbbell shrug/bent over row/etc
friday - deadlifts/front squat/clean and press - is this really considering lower or should I maybe do leg extensions or something else...?
Also, someone had mentioned to me that I may want to do a re-feed on rest days and eat up to 2800 calories and then during rest of week be at 2000 calories - what are your thoughts on this?
Regarding the upper/lower, the idea is that you do less volume compared to a bodypart split but you are doing more frequency to compensate. So for each upper day you would ideally hit everything.
Example from a starting strength template:
Upper - Monday (heavy)
Bench Press - 3x5
Barbell row - 4x5
Standing push Press - 3x8
T-Bar Row 4x8
arms
Lower - Tuesday (light)
Squats - 2x10
SLDL - 3x10
leg extensions/curls - 2x15
calves
Upper - Thursday (light)
Incline DB press 2x10
BTN Pullups - 3x10
Seated DB press - 2x10
Chinups - 3x10
arms
Lower - Friday (Heavy)
Deadlifts - 3x3
Front squats 4x5
calves
This is just one example to give you an idea. Note that on both upper days you're pressing and pulling.
Regarding refeeds, I wouldn't eat at maintenance on every rest day and in a deficit on all training days. I would recommend you just eat at a steady deficit as Sara outlined and if you'd like, start with 1 maintenance/refeed day where you leave P/F the same and crank up the carbs to reach maintenance or a small surplus.
thanks sidesteel this makes sense to me...I will adjust my diary to 2000 cals and adjust work out regimen starting this Monday and let you all know how it goes...
Keep us posted via PM. We normally request about every 4 weeks but I'd actually like to hear how this goes in the next 3-5 days just in terms of how you feel on this intake.0 -
10-4 will do!0
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hey guys, just thought I would check in at end of week 1 and let you know how it is going.
The new calorie plan of 2000 a day has not really bothered me. I was doing around 2000 a day about four months ago and had made the bump to 2320 maybe two months ago...The one problem I have been having is hitting 200 carbs a day. I like carbs I just really do not eat a lot of them...I think I have been hitting between 115 to 170 a day ..probably averaging 140 a day...
I went with the upper/lower split. workouts over first week were following.
Mon - barbell bench press 175# 6,6,6/180# 4/ dumbbell incline press 70# 6,6,5/over head press 45# 6,6,6/50# 4/ low row 180# 6,6,6,6/lat pulldown 160# 6,6/180# 4,4/ chin + 30# 7, 7, 6/35# 5,5,4/hammer curl 40# 5,5,4
tues - barbell squat 205# 6,6,6,5/220# 2/ sumo DL 275# 3/295# 3/305# 2,2/ calf extension machine 230# 8/270# 8/310# 6,6/dumbbell lunge 60# 5,4,4,,4
wens - rest (five minutes treadmill walking/slow jog and 15 minutes abs)
thurs - dumbbell decline 55# 8,8/60# 7,7/ dumbbell fly 45# 8,8/50# 6,6/ seated dumbbell military press 60# 6,4,5/dumbbell lateral raise 35# 6,6,6,6/ pull + 25# 7,7,6,5/dumbbell bent over row 65# 7,7,7,6/ tricep pull down 7,5,5
friday - deadlift 265# 6/275# 4/295# 3,3/305# 2/315# 2 / front squat 135# 5,4/145# 2,2/ leg extension 170# 8/210#6,6/230# 4/ leg curl 140# 4,4,4,4,3
Saturday - HIIT 7 sprints 30 second work 45 second rest
Looking back - on thursday I probably should of just done dumbbell declines and ditched the flys...i really wanted to do pulls first on Wens but pull up station was taken over so went with chest work first...
anything else you all notice that I might want to tweak feel free to let me know....
I lik the new routine....I really don't like resting on wens would rather be cranking something out, but I get the rest concept..0 -
As long as your gym performance is going well and you have no issues with energy, I would not worry about hitting your carbs.
Your routine looks good to me - nothing jumps out at me as missing or overkill.
And thanks for the update.0
