Dead lifts
mmddwechanged
Posts: 1,687 Member
How are wide legged deadlifts different than regular deadlifts? Is it merely that it challenges the muscle from a different angle, or is it easier to lift heavier with one of the two exercises?
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Sumo deadllifts (wide stance) involve a little more quads and adductors, bit less lower back as you are more upright. Conventional is mostly glutes, hams and lower back.
You might find one easier than the other depending on your structure, limb length etc.0 -
Sumo deadllifts (wide stance) involve a little more quads and adductors, bit less lower back as you are more upright. Conventional is mostly glutes, hams and lower back.
You might find one easier than the other depending on your structure, limb length etc.
This.
Try both, see what works for you and your goals.
I pull conventional for my heavy stuff, but I'll occasionally do some sumo work just to strengthen my hips.0 -
I do not do sumo much (I do them for assistance work) but woman are generally more suited to sumo due to the physiology of our hips and our musculature.0
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So, I'm hijacking this thread rather than starting a new dead lift thread. (hope that is ok)
I'm following NROLFW and in the next stage I'm supposed to do dead lifts from a box for a greater range of motion, but I find my back rounds out with the bar that low and I know that is bad. Someone suggested I decrease weight but that seems counterintuitive to me. I think it is a flexibility issue (my hips), which I'm working on with stretches, but it may take a while. What are your thoughts?
Thanks0 -
So, I'm hijacking this thread rather than starting a new dead lift thread. (hope that is ok)
I'm following NROLFW and in the next stage I'm supposed to do dead lifts from a box for a greater range of motion, but I find my back rounds out with the bar that low and I know that is bad. Someone suggested I decrease weight but that seems counterintuitive to me. I think it is a flexibility issue (my hips), which I'm working on with stretches, but it may take a while. What are your thoughts?
Thanks
are you using a standard 45lb olympic plate or something smaller?0 -
I'm using a 45lb bar with 4 10lb plates (once I can get to 25's I should have the bar at the correct height for a normal dead lift so right now I use something to prop the bar up a little)0
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I'm using a 45lb bar with 4 10lb plates (once I can get to 25's I should have the bar at the correct height for a normal dead lift so right now I use something to prop the bar up a little)
So are you putting the bar on the floor AND standing on a box, because the bar is already at a deficit without the box?0 -
Right now, I'm on the floor and I have the bar propped up to bring it to the correct height for a normal DL.
Next week I start the next stage of the work out and I'm supposed to be standing on a box with the bar on the floor. I may be at 25lb plates at that point which will bring the bar up a little.0 -
Right now, I'm on the floor and I have the bar propped up to bring it to the correct height for a normal DL.
Next week I start the next stage of the work out and I'm supposed to be standing on a box with the bar on the floor. I may be at 25lb plates at that point which will bring the bar up a little.
What's the point of this (serious question)? Seems like it would put a lot more stress on your lower back.0 -
Right now, I'm on the floor and I have the bar propped up to bring it to the correct height for a normal DL.
Next week I start the next stage of the work out and I'm supposed to be standing on a box with the bar on the floor. I may be at 25lb plates at that point which will bring the bar up a little.
What's the point of this (serious question)? Seems like it would put a lot more stress on your lower back.
It's a deficit deadlift. Although I am not sure I would be doing it until I was pretty far along with conventional.0 -
Right now, I'm on the floor and I have the bar propped up to bring it to the correct height for a normal DL.
Next week I start the next stage of the work out and I'm supposed to be standing on a box with the bar on the floor. I may be at 25lb plates at that point which will bring the bar up a little.
"correct" height is 45lb plates not 25lb plates.0 -
Right now, I'm on the floor and I have the bar propped up to bring it to the correct height for a normal DL.
Next week I start the next stage of the work out and I'm supposed to be standing on a box with the bar on the floor. I may be at 25lb plates at that point which will bring the bar up a little.
What's the point of this (serious question)? Seems like it would put a lot more stress on your lower back.
It's a deficit deadlift. Although I am not sure I would be doing it until I was pretty far along with conventional.
I'm asking because it is in the program I'm following. Common sense tells me I should alter the program to fit my needs, the question is, do I alter by reducing the weight and attempting the deficit deadlift or continue working on increasing the weight and getting better at regular deadlift? I'm a serious newbie when it comes to lifting. See... I didn't even know the "correct" height was 45lb. At what point should a deficit deadlift be incorporated into a program? Does it work more or different muscles than a regular deadlifts?0 -
Right now, I'm on the floor and I have the bar propped up to bring it to the correct height for a normal DL.
Next week I start the next stage of the work out and I'm supposed to be standing on a box with the bar on the floor. I may be at 25lb plates at that point which will bring the bar up a little.
What's the point of this (serious question)? Seems like it would put a lot more stress on your lower back.
It's a deficit deadlift. Although I am not sure I would be doing it until I was pretty far along with conventional.
I'm asking because it is in the program I'm following. Common sense tells me I should alter the program to fit my needs, the question is, do I alter by reducing the weight and attempting the deficit deadlift or continue working on increasing the weight and getting better at regular deadlift? I'm a serious newbie when it comes to lifting. See... I didn't even know the "correct" height was 45lb. At what point should a deficit deadlift be incorporated into a program? Does it work more or different muscles than a regular deadlifts?
I would stick to conventional to be honest. I tend to think of them as an assist for conventional, not an alternative. I would only think about working them in if I was having problems getting the conventional off the floor and wanted to work on that part of the lift.
Interested to see other's input though0 -
Right now, I'm on the floor and I have the bar propped up to bring it to the correct height for a normal DL.
Next week I start the next stage of the work out and I'm supposed to be standing on a box with the bar on the floor. I may be at 25lb plates at that point which will bring the bar up a little.
What's the point of this (serious question)? Seems like it would put a lot more stress on your lower back.
It's a deficit deadlift. Although I am not sure I would be doing it until I was pretty far along with conventional.
I'm asking because it is in the program I'm following. Common sense tells me I should alter the program to fit my needs, the question is, do I alter by reducing the weight and attempting the deficit deadlift or continue working on increasing the weight and getting better at regular deadlift? I'm a serious newbie when it comes to lifting. See... I didn't even know the "correct" height was 45lb. At what point should a deficit deadlift be incorporated into a program? Does it work more or different muscles than a regular deadlifts?
I would stick to conventional to be honest. I tend to think of them as an assist for conventional, not an alternative. I would only think about working them in if I was having problems getting the conventional off the floor and wanted to work on that part of the lift.
Interested to see other's input though
I agree, I see deficit deads as an assistance move.0 -
Interesting.
Even more interesting that they would be included in a beginner's program.0 -
Even more interesting that they would be included in a beginner's program.
Makes me wonder about the whole program.0 -
Even more interesting that they would be included in a beginner's program.
Makes me wonder about the whole program.
What program is it?0 -
Even more interesting that they would be included in a beginner's program.
Makes me wonder about the whole program.
What program is it?
I think she said it was NROLFW.
(tagging to follow interesting discussion)0 -
Even more interesting that they would be included in a beginner's program.
Makes me wonder about the whole program.
What program is it?
I think she said it was NROLFW.
(tagging to follow interesting discussion)
Derp...yes she did.
I had no idea that they were in there. It's one of the things I don't like about the program...they seem to complicate things unnecessarily.0 -
I loved the book, there was some great info in the book, and when I mentioned in my news feed that I got it, the responses were pretty much "it is a great book even if you don't follow the workout" which was my first clue that the workouts may not be ideal. I thought I'd give the work outs a try anyway, but as I followed a lot of the conversations here about lifting, I am started to rethink the work out. One thing that stands out is the fact that you go through 7 different work outs during the course of 6 months. Meanwhile, a lot of the threads here suggest sticking to one work out for at least 6 months.0
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Alright, stupid question, but if you didn't realize that 45lb plates were working height, how high are you propping up the 10lb plates? I'm assuming you're not using 3-4 plates, so wouldn't you already be doing deficit deads? (Or maybe I'm just over thinking this.)0
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Alright, stupid question, but if you didn't realize that 45lb plates were working height, how high are you propping up the 10lb plates? I'm assuming you're not using 3-4 plates, so wouldn't you already be doing deficit deads? (Or maybe I'm just over thinking this.)
I probably am doing deficit deads but only by an inch or two. I'm not using a tape measure to get them at the right height, just estimating.0 -
If I understand the box DLs in NROLFW correctly, you don't put the bar all the way down between reps, which means you wouldn't be doing those with super heavy weights anyway.
Which means they're technically not deadlifts as the bar is "suspended". Deadlift means you pick something up from a "dead stop" lying/sitting on the floor, not yank on something that's suspended by you in the air. This looks like more of a "deadlift row" if there is such a thing. It's a hybrid move, from the way I see it.
I'd stick with regular deadlifts, TBH, and I agree that having smaller plates without propping them already gives you the greater ROM that doing the box lifts are supposed to give you.
I can see where at a lower weight there might be some benefit to doing the box lifts, but I'm more of a purist who prefers simple moves, and that just seems to be more complicated than it's worth. Strictly my opinion, though.0 -
This move was one of the reasons I started to dislike NROLFW. After trying it a couple times, I just went back to regular deadlifts.0
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The only reason I can see of them including deficit is that many women can't pull a reasonable amount of weight in a standard deadlift? I don't know.0
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I can't imagine making deficits a primary lift for any reason, especially a beginner.
Deficits are a great tool for building leg drive, or learning to keep your butt down when pulling. But they aren't something I would do week after week as the main movement, as it is going to throw off your form when you pull from the floor.
If anything, with a new lifter, I'd have them pull from 1" or 2" blocks (not a deficit, the plates would be on the blocks), until their mobility was good enough to maintain position from the floor.0 -
If I understand the box DLs in NROLFW correctly, you don't put the bar all the way down between reps, which means you wouldn't be doing those with super heavy weights anyway.
Which means they're technically not deadlifts as the bar is "suspended". Deadlift means you pick something up from a "dead stop" lying/sitting on the floor, not yank on something that's suspended by you in the air. This looks like more of a "deadlift row" if there is such a thing. It's a hybrid move, from the way I see it.
I'm not doing New Rules but the program I am following (STS) also does 'deadlifts' from a platform, which is as you've stated is with the bar not going to the floor between reps. In fact the starting position is standing on the platform, holding the bar in the standing upright position then bending from the hips in a near stiff-legged stance. The aim of being on the box is supposendly to increase ROM. I don't like them and would much rather do proper deads.0 -
I can't imagine making deficits a primary lift for any reason, especially a beginner.
Deficits are a great tool for building leg drive, or learning to keep your butt down when pulling. But they aren't something I would do week after week as the main movement, as it is going to throw off your form when you pull from the floor.
If anything, with a new lifter, I'd have them pull from 1" or 2" blocks (not a deficit, the plates would be on the blocks), until their mobility was good enough to maintain position from the floor.
^ I agree.0 -
This move was one of the reasons I started to dislike NROLFW. After trying it a couple times, I just went back to regular deadlifts.
Are you still doing NROLFW?0 -
Interesting thread. I just started NROLFW (in week 2) - is the consensus here that it's more complicated than it needs to be? I thought the book was excellent - lots of interesting information and well written but I can see where the workouts could be considered a lot. Would love to hear if you recommend sticking the NROLFW and just modifying when necessary or trying something else.0
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