Calorie tracking is counter-BED recovery?
eso2012
Posts: 337 Member
I am an, um, experienced binge-eater. I have been good for a loong time. Recent relapses made me dig deeper into the WHY and HOW to manage BED.
Professionals state that BED is related to strict dieting. Many BE sufferers had their first episodes after a starvation period. By starvacation, it may not be technically the number of calories, but the mind set - to count and track every calories.
Now, I have enjoyed my MFP success - lost weight, became a regular workout bunny. But this relapse has got me thinking - would it be wise to PAUSE TRACKING for a while when I regroup - mindfulness of eating, mindfulness of being..as opposed to focus and, sometimes, be dictated by the calorie tracker?
Professionals state that BED is related to strict dieting. Many BE sufferers had their first episodes after a starvation period. By starvacation, it may not be technically the number of calories, but the mind set - to count and track every calories.
Now, I have enjoyed my MFP success - lost weight, became a regular workout bunny. But this relapse has got me thinking - would it be wise to PAUSE TRACKING for a while when I regroup - mindfulness of eating, mindfulness of being..as opposed to focus and, sometimes, be dictated by the calorie tracker?
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I posted a topic based on this pretty much. And for me YES...I think calorie counting has caused the black or white "all or nothing" mentality for me and that's why I'm trying my hardest not to log. (Even though it's so tough) but again, everyone is different and I'm only speaking from my own experience! Best of luck to you!1
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Thanks for the confirmation! Reading your post and others' responses now...0
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I honestly believe this is true! After tracking and being strict for a long period I just lose control and say screw it, Im tired of feeling deprived. Thats why Im being more relaxed about the whole thing now. I dont want to feel abnormal...no I cant have this..blah blah. That really does set off a binge for me.0
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IT IS AS INDIVIDUAL AS OUR BED TRIGGERS. WE NEED TO LEARN FROM OUR OWN EXPERIENCES AND ELIMINATE WHAT DOESN'T WORK WHILE EMBRACING WHAT WORKS. .
FOR ME THE OPPOSITE HAS BEEN TRUE. I WAS ALWAYS FAT BUT LOST WEIGHT BEFORE HIGH SCHOOL BY STRICT LOW CARB EATING AND WEIGHING DAILY. ONLINE TRACKING WAS NOT AN OPTION BUT I MANUALLY TRACKED EACH DAY.
NO DOUBT IT IS WHEN I STOPPED OBSESSING OVER MY WEIGHT THAT I BECAME OBESE. OUT OF SITE, OUT OF MIND. THEN CAME THE ADVENT OF VANITY SIZING ALLOWING ME TO EXPAND WHILE THE SIZE NUMBERS DIDN'T CHANGE. I CHOSE TO FOOL MYSELF. MY OCD TENDENCIES SERVE ME WELL IN SOME CIRCUMSTANCES. WEIGHT CONTROL IS AMONG THESE.
WHEN I START THE DAY WITH A FOOD PLAN I AM LESS LIKELY TO BINGE. WHEN I WEIGH DAILY I AM MORE COGNIZANT OF MY FOOD CHOICES. THERE ARE TIMES WHEN I CAN'T TRACK MY FOOD. THIS IS WHEN I GET CARELESS. THEN I BECOME ANXIOUS BECAUSE I AM CARELESS. THEN I BINGE. WHEN I TRACK I MAY HAVE UPS AND DOWNS; BUT, MY OVERALL AVERAGE STAYS ON POINT. WHEN I DON'T TRACK I LOOSE CONTROL.
I'VE LEARNED THE HARD WAY DOUBLING MY WEIGHT AS A TEEN AND RETURNING TO "NORMAL" IN MY 40'S. NOW OVER 50 I'M BACK TO DOING WHAT I DID IN MY EARLY TEENS. FOR ME CALORIE COUNTING AND FOOD TRACKING WORK. HOWEVER, IF THIS HAS A NEGATIVE IMPACT ON YOUR RELATIONSHIP TO FOOD, YOU SHOULD FIND ANOTHER WAY TO MANAGE YOUR DIET AND NUTRITION. RARELY IS ONE APPROACH EVER RIGHT FOR ALL PEOPLE.
I TYPE LOUD CAUSE I'M HARD OF SEEING ;-)
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Agree that everyone is different. I know that OA doesn't want you to track foods, ever, but that doesn't work for me. Do what you want to do & what works for you!
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Agree that everyone is different. I know that OA doesn't want you to track foods, ever, but that doesn't work for me. Do what you want to do & what works for you!
INTERESTING. MY OA SPONSOR TOOK THE OPPOSITE APPROACH. SHE WANTED MY DETAILED FOOD DIARY DAILY.
I AGREE WITH YOU. WE MUST DO WHAT WORKS FOR OURSELVES. IF IT HURTS WHEN YOU DO "THAT" THEN DON'T DO "THAT"! LOL
NO SHOUTING. HARD OF SEEING. ;-)
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I must agree. Unfortunately, when I started on this site, I took the 1200 calorie/day recommendation and ran with it. I was the best at it. I lost 10 lbs, deluded myself into thinking I was "full", "happy", "healthy". And little by little, almost without being aware of it, I started overeating and binging because of the strict dieting I put myself through.
Now, my binging has nothing to do with undereating, and I'm still struggling to find balance. If I don't log, I can be okay for awhile, but I notice I am slowly starting to put on a few. If I do log, I can be just fine, under my goal and feeling great!...for a time.
I'm really not sure how to approach this anymore. It seems no matter what, I fall into the same cycle. I keep telling myself I don't need to be perfect to make progress. The problem is in practice.0 -
It is refreshing to get everyone's perspective. If you are frustrated like me, I am with you I did a plan the other day trying to figure out what works for me - track or not track. I tracked and had LOTS of success (and yes, I thought I was at my ultimate happy and healthy state too...till relapse...a surprise relapse too)...so I know there are benefits associated with tracking. But 1200 or whatever TDEE I should be at...I think I got a bit too obsessed with it at one point. Surely that is NOT the way to live for life, right?
The BEST ever is when I travel. I eat whatever I want, full and satisfied but not binge, and walk so much that I ended up losing or maintaing weight without diet restriction or tracking. It is a great place for my mind to be.
So now back to real life. where cal burns is very limited to my workouts, I need to be careful.
I think I will go with tracking, but "loose" tracking, not being too concerned about the exact number. Most important, really slow down and enjoy the process of eating. It really helps to bring mindfulness to the whole situation.0 -
Agreed!! I don't restrict my calories too low, like 1200 but I have to track because otherwise open season. I don't beat myself up when over calories either. I use tracking as another tool to keep me mindful of my actions too.Agree that everyone is different. I know that OA doesn't want you to track foods, ever, but that doesn't work for me. Do what you want to do & what works for you!
When I was in BED program they did not want us counting calories but the wanted us to track meals. I was in program for over 3 months. I gained 20 pounds. Other factors cause it too. Learned a lot about me and why I binge too. I went back to tracking in felt much more in control.0 -
This is the attitude I recommend you work on because I feel this will keep the ugly binge monster away. If you grade yourself on going over calories like you failed or something then it will never work for you. It is never black and white or exact. Try setting your calories to lose 1 pound per week instead of 2 pounds per week. I did this and it felt less restrictive and even then I did not care about going over calories.I think I will go with tracking, but "loose" tracking, not being too concerned about the exact number. Most important, really slow down and enjoy the process of eating. It really helps to bring mindfulness to the whole situation.0 -
YOUR OA SPONSOR IS UNIQUE, BECAUSE IT IS AGAINST OA TO COUNT CALORIES.Agree that everyone is different. I know that OA doesn't want you to track foods, ever, but that doesn't work for me. Do what you want to do & what works for you!
INTERESTING. MY OA SPONSOR TOOK THE OPPOSITE APPROACH. SHE WANTED MY DETAILED FOOD DIARY DAILY.
I AGREE WITH YOU. WE MUST DO WHAT WORKS FOR OURSELVES. IF IT HURTS WHEN YOU DO "THAT" THEN DON'T DO "THAT"! LOL
NO SHOUTING. HARD OF SEEING. ;-)
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Good post and responses!!! Thanks!! We all have to find what works for us. There is not magic conclusion. Even the experts do not know what works for us. We have continue to work at it and never give up on ourselves!! Keep up the good work!0
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Really appreciate all responses, thank you! I want to lose the weight due to recent BED, but technically I really do not need to lose weight. So the focus on understanding and managing BED is most important for me. Re-living my earlier MFP days (tracking cals) does help if done 'loosely' because feeling good about my body is one way to end the cycle. So complicated yet so interesting, positive thinkng helps!0
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This was what I had been thinking about as well...0
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I've read on multiple websites and books that one of the most important ways to curb binge eating is to eat very nutrient dense food (whole foods, plant-based, with animal products used as "garnish", if any, and not main part of meal as they have very little micronutrients). Your body will be a lot more likely to send your brain signals that you are satiated and thus the emotional part of the disorder will be easier to control. As far as I have experienced, it really works. It can be very hard if you don't have much time for food prep, though, because of using mostly fresh ingredients and no processed "stripped" foods. I didn't have any food prep time when I started post-secondary along with my full-time job, and I relapsed hard.
So to answer your question and come to the point (I have one, I swear!), as far as logging goes it really helps me to make sure that I am consistently eating a wide variety of nutrients weekly- I ignore the calories completely. I do believe that calorie counting is counter-productive and more often than not encourages negative thoughts and feelings (at least for me). I have a tendency (along with so many binge eaters) to eat processed, nutrient stripped food (my binge food of choice is potato chips), so this is very helpful.
By the way, I'm new to the forums (first post); I'm Lea 0 -
I've read on multiple websites and books that one of the most important ways to curb binge eating is to eat very nutrient dense food (whole foods, plant-based, with animal products used as "garnish", if any, and not main part of meal as they have very little micronutrients). Your body will be a lot more likely to send your brain signals that you are satiated and thus the emotional part of the disorder will be easier to control. As far as I have experienced, it really works. It can be very hard if you don't have much time for food prep, though, because of using mostly fresh ingredients and no processed "stripped" foods. I didn't have any food prep time when I started post-secondary along with my full-time job, and I relapsed hard.
So to answer your question and come to the point (I have one, I swear!), as far as logging goes it really helps me to make sure that I am consistently eating a wide variety of nutrients weekly- I ignore the calories completely. I do believe that calorie counting is counter-productive and more often than not encourages negative thoughts and feelings (at least for me). I have a tendency (along with so many binge eaters) to eat processed, nutrient stripped food (my binge food of choice is potato chips), so this is very helpful.
By the way, I'm new to the forums (first post); I'm Lea
Hi Lea, thank you, welcome and flattered that we get your first post
I totally agree with your advice. BED or not, nutrition-packed food is so important My tracking was totally focused on calories for 3 years, as I wanted to focus on (1) learning portion control (2) weight loss - results encourage more life changes (3) loving workouts. I have achieved all 3.
Now into stage 2, supposedly better nutrition (learning and practising) and sculpting, I had the unexpected setback of BED. Which got me to evaluate what I did, do and should do.
Because BED is a mental health issue, and does not standalone (depression, anxiety etc often if not always part of the package), I tend to focus on the mind issue. I believe that is the core, the foundation, that needs to be diagnosed, evaluated, "sorted out" in order for your behaviour to change.
Having said that, I am sure the reverse - eat well, feel satiated, reduce BED - is also valid. Biochemically speaking, as you have pointed out, and psychologically too.
THank you for the reminder. And please post some website resources re: the topic - would love to read more!0 -
Thanks for the welcome
It's so hard to figure out what to tackle first! I agree, the mind is core. There are not a lot of free options where I live for counselling, or that would definitely be my first step.0 -
Thanks for the welcome
It's so hard to figure out what to tackle first! I agree, the mind is core. There are not a lot of free options where I live for counselling, or that would definitely be my first step.
Professional counselling is good, but so is self-tracking. I have never gone to counselling for BED. Over the years I began to see a pattern, started to track and ask myself questions etc. My husband also acts as an excellent observer and supporter.
I would be lying to tell you that I have solved the whole mystery of BED But I have developed some strategies here and there which are useful in bad times. For a while, I blogged myself out of the cycle on MFP! 0 -
I find if I make sure the meal is 'clean' and only consists of healthy food (heavy on the vegetables) then I'm ok. When I track and count calories it makes me kinda obsessed with food and that's a bad thing for a person recovering from BED. Weighing is in even worse for me. I know people say you should weigh in regularly to monitor progress but I know for myself if I just plod along and eat right (healthy 'clean' meals with no junk food) and exercise I do well but if I check the scale, even once a week, then I feel like I'm getting nowhere and throw it all in. Monthly weigh-ins work best for me. x0
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Agree that everyone is different. I know that OA doesn't want you to track foods, ever, but that doesn't work for me. Do what you want to do & what works for you!
^^^This. By forcing myself to log in every bite and face the damage, I've minimized or eliminated several binges. Two nights ago I began to binge. I forced myself to weigh and log each bite. I did go over my calorie allowance, but only by about 450 calories. It could have been much worse.
TBH, OA never worked for me. They wanted me to give up all of my "trigger" foods forever, which left me only eating the few foods that I hate (tomatoes, beets and cow's milk). Also, once I had to give up a food, I became obsessed with that food. If I allow myself the food and unfailingly log it in, I do better.
You should do whatever you can sustain. If you can control eating without logging it in, do that. If you have to log it in, do that instead. Everyone is different and there is no one "right" answer. If there was, we wouldn't have so many options.
Good luck and I wish you the best! :flowerforyou:0 -
I've read on multiple websites and books that one of the most important ways to curb binge eating is to eat very nutrient dense food (whole foods, plant-based, with animal products used as "garnish", if any, and not main part of meal as they have very little micronutrients). Your body will be a lot more likely to send your brain signals that you are satiated and thus the emotional part of the disorder will be easier to control. As far as I have experienced, it really works. It can be very hard if you don't have much time for food prep, though, because of using mostly fresh ingredients and no processed "stripped" foods. I didn't have any food prep time when I started post-secondary along with my full-time job, and I relapsed hard.
So to answer your question and come to the point (I have one, I swear!), as far as logging goes it really helps me to make sure that I am consistently eating a wide variety of nutrients weekly- I ignore the calories completely. I do believe that calorie counting is counter-productive and more often than not encourages negative thoughts and feelings (at least for me). I have a tendency (along with so many binge eaters) to eat processed, nutrient stripped food (my binge food of choice is potato chips), so this is very helpful.
By the way, I'm new to the forums (first post); I'm Lea
Hi Lea, welcome to MFP! The whole nutrient-dense thing is great but wouldn't work for me. My bingeing has more to do with emotion than nutrition and although hunger will trigger a binge, once I start eating, I eat well past the "not hungry" "full" and "uncomfortable" mark and don't realize I'm bingeing until I'm in pain and nauseated. Then I get mad at myself which begins the cycle all over again. And, of course, once I consider a food off limits because it isn't nutrient dense or whatever, I obsess over it. If I eat it, log it in I can get over it without guilt and I do better. But that's just how I roll, I'm not advocating this behavior for anyone else.
In fact, OP, I suggest that you try a variety of behaviors, log in, don't log in, log in "loosely" eat nutrient-dense and "clean" (whatever that term means to you), avoid food triggers, and see what works for you as a long-term solution.0 -
Thanks for the welcome craftywitch I agree with your statement that we should do whatever we can sustain.
And I'll take your tomatoes and beets
yummm hehe 0 -
I applaude you for doing it more or less on your own! I have a very hard time bringing myself to present moment awareness like that (asking myself questions). It must be a great help having someone close to you for support. I've been trying and trying but I finally threw in the towel and got up the courage to tell my doc I need help a couple days ago. Just waiting for news on an appointment with a counselor. I think I will need both counseling and personal tracking if I'm going to beat this.Professional counselling is good, but so is self-tracking. I have never gone to counselling for BED. Over the years I began to see a pattern, started to track and ask myself questions etc. My husband also acts as an excellent observer and supporter.
I would be lying to tell you that I have solved the whole mystery of BED But I have developed some strategies here and there which are useful in bad times. For a while, I blogged myself out of the cycle on MFP!0 -
I do use - that's why I'm here on MFP - but I am very much in recovery. I don't stress out about numbers the way I used to. I don't deprive myself and I use the tools I've learned along the way to not overindulge either. If I go over my calories by a little bit, that's ok. It doesn't mean I'm a bad person or having a relapse.
The most important thing I keep in mind is to be kind to myself.0 -
I find if I make sure the meal is 'clean' and only consists of healthy food (heavy on the vegetables) then I'm ok. When I track and count calories it makes me kinda obsessed with food and that's a bad thing for a person recovering from BED. Weighing is in even worse for me. I know people say you should weigh in regularly to monitor progress but I know for myself if I just plod along and eat right (healthy 'clean' meals with no junk food) and exercise I do well but if I check the scale, even once a week, then I feel like I'm getting nowhere and throw it all in. Monthly weigh-ins work best for me. x
I can totally relate! The more I "just do it", the less I feel pressured, and almost always a pleasant surprise when I step on that scale.0 -
In fact, OP, I suggest that you try a variety of behaviors, log in, don't log in, log in "loosely" eat nutrient-dense and "clean" (whatever that term means to you), avoid food triggers, and see what works for you as a long-term solution.
Exactly what's happening these days What works for me is always mega amount of workouts, like when I was travelling and walked 8 hours a day. But that's not possible outside the vacation period. Hence the whole rethink and experimentation. 0 -
I applaude you for doing it more or less on your own! I have a very hard time bringing myself to present moment awareness like that (asking myself questions). It must be a great help having someone close to you for support. I've been trying and trying but I finally threw in the towel and got up the courage to tell my doc I need help a couple days ago. Just waiting for news on an appointment with a counselor. I think I will need both counseling and personal tracking if I'm going to beat this.
I am VERY happy to hear that you are getting counselling. Recognition is the first step really, as cliche as it may sound. Now you will been able to share with a professional and get some advice!! I know sometimes you may "click" immediately with a counseller or his/her advice; other times need some shopping around.
Good luck with your first appointment!0 -
Thanks for the welcome craftywitch I agree with your statement that we should do whatever we can sustain.
And I'll take your tomatoes and beets yummm hehe
:happy: :happy: :happy: :happy:0 -
I can most definitely say that calorie counting is what caused my BED. I was on a really good roll after New Years (there's something about making a resolution that really kept me motivated). I went over a month with no binges, eating healthy, and eating a decent amount of food around my maintenance goals everyday. I wasn't trying to eat at a deficit, or trying to restrict, but I was still weighing, measuring and logging everything I put on my plate. I swear it's enough to drive you insane, trying to be so meticulate and keeping track of every little crumb like that. I get obsessed...nothing goes into my mouth without being weighed/measured. It makes me feel so crazy sometimes. I have gotten to a point that can do this in front of my BF (we live together), but I know he must think I am crazy. He doesn't say anything to me about it, but sometimes he will just watch me as I'm doing it and i feel like such a freak.
In any case, all that to say, that I was not putting myself in any kind of starvation mode for over a month, but still logging every little crumb, and I still got sucked back into the cycle of binge eating. I am in there right now and trying so hard to get out. I had a bad weekend.....Monday was supposed to be better, and I went the whole day without logging anything...though I did weigh/measure for portion control in the morning... then came lunch and an office goodbye party for a co-worker, and then around 8-9 brownies later I wrecked my day and continued to do so throughout the evening when I got home....
I'm not gonna log again today, it usually takes me a few days to come back from a weekend of binging anyways, so I'm over what happened yesterday. Here's hoping today is a "good day".0 -
The majority of my binge-eating is to "drop out" of life - the stresses, discomforts, challenges, whatever. It has been very helpful for me to use the MFP food diary because I had no idea how many calories I was eating especially when I binged. I currently need that accountability, however I can also see that the perfectionism mentality of logging food could be counter-productive to folks as well.
My main reason for posting is just to say that a binge always starts in my head, not with what I put in my mouth. I have had success reducing my binges since I joined MFP last December and I am back to logging after a month break which resulted in a 2-3 lb gain and a number of serious binges. The break was planned and was supposed to be for just a couple of weeks while I celebrated my birthday. Didn't happen that way, so I've tried to be kind to myself as others here have mentioned, think about what didn't work, and learn how to do things differently next time.
Thanks to everyone who posts so honestly and openly about BED. It helps me so much to know I am not alone.0
