Are there any exercises you just won't do?
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gweneddk
Posts: 183 Member
I am just starting out in crossfit and halfway through my Foundations program. I think I have a pretty decent knowledge of exercise science for a recreational exerciser, though like most people, much of my "book knowledge" has been taken from the internet. I have also had several conversations with coaches over the years about the hows and whys behind certain exercises.
That being said, there are certain things common to crossfit that in my opinion, the risk outweighs the reward, for ME. I have not yet sat down with my crossfit coaches yet to talk about these, but mentioned in passing and was told it wouldn't be a problem. Are there any exercises you substitute and why? Here's my list (so far):
American style KB swings (I like my RKC style swing and don't want to mess up my technique)
SDHP (risk of shoulder impingement; limited carryover to other lifts as far as I can tell)
kipping pull-ups(does not align with my goals of getting stronger--I would rather just get better at dead hang pull ups)
very high rep olympic lifts-- If I do higher reps they are going to be in sets of no more than 2-3. Especially since I am still learning the techniques.
Things I am on the fence about or will modify:
touch and go deadlifts for high reps. I will probably reset as needed to get my brace and grip.
Part of my decision on whether to join this "box" or not will revolve around how much support I get from the coaches in individualizing WODs to my specific goals--I am not asking for an individual workout each time, and since I already know my body well I shouldn't need too much help in figuring out which movements won't work for me. Anyone else in the same boat?
That being said, there are certain things common to crossfit that in my opinion, the risk outweighs the reward, for ME. I have not yet sat down with my crossfit coaches yet to talk about these, but mentioned in passing and was told it wouldn't be a problem. Are there any exercises you substitute and why? Here's my list (so far):
American style KB swings (I like my RKC style swing and don't want to mess up my technique)
SDHP (risk of shoulder impingement; limited carryover to other lifts as far as I can tell)
kipping pull-ups(does not align with my goals of getting stronger--I would rather just get better at dead hang pull ups)
very high rep olympic lifts-- If I do higher reps they are going to be in sets of no more than 2-3. Especially since I am still learning the techniques.
Things I am on the fence about or will modify:
touch and go deadlifts for high reps. I will probably reset as needed to get my brace and grip.
Part of my decision on whether to join this "box" or not will revolve around how much support I get from the coaches in individualizing WODs to my specific goals--I am not asking for an individual workout each time, and since I already know my body well I shouldn't need too much help in figuring out which movements won't work for me. Anyone else in the same boat?
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Replies
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Here is my personal opinion on this coming from someone who was totally foreign to 99% of the movements that crossfit presented (I am about 10 months in at this point now):
-Don't go into it saying that you absolutely won't do something. Keep an open mind. I had never done an American KB swing either and had never been instructed to bring the KB higher than my shoulders by any instructor or personal trainer previously. But thousands upon thousands of people are doing it and getting fitter for it and that is worth something to me.
-SDHP - you will never be asked to do these at heavy weights and therefore, you will not be at risk of shoulder impingement. I feel that this movement is really helpful in initiating the explosiveness of the hips which is used in so many other crossfit movements.
-Kipping pull-ups are simply a more efficient way of getting more reps done in a shorter amount of time. Though strict pull-ups are much harder and require more out of you, kipping pull-ups should not be dismissed. I have to say that after doing a high volume of kipping pull-ups, I am sore for days! It has to be working something! Also the gymnastics-based movement of the kipping pull-up can be applied in other movements, such as the toes-to-bar.
-High-rep Olympic lifts - don't discount these. They are mainly used at lower weights than your 1 rep max and serve many different purposes. A coach will never make you do these at heavy weights until you have the form down. They are challenging, especially as part of timed WODs and I find that they are some of my favorite parts of WODs.
-At some point, you will have to surrender to the best interest of your coach(es). They've been doing this for countless hours and chances are this is their number one passion. They do NOT want to see anyone get hurt and will not make you do something that you are not comfortable doing. If they do, ditch that coach (and box) and find somewhere else.
The bottom line is, keep an open mind. Let your coaches guide you. Crossfit is wildly popular because it WORKS and it's FUN. Let it happen instead of resisting certain things off the bat and cherry picking. You'll be amazed at what your body can do if your mind allows it!0 -
Agree with you about the high rep Oly lifts. I also have zero interest in double unders and hand stand pushups.0
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Hello,
I have to agree with ashlando on many of her points. To add to it...
I have been doing crossfit for about 6 weeks now. In my opinion it is all about knowing your body AND trusting your coaches. If you don't trust your coaches to do what is best for you, try another box. It is also about form. I don't think your coach should encourage heavy weight until you have proper form. For example, I was doign DLs yesterday, and was encouraged to put more weight after my coach saw the lower weight was too easy for me. Crossfit coaches should be able to tell if weight is too heavy or too lite for you, and you should be able to trust them with this.
As far as kipping pull-ups, I was told by my coach, just yesterday (again), that I will get there, but I need to get stronger first. As ashlando said, KPUs are easier than the strict PUs, but you work up to those.
As you continue with crossfit you will notice you're getting stronger little by little and you are able to do more. And it is an awesome feeling!!!
Good luck! I hope you take a chance and step outside of your comfot zone every now and then and come to Love crossfit as much as I do
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Well, as for kipping pull ups in particular, I really don't care about how fast I can do them; I just want to get stronger at pull ups. One of my coaches even told me he doesn't ever kip because his shoulders don't like it. So if HE says he doesn't kip, I think it's ok for me to say the same thing ;-)
I totally agree with keeping an open mind and allowing myself out of my comfort zone. I've already modified my squat stance to be narrower based on the advice of my coach--I will probably still keep a wider stance for 1RM low bar back squats but for the squats we do in CF I think the narrower stance will work.
As for strength, I am pretty sure that CF will help me improve several facets of my fitness, but I'm not counting on strength being one of them (except for the lifts that I have little experience with like OH squat and oly lifts). I'm already really strong and the reason I'm trying CF is to get a break from solely strength-based workouts!0 -
I think one of the benefits of the high rep, relatively low weight OLY lifts is to use it as a conditioning workout, not necessarily pure strength or pure cardio.
As others have said, IMO I will continue to be coachable and do the workouts as close to the prescribed way as I possibly can. That is what I pay for. Although I have "no interest" in burpees, for example. they are part of the system. I believe one of the points is that while you can work on certain goals, and scale for ability and injury, the coaches are there to COACH you. You don't hear a professional swimmer saying to their coach "No, I am not interested in doing those laps today". They just do it. That is why I go.
I scale BIGTIME. I don't run because I have nasty shin splints. But I do the WODS because they have been specially designed to work together to create optimal fitness.0 -
I want to master double unders just because i think it is the most easily attainable Crossfit "move" so to speak.
I have no interest in HSPU and won't even attempt one until I lose a lot more weight. I'm not dropping 285 lbs on my head/neck. I know I can't strict press anywhere near that, so I'm not even going to attempt a HSPU0 -
Anything upside down!0
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There are a lot of movements I physically can't do right now, either because of lack of strength or flexibility/mobility.
I can't think of anything I wouldn't want to try or work on, baring those limitations. This is about identifying my boundaries and pushing past them, if only by a little bit.0 -
In short .. not yet. My coaches always provide scaling options or if you let them know you have an injury they are more than ok with you doing another movement. Personally I'm a bit bow pegged and have some medical issues that affects my muscles and elasticity so I have to modify lower body movements to allow for my knees to push out. When I started I didn't think I'd be ever able to lift past 40/50lbs, 3 months later I'm using that weight to warm up. It all comes down to knowing yourself and trusting your coach.0
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"I think one of the benefits of the high rep, relatively low weight OLY lifts is to use it as a conditioning workout, not necessarily pure strength or pure cardio."
I guess my problem there lies with the fact that Oly lifts are highly technical lifts where the goal is maximal power production. There are dozens of other highly demanding exercises that could be chosen for conditioning purposes. IF the goal is to get a lot of practice in on the lifts, then I will happy do my 30 reps or whatever. In sets of 1-3, which as much rest as I need to to maintain good form. If the goal is conditioning, then I am not going to be able to keep up a fast enough pace with my current minimal technical proficiency.
Hell, for all I know, my box owner agrees with me and doesn't program high rep Oly lifts--the highest I've ever seen on the WODs on the website is 10. Which is still pretty high, but not as bad as I've seen.
To each their own though!0 -
I just joined the other day so i don't have much of an opinion (though my body doesn't seem to like overhead squats). I did enjoy reading all your comments.0
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Here is my personal opinion on this coming from someone who was totally foreign to 99% of the movements that crossfit presented (I am about 10 months in at this point now):
-Don't go into it saying that you absolutely won't do something. Keep an open mind. I had never done an American KB swing either and had never been instructed to bring the KB higher than my shoulders by any instructor or personal trainer previously. But thousands upon thousands of people are doing it and getting fitter for it and that is worth something to me.
-SDHP - you will never be asked to do these at heavy weights and therefore, you will not be at risk of shoulder impingement. I feel that this movement is really helpful in initiating the explosiveness of the hips which is used in so many other crossfit movements.
-Kipping pull-ups are simply a more efficient way of getting more reps done in a shorter amount of time. Though strict pull-ups are much harder and require more out of you, kipping pull-ups should not be dismissed. I have to say that after doing a high volume of kipping pull-ups, I am sore for days! It has to be working something! Also the gymnastics-based movement of the kipping pull-up can be applied in other movements, such as the toes-to-bar.
-High-rep Olympic lifts - don't discount these. They are mainly used at lower weights than your 1 rep max and serve many different purposes. A coach will never make you do these at heavy weights until you have the form down. They are challenging, especially as part of timed WODs and I find that they are some of my favorite parts of WODs.
-At some point, you will have to surrender to the best interest of your coach(es). They've been doing this for countless hours and chances are this is their number one passion. They do NOT want to see anyone get hurt and will not make you do something that you are not comfortable doing. If they do, ditch that coach (and box) and find somewhere else.
The bottom line is, keep an open mind. Let your coaches guide you. Crossfit is wildly popular because it WORKS and it's FUN. Let it happen instead of resisting certain things off the bat and cherry picking. You'll be amazed at what your body can do if your mind allows it!
I totally disagree with your post. OP: I think you should do your research and do whatever works for you.
My own coaches have told me they don't approve of SDHP's and don't like programming them. Not all coaches have been doing this for endless hours. Some have; some haven't.
OP: It's not a cult. It's a fitness program. Use it in the way that best suits YOUR NEEDS as long as you don't deviate from the overall principles of the program so much that you are bringing down the intensity and variety. Personally I've never had any issues with high rep olympic lifts or touch and go deadlifts (I just keep the weight lighter), but given my shoulder issues, when there is a workout with elements that don't work with my shoulders, I talk with my more experienced coaches and ask them how to modify. It's worked great and I've always gotten a good workout. That's what makes CF so great: You can scale it or mix it up with the guidance of your coaches. Any good coach should be open to hearing your concerns.
In response to this post above, well of course high rep olympic lifts are done at a weight lower than your one rep max. If you can lift it consecutively it for more than one rep, it's not your 1 rep max.
Don't "surrender" to anything, especially "the best interest of your coaches." Your own best interests should always be first and foremost. This is a program for YOU that you are paying for. Work with your coaches to achieve the results you want within the boundaries of what is appropriate for you based on your own medical history. Get out of your comfort zone, of course, but do with your eyes open. The points about not liking burpees or DU's are well-taken. Don't discount things right off the bat but do weigh the pros and cons. Just make sure you aren't discounting so much that you are no longer really doing Crossfit and keep in mind that yes, coaches generally have your best interest in mind.
I'm never sore "for days" from Crossfit and I Rx pretty much all normal workouts with no advanced movements (like muscle ups, pistols). I also powerlift and oly lift outside of CF. My own coaches have told me that if I am sore for days regularly or that if a movement makes me so sore that I can't do my other sports, I need to less of it.
I often sub ring rows or body rows for kipping pull ups. I don't like American kb swings either but they are not programmed often and our coaches don't care if we do Russian kb swings instead. I will do them though--just depends on how I feel that day and what stuff I have going on physically given that I do other training outside CF. We hardly ever do SDHP's except during Fight Gone Bad and in that case, I just do them. I guess my only real concern is kipping pull ups at this point. We don't do any of the other movements enough for it to be a real issue for me. I actually have to modify quite a bit to make my sports work together if I had a big max day in power lifting, but it never really seems to be a big problem. My coaches are fine with this and have said they want CF to help us be better at our other activities.0 -
"I think one of the benefits of the high rep, relatively low weight OLY lifts is to use it as a conditioning workout, not necessarily pure strength or pure cardio."
I guess my problem there lies with the fact that Oly lifts are highly technical lifts where the goal is maximal power production. There are dozens of other highly demanding exercises that could be chosen for conditioning purposes. IF the goal is to get a lot of practice in on the lifts, then I will happy do my 30 reps or whatever. In sets of 1-3, which as much rest as I need to to maintain good form. If the goal is conditioning, then I am not going to be able to keep up a fast enough pace with my current minimal technical proficiency.
Hell, for all I know, my box owner agrees with me and doesn't program high rep Oly lifts--the highest I've ever seen on the WODs on the website is 10. Which is still pretty high, but not as bad as I've seen.
To each their own though!
To me, the oly lifts are a lot of what makes Crossfit what it is and I guess if I were not open to doing them, I would be better off doing boot camp style workouts elsewhere. I did break mine up and did them very slowly when I started. I also have taken a lot of supplemental lifting classes. I still do them much more slowly than many unless I am in a competition because form is important to me. Most of the time I see workouts with 10 or less oly lifts in a row (9-6-3 is common at my box) After you are more proficient, if you are using the right weight, you probably can't do them unbroken after the first set anyway if there are more than 10. Even on the first set, you might need to break them up into 2 or 3 sections. We spend a lot of time learning how to pace ourselves in our WODs and how to break up lifts and make up time in non-technical sections.0 -
The only move I don't do/attempt right now are broad jumps. I ran into a NASTY shin splint problem that had me wondering if it wasn't really just stress fractures. As the other thing I do a lot of is distance running...you can see how shin splints that have me limping were not productive! Process of elimination put the broad jumps down as the culprit, so away they went and my shins have been happier since.0
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Agree with you about the high rep Oly lifts. I also have zero interest in double unders and hand stand pushups.
Handstand pushups are super fun once you get them though. Just getting upside down is fun for me.0 -
"I think one of the benefits of the high rep, relatively low weight OLY lifts is to use it as a conditioning workout, not necessarily pure strength or pure cardio."
I guess my problem there lies with the fact that Oly lifts are highly technical lifts where the goal is maximal power production. There are dozens of other highly demanding exercises that could be chosen for conditioning purposes. IF the goal is to get a lot of practice in on the lifts, then I will happy do my 30 reps or whatever. In sets of 1-3, which as much rest as I need to to maintain good form. If the goal is conditioning, then I am not going to be able to keep up a fast enough pace with my current minimal technical proficiency.
Hell, for all I know, my box owner agrees with me and doesn't program high rep Oly lifts--the highest I've ever seen on the WODs on the website is 10. Which is still pretty high, but not as bad as I've seen.
To each their own though!
To me, the oly lifts are a lot of what makes Crossfit what it is and I guess if I were not open to doing them, I would be better off doing boot camp style workouts elsewhere. I did break mine up and did them very slowly when I started. I also have taken a lot of supplemental lifting classes. I still do them much more slowly than many unless I am in a competition because form is important to me. Most of the time I see workouts with 10 or less oly lifts in a row (9-6-3 is common at my box) After you are more proficient, if you are using the right weight, you probably can't do them unbroken after the first set anyway if there are more than 10. Even on the first set, you might need to break them up into 2 or 3 sections. We spend a lot of time learning how to pace ourselves in our WODs and how to break up lifts and make up time in non-technical sections.
kelly:
A big reason why I wanted to try crossfit was that I DO want to try to Oly lifts. I realy have zero problem with programming them like you've mentioned; like you said, once I'm more proficient I will prob be able to knock out a few in a row with light weights.
I like how you said: We spend a lot of time learning how to pace ourselves in our WODs and how to break up lifts and make up time in non-technical sections.
Pacing is tough for me because with conditioning I'm used to either strict intervals based on a clock (maybe prowler sprint for a certain distance followed by a specific rest repeated 3x if the rests are short or up to 10x if the rests are longer) OR just getting as much work done as possible in say a 20-30 min circuit. This whole "go as hard as you can for 7 minutes" thing is foreign to me. Invariable after a few minutes of rest I feel like I want to go again, which seems contrary to the point!0 -
kelly:
A big reason why I wanted to try crossfit was that I DO want to try to Oly lifts. I realy have zero problem with programming them like you've mentioned; like you said, once I'm more proficient I will prob be able to knock out a few in a row with light weights.
I like how you said: We spend a lot of time learning how to pace ourselves in our WODs and how to break up lifts and make up time in non-technical sections.
Pacing is tough for me because with conditioning I'm used to either strict intervals based on a clock (maybe prowler sprint for a certain distance followed by a specific rest repeated 3x if the rests are short or up to 10x if the rests are longer) OR just getting as much work done as possible in say a 20-30 min circuit. This whole "go as hard as you can for 7 minutes" thing is foreign to me. Invariable after a few minutes of rest I feel like I want to go again, which seems contrary to the point!
I would assume that another reason you wanted to try CrossFit was because you were unsatisfied in what you were doing before and/or you were looking to switch things up. With that in mind, you might be well served to let go what you are "used to" and realize that in trying something new you are going to have some trouble adjusting. That's normal and can even be part of the fun of self exploration. 0 -
kelly:
A big reason why I wanted to try crossfit was that I DO want to try to Oly lifts. I realy have zero problem with programming them like you've mentioned; like you said, once I'm more proficient I will prob be able to knock out a few in a row with light weights.
I like how you said: We spend a lot of time learning how to pace ourselves in our WODs and how to break up lifts and make up time in non-technical sections.
Pacing is tough for me because with conditioning I'm used to either strict intervals based on a clock (maybe prowler sprint for a certain distance followed by a specific rest repeated 3x if the rests are short or up to 10x if the rests are longer) OR just getting as much work done as possible in say a 20-30 min circuit. This whole "go as hard as you can for 7 minutes" thing is foreign to me. Invariable after a few minutes of rest I feel like I want to go again, which seems contrary to the point!
I would assume that another reason you wanted to try CrossFit was because you were unsatisfied in what you were doing before and/or you were looking to switch things up. With that in mind, you might be well served to let go what you are "used to" and realize that in trying something new you are going to have some trouble adjusting. That's normal and can even be part of the fun of self exploration.
Good point! I was feeling a bit burnt out from training for purely strength performance and struggling to get leaner, so those were the two reasons to switch things up a bit!0 -
"I think one of the benefits of the high rep, relatively low weight OLY lifts is to use it as a conditioning workout, not necessarily pure strength or pure cardio."
I guess my problem there lies with the fact that Oly lifts are highly technical lifts where the goal is maximal power production. There are dozens of other highly demanding exercises that could be chosen for conditioning purposes. IF the goal is to get a lot of practice in on the lifts, then I will happy do my 30 reps or whatever. In sets of 1-3, which as much rest as I need to to maintain good form. If the goal is conditioning, then I am not going to be able to keep up a fast enough pace with my current minimal technical proficiency.
Hell, for all I know, my box owner agrees with me and doesn't program high rep Oly lifts--the highest I've ever seen on the WODs on the website is 10. Which is still pretty high, but not as bad as I've seen.
To each their own though!
To me, the oly lifts are a lot of what makes Crossfit what it is and I guess if I were not open to doing them, I would be better off doing boot camp style workouts elsewhere. I did break mine up and did them very slowly when I started. I also have taken a lot of supplemental lifting classes. I still do them much more slowly than many unless I am in a competition because form is important to me. Most of the time I see workouts with 10 or less oly lifts in a row (9-6-3 is common at my box) After you are more proficient, if you are using the right weight, you probably can't do them unbroken after the first set anyway if there are more than 10. Even on the first set, you might need to break them up into 2 or 3 sections. We spend a lot of time learning how to pace ourselves in our WODs and how to break up lifts and make up time in non-technical sections.
We are pretty similar. We might occasionally see higher numbers (5 reps for time that include 10 cleans) but the weight is almost always one that you can move briskly and ideally unbroken for at least 3 of the sets. And if it's not you are told clearly to move to weight that it.
IMO there is some benefit to doing Olympic lifts a lighter weights in good form while a bit fatigued. You just need to be smart enough to drop the weight if your form starts to go. In the end it all comes back to you. Your coaches and fellow athletes are there to guide and motivate. It's up to you to decide what is the appropriate weight for your skills and strength.0 -
The only move I don't do/attempt right now are broad jumps. I ran into a NASTY shin splint problem that had me wondering if it wasn't really just stress fractures. As the other thing I do a lot of is distance running...you can see how shin splints that have me limping were not productive! Process of elimination put the broad jumps down as the culprit, so away they went and my shins have been happier since.
That's what I'm talking about!
As you get stronger give them a try again down the road. They don't give me any issues and I land them a bit softer than I used to, which I think helps quite a bit. Weight loss and stronger legs helped me with that quite a bit.0
