This may be of interest also:

https://eatmeatdrinkwater.wordpress.com/bone-broth/

Well, the time-line will be a bit varied. It's also a long story. Might want to grab a cup of joe.

Around 10-12 years ago, I was a vegetarian. Yes, your friendly neighborhood carnivore once tried to live without flesh. I knew eating "normal" food wasn't working for me. I was fat and unhappy. I thought the vegetarians had the answer. When I stayed fat and got sicker eating that way, I gave it up.

A little over 4 years ago, I was all CICO. I had been already. But, I joined this site determined to finally make it work by really counting everything. I lost some weight, rapidly, by pretty extreme restriction. At one point, I reached 75 kg (165 lbs). That was the lowest I could get. I don't have the exact time line, but it probably came off in 8 months. I then slowly, painfully, regained most of it due to lack of will power.

About 2.5 years ago, I fell into the primal/paleo thing. I cut a lot of carbs, but kept the "good" ones like potatoes, rice, plantains, fruits. This didn't really help me lose any weight. I probably continued to gain during this time.

About 1.5 years ago, I read about real carb restriction. At this point, I had realized that the potatoes and other "ok" carbs from paleo/primal weren't helping me. I started a ketogenic diet (at about 92.5 kg -- 204 lbs). From almost the start, I was very low carb. I also ate vegetables, but not very much. I ate them out of an "obligation" that I thought I had. They're what made this high-fat diet healthy, right?

Late January/Early February 2014 (a few months after going keto), I stumble across the above book. I am instantly hooked by it. I remember rambling about it at length during a family get together. There's an email from March 7th, where I email the book to my father. So, it had to be sometime before that. At that point, I had read it and was already very close. I had already cut a lot of my vegetables down. I was even logging vegetables, that I planned on eating, but never actually eating them. So, I was very close. I was still not sure.

March through May 2014, I repeatedly attempted to go full meat, and then wimped out. Sometimes it was because I had massive cravings (I still included nuts and artificial sweeteners). Sometimes it was because I was worried that this wasn't actually safe. Was I going to kill myself? Was I going to be "that guy who got scurvy in the year 2014"? I knew the science said it wouldn't happen, but how could I be sure.

I had found other groups and other resources about this way. There's a mega-thread when one guy (Bear) talks about living this way for over 50 years. I read through that. I found the ZIOH forums. I started reading those. They were *kitten*. LOL, I still think they are at times. I love them all. But, they're not always nice or tolerant. They were talking about how artificial sweeteners, nuts, plant oils, and all this other stuff were unacceptable and would cause problems. I decided for a month long "proof" that they were wrong. I was going to eat, at a minimum, one Atkins/Detour/Quest bar (or some other heavily sweetened fat bomb keto-approved treat) every single day of June.

I was going to continue to eat ad libitum. That is, I didn't restrict daily calories during keto. I tracked, but I ate as much as I felt like and stopped when I was full. That's why I was logging vegetables I *might* eat. So, I knew what amount I had to eat under. The rest of the stuff was "eat until done." June was not a good month.


You can see the two months leading up to June. I was losing. The rate is actually 0.46 kg/week (a little more than 1 lb/week) for those two months. It was pretty typical for the whole time I had done keto. June, I gained at a rate of 0.46 kg/week. Yep, it was pretty much the equivalent of a 1,000 calorie swing. I did eat more, but not that much more.

After reviewing that month, I decided they might have a point. They clearly weren't sick or dying. Some had done it for over a decade. I waited a couple weeks. I forget why. I had gone back to my old way of eating, with minimal sweeteners. But, I had a couple veggies during those two weeks. I can't, for the life of me, remember why I kept the veggies those two weeks. I knew I was going to try the hard-core for 30 days after my June thing. Maybe I just needed a mental rest before starting.

On July 17th, I stopped eating plants. It was going to be for 30 days. Give their method a shot. I never stopped after 30 days. I currently eat eggs, cheese, cream, and meat. I drink water and coffee. I've actually not eaten any dairy for about a month. It's mostly coincidence. I just haven't bothered to buy any. I haven't really wanted any either. Most of my diet is beef. I tend to eat lots of ground beef and roasts/steaks.

I've eaten this way without supplementation since that date. Well, I did have a few nuts and a couple Atkins bars during a moment of weakness after my honeymoon. And, let's not talk about the honeymoon. My wife begged be to "eat normal and not stress her out" during the honeymoon. I still ate mostly meat, but I did drink a lot and included some other stuff. One night, I tried to eat a whole 4 pound burger with a pound of cheese on it. The killer for me was the bun and fries. I didn't even come close. That period was probably the most significant deviation, and no vegetables. The carbs were junk carbs and booze.

What's funny, by the end of the week, my wife told me that she couldn't wait for me to go back to "eating the way you normally do." Why? She had forgotten that I never have gas when eating just meat. LOL. In all honesty, I would have been so much happier to just stick with it. I was pretty miserable that week from the food. I didn't feel good. I just felt like I was running on low-octane gas. It also hit my weight pretty significantly. It's coming back off, but my weight spiked and stayed pretty high for a while. Plus, my cravings were back in force for a couple weeks after.

That's pretty much it. I eat meat and eggs. I drink coffee and water. There's nothing sweet in my diet. There's no plants (except some spices, if I feel like them). I don't count anything, not even carbs. I'll eat liver, knowing there's carbs, but not worrying about tracking. I just avoid plants.

I think that answered the question. I'm still very much a "newbie" in the eyes of most carnivores. I'm only at 8-9 months. They consider a year a good start. And really, 5 years is a pretty common benchmark time-frame for being considered truly experienced.

FIT_Goat wrote: »

Oh, and I say "I'll eat liver" and not worry about the carbs. But, I do not include liver in my normal diet, nor do I eat it for the vitamins or minerals. I haven't actually had liver this entire time. I will eventually have it. I would need to go buy some first. And, to do that, I would probably need to work up a craving for it. I say that I'll eat it, because it's not the carbs that stop me from eating it. It's mostly that I don't know if I'll enjoy it without all the onions I used to fry it with. So, I just haven't had it. It's not out of the picture though.

I'm not very keen on liver and onions myself, liver and bacon on the other hand... I usually buy lambs liver as it is a bit milder in flavour - soaking liver for a couple of hours in milk can make the flavour a bit less strong as well (I don't usually bother with lambs liver though). I usually cut the liver into thin strips and stir fry with the bacon. I'll have that with veg

Really interesting thread! I had a night out in Shimbashi (Tokyo) last night -- we ate yakitori, and the best bit was the grilled chicken liver bits! small 2-cm chunks on a skewer, roasted outside and kinda pink inside, so it was juicy and not tough at all. You could do it under a broiler. The meat may have been marinated, I could not tell.