Help with TDEE/Fitbit/Heybales Spreadsheet

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Alright, I've been at this before but it seems that after baby #2, I need to constantly remind myself that less isn't always better.

I've been doing the math with my numbers and I just want to make sure I'm on the right track. I'm pulling numbers from different places to see what the pattern might be. I would hate to be depriving myself of some (much desired) calories, and I also want to make sure that I properly lose the weight and reach my goal.

So please (waving at heybales!), look at it and let me know if things look right.

Stats:
5'3
CW: 158-160 lbs
SAHM of 2 (2.5 yrs and 9 months)

Mon, Wed: 25 min HIIT Cardio
Tues, Thurs: Lifting (40 min?)
Fri: 25 mins of some form of Medium Intensity/Recovery/Low impact Cardio or Pilates + (maybe) 10 min yoga

1) According to Fitbit, my average TDEE is around 2000. I do not manually enter my lifting sessions and Fitbit isn't great at measuring HIIT, so I understand that number is probably underestimated.

2) With current activity and weight, heybales spreadsheet has me at TDEE 2125 and a goal of 1637 for a 22.9% deficit (1 lb expected fat loss).

3) On 1/5, I weighed in at 165.6 lbs.
9 weeks later, I weighed in at 158 lbs.
7.6 lbs lost in 9 weeks
7.6/9 = .84 lb/week
Weekly deficit of 2940
Daily deficit of 420

I averaged my calories consumed during those 9 weeks and obtained 1767 (I missed one day of logging in those 9 weeks and estimated that I had surely gone well past my goal that day). This brings me to a TDEE of 2187 (1767+420).


All 3 numbers seem pretty close, right? (assuming Fitbit is underestimating) So, what should I set my TDEE at? And my cut? Is it okay if I eat slightly less during the week (say, 100 less) and slightly more on weekends, so long as my weekly avg falls within goal?

Replies

  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    First, I would manually log those lifting workouts in Fitbit to get a better estimate of TDEE. That's going to be your best tool there.
    Though the spreadsheet may suggest a height change to make it a better tool.

    The HIIT (if like real HIIT running) would actually be handled just fine with step based calorie burn by Fitbit. HR based burn would be inflated though if using one of those devices.

    Yoga must also be manually logged, you'll likely have no steps for minutes on end, but obviously burning more calories than sleeping it gives you.

    But that may allow Fitbit to get up to the estimate of the others, and your calculated based on weight loss trumps them all, and you were indeed eating enough for that to be valid results.

    Not sure if you saw it, but on the Progress tab, far right, is a place to do what you did but monthly, daily eating amounts, average daily, weight loss, and calculated TDEE.

    I'd keep that up each month with new measurements.

    And 15% off that TDEE figure is what this group recommends. So 2200 x 0.85 = 1870 now.
    Weigh less, get to eat more.

    100 less daily is rather a big amount for only 1870 on the actual days the workouts are being done. Because that extra 500 on the weekend with no workouts would likely push some time period beyond your deficit, meaning it would literally be surplus calories at that point.
    If it was only 250 more on each day, maybe not so bad. But the extra deficit each day during the week is probably worse than.
    Might see what the Fitbit says normal weekend calorie burn is.

    Why not just plan the eating in the day better, smaller breakfast and lunch if dinner will be out?

    Or do a totally extra workout not included in TDEE estimate of activity so you have eat back calories. Like Sat has nothing planned or normally done, so the TDEE estimate doesn't include it. Do a 500 cal workout though, less same 15%, and there's some extra eat back calories.
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
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    Thanks.
    So I'd take a 15% cut even though I still have about 30 lbs to lose?

    I have to admit, I didn't expect to be recommended a number higher than 1700, haha. I was not expecting 1870! :o Doesn't that mean I'd be losing weight at an even slower rate? (And I thought I was going slow enough!)

    According to Fitbit, I tend to burn just as much on weekends as I do on a workout day (that's without manually logging lifting and such). From now on, I'll log lifting and yoga in the Fitbit database. Does the same concept apply to pilates since it's not step based?

    If 1870 is my final # (I'm still hesitant lol), I totally can manage that on weekends without having to play with my cals during the week. When I said weekend, I did mean Saturday and Sunday, so it would have been 250 extra each day. But you know what, I don't even want that to be the norm. I'd hate to mess up and for my body to end up counting those as surplus. I'll stick to the #, day on or day off, and plan my day better.
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
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    And I never knew about the Progress Tab feature. I'll give it a shot!
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Pilates would indeed be the same, because there missing out on even more calories with bigger resistance nature of workout compared to stretching.

    30 lbs isn't that much left. Less to lose, slower.

    Yes slower loss, but body will make better transformation from exercise too, so inches may move faster.

    So good on the weekends, that would have made the idea of eating a tad less and then more then not so bad.
    You could still cut back 100 on Fri and Mon, and eat 200 more for a meal on Sat or Sun. But too far away from actual trade day and it's not really doing what you hoped for.

    Your Fitbit should also pick up on your changes to activity as seasons change, but that month to month on Progress tab does too, just a month delayed.

    And if you have a decent bodyfat % measurement or calculation, check out the Fitbit tab to change your height so their BMR matches the better Katch BMR.
    Though, if you use the TDEE calculator, that's handled automatically too based on results.
    But won't hurt if the difference is enough to matter.
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
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    Always thorough as usual! Much appreciated.

    I really am surprised that I fall in the Active category because I hardly go out with this weather, and I tend to keep my workouts short because of the kids.

    Would you recommend that I unsync Fitbit and MFP? I might have read a post of yours advising someone to do so.

    Slower loss, better body transformation? I'm sold! :D

    I haven't taken measurements in a while (losing good habits). Will do that this Sunday (day after rest day) and make great use of the Progress Tab. I'll be watching closely what happens in the next couple of weeks as I shoot for 1870 (starting this Sunday). I'll also monitor my hunger level on weekends (if it's even true hunger).

    Since the new # isn't too far off from my previous average, what do you think I should expect from the increase?
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
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    Another question, what is recommended for macros? 40/30/30?
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Unless you want your macro and calorie goals changing on you - you'll have to unsync accounts, and just keep an eye that the Fitbit TDEE is staying about the same in your weekly reports.

    Those kids are keeping you active. Shows why an hour of exercise doesn't replace a day on the farm being active.

    I'll bet you get nothing from the increase. Mere 100 more.
    Even if your body didn't speed up and the prior 1770 was maintenance level - it would take 35 days to slowly add on 1 whole pound.

    Anything faster or more is water weight, proving out prior eating level could not have been maintenance. Because you just topped off carb stores with attached water in the muscles.

    Workouts will probably get stronger, or at least attempt to when appropriate.

    That macro combo is like failsafe way of confirming enough protein, even if overkill.
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
    edited March 2015
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    I'm not sure if it matters or not, but the high average was purely coincidental. Well, not really because I did eat all those calories. What I'm trying to say is, I wasn't aiming for anything close to 1770. More like 1550-1610. That average happened to be higher because of days during which I'd eat way past my goal, often reaching 2000s. But does that actually mean that had I consumed around 1770 for 9 wks, I'd have still lost 0.8 lb/week? I'm not sure if that information means anything for my actual TDEE. I'm not even sure I make sense! Ignore if I don't.

    I'll plug in the numbers and watch what happens. I'm skeptical (losing at ~1900 when I don't "feel" like I burn much) but I won't know until I try. Will update!
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Yes, you would have lost that amount if you had eaten that daily.
    That's what the 420 daily average deficit means.

    Now, in reality, you probably had a suppressed maintenance for some of that time, and those big days wasn't eating up to maintenance, but rather over, so adding fat.

    But the calculated TDEE still takes that in to account over that long time span, so that's still valid calculation.

    You are starting to confuse yourself though, you did the math right.

    It's exactly the same way as someone that eats 1200 and loses 20 lbs in 8 weeks, but then plateaus for 12 weeks and is still stuck.
    If they had eaten 20 lbs x 3500 / 20 weeks / 7 days = 500 cal deficit daily that entire time - they would have almost certainly lost the entire time and still be going instead of stuck. And eating more, and exercise probably having a better effect, and not so stressed about it, ect.

    Just remember, your weight loss shows you were burning upwards of 2200, during cold winter months. Or was it winter for you?
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
    edited March 2015
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    Yes heybales, it sure was winter! Brrrr!! It's just starting to feel decent outside. :)

    I really like the example you gave there. If I understand correctly, the fact is, it's better to eat at an adequate deficit on a regular basis instead of eating on a big deficit here, low deficit there.

    In the former, the body registers the moderate cut better, TDEE stays constant (with the help of a reset or diet break), one gets to eat more on a daily basis (= happier individual), and when comes time for maintenance, it won't be going from 0 to 100 as one will be close to maintenance # anyway. This keeps the body from registering the extra bits as surplus.

    In the latter, TDEE ends up suppressed due to the large cut and if suppressed for a while, such TDEE might end up sticking around. Then, in order to continue losing, one will have to keep lowering calories (to match up to suppressed TDEE).

    This all makes perfect sense to me if that's what you're saying.

    I know it's not an exact science, but I apply better when I understand well. :D

    Side note: my husband told me yesterday that 2 yrs ago, after losing baby #1 weight, I looked slimmer at this same weight. I really wasn't happy to hear that :\ , but it prompted me to look back at the numbers. It turned out that I was averaging the same as now (or slightly less) while being a SAHM of ONE child. Oh and I was losing an avg of 0.7 lb/week (slow loss). And I was quite serious about hitting protein macros. If this doesn't serve as a reminder that less isn't more! Lol
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
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    Aaaargh!!! :( This isn't a good weekend for me. I'm feeling frustrated and discouraged. Right now, my mind is playing tricks and I've been tempted to cut further (but I haven't actually done that). The scale numbers are killing me. Deep down I know they don't tell the whole story but with 30 lbs left to lose, I'd think it would move...faster? Ugh.

    I weighed daily during this time to see weight fluctuations.

    On top of it, I look at myself and I don't SEE any changes. And I knooooow I shouldn't rely on what might be a twisted vision, but my mind is saying, "See, you would be visibly smaller if you were eating around 1500!" Measurements, I know! I was supposed to have them done this weekend but I stress ate yesterday (not from hunger, just feeling plain discouraged, thinking that this isn't working, ate quite a lot :| ), so it makes today invalid.

    I need third party input here.
    Do these numbers mean anything?
    Am I on the right track? Should I adjust anything? Too early to tell?

    So far...

    From 3/29 to 4/24
    Average caloric intake: 1795
    Average TDEE (Fitbit): 2193
    Starting weight (on 3/31): 158
    Highest weight recorded: 159.8 (on 4/6 and 4/7)
    Lowest weight recorded: 156.4 (on 4/17)

    I'm not sure that lowest # equals an actual loss due to weight fluctuations. I'm dancing around 158 most days. :/
    When do you know it's an actual loss?

    I'm just frustrated and would like to know what you guys think.

    Thanks
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
    edited April 2015
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    I have to add that I recently walked past the freezer section at the supermarket and had to do a double take. I was shocked by how slimmer less fat I looked. I brushed it off telling myself that it was one of those glasses that made one look smaller. The same day, I walked towards a glass door and stopped at the reflection, thinking, "Is that me???" Brushed it off too...because my bathroom mirror tells me otherwise!!

    Does this happen to anyone? Some days, you look ok. Other days, you look bigger. Strange.

    Sorry guys if I sound crazy but these are just raw thoughts, and I'm not in the greatest state of mind at the moment. Lol
  • williams969
    williams969 Posts: 2,528 Member
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    I'd say your Fitbit numbers, your average intake, and your weightloss are pretty much in agreement.

    Here's a little math:

    2193-1795 = daily average deficit of 398

    weightloss over 17 days (going on the 3/31 to 4/17 numbers) = 1.6 lbs

    1.6 divided by 17 times 3,500 (1 lb fat loss rate) = 329 calorie actual deficit

    That's only difference of 70 calories between estimated and actual weight loss (which, seriously, chalk that up to "normal fluctuations/errors")

    I'd stay stick with the plan. It's working as it should.
  • Labouffecestbon
    Labouffecestbon Posts: 182 Member
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    I'd say your Fitbit numbers, your average intake, and your weightloss are pretty much in agreement.

    Here's a little math:

    2193-1795 = daily average deficit of 398

    weightloss over 17 days (going on the 3/31 to 4/17 numbers) = 1.6 lbs

    1.6 divided by 17 times 3,500 (1 lb fat loss rate) = 329 calorie actual deficit

    That's only difference of 70 calories between estimated and actual weight loss (which, seriously, chalk that up to "normal fluctuations/errors")

    I'd stay stick with the plan. It's working as it should.
    Aaaah thank you!!

    It seriously makes me smile. :)

  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Those reflections better start making you smile too!

    If eating enough, always do the math.

    And see how the measurements look next valid day, don't wait a month.
    Can't see all around you. Well, unless you have a 360 mirror, but that sounds scary for anybody.