Runner's Poll: Thoughts on Cross-training?

lporter229
lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
edited November 20 in Social Groups
Runners: How do you approach cross-training 1-2 days per week? (Note: By cross-training, I am referring to other forms of cardio exercise, not strength training).

A. I appreciate the break from running
B. It's a necessary evil, but I do it to minimize the risk of injury
C. No thank you...I'd rather just run

I'll go first: I used to be a strong "C", but now I teeter somewhere between an "A" and a "B". I rode on my stationary trainer this morning in lieu of running and I was surprised at how much I looked forward to my workout after many consecutive days of suffering through the early morning humidity. It was just nice to have a break.

Replies

  • ftrobbie
    ftrobbie Posts: 1,017 Member
    C - Only because gyms bore me and I get scared with the maniacs in cars early in the morning if I am on a bike. If I need a break from running, I'll take it and re evaluate the programme.
  • glevinso
    glevinso Posts: 1,895 Member
    As a triathlete, running is just 1/3rd of what I do. I never get bored with my routine. I have occasionally thought of just being a road cyclist, or just a runner, but I find I would miss the other training.
  • dougii
    dougii Posts: 679 Member
    C - because my cross training consists of strength training although I am toying with the idea of taking the bike out but don't really trust the nuts behind the wheels of the cars - I can avoid most of them by running pre dawn!
  • isulo_kura
    isulo_kura Posts: 818 Member
    Generally a 'C' bit occasionally an 'A' if I go through a swimming phase (which isn't often at the moment). If I need a break I just do a different type of run be it the time/distance or surface
  • STrooper
    STrooper Posts: 659 Member
    A. Old guys need an occasional break.
  • MeanderingMammal
    MeanderingMammal Posts: 7,866 Member
    Needs a fourth option, I cycle most days for commuting but a reasonable amount of training as well.

    I enjoy it in a different way to enjoying running, so the closest would be A, but it's as much about balance as a break. They're both complementary, and it avoids the need for any resistance training, which is dull as f**k.
  • lishie_rebooted
    lishie_rebooted Posts: 2,973 Member
    As a perpetually broken runner, definitely A.
    I'm find lots of joy in walking, yoga, and cycling these days.

    The drivers are less scary in the morning than they are after work for cycling.
  • cheshirecatastrophe
    cheshirecatastrophe Posts: 1,395 Member
    B-prime: I do it so that *when* I get injured (because runner, amirite?), I will have a base of something else already built up to substitute in an equivalent, instead of having to build from scratch.

    Mostly kidding. I really, really like road cycling in the summer. It's not so much a *break* from running, as it is a thing that is really cool in its own right. There is just something magical about biking to another town. Winter is more difficult. I'll do the elliptical, but then we're back in B-prime territory.
  • litsy3
    litsy3 Posts: 783 Member
    I cycle to and from work at least 4 days a week, 10-10.5 miles each way. I don't think of it as cross-training, more just transport, but I enjoy it and think it's probably good for my overall fitness. I think my approach is 'just do all the activities you want to do and enjoy in their own right, rather than thinking of them as cross-training for something else'. Similarly, I think of food as food and not as 'nutrition', which I would find depressing.
  • GiddyupTim
    GiddyupTim Posts: 2,819 Member
    STrooper wrote: »
    A. Old guys need an occasional break.

    ^ This. I go for a good long bike ride about once a week. I hurt my knee and had surgery about two and a half years ago. The bike was an integral part of my rehab as I could not run very well or far at first. I got hooked. Now I find it is a nice day when I am spared the pounding.
  • alikonda
    alikonda Posts: 2,358 Member
    A, for sure. I'm a cardio junkie, but I get Runner's Fatigue like you wouldn't believe.
  • vcphil
    vcphil Posts: 79 Member
    C. Run streak day 370+ :smiley:
  • Carrieendar
    Carrieendar Posts: 493 Member
    I do other activities, but the only real cross training I do is a cycle class (which also has lifting in it), but I do that on a run day, so not sure that counts! I also do plyometrics, hip and core routine, and a shorter lift routine, but I don't really consider any of those to be cross training.

    I think that, as I get older, as some members have said, I will incorporate a cross training day as needed for fatigue prevention.
  • DavidMartinez2
    DavidMartinez2 Posts: 840 Member
    I don't understand why you do not consider strength training as an option.
  • lporter229
    lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
    I don't understand why you do not consider strength training as an option.

    I think strength training is an important part of any training program, but I think of it more of an "in addition o running" rather than an "instead of running". It's purpose isn't to get the heart rate up into a specific zone, which is what I think of with other cardio cross-training options.

  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
    Kind of a timely topic based on an email from Runners Connect that I received this morning. Granted, this is about strength training, but I'm not sure this is way off topic (apologize if others think differently). I receive these emails because I signed up to receive emails on their website, so some others here have probably seen this too. Just thought I would share. I'm not endorsing anything, just sharing info that is on topic.

    As for me...I think strength training is beneficial but right now I am on hiatus from strength training as my focus is on long, slow mileage gains, adding considerable mileage to what I was previously doing. I find that adding in the strength training negatively impacts my ability to add in those extra miles, and those extra miles are quite a workout on my running muscles already. As for cross training (cardio) I do not do any currently, also because my focus is on long, slow mileage increases (to build aerobic system further and increase pace).


    Runners are near legendary for their aversion to strength training.

    Many successful coaches and athletes in the past made a point to avoid strength training.

    Moreover, it can sometimes seem like it's just one more thing to add without any measurable benefits.

    The philosophical debate over the place of strength work (especially heavy weight training) has gone on for quite a while, and it’s spurred a range of research on the topic.

    Luckily, we now have the research on how strength training can help you improve your running.

    More importantly, we even know what type of strength training will work best.

    Let's dive into some of this research...
    Result of light strength work on running performance

    In Sato and Mokha’s (20091) study, 28 recreational runners with 5k PRs just under 30 minutes were divided into an experimental and control group.

    During the six week experiment, both groups continued their normal training routines, but the experimental group was given a set of five exercises to be performed four times a week in 2-3 sets of 10-15 repeats each.

    The exercises—crunches on an exercise ball, back extensions on an exercise ball, opposite arm-leg raises while lying on the stomach, hip “bridges” on an exercise ball, and “Russian twists” (twisting the torso side-to-side while in a sit-up position) on an exercise ball—were all targeted at the hip and torso muscles, which are thought to contribute to stability while running.

    The researchers hoped that strengthening these muscles would lead to better running form and a performance boost to boot.

    Interestingly, the exercise program did not lead to improvements in running form, but did lead to a moderate improvement in running performance.

    The experimental group dropped their 5k time by 47 seconds, while the control group only improved 17 seconds.

    An astute observer might question whether the performance boost was simply due to the recreational runners taking on more training and achieving better general fitness instead of a running-specific improvement.

    If this is the case, perhaps any physical intervention (moonlighting as a bricklayer, for example) would improve running performance for recreational runners.
    Strength work plus additional training

    This was one question addressed in a 2010 study by Alexander Ferruati and his colleagues at Ruhr University in Germany.

    Twenty two recreational runners (no information was provided on their race times, but their normal training consisted of about 40min of running per day) were split into two groups.

    Both groups added a 9-mile “tempo run” at about 5-10% slower than marathon pace to their weekly training schedule, but the experimental group also added two strength sessions: one targeting the upper body, and one targeting the lower body.

    Each session had five exercises, most of which were done on health-club style weight machines.

    While both groups improved their fitness over the eight week study and the strength group became significantly stronger, neither group was better off than the other. The strength training did not noticeably affect running economy or oxygen intake.

    While Ferruati’s study seems to be a tough blow to proponents of strength work, it deserves a second look. Runners rely primarily on their legs to propel them, and Ferruati et al. had their subjects doing only one session of leg strength a week.
    Leg strength training for runners

    A 2008 study by Øyvind Støren and coworkers in Norway examined a more rigorous program focusing on raw leg strength.3 Støren’s protocol was four sets of four half-squats with a barbell, three times a week with three minutes of recovery, with nearly the heaviest weight the subjects could manage.

    Seventeen runners (nine men and eight women) with 5k bests in the 18:40-range partook, with nine in the experimental group and eight in the control group. All of the subjects carried out their normal training during the eight week study and underwent the usual battery of physiology tests before and after the study.

    The results stand in contrast to Ferruati’s study: Støren’s subjects displayed no increase in oxygen intake but a 5% increase in running economy and a startling 21% improvement in a treadmill run to exhaustion at somewhat faster than 3k race pace vs. the control group, who had no improvement on either mark. Støren et al. chalk up the improvements to increased muscular efficiency.

    The runners who completed the half-squat protocol not only became stronger, but also more powerful—they were able to generate force much more quickly after the strength program.

    The researchers proposed that this allowed them to have a “quicker” stride and save energy while running.
    Strength training and elite runners – does it work

    Still, one criticism remains: is this sort of training useful for someone whose body is already developed to a very high level of fitness? Physiology studies on elite athletes are notoriously difficult to find, since elite runners are exceedingly picky (and rightfully so!) about their training.

    Fortunately for us, one extraordinary study by Philo Saunders and his coworkers at the Australian Institute of Sport4 managed to round up fifteen elite runners and have seven of them undergo a nine-week explosive lifting and jump training program. All of the runners had 3km PRs around 8:30 (equivalent to well under 15 minutes for 5km) and six of them had competed internationally.

    Accordingly, the strength program they did was fairly comprehensive: three sessions a week, split between gym exercises like the leg press, hamstring curls, and back extension, and outdoor sessions done on grass consisting of bounding, skipping, double-legged hurdle jumping, and scissor jumps. As usual, both groups continued with their normal training.

    At the conclusion of the study, the strength program group displayed a 4% increase in running economy at fast speeds and a smaller, non-statistically significant increase in running economy at slower speeds vs. the control group. Just like in Støren et al., these elite runners also were able to generate force more quickly, which probably accounts for their improved economy.
    What you can take away from this research on strength training

    In summary, it seems that the benefit of strength training for the distance runner hinges on the intensity and frequency of the exercises as well as the type of strength work being done.

    A moderate, once-a-week excursion to the gym to use a few weight machines is unlikely to result in significant gains.

    Yet, a more intense program focusing on an effective, targeted, running-specific strength routine is a great idea for runners of all fitness levels.
    Light weights are unlikely to benefit you as much as heavy weights when it comes to improving performance.

    If you’re interested in adding running-specific strength training to your schedule, we’ve created the ultimate Strength Training Guide for Runners

    With 18 running-specific routines (each provided online as well as .pdf and video format), specific prescriptions for how to include in your training (5k, 10k, HM, marathon, beginners, weight loss) and interviews with experts in strength training for runners, you’ll have absolutely everything you need to plan, develop, and understand how strength training fits into YOUR training. Get yours now!

    If you are strapped for time and can’t get in the various exercises the elite runners did in the Saunders study, you’re still likely to see significant benefits from including 5-7 minute strength routines after your runs.

    We also provide two general strength and one cool down routine gleaned from these studies in our strength training for runners guide

    In my next email I am going to talk a bit more about the third point above - heavy versus light weights.

    I'll show the research on which is best and give you a good practical example on why.

    Regardless, if there’s one lesson to be learned from this research, it’s that you shouldn’t bother going halfway on weights!

    Coach Jeff
  • Equus5374
    Equus5374 Posts: 462 Member
    A - I love to swim and find that's a refreshing break from running. I'd really like to work toward becoming a triathlete, because I like to bike, too (although having smashed my front teeth out in a bike accident has me a bit nervous). I appreciate the posts on strength training, because I'd like to do more of that, but I'm one of those reluctant runners. I posted about my increasing skinny runner look in another thread, and I know that doing some lifting will help provide some definition. But when and how to work it in? I may check out the Strength Training Guide for Runners.
  • CarsonRuns
    CarsonRuns Posts: 3,039 Member
    C. I only cross train with alternative cardio if I am unable to run.
  • scottb81
    scottb81 Posts: 2,538 Member
    I do not cross train, but rather run every day with an occassional off day.

    This is mainly because I like running more than I like doing the other things. However, I did try strength training a couple of years ago along with marathon training and had disasterous results.

    I did get stronger, up to a 235 Squat, 305 Deadlift, and 170 bench. However, due to a combination of overtraining and a horrible physical reaction to some creatine I tried, 2 years of aerobic fitness was destroyed overnight. In two weeks I went from a 3 hr 20 mile training run that felt pretty good to being unable to run further than 6 miles at a slower than 10 min pace. That in turn killed my motivation and led to me taking an extended break.

    So, now that I'm back to it I'll stick to running.
  • Aine8046
    Aine8046 Posts: 2,122 Member
    A - I enjoy my swimming day! :)
  • SKME2013
    SKME2013 Posts: 704 Member
    B. I cross train on my rest day.
  • torituma4
    torituma4 Posts: 10 Member
    C - because i m really bad at cycling. and i dont know how to swim. trying to learn but motivation wise i rather run
  • brandiuntz
    brandiuntz Posts: 2,717 Member
    I guess I'd be B if I did cardio cross-training. I do strength training 2 days a week (non-run days). I want to add cardio to those days, and will probably add cycling. Increasing my mileage is bringing out some nagging little issues and I suspect I can't handle running 6 days a week, so would rather pickup another cardio to improve my endurance. I'd already be doing it if I trusted cars more.
  • Wendy98
    Wendy98 Posts: 72 Member
    I used to be a "C", but now I am more "A" with a little "B". Running will always be my first love, but I am learning to really like cycling. Husband got me a beautiful carbon fiber bike for my milestone birthday last year and I am spending more and more time on it. I had to embrace swimming this past winter while I recovered from a stress fracture in my femur. As much as I try, I just don't love swimming (although I do it in hopes of taking the step to triathlon). I also am an elliptical junkie since it is close to running, but doesn't aggravate my new stress fractures (ftr, I have some bone issues).

    With all that being said, my last marathon was 2.5 minutes off my PR and I ran the least I ever have in a training cycle. I don't believe in running a bunch of junk miles just for the sake of getting numbers in. I'd rather save my joints and have a hard elliptical session.
  • jtdominion
    jtdominion Posts: 5 Member
    C (if excluding strength training). But I have always think of strength training as a type of cross-training. For some reasons, I never do enjoy strength training all that much. And I find that I am always too tired to run the next few days. Maybe that's why. Anything that takes away running, I tend to avoid.
  • snowflakesav
    snowflakesav Posts: 649 Member
    I run 5 or 6 days a week and cross train 6. My current mileage is pretty moderate at about 40 miles a week. When I start training for realz again in my next training cycle I will drop the cross training down to 2 or 3 days. Cross training for me is an at home DVD program like PIYO or Jillian michaels and a weekly yoga class.
  • pobalita
    pobalita Posts: 741 Member
    C - unless trail running counts as cross-training (I know it probably doesn't, but it does use the muscles a lot differently than road running.

    I do core workouts about 5 days per week, strength training 2 - 3 days per week, and yoga 1 - 2 days per week in addition to running.
  • valentine4
    valentine4 Posts: 233 Member
    Jillian Michaels is fantastic, my circumstances have changed I can't get out running as much as I would like so am having to improvise. Lots of runs with kids on bikes/ flickers and JM in the kitchen with me pushing the dogs off me with my kids laughing at me.

    One of my neighbours runs alot of marathons, she has just completed her 350th. She was saying she dropped some running days and started doing Jillian Michaels and she saw a big improvement in her running! can't get better than that.

  • lporter229
    lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
    valentine4 wrote: »
    Jillian Michaels is fantastic, my circumstances have changed I can't get out running as much as I would like so am having to improvise. Lots of runs with kids on bikes/ flickers and JM in the kitchen with me pushing the dogs off me with my kids laughing at me.

    One of my neighbours runs alot of marathons, she has just completed her 350th. She was saying she dropped some running days and started doing Jillian Michaels and she saw a big improvement in her running! can't get better than that.

    Which JM are you doing? I have 30 Day Shred. I thought it was actually pretty hard.
  • kristinegift
    kristinegift Posts: 2,406 Member
    lporter229 wrote: »
    Runners: How do you approach cross-training 1-2 days per week? (Note: By cross-training, I am referring to other forms of cardio exercise, not strength training).

    A. I appreciate the break from running
    B. It's a necessary evil, but I do it to minimize the risk of injury
    C. No thank you...I'd rather just run

    Sort of A and sort of C. I get really into cross-training when I've got mild injuries. It's nice to do something else and feel myself getting stronger in a different activity. I'd rather run, though. But I am scheduling some cross-training this summer -- probably mostly biking, maybe a bit of rowing -- just to give my legs a break once a week.
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