Fueling for long bike rides while staying low carb
mrron2u
Posts: 919 Member
So this may have been addressed in the past, but I couldn't find anything that really outlines what I'm looking for.
I'm trying to figure out how to fuel properly for long bike rides (2-3 hours or more). Articles I've read say you should start with around 30g of carbs close to your ride start and then every hour you can consume 30-60g carbs (but no more than that as your body cannot process more than 1g carb per minute of moderate exercise).
The problem is, like most of you I am trying to keep my carbs under 100g per day and by working this plan, I will be well over that just for my pre-ride meal and probably 3 snack breaks.
Some background. I am a Type 2 Diabetic and so I need to at least keep enough sugar in the tank to avoid a sugar low. The exercise groups say that carbs are the best fuel for biking as it is readily available energy.
What I'm wondering is are there any long distance riders or bikers here that have some experience with fueling for their rides/runs? Are you able to do keto or low carb without it causing sugar crashes during long exercise periods?
I am not doing Keto yet, just staying under 100g carbs which has made a huge difference in my diabetes fasting blood sugar readings.
Thanks for any help!
I'm trying to figure out how to fuel properly for long bike rides (2-3 hours or more). Articles I've read say you should start with around 30g of carbs close to your ride start and then every hour you can consume 30-60g carbs (but no more than that as your body cannot process more than 1g carb per minute of moderate exercise).
The problem is, like most of you I am trying to keep my carbs under 100g per day and by working this plan, I will be well over that just for my pre-ride meal and probably 3 snack breaks.
Some background. I am a Type 2 Diabetic and so I need to at least keep enough sugar in the tank to avoid a sugar low. The exercise groups say that carbs are the best fuel for biking as it is readily available energy.
What I'm wondering is are there any long distance riders or bikers here that have some experience with fueling for their rides/runs? Are you able to do keto or low carb without it causing sugar crashes during long exercise periods?
I am not doing Keto yet, just staying under 100g carbs which has made a huge difference in my diabetes fasting blood sugar readings.
Thanks for any help!
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Replies
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There are a couple of schools of thought on this:
1. Once you're actually fat adapted, you won't need much, if any in the way of extra carbs for the ride. Fat adaptation is actually superior for endurance activities, because your body adapts and can burn fat at higher heart rates. So, if you are finding that you do need fuel, you can eat something containing medium chain triglycerides (for quick fuel) and other fats and be fine. (See also: http://eatingacademy.com/how-a-low-carb-diet-affected-my-athletic-performance)
2. You'll be fine going a little over your carbs (if you need to) on days in which you go on long rides, because you'll be burning the carbs first. This is the case even if you're in a state of ketosis, because it's as much about consumption/use of that glucose as it is about the raw numbers. (See also: http://eatingacademy.com/sports-and-nutrition/ketones-carbohydrates-can-co-exist)
The fun part? Both of these are correct.
Yep, that's right, these two seemingly conflicting schools of thought are equally true and equally valid. The difference lies in how fat-adapted you are and whether you want to encourage that fat adaptation (and yes, you can do it even as a diabetic). You can even do a blend, especially at the level you're at. So, instead of consuming 30g of carbs, you may be able to consume 10g of carbs and 10 or 15g of fat. This gives you a blend of fuel that your body can use, without consuming a ton of carbs. You'll have to toy around with these numbers to see where you'd sit.0 -
Here is an older post that seems to have some good info in it though it will probably be more applicable once you have started keto and have had time to get adapted!
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10253528/exercise-snack#latest0 -
Before hard core work outs (burning 900+ calories), I find that a smaller amount of carbs - an apple or banana, are sufficient. I am prone to hypoglycemia, but it has improved greatly since keeping my daily carbs low. (Usually around 60 daily). I don't eat the fruit in addition to my daily carbs, but will move an afternoon Apple to the AM if I'm working out in the AM.
I find if I don't have a little carb before big workouts, I do get lightheaded. But I tweaked to find out the minimum amount of carb that I needed. And really during these workouts, I WANT to be burning fat for fuel! So I just want enough carb to prevent passing out.
I would recommend trying smaller amounts of carb & see how you do. Every body is different, so experimentation is key!
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Great advice and super fast! I am going to do some experimenting this weekend.
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We need kittens for this post
A long lost member, for those that didn't know him. Did long distance rides and did use some carbs. You may find some old posts a couple months back if you feel like digging. His name was KittensMaster
Come home kittens!0 -
This might sound weird, but when I was in ketosis before my trip to Iceland (where I ate whatever my hosts served me) I had more than enough physical energy for everything I was doing. Admittedly, my long bike rides were stationary as I'm still recovering from a broken bone in my knee, but I was doing long, vigorous sessions. It was only my brain that felt sluggish.
I just noticed that you're diabetic, so you might want to play this safe, especially if you use medication to lower your blood sugar. You can always take some carbohydrate snacks with you, as well as keto snacks. Good for you for using diet to control your diabetes.0 -
If you're fat adapted, you may not need any extra fuel for a 3hr ride.
What does "fat adapted" mean? It means that your muscles burn fat at exertion levels when they used to burn glycogen.
So we've all heard about the exercise "fat burning zone," right? Typically at a fairly low heart rate.
All "fat adaptation" means is that the "fat burning zone" gets wider.
Unless you're sprinting during that 3hr ride, you'll probably stay in the "fat burning zone" for the entire ride. You will burn very little glycogen, and you will probably need 0 carb intake to refill your glycogen stores.
But bring some snacks in case you get hungry.
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Some background. I am a Type 2 Diabetic and so I need to at least keep enough sugar in the tank to avoid a sugar low. The exercise groups say that carbs are the best fuel for biking as it is readily available energy.
Are you taking insulin, or a metformin combo drug? If not, you don't need to worry about sugar lows. True hypoglycemia doesn't occur in Type 2 diabetics who are not medicated, or only taking metformin.
I'm new to diabetes, from a personal standpoint, but not new since I've lived near or with people with both type 1 & type 2 for 50+ years.
I'm also a long distance biker (I've done 100 miles in a day) - but not since my diagnosis 4 weeks ago.
My meter drives the details of what I can eat in any one sitting - but I try to stick to below 50 net carbs a day. 3 week in, my blood sugars were absolutely normal (I haven't been above 120 in a week, and my fasting readings are below 100).
I don't know my total carb consumption will change the next time I do long distance biking. I'll have to play it by ear. I will try a relatively high (for me) carb meal and see what my blood glucose looks like an hour in, and then 2 hours in. Or I might even test at 30 minutes - just to see what the pattern is.
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I don't know my total carb consumption will change the next time I do long distance biking. I'll have to play it by ear. I will try a relatively high (for me) carb meal and see what my blood glucose looks like an hour in, and then 2 hours in. Or I might even test at 30 minutes - just to see what the pattern is.
Are you familiar with how endurance athletes use low-carb diets to increase fat-burning mitochondrial biogenesis?
If not, definitely look into it. One of the coolest aspects of low-carb physiological adaptation, IMO.
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »We need kittens for this post
A long lost member, for those that didn't know him. Did long distance rides and did use some carbs. You may find some old posts a couple months back if you feel like digging. His name was KittensMaster
Come home kittens!
Yes. Miss him! He used to eat a snickers bar before a long ride!0 -
He was a sprinter. He averaged close to 20mph on his rides. If you're going to sprint, a Snickers bar will help. 0
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Great advice and super fast! I am going to do some experimenting this weekend.
I do a lot of long distance cycling, but not that fast: I think I average about 20 - 22 km/h, because often I cycle fully loaded, carrying gear. Anyway, I used to think I needed carbs for that, turns out I was wrong. Last summer I did a couple of 100km days and lot of average distance days of about 60 - 80 km and I used MCT oil for energy, nuts, drank a lot and had a huge meal at the end of the day with lots of protein and fat. No problem. In fact, I was surprised at how much steady energy I had. If you want explosive sprints in races, or if you do a lot of intervals, it may be different. But for me, just covering the distance and keeping energy up all day: keto was awesome. No extra carbs were needed.0 -
@Dragonwolf's reply up top is sound advice. It depends on context. So read up on the links she gave youBefore hard core work outs (burning 900+ calories), I find that a smaller amount of carbs - an apple or banana, are sufficient.
(...)
I find if I don't have a little carb before big workouts, I do get lightheaded. But I tweaked to find out the minimum amount of carb that I needed. And really during these workouts, I WANT to be burning fat for fuel! So I just want enough carb to prevent passing out.
I would recommend trying smaller amounts of carb & see how you do. Every body is different, so experimentation is key!
Fruit is fructose, processed in liver. That sugar isn't touching the muscles, so eating fruit to «power workouts» is placebo.
Becoming lightheaded is usually about electrolytes, specifically too low sodium. Try up the lytes before training. If a massive bump in salt doesn't help you, consider revising your pre WO intake. r/ketogains.
I take a ts of salt in morning and also before training
I totally agree with you that experimenting w variables is the key to do sports and lchf!
Edit: Spellings and added in agreeing on experiments.
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I in no way cycle at any speed but i managed a 4.5 hours mooch fasted at the weekend, i was hungry at the end but still had energy.0
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Thankfully I do not take insulin, but I am on Metformin and Gluyburide. In the past I would get low blood sugar a lot on this combo, but as of late I have not had this problem, not even when riding longer distances.
I mapped out a 32.5 mile ride and decided to do the ride yesterday. I experimented with stopping every hour to have a break and a snack. Pre-ride I had a 2 egg omelette with cheese, 1 coffee and a banana. 1 hour in I had a cheese stick and a trail mix that I made myself that had about 40 carbs. I was going for between 30-40 carbs for every hour of exercise. Post exercise my Blood Sugar was at 165 but I always tend to run a little high after exercise (probably a reason why I don't need very many carbs during exercise). This morning I was back down to 99 so at least that was good.
Next weekend I have a similar ride planned so I think I'm going to dial back the carbs as I don't think they really made much of a difference.
I'll keep experimenting and reading through all the responses above. You guys are giving me some great info!
I am just trying to figure out how to best maintain energy throughout a long ride without killing my blood sugars. I am hoping by next spring/summer to do my first century and know to ride that long will require the proper fueling technique for my body.0 -
Foamroller wrote: »@Dragonwolf's reply up top is sound advice. It depends on context. So read up on the links she gave youBefore hard core work outs (burning 900+ calories), I find that a smaller amount of carbs - an apple or banana, are sufficient.
(...)
I find if I don't have a little carb before big workouts, I do get lightheaded. But I tweaked to find out the minimum amount of carb that I needed. And really during these workouts, I WANT to be burning fat for fuel! So I just want enough carb to prevent passing out.
I would recommend trying smaller amounts of carb & see how you do. Every body is different, so experimentation is key!
Fruit is fructose, processed in liver. That sugar isn't touching the muscles, so eating fruit to «power workouts» is placebo.
Becoming lightheaded is usually about electrolytes, specifically too low sodium. Try up the lytes before training. If a massive bump in salt doesn't help you, consider revising your pre WO intake. r/ketogains.
I take a ts of salt in morning and also before training
I totally agree with you that experimenting w variables is the key to do sports and lchf!
Edit: Spellings and added in agreeing on experiments.
Actually, contrary to popular belief, most fruits have a fair bit of glucose in them, and in some cases, they have more glucose than fructose.
http://thepaleodiet.com/fruits-and-sugars/0 -
Dragonwolf wrote: »Foamroller wrote: »@Dragonwolf's reply up top is sound advice. It depends on context. So read up on the links she gave youBefore hard core work outs (burning 900+ calories), I find that a smaller amount of carbs - an apple or banana, are sufficient.
(...)
I find if I don't have a little carb before big workouts, I do get lightheaded. But I tweaked to find out the minimum amount of carb that I needed. And really during these workouts, I WANT to be burning fat for fuel! So I just want enough carb to prevent passing out.
I would recommend trying smaller amounts of carb & see how you do. Every body is different, so experimentation is key!
Fruit is fructose, processed in liver. That sugar isn't touching the muscles, so eating fruit to «power workouts» is placebo.
Becoming lightheaded is usually about electrolytes, specifically too low sodium. Try up the lytes before training. If a massive bump in salt doesn't help you, consider revising your pre WO intake. r/ketogains.
I take a ts of salt in morning and also before training
I totally agree with you that experimenting w variables is the key to do sports and lchf!
Edit: Spellings and added in agreeing on experiments.
Actually, contrary to popular belief, most fruits have a fair bit of glucose in them, and in some cases, they have more glucose than fructose.
http://thepaleodiet.com/fruits-and-sugars/
Response to Foam, not dragon:
And also, if someone is prone to clinical low blood sugar (mine will dip to (30-40) during hard exercise) the piece of fruit literally makes a difference as to whether or not I stay conscious. I've had to pull off the road when driving home from workouts where I didn't have a small amount of carb - because i was losing vision. (Happens before I pass out). Please don't be so quick to call it placebo.
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Thankfully I do not take insulin, but I am on Metformin and Gluyburide. In the past I would get low blood sugar a lot on this combo, but as of late I have not had this problem, not even when riding longer distances.
The Gluyburide will do it (the low blood sugar) - it makes the pancreas dump more insulin in the bloodstream without regard to whether it is needed. And insulin does what insulin does - remove glucose, even if it is already in the right range. If/when I get to that stage, my doctor and I will have a serious conversation about using actual insulin that can be added when it is needed, rather than at inopportune times (plus it saves stress on an already sad pancreas).
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Thankfully I do not take insulin, but I am on Metformin and Gluyburide. In the past I would get low blood sugar a lot on this combo, but as of late I have not had this problem, not even when riding longer distances.
The Gluyburide will do it (the low blood sugar) - it makes the pancreas dump more insulin in the bloodstream without regard to whether it is needed. And insulin does what insulin does - remove glucose, even if it is already in the right range. If/when I get to that stage, my doctor and I will have a serious conversation about using actual insulin that can be added when it is needed, rather than at inopportune times (plus it saves stress on an already sad pancreas).
I've already cut my Glyburide dose in half when I noticed my sugars staying consistently low. Hoping to 86 the Glyburide completely in the next month or so. That will put more motivation on me to stick with my eating and exercise plan.0 -
I'm not diabetic, but my fasting blood glucose did drop from 111 to 83 on low carb. I run totally fasted. Usually less than an hour. I bike totally fasted. Also, usually under an hour, but up to 3hrs on occasion.
It may be different for diabetics, but I doubt it. As you discovered, exercise will raise your blood sugar, not lower it. That's due to cortisol signalling your liver to release glycogen.
At the same time, you are making ketones. Even at 100g/d of carbs, you are feeding your brain at least 30g/d of ketones.
I don't want you to risk passing out, but there have been reports of people on ketogenic diets whose blood sugar has dropped very low. And they didn't pass out.
On a high carb diet, your brain needs about 130g/d of carbs. On a low carb diet, that drops to about 40g/d. That alone gives you much more flexibility in your blood sugar levels, and that's not even true fat adaptation.
I'm reluctant to give you any advice, but I would guess that you could get by on the same level of carb intake as I do on my rides -- zero. Take some fast-acting glucose with you just in case, though.0
