December Q and A

Options
SideSteel
SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
Hey everyone!

This is the (early) Q&A thread for December.
I'll do what I can to check this thread regularly for those of you that have questions.

In return, please join my facebook group if you haven't already. You can find it here, and please do me a favor by sharing some of the posts.

Thanks!

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Eat-Train-Progress/1451299741759830
«134

Replies

  • amrelmesery
    amrelmesery Posts: 86 Member
    Options
    hey , i am not lifting right now , i do only cardio , should i eat the same amount of portion as the person who lifting?
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    Options
    hey , i am not lifting right now , i do only cardio , should i eat the same amount of portion as the person who lifting?

    I'm going to assume you meant "protein".

    And the answer to this is "it depends".

    I'm going to speak in generalizations here and I'm using voice text so this may have some errors.

    Protein is very satiating, so in that regard, you should still be consuming enough protein to effectively blunt hunger.

    The only two arguments I could see being made for reducing protein because you are not resistance training would be as follows:

    - at the same calorie intake, reducing protein allows you to eat more carbohydrates, and depending on the current status of your diet this may be favorable in some situations.

    - you may find a lower protein intake favorable for personal preference/adherence reasons.

    Keep in mind, I'm generalizing to talk about concepts.
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    edited November 2015
    Options
    Actually, a third potential reason could be financial.
  • amrelmesery
    amrelmesery Posts: 86 Member
    Options
    ok , i will make sure to get enough protein with good amount of carbs , thank you so much
  • andylllI
    andylllI Posts: 379 Member
    Options
    I've been trying to train cardiovascular endurance and strength at the same time but I'm running into issues with interference. So I was thinking of periodizing into a cardio block with 2x week full body complex barbell lifts for maintenance and a strength block 3-4 times a week either SS or eventually 5/3/1 with maybe one day of LSD/ steady state. My question is, how long does a block need to be to see benefit? 6 weeks? 8 weeks? 12 weeks?
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    Options
    andylllI wrote: »
    I've been trying to train cardiovascular endurance and strength at the same time but I'm running into issues with interference. So I was thinking of periodizing into a cardio block with 2x week full body complex barbell lifts for maintenance and a strength block 3-4 times a week either SS or eventually 5/3/1 with maybe one day of LSD/ steady state. My question is, how long does a block need to be to see benefit? 6 weeks? 8 weeks? 12 weeks?

    Can you clarify how you are determining that there's an interference effect taking place?

    What are you observing that leads you to this conclusion and what did your training look like?
  • StephieWillcox
    StephieWillcox Posts: 627 Member
    Options
    In one of the other threads you talk about autoregulation and RPE.

    I have no concept of RPE right now, I literally don't know if I could get another rep, or two, or another five. I am constantly surprised when I hit all the reps that I didn't think I could.

    Is this something that improves over time by itself or is this something that I should work on now? I.e. after a rep or two imagine how many more I think I could get and then test it?

    I ask because in January I am looking to move on from stronglifts, I'm finding it extremely taxing to squat at my max 3 times a week and had thought of moving on to Madcow to at least remove one heavy day of squats.

    But now I am wondering if an autoregulated programme would be better (I have found at least one online that appeals to me - PowerliftingToWin, if you have heard of that before)

  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    Options
    In one of the other threads you talk about autoregulation and RPE.

    I have no concept of RPE right now, I literally don't know if I could get another rep, or two, or another five. I am constantly surprised when I hit all the reps that I didn't think I could.

    Is this something that improves over time by itself or is this something that I should work on now? I.e. after a rep or two imagine how many more I think I could get and then test it?

    I ask because in January I am looking to move on from stronglifts, I'm finding it extremely taxing to squat at my max 3 times a week and had thought of moving on to Madcow to at least remove one heavy day of squats.

    But now I am wondering if an autoregulated programme would be better (I have found at least one online that appeals to me - PowerliftingToWin, if you have heard of that before)

    A few things:
    I really like PowerliftingtoWin. They put out awesome content and I'm surprised it's not talked about more often. Damn solid material IMO, having said that I've not looked into their programs, just their videos and articles on leverages.

    The ability to perceive how many reps you have left, or estimate how many pounds you have in the tank, is a skill and I also think some people may be naturally better at it than others. But because it's a skill it's something that needs to be practiced.

    In my opinion, a good way to attempt to do this is to start with a non-autoregulated program and log an RPE after the fact so you can start documenting where you THINK you were at for RPE. Simply doing this will build awareness and it starts there.

    Another technique you could consider, but you'd want to implement this carfeully, would be to get a spotter and test some rep maxes by doing AMRAP sets. So for example if you took an estimated 3 rep max load and took it to complete failure (and/or a 5rm, 8rm etc) and use these as benchmarks.

    Finally, as it pertains to SL, I'm totally with you on that. This is one reason why I prefer to program a bit differently even for beginners when it comes to squatting. Right now I tend to program it such that mixed rep ranges and intensities are used throughout the week primarily because it gets away from the anxiety/grind of constantly lifting heavy *kitten* weights every session.

    The only time I'll use a classical 3x5 or 5x5 linear model would be someone who wants to get as strong as possible as fast as possible and has the right mindset for it.

    Now, with some exceptions as I will sometimes have someone run a short cycle, like 4-6 weeks of a 5x5, but it's sort of a get-in, get-out quick type of thing.

    Let me know if this answers your questions, I sort of rambled there.....
  • DopeItUp
    DopeItUp Posts: 18,771 Member
    edited December 2015
    Options
    SideSteel wrote: »
    In one of the other threads you talk about autoregulation and RPE.

    I have no concept of RPE right now, I literally don't know if I could get another rep, or two, or another five. I am constantly surprised when I hit all the reps that I didn't think I could.

    Is this something that improves over time by itself or is this something that I should work on now? I.e. after a rep or two imagine how many more I think I could get and then test it?

    I ask because in January I am looking to move on from stronglifts, I'm finding it extremely taxing to squat at my max 3 times a week and had thought of moving on to Madcow to at least remove one heavy day of squats.

    But now I am wondering if an autoregulated programme would be better (I have found at least one online that appeals to me - PowerliftingToWin, if you have heard of that before)

    A few things:
    I really like PowerliftingtoWin. They put out awesome content and I'm surprised it's not talked about more often. Damn solid material IMO, having said that I've not looked into their programs, just their videos and articles on leverages.

    The ability to perceive how many reps you have left, or estimate how many pounds you have in the tank, is a skill and I also think some people may be naturally better at it than others. But because it's a skill it's something that needs to be practiced.

    In my opinion, a good way to attempt to do this is to start with a non-autoregulated program and log an RPE after the fact so you can start documenting where you THINK you were at for RPE. Simply doing this will build awareness and it starts there.

    Another technique you could consider, but you'd want to implement this carfeully, would be to get a spotter and test some rep maxes by doing AMRAP sets. So for example if you took an estimated 3 rep max load and took it to complete failure (and/or a 5rm, 8rm etc) and use these as benchmarks.

    Finally, as it pertains to SL, I'm totally with you on that. This is one reason why I prefer to program a bit differently even for beginners when it comes to squatting. Right now I tend to program it such that mixed rep ranges and intensities are used throughout the week primarily because it gets away from the anxiety/grind of constantly lifting heavy *kitten* weights every session.

    The only time I'll use a classical 3x5 or 5x5 linear model would be someone who wants to get as strong as possible as fast as possible and has the right mindset for it.

    Now, with some exceptions as I will sometimes have someone run a short cycle, like 4-6 weeks of a 5x5, but it's sort of a get-in, get-out quick type of thing.

    Let me know if this answers your questions, I sort of rambled there.....

    I'm a big fan of training to failure from time to time. IMO, it's basically the only way to truly judge RPE. Most people lie to themselves or their bodies/minds lie to them.

    As an anecdote, it's one of the things that made a huge difference in my squat training. My squats weren't progressing at all, so one day I gathered up the balls to just keep doing reps until I couldn't do them anymore. Turns out, what I thought was my 3RM weight was actually my 5RM weight. Sure I was shaking on rep 3 and felt like death but I could actually do two more reps (despite barely even being able to see anymore). Adding two more reps at that (seemingly) max-effort level is a huge difference in training. I was effectively mailing in all of my squat workouts because I wasn't pushing myself. This realization and change eventually allowed me to make pretty big progressions last year and this year.
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    Options
    ^ That all seems reasonable and it's probably the best argument for taking any of the big 3 to failure.
  • andylllI
    andylllI Posts: 379 Member
    Options
    SideSteel wrote: »
    andylllI wrote: »
    I've been trying to train cardiovascular endurance and strength at the same time but I'm running into issues with interference. So I was thinking of periodizing into a cardio block with 2x week full body complex barbell lifts for maintenance and a strength block 3-4 times a week either SS or eventually 5/3/1 with maybe one day of LSD/ steady state. My question is, how long does a block need to be to see benefit? 6 weeks? 8 weeks? 12 weeks?

    Can you clarify how you are determining that there's an interference effect taking place?

    What are you observing that leads you to this conclusion and what did your training look like?

    Basically a lack of recovery leading to stalling on lifts for over a month at a time and general fatigue.

    Training looked like this:
    M: easy cardio to and from work on the bike 45 min; 3x5 squat, bench, deadlift, pull up, hip thrusts
    T: 45 min cycle commute, evening steady state (65% MHR) 90 min
    W: cycle commute 45 min, 3x5 squat, OHP, row, chin-ups
    Th: one hour with trainer working on form light weight, some HIIT
    F: rest
    Sat: 3x5 squat bench deadlift pull up
    Sun: steady state 65% MHR 90 min

    I figured lack of recovery after I spent 2 months at a 120 lb squat (BW 145). I expected all kinds of stalling on upper body lifts, bc of my gender, but the squat stall I blamed on running and biking.

    I wasn't doing any tempo work at the time so I don't know if the weight training was interfering with cardio adaptation because I wasn't keeping track of times or distances.
  • StephieWillcox
    StephieWillcox Posts: 627 Member
    Options
    @SideSteel & @DopeItUp

    Thanks for both your input - I think I am going to have to pull up my big girl pants to test my maxes - I would most likely take my current 3x5 working weight (I have already dropped 5x5 to 3x5 because it was taking over an hour to get my training done), and see how many reps I can get.

    I completely agree on the squats Dope - after 2 reps at yesterday's working weight I just thought there was no way I'd be able to finish, but I did, and it wasn't a complete grind so maybe I could have got even more.

    Won't be a problem to get a spot for bench as my immediate colleagues train in the same gym, at the same time, on the same equipment :#

    I am pleased I used SL5x5 to start out with, in less than 2 months I am shocked at the weight on the bar, and without the incessant progression of SL I wouldn't have added that much myself, I would have been far too cautious.

    PowerliftingToWin has a lot of routines available - I won't replicate them here, but I did get them for nothing initially (you can pay as little/much as you want and since I am not a powerlifter and not training for competition I had no idea if it would be suitable for me). They start with "Starting strength" type routines and then start to introduce autoregulation.

    I would be using the "autoregulated novice" routine which (from my reading) is:

    Monday/Friday
    Squat, Bench, DL using "load drop"
    Working up to a weight where you get 2 - 6 reps with one in the tank, then dropping the weight and doing as many sets of the same reps as you got in your working set until you reach 9 RPE again

    Wednesday
    2 count pause squats and bench using "repeat" autoregulation where you get 2 - 6 reps at RPE8 and then do sets with the same weight/reps until you get to RPE9

    There is also some other work done on tuesday's and saturday's (row/abs/curl/conditioning/mobility) which is all lighter stuff, I would either have to do that on tuesday and thursday, or only do it once per week (I'm guessing once would be enough for me!!)

    That turned into a bit of an essay, so sorry for that!
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,391 MFP Moderator
    Options
    First love these q&a's.


    What squat would you recommend to do instead of front squat? I am currently doing PHUL and it calls for front squat on the hypertrophy upper day and i do back squat on power upper. But since i have tendinitis in my arms, front squat seems to flare it a bit.
  • _benjammin
    _benjammin Posts: 1,224 Member
    Options
    psulemon wrote: »
    First love these q&a's.


    What squat would you recommend to do instead of front squat? I am currently doing PHUL and it calls for front squat on the hypertrophy upper day and i do back squat on power upper. But since i have tendinitis in my arms, front squat seems to flare it a bit.

    Patrick does my programming and had programmed front squats as an accessory. I politely declined doing those so he said do a unilateral Squat accessory. I had no idea what that meant. Found this Brett Contreras article on the 10 best: https://www.t-nation.com/training/10-best-unilateral-exercises

    I'm guessing one of those would suffice for you too.
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    Options
    psulemon wrote: »
    First love these q&a's.


    What squat would you recommend to do instead of front squat? I am currently doing PHUL and it calls for front squat on the hypertrophy upper day and i do back squat on power upper. But since i have tendinitis in my arms, front squat seems to flare it a bit.
    psulemon wrote: »
    First love these q&a's.


    What squat would you recommend to do instead of front squat? I am currently doing PHUL and it calls for front squat on the hypertrophy upper day and i do back squat on power upper. But since i have tendinitis in my arms, front squat seems to flare it a bit.

    This is one of those things that could have plenty of reasonable answers.

    Depending on goals and what the rest of your program looks like you could just do more back squats. You could safety bar squat if you have access to one. You might be able to goblet squat in higher rep ranges, you could look at unilateral options but again it depends on your goals and what the program looks like.
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    Options
    Also does grip effect the issue?
  • DopeItUp
    DopeItUp Posts: 18,771 Member
    edited December 2015
    Options
    SideSteel wrote: »
    psulemon wrote: »
    First love these q&a's.


    What squat would you recommend to do instead of front squat? I am currently doing PHUL and it calls for front squat on the hypertrophy upper day and i do back squat on power upper. But since i have tendinitis in my arms, front squat seems to flare it a bit.
    psulemon wrote: »
    First love these q&a's.


    What squat would you recommend to do instead of front squat? I am currently doing PHUL and it calls for front squat on the hypertrophy upper day and i do back squat on power upper. But since i have tendinitis in my arms, front squat seems to flare it a bit.

    This is one of those things that could have plenty of reasonable answers.

    Depending on goals and what the rest of your program looks like you could just do more back squats. You could safety bar squat if you have access to one. You might be able to goblet squat in higher rep ranges, you could look at unilateral options but again it depends on your goals and what the program looks like.

    All of this, except I'll add: where is the tendonitis? You could just do front squats with a crossed-arm grip if that works for you.

    big-front-squat.jpg
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,391 MFP Moderator
    edited December 2015
    Options
    SideSteel wrote: »
    Also does grip effect the issue?

    The grip tends to be my biggest issues. Anytime my wrist go 90° or more it starts to become and issue. I am working on yoga and other stuff to strength as much as possible but barbell weight makes it difficult.


    Goals - right now i am in a cut and working on strength up a bit. I got to a gym which has a good amount of equipment to include trx bands, and 4 different barbells (hex, 45lb straight, 35lb straight and ez curl bar). There is a squat rack, an assisted squat bar and a variety of other machines, dumbbells and kettlebells
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,391 MFP Moderator
    Options
    DopeItUp wrote: »
    SideSteel wrote: »
    psulemon wrote: »
    First love these q&a's.


    What squat would you recommend to do instead of front squat? I am currently doing PHUL and it calls for front squat on the hypertrophy upper day and i do back squat on power upper. But since i have tendinitis in my arms, front squat seems to flare it a bit.
    psulemon wrote: »
    First love these q&a's.


    What squat would you recommend to do instead of front squat? I am currently doing PHUL and it calls for front squat on the hypertrophy upper day and i do back squat on power upper. But since i have tendinitis in my arms, front squat seems to flare it a bit.

    This is one of those things that could have plenty of reasonable answers.

    Depending on goals and what the rest of your program looks like you could just do more back squats. You could safety bar squat if you have access to one. You might be able to goblet squat in higher rep ranges, you could look at unilateral options but again it depends on your goals and what the program looks like.

    All of this, except I'll add: where is the tendonitis? You could just do front squats with a crossed-arm grip if that works for you.

    big-front-squat.jpg

    Thanks dope, its mainly in my wrist, but occasionally get pains throughout my forearms.

    This is one variation i have tried and wasnt successful in the execution (bad form). So i hage to build up before doing this.
  • christch
    christch Posts: 238 Member
    Options
    Just a side question about front squats, because i am tall 5'10 and have long legs and a longer back then the average woman I find it difficult to squat at parallel or below under weight. I'm squatting 50kg now and when I do goblet squats (20 kg) I can go alot lower. I've read different articles about having to squat lower to get most benefit or you're just wasting your time. I've only been squatting with bar 4 weeks now. I have had to work hard on glutes and hip flexors in past.
    Is it OK to not get to parallel or to do box front squats, I'm a bit worried I'll squat to deep and get stuck or do I deload weight and go for depth not weight?