Bench Press - Failing at the Bottom
JTick
Posts: 2,131 Member
Hi All -
I am struggling with progressing my bench press - I fail at my chest. I am working on some form issues (moving to flat footed bench instead of on my toes, which so far seems to really be helping my leg drive), but I am curious if there are any specific accessory lifts I could add. I feel as though I can control the weight well on the way down, but as soon as I touch my chest it's like I lose all tightness and can't get it moving again, even when I am attempting touch and go. Thoughts?
TIA
I am struggling with progressing my bench press - I fail at my chest. I am working on some form issues (moving to flat footed bench instead of on my toes, which so far seems to really be helping my leg drive), but I am curious if there are any specific accessory lifts I could add. I feel as though I can control the weight well on the way down, but as soon as I touch my chest it's like I lose all tightness and can't get it moving again, even when I am attempting touch and go. Thoughts?
TIA
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Replies
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Have you tried Spoto Presses?
http://www.muscleandfitness.com/workouts/chest-exercises/bench-big-get-big-spoto-press
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_benjammin wrote: »Have you tried Spoto Presses?
http://www.muscleandfitness.com/workouts/chest-exercises/bench-big-get-big-spoto-press
I have not - will start working on these. Thanks!0 -
Do you happen to have any video of you benching? I found that I wasn't setting up properly, thus lacking tightness in my LATS to help with the movement.0
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_benjammin wrote: »Have you tried Spoto Presses?
http://www.muscleandfitness.com/workouts/chest-exercises/bench-big-get-big-spoto-press
Paused bench is good too (almost the same thing as a Spoto press). Jmule's talk of lat engagement is a big one too. Tucking your elbows at the bottom of the lift will help with that. You'll really feel your lats activate then.0 -
I'd also like to see a video if possible.
How wide is your grip?
One of my clients was at max legal width and it was great if she could get the bar in motion but she would stick on the chest too.
We narrowed her grip just a touch for this training cycle and added more paused work and that's helped.0 -
Hi All -
Thanks for the feedback. I will try to get a video this weekend - the videos I have are pretty old.
SS: I think I do a neutral grip. It's definitely not wide. I've actually been trying to get it a little bit wider as it felt pretty narrow and was killing my triceps.0 -
If you video, get your initial set-up too. As the others mentioned, Lat tightness makes a big differences. If you aren't getting your lats tight during set-up, you never will. You may feel tight on the way down but as you've mentioned, can't seem to stay tight on the the press, you might not actually be getting completely tight to start.0
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_benjammin wrote: »If you video, get your initial set-up too. As the others mentioned, Lat tightness makes a big differences. If you aren't getting your lats tight during set-up, you never will. You may feel tight on the way down but as you've mentioned, can't seem to stay tight on the the press, you might not actually be getting completely tight to start.
i would agree with this..I had issues with my bench and re did my entire set up and have seen some nice strength gains….
i found this article pretty helpful..
https://www.muscleandstrength.com/expert-guides/bench-press-mistakes0 -
^^ thanks - always looking for tips with bench0
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_benjammin wrote: »If you video, get your initial set-up too. As the others mentioned, Lat tightness makes a big differences. If you aren't getting your lats tight during set-up, you never will. You may feel tight on the way down but as you've mentioned, can't seem to stay tight on the the press, you might not actually be getting completely tight to start.
i would agree with this..I had issues with my bench and re did my entire set up and have seen some nice strength gains….
i found this article pretty helpful..
https://www.muscleandstrength.com/expert-guides/bench-press-mistakes
This article was super helpful - thank you so much. My grip was much too narrow, and I wasn't squeezing the bar at all. I've found that since I've widened my grip out, my bar path is significantly better and more consistent.
@SideSteel and @jmule24 - I was finally able to get some video tonight - I did both my setup and a set of 115lbx5. I worked up to 145x3, and then backed off to 115 for volume.
Here's the setup - I set my butt, set my shoulders, set my feet, retract my shoulder blades, and roll. There is quite a bit about my technique that's new - flat feet, wider grip, and working on timing my leg drive better. I've also added the Smolov presses and pin presses into my accessory work and I'm really liking both of those. They're ridiculously hard, which tells me I need to work on them more.
And here's the bench - 115x5 touch and go.0 -
Couple minor things. Your elbows are a bit flared out. Are you able to tuck them in a bit closer. Engaging my lats is how I'm able to accomplish this.
I would recommend trying a slightly different setup order. Get your hands on the bar, then positions your shoulders, and finally get your butt and feet set last.
Lastly, your butt is coming off the bench if you plan on competing you will need to make sure your butt stays planted.0 -
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Couple minor things. Your elbows are a bit flared out. Are you able to tuck them in a bit closer. Engaging my lats is how I'm able to accomplish this.
Yeah it looks pretty good but this is what I'd work on. Tuck those elbows at the bottom and get those lats engaged. Bar path will come down lower on the chest and you'll be pushing up and back a bit. Went from 295 to 325 on my bench in a couple months once that whole tuck/lat thing clicked for me.0 -
Couple minor things. Your elbows are a bit flared out. Are you able to tuck them in a bit closer. Engaging my lats is how I'm able to accomplish this.
Yeah it looks pretty good but this is what I'd work on. Tuck those elbows at the bottom and get those lats engaged. Bar path will come down lower on the chest and you'll be pushing up and back a bit. Went from 295 to 325 on my bench in a couple months once that whole tuck/lat thing clicked for me.
Thanks for the critiques - but I seriously cannot figure out the tuck thing. Should they be coming closer to my body, or pointed more towards my feet? I have tried to figure it out several times, but the only thing that seems to happen is I lose all control of the bar path.0 -
Couple minor things. Your elbows are a bit flared out. Are you able to tuck them in a bit closer. Engaging my lats is how I'm able to accomplish this.
Yeah it looks pretty good but this is what I'd work on. Tuck those elbows at the bottom and get those lats engaged. Bar path will come down lower on the chest and you'll be pushing up and back a bit. Went from 295 to 325 on my bench in a couple months once that whole tuck/lat thing clicked for me.
Thanks for the critiques - but I seriously cannot figure out the tuck thing. Should they be coming closer to my body, or pointed more towards my feet? I have tried to figure it out several times, but the only thing that seems to happen is I lose all control of the bar path.
One thing you can attempt would be to just focus on touching slightly lower on your torso with the barbell. About 2".
One of two things will happen -- you will either tuck your elbows automatically or you will get way out of position and it will suck *kitten*.
But as far as tucking the elbows:
Decrease the angle between the humerus and the torso. (A flared elbow is one such that the angle between the upper arm segment and the torso is approaching 90 degrees. A tucked elbow is such that the angle approaches zero). I actually wouldn't tuck a lot, but reducing that angle slightly may be beneficial for shoulder health and for getting the bar in motion at the bottom of the press.
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As far as your setup goes, it looks pretty solid.
One thing I think you could improve would be to get more hip extension by getting your feet even slightly further under you more. You look like you have room to do it and I say that because your butt comes off the bench a bit (at least it appears to).
You could try finding the proper foot placement before you tuck under the bar so that once your feet start out in place, they stay down. So basically you set your feet first and once they are down they never leave that footprint so you maintain that tension as you're packing yourself into the bench.
A lot of this is personal preference though. I used to set up in such a way that my feet were placed last in the setup but it's not as tight for me.
Think of it like packing a spring in a way. You're setting your feet first and stuffing yourself underneath the barbell. If you move your feet off of the ground at any point during the setup you're losing tension.
Alternatively if you don't want to make any major changes to your setup method, you could just try to move your feet slightly further under you and if you lack the ankle mobility just rotate the foot as you set it down (so the heels are going inwards) as this will give you a bit more room.
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dupe post0
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Couple minor things. Your elbows are a bit flared out. Are you able to tuck them in a bit closer. Engaging my lats is how I'm able to accomplish this.
Yeah it looks pretty good but this is what I'd work on. Tuck those elbows at the bottom and get those lats engaged. Bar path will come down lower on the chest and you'll be pushing up and back a bit. Went from 295 to 325 on my bench in a couple months once that whole tuck/lat thing clicked for me.
Thanks for the critiques - but I seriously cannot figure out the tuck thing. Should they be coming closer to my body, or pointed more towards my feet? I have tried to figure it out several times, but the only thing that seems to happen is I lose all control of the bar path.
Take an empty bar (or something light) and bench press. Try to touch your elbows to your sides (ribs) as you lower the bar (do it slowly so you can really concentrate). Feel how your lats are activating while you're doing this. Bar path will have to go south towards your feet to maintain balance. This will happen naturally, don't have to think about it too much.
Or SS's recommendation, which is basically the same thing in reverse (force bar path south, elbows will have to tuck to accommodate balance of bar).
If you have access to a Slingshot this can be great for queuing, since it forces your elbows in at the bottom due to its design.
You'll notice almost every great powerlifter does this, and for good reason. You can move more weight and you will have lower shoulder injury risks. The only people who flare their elbows a lot like you, tend to have (and/or want) major pec development. But risks are high.0 -
I'm going to assume with the above reply, you're suggesting this is a training drill to feel the lats and not suggesting that she tuck her elbows all the way into her sides on an actual bench press.
As far as getting the sensation of tightening your lats another thing you can do is attempt to bend the bar in half which should cause shoulder internal rotation.0 -
I'm going to assume with the above reply, you're suggesting this is a training drill to feel the lats and not suggesting that she tuck her elbows all the way into her sides on an actual bench press.
As far as getting the sensation of tightening your lats another thing you can do is attempt to bend the bar in half which should cause shoulder internal rotation.
Correct, sorry for not being clear. Hence using a light weight just to get a feel for what's happening.0 -
Re Feet and assuming you are training for a competion that requires flat feet. I've tried the getting feet set first but never got comfortable and consistent. What I've found works for me is getting setup and pretty tight on my toes, moving around my toes/feet till the poison feels right, then locking my heels down, that really tightens my arch and lats into the bench. YMMV0
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I've read repeatedly to try to bend the bar in half, but query: are you trying to bend the bar as if your pinkies are bending down (moving the center of the bar perpendicular away from the floor, making an arch from the perspective of an outside observer) or for your pinkies to bend up (making a letter U of the bar)? For that matter, is the bend parallel with the ground, making either an arch or a letter U from the perspective of you the bencher?
I must be doing something wrong when I bring my elbows next to my ribs while benching, because it feels to me I'm working strictly my front delts and tris but not my chest. Considering I hurt my front delts over the summer, that makes me rather nervous.
While we're talking bench, what's your take on having the bar touch the chest? Is it an absolute requirement for non-competitors? My left shoulder rapidly loses strength if I bend it behind me, thus I avoid dips and only bring the bar down on a bench press far enough so my upper arm is parallel with the ground, which leaves the bar typically an inch or two above my chest. I can go lower and actually make contact during warmup sets of 50% 1RM or less, but heavier than that begins to hurt.
Clear as mud?0 -
I've read repeatedly to try to bend the bar in half, but query: are you trying to bend the bar as if your pinkies are bending down (moving the center of the bar perpendicular away from the floor, making an arch from the perspective of an outside observer) or for your pinkies to bend up (making a letter U of the bar)? For that matter, is the bend parallel with the ground, making either an arch or a letter U from the perspective of you the bencher?
I must be doing something wrong when I bring my elbows next to my ribs while benching, because it feels to me I'm working strictly my front delts and tris but not my chest. Considering I hurt my front delts over the summer, that makes me rather nervous.
While we're talking bench, what's your take on having the bar touch the chest? Is it an absolute requirement for non-competitors? My left shoulder rapidly loses strength if I bend it behind me, thus I avoid dips and only bring the bar down on a bench press far enough so my upper arm is parallel with the ground, which leaves the bar typically an inch or two above my chest. I can go lower and actually make contact during warmup sets of 50% 1RM or less, but heavier than that begins to hurt.
Clear as mud?
Everything I've ever read says basically "full ROM or GTFO" but if you have an injury, what can you do? I'd probably worry more about fixing your shoulder than anything.
BTW, I believe most pec engagement is at the bottom of the press so if you're having trouble with full ROM and only feeling it in your delts and tris then the two things could be related.
Jason Blaha has done some videos on this recently that I can think of:
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To help with my elbow tuck I imagine I'm spreading the bar apart when I working lighter weights.
Also I would think the sling shots help address this as well, though I haven't tried one.0
http://youtu.be/K6xRILfJw24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_CTp7H7bK4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrmyZDumJow