Hal Higdons Novice 1 Marathon Plan
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FL_Hiker
Posts: 919 Member
Hi yall,
I'm currently training for a marathon on Janurary 27th, I started running again back in August (did track, cross country, swimming for 12 years prior to that then took a break from it all when I went to college) . Right now i'm on week 12 of the Hal Higdons Novice 1 Marathon training plan, this past Saturday I finished the long 16 mile run and felt great, I was actually bummed out when I had to head back home already I wanted to keep running! My times are consistently getting faster and I feel like I can run forever, I really love this plan! However I notice as i'm getting closer to taper week that the plan doesn't even reach above a 20 mile long run, I have so much extra time to prepare I wonder if it would be a good idea to continue to increase mileage in the pattern the plan has been following? (ex. increase short runs by a mile or two each week, hold for 2 weeks and increase long runs for a couple miles each week then step down?) Or would that increase my chances of injury? I also know that the week of Christmas I will likely be taking off an entire week since we're going up to the mountains and it will possibly be too dangerous to run on the ice (FL girl here without any cold weather equipment);. However I plan on hiking a lot while we're up there and hopefully play in the snow! Will taking an entire week off of running hurt me too badly? Chances are i'll probably get sick another week too since it's winter... so far I haven't missed a single training day.
Thanks for your help
I'm currently training for a marathon on Janurary 27th, I started running again back in August (did track, cross country, swimming for 12 years prior to that then took a break from it all when I went to college) . Right now i'm on week 12 of the Hal Higdons Novice 1 Marathon training plan, this past Saturday I finished the long 16 mile run and felt great, I was actually bummed out when I had to head back home already I wanted to keep running! My times are consistently getting faster and I feel like I can run forever, I really love this plan! However I notice as i'm getting closer to taper week that the plan doesn't even reach above a 20 mile long run, I have so much extra time to prepare I wonder if it would be a good idea to continue to increase mileage in the pattern the plan has been following? (ex. increase short runs by a mile or two each week, hold for 2 weeks and increase long runs for a couple miles each week then step down?) Or would that increase my chances of injury? I also know that the week of Christmas I will likely be taking off an entire week since we're going up to the mountains and it will possibly be too dangerous to run on the ice (FL girl here without any cold weather equipment);. However I plan on hiking a lot while we're up there and hopefully play in the snow! Will taking an entire week off of running hurt me too badly? Chances are i'll probably get sick another week too since it's winter... so far I haven't missed a single training day.
Thanks for your help
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Replies
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I would not expect a beginner plan to run farther than 20 miles; that is the traditional longest distance for US based marathon training plans. Hard core, advanced plans may run 22 miles; plans that run a full 26 miles are outliers.
But that's just the United States. Apparently European runners consider a 30K long run sufficient for marathon preparation.
So why 20 miles or 30K? Because they're nice round numbers, and short enough that recovery time is reasonable.
I would advise someone training for a first marathon not to attempt a training run of over 20 miles, just save that for race day. Use the extra time to plateau at the level of distance your plan has before taper, with cutback weeks in the same pattern that you had them while building mileage.
Don't worry about losing conditioning when you take that week off. Assuming this is the first time you've been running this much volume, having a week off at that point is likely to be more valuable for injury avoidance than costly from loss of conditioning. Hiking is good for that week; it will work supporting muscles in a different way than running does.3 -
I would not expect a beginner plan to run farther than 20 miles; that is the traditional longest distance for US based marathon training plans. Hard core, advanced plans may run 22 miles; plans that run a full 26 miles are outliers.
But that's just the United States. Apparently European runners consider a 30K long run sufficient for marathon preparation.
So why 20 miles or 30K? Because they're nice round numbers, and short enough that recovery time is reasonable.
I would advise someone training for a first marathon not to attempt a training run of over 20 miles, just save that for race day. Use the extra time to plateau at the level of distance your plan has before taper, with cutback weeks in the same pattern that you had them while building mileage.
Don't worry about losing conditioning when you take that week off. Assuming this is the first time you've been running this much volume, having a week off at that point is likely to be more valuable for injury avoidance than costly from loss of conditioning. Hiking is good for that week; it will work supporting muscles in a different way than running does.I would not expect a beginner plan to run farther than 20 miles; that is the traditional longest distance for US based marathon training plans. Hard core, advanced plans may run 22 miles; plans that run a full 26 miles are outliers.
But that's just the United States. Apparently European runners consider a 30K long run sufficient for marathon preparation.
So why 20 miles or 30K? Because they're nice round numbers, and short enough that recovery time is reasonable.
I would advise someone training for a first marathon not to attempt a training run of over 20 miles, just save that for race day. Use the extra time to plateau at the level of distance your plan has before taper, with cutback weeks in the same pattern that you had them while building mileage.
Don't worry about losing conditioning when you take that week off. Assuming this is the first time you've been running this much volume, having a week off at that point is likely to be more valuable for injury avoidance than costly from loss of conditioning. Hiking is good for that week; it will work supporting muscles in a different way than running does.
Wow great advice, thank you for your input! That all makes a lot of sense.0 -
I agree. 1) a week off, especially with cross training, won't hurt you. 2) Follow the plan. Most marathon plans don't go above 20 miles because it takes time to recover from runs that are more than 3 hours long.
A third point: Don't race your training. Keep your easy runs easy. It's fun to watch your speed pick up, but for a first race especially, working on building endurance is the key.3 -
I've only run one marathon (with second booked for April 2019) so I cannot offer you a wealth of experience, but I enjoy doing my research and the majority of what I've read is consistent - that for amateur marathon runners, 32kms is a wise upper limit. This being because that distance really takes a toll on the body and so going further has potential issues; 1) you risk injury and 2) you'll need significant recovery which can impede upon your training.
Like you I have been enjoying recently seeing my long run times tumble. Spiriteagle above cautioned against turning those easy runs into harder efforts - quite right too. That note of caution made me go check my garmin data to ensure I haven't been exerting more than I think. If you have that heart rate data too, it might be worth examining that for extra confidence.
Regarding your week off, I personally would follow that week of rest with my final 20m/32km runs. I can't think of anything more confidence boosting for the race itself than knowing how it felt to do 32kms on rested legs.
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spiriteagle99 wrote: »I agree. 1) a week off, especially with cross training, won't hurt you. 2) Follow the plan. Most marathon plans don't go above 20 miles because it takes time to recover from runs that are more than 3 hours long.
A third point: Don't race your training. Keep your easy runs easy. It's fun to watch your speed pick up, but for a first race especially, working on building endurance is the key.
So even on the short runs (4,5 milers) I shouldn’t be sprinting?? And on the long runs I shouldn’t be pushing myself?0 -
spiriteagle99 wrote: »I agree. 1) a week off, especially with cross training, won't hurt you. 2) Follow the plan. Most marathon plans don't go above 20 miles because it takes time to recover from runs that are more than 3 hours long.
A third point: Don't race your training. Keep your easy runs easy. It's fun to watch your speed pick up, but for a first race especially, working on building endurance is the key.
So even on the short runs (4,5 milers) I shouldn’t be sprinting?? And on the long runs I shouldn’t be pushing myself?
For a first time marathoner, speed work isn't necessary, but if you feel like you want to do a faster run, I would limit it to once per week. And definitely not "sprinting", but maybe some fast intervals or a tempo run which is pushing yourself to a comfortably hard pace for several miles after a slow warm up.
Here's the thing. It's great that you had an nice run on your first 16 miler, but this is where the training actually starts to get real. You will start to feel the cumulative effects of these long runs adding up in the next 4-6 weeks. As others have said, the key to a successful marathon is allowing for recovery and not pushing yourself to the point of injury. There is a fine line there and I am sure there are dozens upon dozens of runners on these boards that can attest to that.3 -
spiriteagle99 wrote: »I agree. 1) a week off, especially with cross training, won't hurt you. 2) Follow the plan. Most marathon plans don't go above 20 miles because it takes time to recover from runs that are more than 3 hours long.
A third point: Don't race your training. Keep your easy runs easy. It's fun to watch your speed pick up, but for a first race especially, working on building endurance is the key.
So even on the short runs (4,5 milers) I shouldn’t be sprinting?? And on the long runs I shouldn’t be pushing myself?
Remember when I asked you the other week about speed work? That was why...0 -
TavistockToad wrote: »spiriteagle99 wrote: »I agree. 1) a week off, especially with cross training, won't hurt you. 2) Follow the plan. Most marathon plans don't go above 20 miles because it takes time to recover from runs that are more than 3 hours long.
A third point: Don't race your training. Keep your easy runs easy. It's fun to watch your speed pick up, but for a first race especially, working on building endurance is the key.
So even on the short runs (4,5 milers) I shouldn’t be sprinting?? And on the long runs I shouldn’t be pushing myself?
Remember when I asked you the other week about speed work? That was why...
Gotcha lol. I don’t sprint purposefully, I just really hate the short runs and try to get them over with as quickly as possible 😕.1 -
Okay I have another question... I originally asked about increasing the distance of the long run. Would it be just as detrimental to increase overall weekly volume? Say on the short run days throw in another short run later in the day and do two work outs a day? Last week was the 18 miler and I think around 36 miles total, I don't really feel like i'm being challenged enough. I'm getting a bit bored and would like to do more (not to mention the weather is getting beautiful, I want to get out there more!).. but don't want to hurt myself either. Should I not go over a certain volume of mileage per week? Better to just stick to the plan ? Thoughts?
Thanks for your help again 0 -
When I did my first marathon, I started with Higdon's Intermediate 2 because it fit the mileage I was running at the time (about 35 mpw) and the ramp up to 50 wasn't going to be too great. Like you, I found it mostly pretty easy, so I added a mile here and a mile there to my daily runs. So 4 miles instead of 3, or 6 instead of 5. Or I'd do 5.3 or 7.8 instead of 5 and 7. That was low enough I wasn't worried about overdoing it, but enough that I got a little extra and felt happier about my training. It is better to increase the overall volume than just the distance of your long run. I still do that with my training. However, I try to do it cautiously, since I don't want to end up seriously injured, as I was when I was training for my first HM. So it's a mile here, a mile there, not 5 miles at a time extra. One of the reasons I like to follow a plan in training is I have a tendency to let my enthusiasm get the better of me. Hopefully, the plan will build up gradually enough I won't get injured as I would if I followed my desire to do more.
Since you've been following this plan for 13 weeks already and only have a few to go before you start your taper, I wouldn't do a lot of extra right now. If you want to get outside, go for a hike or a bike ride. You'll strengthen your legs, but won't have a lot of extra impact. On your next race, choose a plan that is a bit more challenging.1 -
spiriteagle99 wrote: »When I did my first marathon, I started with Higdon's Intermediate 2 because it fit the mileage I was running at the time (about 35 mpw) and the ramp up to 50 wasn't going to be too great. Like you, I found it mostly pretty easy, so I added a mile here and a mile there to my daily runs. So 4 miles instead of 3, or 6 instead of 5. Or I'd do 5.3 or 7.8 instead of 5 and 7. That was low enough I wasn't worried about overdoing it, but enough that I got a little extra and felt happier about my training. It is better to increase the overall volume than just the distance of your long run. I still do that with my training. However, I try to do it cautiously, since I don't want to end up seriously injured, as I was when I was training for my first HM. So it's a mile here, a mile there, not 5 miles at a time extra. One of the reasons I like to follow a plan in training is I have a tendency to let my enthusiasm get the better of me. Hopefully, the plan will build up gradually enough I won't get injured as I would if I followed my desire to do more.
Since you've been following this plan for 13 weeks already and only have a few to go before you start your taper, I wouldn't do a lot of extra right now. If you want to get outside, go for a hike or a bike ride. You'll strengthen your legs, but won't have a lot of extra impact. On your next race, choose a plan that is a bit more challenging.
Great advice, thank you.0 -
I don't think going over 20 miles is necessary. I just completed a training plan that called for a 22-miler - I don't think it made a difference (meaning, I could have just done 20 miles and gotten the same results). In my experience, adding in more middle distances during the week was helpful. So, instead of an 8 miler do 10 miles. At least one ten miler per week plus your long run (and the other prescribed runs) will help condition and prepare your body for the marathon distance.
I've used HH plans for two marathons, and, while they got me over the finish line, I do feel like they are a bit light on mileage.0 -
VanderTuig1976 wrote: »I don't think going over 20 miles is necessary. I just completed a training plan that called for a 22-miler - I don't think it made a difference (meaning, I could have just done 20 miles and gotten the same results). In my experience, adding in more middle distances during the week was helpful. So, instead of an 8 miler do 10 miles. At least one ten miler per week plus your long run (and the other prescribed runs) will help condition and prepare your body for the marathon distance.
I've used HH plans for two marathons, and, while they got me over the finish line, I do feel like they are a bit light on mileage.
This is a pretty old post lol, finished the race a long time ago. My pitfall actually ended up being exactly what I thought it would be, took a week off for Christmas and then caught the flu as soon as I returned. Went back at it too hard when sick and ended up getting PFPS. Apparently I was also anemic during this time as well but didn’t get my lab results back until after the race. The exhaustion caught up to me not long after that. It ended up still being a memorable experience and I’m trying again this year, hopefully injury free for a better time and a higher total mileage plan and dialing in more on nutrition and taking iron supplements 🙂.3
