Training plans
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FoxyMcDeadlift
Posts: 771 Member
So, im about 20 weeks away from the London Marathon, time to pick a plan! As a bit of background, i've run two 1:40 halfs but no full marathons. I am currently following Hal Higdons spring training and I run about 7 minute miles in training.
I like the look of this programme: http://www.coolrunning.com/engine/2/2_4/128.shtml I like that it goes up to 26 miles and think its best to take a challenge head on, to know what doing the distance is like. Also, i dont like that a lot of programmes are just abut mileage, so i appreciate this has a speed day in it aswell. Im aiming for approximately 4 hours. Is this too ambitious for a first timer? All advice welcome
I like the look of this programme: http://www.coolrunning.com/engine/2/2_4/128.shtml I like that it goes up to 26 miles and think its best to take a challenge head on, to know what doing the distance is like. Also, i dont like that a lot of programmes are just abut mileage, so i appreciate this has a speed day in it aswell. Im aiming for approximately 4 hours. Is this too ambitious for a first timer? All advice welcome
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I like that plan, though I don't think it is necessary (or smart) to run up to 26 miles. It takes your body a long time to recover from such a long run. I have ran many marathons. My last one was last November and I finished it in 3:09. I am also running Boston in April. I usually get up to 22 miles or so, and only once. I do another 3 x 20 milers and the runs leading up to that distance. I think speed is definitely importance since you have a time goal. And 4 hours is a great, attainable goal since you can run a half in 1:40. A general rule of thumb is to double your half time and add 10 min, so that would put you well under 4.0
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Ok here's is what we know, if you half marathon time is ~ 1:40 you certainly have the "wheels" to run well under 4 hours, but you need to train properly to do so.
As far as long runs, for most people it is too hard to recover from 26 miles in training. That's why you see most plans topping out at 20-21. You want to be able to run your long runs, but not have it mess up the rest of your training.
You also need to watch you training paces. 7 minute miles should be ~ your 5k pace = VO2max speedwork. Either that or you are faster than your half marathon times indicate.
9:00 minute miles will get you 3:56 marathon. The tricky part of marathoning is NOT going out too fast. It is easy to feel great at mile 5 while running at an easy pace, but you need to think about mile 22.0 -
Sorry, i didnt clarify that, i do run my 5ks at 7 minute miles, i run distance at closer to 7:45s, hence the 1:40 times as you pointed out!
So in your opinions, Would it be better to modify the programme so you peak on week 15 (24m) and then taper down, doing 20 miles on week 17, or should i pick another programme? The only other one i've liked is Higdons advanced http://www.halhigdon.com/marathon/MaraAdvanced1.html
Also, how detrimental would it be to race a half about two weeks before? a lot of the plans recommend doing 12 milers then anyway0 -
I ran a half marathon 2 weeks before my marathon in 1:40:07 and then ran a full marathon in 3:34:56. I think running the half 2 weeks before helped me and would recommend it.
I think the train slower than you race with lots of miles is the best approach and has worked so far for me. Following a plan like this I cut nearly 20 minutes off my marathon time 6 months earlier.0 -
My $.02 - despite what malenhan did (who is clearly a gifted runner), I would not suggest the goal for your first marathon to be any faster than 3:50. If you get to mile 23 at that pace and are feeling great, then feel free to drop the hammer and blast the last 5k.0
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I agree with arc! 26 miles is a long way and no one knows how their body is going to react to the mileage until after they have done 1 or 2.
I would also suggest (if you're feeling ok) making one of the 20 mile training runs a 22 mile training run. I think that really helped me mentally.0 -
I agree with arc! 26 miles is a long way and no one knows how their body is going to react to the mileage until after they have done 1 or 2.
I would also suggest (if you're feeling ok) making one of the 20 mile training runs a 22 mile training run. I think that really helped me mentally.
Good call on trying for a 21 or 22. I would route it so you can stop at 20 or keep going if needed. Once you have a few more under your belt, I'm a also a big fan of "fast finish" long runs. Also, I never take a rest day before my long runs - learning to run on tired legs is what it is all about.0 -
I've added that into my training schedule as well. Do you run the day after your long run as well? Do you run your training runs at the same pace that you want to run your race?0
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I've added that into my training schedule as well. Do you run the day after your long run as well? Do you run your training runs at the same pace that you want to run your race?
I usually do run the after day my long runs (very easy recovery pace). My long run pace is usually about 45 seconds per mile slower than goal marathon pace. This can also end up being my "things aren't going too well in this marathon pace..."0 -
Thanks guys! This is a wealth of information! I think i'll take this plan and modify the long runs so they're a bit shorter, and i think i will go for the half a few weeks before. It was my first half, so i'd like to redo it and beat my time! I like what you guys are saying about no rest days, i dont do rest days at the moment and my half plans didnt have them, although i thought for a bigger programme like this, it may be necessary. What mileage do you do on the monday then? I dont want to be 1:50, im aiming for ~4,preferably just south of 4 hours0
