How many #s of water do you pack on with a cheat/binge?
zoom2
Posts: 934 Member
I apparently can absorb a whopping 7#s!! This past weekend was "birthday weekend." All 3 of the members of our household have Feb. birthdays, so we had cake, ice cream, pizza, the grown-ups had hard cider and wine...and I didn't log for about 36 hours. I definitely didn't carry a calorie deficit, but there's no way I ate 7#s worth of calories, heh.
Yesterday I was fully back-on-track, gladly. Man, does carby garbage make me feel gross (though it's fun "vacation" eating in the short-term).
It's truly shocking to me how much water carbs bring with them. I'm still up 7#s. I expect in the next few days that I'll be doing a lot of peeing.
Yesterday I was fully back-on-track, gladly. Man, does carby garbage make me feel gross (though it's fun "vacation" eating in the short-term).
It's truly shocking to me how much water carbs bring with them. I'm still up 7#s. I expect in the next few days that I'll be doing a lot of peeing.
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Before I switched my eating, my weight would fluctuate as much as 10lbs. It will still do that if I eat a lot of carbs, but I don't even bother weighing after a carbage day, because it won't tell me what I don't already know (and I don't want to see that number, anyway), and the water weight is the least of my worries in those circumstances (I get headaches from carbage in general).0
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Hence the suffix "-hydrate" of carbohydrate. An evening binge of carbs for me is a negligible gain. A whole day can be a couple pounds of water and a full weekend...I've hit close to ten pounds of water. One of many reasons I try to limit splurges/cheats/refills/reward or whatever I decide to call it to a few hours once a week ala CarbNite kinda of plan. I've noticed the more I cheat, the more I cheat. So a few hours this week lead to a few more hours the following week to a few days the following week till my cheat meals have now become my normal diet with my new cheats becoming the only days I eat keto... So the less I cheat the better, and the less yo-yo with the water weight...j/s0
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Yeah...I recall someone explaining that for every gram of carbs the body requires 3 grams of water to process. Whether that's the exact "formula," I don't know...but there sure does seem to be some "weight" to that explanation. I've been so prone to edema since my pregnancy with my 14 year old, so low-carb was a pleasant surprise for me when I first adopted that WOL a decade or so ago. Suddenly I felt so much less sloshy, for lack of a better term.0
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Dragonwolf wrote: »Before I switched my eating, my weight would fluctuate as much as 10lbs. It will still do that if I eat a lot of carbs, but I don't even bother weighing after a carbage day, because it won't tell me what I don't already know (and I don't want to see that number, anyway), and the water weight is the least of my worries in those circumstances (I get headaches from carbage in general).
Dragon,
Carbage.... I like that (the word)
That aptly describes what carbs are...
Dan the Man from Michigan
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I solve this by not bingeing.0
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Exactly. And having type 2, I don't really have the luxury of being able to binge.nicsflyingcircus wrote: »I solve this by not bingeing.
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I do not usually binge either but tonight I am feeling horribly guilty for eating 1/4 cup Acorn squash. Stayed within my carb limit. I will do it again in a couple of days then the little squash will be gone.0
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shadesofidaho wrote: »I do not usually binge either but tonight I am feeling horribly guilty for eating 1/4 cup Acorn squash. Stayed within my carb limit. I will do it again in a couple of days then the little squash will be gone.
If you stayed within your carb limit why are you feeling guilty? You should be proud that you only had 1/4 cup.
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I've had splurges over vacations. They were planned. I expected the water weight gain, and it wasn't that hard to get back off.
Labor Day 2014 = approx 2 lbs
Mexico Thanksgiving trip for 14 days = 5.2 lbs
Christmas 1 day planned splurge turned into 4 days (oops) =4.8 lbs
Ski trip Jan 2015 = 8.4 lbs. Some of this had to be DOMS as well as water from carbage.
None took longer than 7 days to remove once returning to my normal WOE/LCHF.
Oh, and it was ALL worth it to me.0 -
sljohnson1207 wrote: »I've had splurges over vacations. They were planned. I expected the water weight gain, and it wasn't that hard to get back off.
Labor Day 2014 = approx 2 lbs
Mexico Thanksgiving trip for 14 days = 5.2 lbs
Christmas 1 day planned splurge turned into 4 days (oops) =4.8 lbs
Ski trip Jan 2015 = 8.4 lbs. Some of this had to be DOMS as well as water from carbage.
None took longer than 7 days to remove once returning to my normal WOE/LCHF.
Oh, and it was ALL worth it to me.
Help me out Johnson, what does DOMS mean? I tried to look it up, but none of them made any sense:
If its a possible keto term, I'll add it to my Keto Terms blog.
Thank you,
Dan the Man from Michigan
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sljohnson1207 wrote: »I've had splurges over vacations. They were planned. I expected the water weight gain, and it wasn't that hard to get back off.
Labor Day 2014 = approx 2 lbs
Mexico Thanksgiving trip for 14 days = 5.2 lbs
Christmas 1 day planned splurge turned into 4 days (oops) =4.8 lbs
Ski trip Jan 2015 = 8.4 lbs. Some of this had to be DOMS as well as water from carbage.
None took longer than 7 days to remove once returning to my normal WOE/LCHF.
Oh, and it was ALL worth it to me.
Help me out Johnson, what does DOMS mean? I tried to look it up, but none of them made any sense:
If its a possible keto term, I'll add it to my Keto Terms blog.
Thank you,
Dan the Man from Michigan
Delayed onset muscle soreness, which is basically what DOMS always means on this site.
I have to say, though, "Diet Office Management System" is an awesome one.
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DOMS - delayed onset muscle soreness.
So for those who never plan "cheats," do you do any sort of higher-intensity aerobic activities? ie running races of half-marathon distance or shorter, 5ks, cyclocross, etc. By racing, I mean not just showing up for a participation medal and run/walking, but all-out effort for the entire distance. I know people who do keto ultra-running races of significantly further than a marathon distance, but I've struggled to find anyone who does higher heartrate aerobic stuff competitively while sticking to Keto long-term.0 -
Help me out Johnson, what does DOMS mean? I tried to look it up, but none of them made any sense:
^^ What they said. Delayed onset muscle soreness. Skiing for three days defo made me super sore all over for several days, even after we came home.
This is the type of sore where you don't want to sit down on the toilet because your thighs are on fire, and you just plop down and then wipe your tears away after you groan really loudly about how sore you are.0 -
oh! ha DOMS. ok. I had that from ab work last week and its taken a week to recover. not expected AT all.0
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DOMS - delayed onset muscle soreness.
So for those who never plan "cheats," do you do any sort of higher-intensity aerobic activities? ie running races of half-marathon distance or shorter, 5ks, cyclocross, etc. By racing, I mean not just showing up for a participation medal and run/walking, but all-out effort for the entire distance. I know people who do keto ultra-running races of significantly further than a marathon distance, but I've struggled to find anyone who does higher heartrate aerobic stuff competitively while sticking to Keto long-term.
The guy behind ruled.me does, though I'm not sure on his exact numbers -- http://www.ruled.me/mythbusting-training-on-keto-diet/
Dr. Peter Attia (Eating Academy) did some of the longer stuff, but he did it all while in ketosis.
Mark Sisson (Primal Blueprint) and the people he trains are generally in or on the border of ketosis, and they do stuff that isn't quite ultramarathon level (though he does train triathletes).
Dave Asprey (Bulletproof Exec), arguably does, as well.
The idea behind citing the ultramarathoners and other elite athletes is that if they can do it on their training taken to extremes, then there's no reason that someone doing Starting Strength, Couch to 5k, or even training for a half or full marathon would have issue. In fact, endurance sports are prime for keto, because it dampens the transition from sugar burning to fat burning, though it does take some time to fully adjust.
Here are a couple of others I found (with some pretty in-depth descriptions of how it feels to do it):
http://www.sftrails.com/2013/08/fat-for-fuel-my-ketogenic-diet.html
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread64390.html0 -
Hmmm...these are all pretty solidly aerobic efforts, though. I read the Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance a while back and know there's at least one Western States 100 winner who is a low-carber...but these are still aerobic athletes. For races like 5k, short distance bike time trials, and cyclocross it requires a helluvalot of anerobic, "redline" output (far different from the sort of energy expenditure for longer stuff), which I've struggled to find much evidence of anyone doing well without glycogen stores. The last time I did a several month ketogenic stint I had to revert to basic calorie counting once I started racing and doing interval workouts. I had no top gears and battled chronic nausea anytime I tried to push the pace.0
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sljohnson1207 wrote: »Help me out Johnson, what does DOMS mean? I tried to look it up, but none of them made any sense:
^^ What they said. Delayed onset muscle soreness. Skiing for three days defo made me super sore all over for several days, even after we came home.
This is the type of sore where you don't want to sit down on the toilet because your thighs are on fire, and you just plop down and then wipe your tears away after you groan really loudly about how sore you are.
Ok, so it was in the list I had. cool I learn something everyday. Once I put a tile floor in my workshop. About 300 square feet (one tile is one sq. ft.), all on my knees. I went home, I was ok. But the next day, DOMS to the max! The hardest part was the same thing you mentioned, sitting on the toilet! It took days for me to recover...
Dan the Man for Michigan0 -
The last time I did a several month ketogenic stint I had to revert to basic calorie counting once I started racing and doing interval workouts. I had no top gears and battled chronic nausea anytime I tried to push the pace.
You seem like an ideal candidate for TKD:
http://www.reddit.com/r/ketogains/wiki/index0 -
I have gone way over carbs and this never, ever happens to me. Why not?
I've been on keto since Sept 2014, so maybe I'm totally fat adapted, so my body naturally burns fat now for energy?
[That's probably just broscience. I'm not suggesting that's actually what's happening. I have no idea!]
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The last time I did a several month ketogenic stint I had to revert to basic calorie counting once I started racing and doing interval workouts. I had no top gears and battled chronic nausea anytime I tried to push the pace.
You seem like an ideal candidate for TKD:
http://www.reddit.com/r/ketogains/wiki/index
I've long wondered about this and CKD (I just don't know any runners/cyclists who do this, which makes it tough to bounce ideas and experience off of anyone. It seems like much more of a weights/HIIT/Crossfitter deal). Kinda thinking this is the year I should give those a whirl. Once I hit peak Summer training I'm generally logging ~10-12 hours of running/biking per week, so that's when CKD might be useful.0 -
Hmmm...these are all pretty solidly aerobic efforts, though. I read the Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance a while back and know there's at least one Western States 100 winner who is a low-carber...but these are still aerobic athletes. For races like 5k, short distance bike time trials, and cyclocross it requires a helluvalot of anerobic, "redline" output (far different from the sort of energy expenditure for longer stuff), which I've struggled to find much evidence of anyone doing well without glycogen stores. The last time I did a several month ketogenic stint I had to revert to basic calorie counting once I started racing and doing interval workouts. I had no top gears and battled chronic nausea anytime I tried to push the pace.
My understanding is that half marathons and 5Ks are still aerobic, except maybe a couple sprints.
That said, Mark Sisson and Peter Attia do a fair amount of anaerobic working out, as well (lifting, sprinting, etc).
You'll also probably find more people in the lifting circles that do keto, as the more fringe diets seem to be more common among lifters than it is among runners/cyclists. Lifting, however, is very much anaerobic, so it might provide you some insight.
Here are a few more resources:
http://primalnorth.blogspot.com/2013/05/sorry-anthony-colpo-truly-keto-athletes.html
http://www.flexonline.com/nutrition/strength-without-carbsThe last time I did a several month ketogenic stint I had to revert to basic calorie counting once I started racing and doing interval workouts. I had no top gears and battled chronic nausea anytime I tried to push the pace.
You seem like an ideal candidate for TKD:
http://www.reddit.com/r/ketogains/wiki/index
I agree with this, TKD/CKD seem to work better for the higher athletes who need the larger glycogen stores during their workouts, as well as for people who are already quite lean. Definitely worth a try.0 -
On the cheating issue I have learned this the hard way. Last Friday I went out with friends blew through my macros. So I was out of keto immediately - added 8 pounds (likely all water) and only yesterday Thursday was the water gone and back on keto per the strips. So I have lost 5 days in the battle. I found this really discouraging. So I think best to stay on course if possible.0
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On the cheating issue I have learned this the hard way. Last Friday I went out with friends blew through my macros. So I was out of keto immediately - added 8 pounds (likely all water) and only yesterday Thursday was the water gone and back on keto per the strips. So I have lost 5 days in the battle. I found this really discouraging. So I think best to stay on course if possible.
To be fair, if the vast majority of what you "gained" was water and you didn't actually ingest 28,000 calories, you'll probably not have lost much time/loss at all once it clears out. I'm still holding onto 4 extra #s a week later, but I'm also dealing with TOM/AF issues at the same time and waking covered in bed marks...and my socks left divots in my ankles yesterday, boobs hurt like heck, etc (so I'd be up 3-4#s, anyhow). Another day or two and I'll be literally p!ssing it all away.
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> back on keto per the strips
strips only measure excess ketones in the urine, and are not indicative of ketosis in general0
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