Still Hungry at Night

TriLifter

Just what the topic says...I'm still hungry at night!

After dinner, I can't seem to stop eating. I have my daily cals set to 2300 (TDEE is 2300-2400) and I still want more food. I crave everything from chips (which I've been good about not giving into) to almond butter, coconut oil, and butter right out of the containter. And cashews. I can't get enough raw, unsalted cashews.

I thought part of the deal with primal/paleo was that your body would be more satiated and that wheat/sugar caused addictive eating. I've switched up my macros a bit for higher carbs because I'm an endurance athlete. I'm 5'6", 120 lbs.

Help!

brenbrenm

How long have you been primal/paleo? Have you been really strict with it, or do you allow not paleo foods? I have also been having some cravings, but I only started about 2 1/2 weeks ago, and haven't been 100% paleo, nor do I plan on it all of the time. I won't even bring cashews in the house, because I'll eat the whole container. I'm not going to buy chocolate in the near future either!

TriLifter

I've been primal since November. I've allowed a few no-no foods (beans, which I'm completely eliminating) and corn (Mexican food is the hardest for me). Aside from those, I'm usually pretty strict.

rmhand

Do you eat a lot of fruit? The sugars in that could be causing issues. Do you have any symptoms of digestive issues or a candida overgrowth?

justaspoonfulofsugar

I would think the shift in hunger is coming from the carbs..maybe they should be adjusted a bit lower.Also,look at the fat.The more fat you eat,the less hungry you will be.
I understand the endurance athlete side of things but perhaps you need to play around with your macros.
The only time I am starving is when I am eating higher carbs(too high for me is over 50..this is just me).I have been playing around with carbs lately and I have not been successful,I am once again craving sugar.

TriLifter

Do you eat a lot of fruit? The sugars in that could be causing issues. Do you have any symptoms of digestive issues or a candida overgrowth?

I've upped my fruit recently because of the extra carbs I need, but even before that, when I was only eating one serving berries/day I had this issue.

frantim528

Amen to the Mexican food. I really like it but it's mostly corn, beans, and rice. Plus you have to sit there and watch everybody else chow down on the chips and salsa before your food gets there. You may want to consider getting your extra calories from sweet potato instead of fruit. It shouldn't spike your blood sugar as much.

brenbrenm

One thing that has been helping me somewhat when I have a strong craving is to allow myself 1 or 2 tbsp of coconut butter followed by a full glass of water. USUALLY within about 10 minutes, I feel really full and the cravings go away for a long time.

Dragonwolf

Just what the topic says...I'm still hungry at night!

After dinner, I can't seem to stop eating. I have my daily cals set to 2300 (TDEE is 2300-2400) and I still want more food. I crave everything from chips (which I've been good about not giving into) to almond butter, coconut oil, and butter right out of the containter. And cashews. I can't get enough raw, unsalted cashews.

I thought part of the deal with primal/paleo was that your body would be more satiated and that wheat/sugar caused addictive eating. I've switched up my macros a bit for higher carbs because I'm an endurance athlete. I'm 5'6", 120 lbs.

Help!

Your diary is closed, so we can't see exactly what you're eating, but it looks like you may need to up your fat some more. Like carbs, fat is pure energy (unlike protein, which is used primarily for building/retaining muscle), so you don't need to worry too much about carb intake outside of around training time. (Ie - if you train in the morning, eat more carbs in the morning and more fat at night and you should still be good.)

Look at what you're craving - fat, fat, and more fat. Pretty much all of the things you say you're craving are pretty much straight fat (butter and coconut oil ARE straight fat, chips are generally fried in fat, and nuts get the bulk of their calories from fat). So eat some more fat. It's actually not unheard of to have a spoonful of coconut oil or a pat of butter as a sort of snack, but if that weirds you out, search Google for some tasty fat-bomb recipes.

TriLifter

Your diary is closed, so we can't see exactly what you're eating, but it looks like you may need to up your fat some more. Like carbs, fat is pure energy (unlike protein, which is used primarily for building/retaining muscle), so you don't need to worry too much about carb intake outside of around training time. (Ie - if you train in the morning, eat more carbs in the morning and more fat at night and you should still be good.)

Look at what you're craving - fat, fat, and more fat. Pretty much all of the things you say you're craving are pretty much straight fat (butter and coconut oil ARE straight fat, chips are generally fried in fat, and nuts get the bulk of their calories from fat). So eat some more fat. It's actually not unheard of to have a spoonful of coconut oil or a pat of butter as a sort of snack, but if that weirds you out, search Google for some tasty fat-bomb recipes.

Doh! My diary used to be open, but when I closed out my old account and started this one I must have forgotten! It's open now.

Even when I was eating higer fat (20/55/25 c/f/p), I was still having the same problem. I hadn't gotten to the point of nutrient timing, but I see your point. Makes total sense. I run in the morning, so I'll shift the bulk of my carbs up there. Thank you for reminding me of that principle!

I'm okay with the spoonfuls of fats, just didn't know if it was normal or not. I've made some fat-bomb things in the past--will look into more. I really appreciate your thoughtful response :flowerforyou:

Akimajuktuq

Unfortunately, eating a lot of carbs causes many people to crave foods and struggle with hunger. Fruit is NOT always our friend, nor are excessive quantities of nuts. Over indulgence of carbs often goes hand in hand with fat, but it's the CARBS that block the feeling of satiety. You need the fat minus the carbs (I like the fat bomb recommendation).

It is a myth that a ketogenic lifestyle cannot support a very active lifestyle. Once a body is fat-adapted, it's unstoppable. imo

The fats are not the problem (please don't fall for that), but the carbs are. (No carbs are not "bad" but for those of us with metabolic syndrome-as in everyone who is sick/fat-they must be limited).

55% fat may not be enough for you. Try eating more. I started out at 60% but I was still struggling, so now I'm at 75% and even try for higher. I feel like super woman and I'm not struggling.

I don't think eating at night is a problem in and of itself (I do all of my eating afternoon/night), but for me, if I eat a bunch of carbs in the morning, I will be hungry all day and will binge at night. That's why I intermittent fast until at least lunch and if I do eat breakfast, it's fat and protein ONLY.

edit: at 5'6 and 120, you are under weight. As an athlete, with muscle, you probably should weigh more. Just my opinion, but your body could be trying to get to a healthier weight.

shar140

I'm glad I'm not the only one who eats a pat of butter or cream cheese sometimes, lol. (still can't do coconut oil straight, though!)

Now that I can see your diary, if you're not going over your calorie or macro goals, then why is eating at night a problem? I kind of assumed you meant you were having cravings, then going over your goals.

The only suggestion I might have, is to eat more protein/fat/calories in general earlier in the day. Eating a bigger breakfast helps me not need to eat between then and lunch, for example.

homesweeths

Unfortunately, eating a lot of carbs causes many people to crave foods and struggle with hunger. Fruit is NOT always our friend, nor are excessive quantities of nuts. Over indulgence of carbs often goes hand in hand with fat, but it's the CARBS that block the feeling of satiety. You need the fat minus the carbs (I like the fat bomb recommendation).

It is a myth that a ketogenic lifestyle cannot support a very active lifestyle. Once a body is fat-adapted, it's unstoppable. imo

The fats are not the problem (please don't fall for that), but the carbs are. (No carbs are not "bad" but for those of us with metabolic syndrome-as in everyone who is sick/fat-they must be limited).

55% fat may not be enough for you. Try eating more. I started out at 60% but I was still struggling, so now I'm at 75% and even try for higher. I feel like super woman and I'm not struggling.

I don't think eating at night is a problem in and of itself (I do all of my eating afternoon/night), but for me, if I eat a bunch of carbs in the morning, I will be hungry all day and will binge at night. That's why I intermittent fast until at least lunch and if I do eat breakfast, it's fat and protein ONLY.

edit: at 5'6 and 120, you are under weight. As an athlete, with muscle, you probably should weigh more. Just my opinion, but your body could be trying to get to a healthier weight.

Like you, I find that carbs make me hungry. I tend to start eating later in the day (mid-morning or after) and I find that I'm eating a couple of big meals a day, spread out by *hours* -- I mean, I have my second meal of the day when I start to get hungry, or when I notice it's been six or 10 hours since I ate and I think I ought to have something more for the day. I am almost never hungry these days, not even for breakfast after a full night's fast.

homesweeths

Unfortunately, eating a lot of carbs causes many people to crave foods and struggle with hunger. Fruit is NOT always our friend, nor are excessive quantities of nuts. Over indulgence of carbs often goes hand in hand with fat, but it's the CARBS that block the feeling of satiety. You need the fat minus the carbs (I like the fat bomb recommendation).

It is a myth that a ketogenic lifestyle cannot support a very active lifestyle. Once a body is fat-adapted, it's unstoppable. imo

The fats are not the problem (please don't fall for that), but the carbs are. (No carbs are not "bad" but for those of us with metabolic syndrome-as in everyone who is sick/fat-they must be limited).

55% fat may not be enough for you. Try eating more. I started out at 60% but I was still struggling, so now I'm at 75% and even try for higher. I feel like super woman and I'm not struggling.

I don't think eating at night is a problem in and of itself (I do all of my eating afternoon/night), but for me, if I eat a bunch of carbs in the morning, I will be hungry all day and will binge at night. That's why I intermittent fast until at least lunch and if I do eat breakfast, it's fat and protein ONLY.

edit: at 5'6 and 120, you are under weight. As an athlete, with muscle, you probably should weigh more. Just my opinion, but your body could be trying to get to a healthier weight.

Like you, I find that carbs make me hungry. I tend to start eating later in the day (mid-morning or after) and I find that I'm eating a couple of big meals a day, spread out by *hours* -- I mean, I have my second meal of the day when I start to get hungry, or when I notice it's been six or 10 hours since I ate and I think I ought to have something more for the day. I am almost never hungry these days, not even for breakfast after a full night's fast.

What I forgot to say above is that I've cut way back on the carbs, like Mark Sisson's formula of eating 50-100 g of carbs for sustained, steady weight loss (someone is talking to me as I type so I *think* that number is right, but look up his chart on Mark's Daily Apple if you want to see his carb recommendations). I eat a lot of non-starchy veggies with my meat and fat, and in order to get enough carbs (more than 50) I have to eat a LOT, it seems. I might have a serving of fruit in a day, usually berries as they're in season right now, but sometimes I forget.

In any event, it's working. I'm never hungry, and sometimes I have to remind myself to eat. I don't want my body to think it's being starved, and switch to a conservation metabolic rate.

TriLifter

Unfortunately, eating a lot of carbs causes many people to crave foods and struggle with hunger. Fruit is NOT always our friend, nor are excessive quantities of nuts. Over indulgence of carbs often goes hand in hand with fat, but it's the CARBS that block the feeling of satiety. You need the fat minus the carbs (I like the fat bomb recommendation).

It is a myth that a ketogenic lifestyle cannot support a very active lifestyle. Once a body is fat-adapted, it's unstoppable. imo

The fats are not the problem (please don't fall for that), but the carbs are. (No carbs are not "bad" but for those of us with metabolic syndrome-as in everyone who is sick/fat-they must be limited).

55% fat may not be enough for you. Try eating more. I started out at 60% but I was still struggling, so now I'm at 75% and even try for higher. I feel like super woman and I'm not struggling.

I don't think eating at night is a problem in and of itself (I do all of my eating afternoon/night), but for me, if I eat a bunch of carbs in the morning, I will be hungry all day and will binge at night. That's why I intermittent fast until at least lunch and if I do eat breakfast, it's fat and protein ONLY.

edit: at 5'6 and 120, you are under weight. As an athlete, with muscle, you probably should weigh more. Just my opinion, but your body could be trying to get to a healthier weight.

I'm not anti-fat at all. I was hovering around 75g carbs/day previously, but was still hungry. I was upping my carbs per Paleo for Athletes because I had also ramped up my marathon training and increased my overall calorie goals.

At 120 lbs, I am not actually underweight, as my BMI is in the "normal" range. Before I started lifting last year I was 113 lbs--THAT is underweight!

TriLifter

I'm glad I'm not the only one who eats a pat of butter or cream cheese sometimes, lol. (still can't do coconut oil straight, though!)

Now that I can see your diary, if you're not going over your calorie or macro goals, then why is eating at night a problem? I kind of assumed you meant you were having cravings, then going over your goals.

The only suggestion I might have, is to eat more protein/fat/calories in general earlier in the day. Eating a bigger breakfast helps me not need to eat between then and lunch, for example.

There's a point after I've closed out my diary for the day that I stand in front of the fridge or cupboard and mindlessly eat stuff. It doesn't often make it into my diary out of laziness, unfortunately.

Howbouto

If you are eating TDEE, you are not eating back exercise calories right? Are you gaining weight? Maybe with the increase exercise from marathon training, you are just hungry. Your body needs more fuel. Just a thought.

TriLifter

If you are eating TDEE, you are not eating back exercise calories right? Are you gaining weight? Maybe with the increase exercise from marathon training, you are just hungry. Your body needs more fuel. Just a thought.

Yup--not adding back any additional exercise cals (they're already figured into my day). I think part of my problem is a self-fulfilling prophecy. I preload my diary for the day leaving room for extra eating because I'm afraid that will happen. Maybe it I front-loaded it bit (more cals at breakfast and lunch), I wouldn't feel that need. It's something to play around with. I think also lowering my carbs to 30% and upping fat to 50% might be an option. At first it was tough to add the extra carbs in (like, I honestly couldn't figure out how to), but then it became TOO EASY!

rmhand

Do you eat a lot of fruit? The sugars in that could be causing issues. Do you have any symptoms of digestive issues or a candida overgrowth?

I've upped my fruit recently because of the extra carbs I need, but even before that, when I was only eating one serving berries/day I had this issue.

Ok. That was my only guess. Are you really hungry or bored/eating out of habit? I snack more in the evenings when I'm bored or waiting for something.

TriLifter

Ok. That was my only guess. Are you really hungry or bored/eating out of habit? I snack more in the evenings when I'm bored or waiting for something.

Might be a habit/boredom thing. At this point, I don't know LOL

shar140

Ok. That was my only guess. Are you really hungry or bored/eating out of habit? I snack more in the evenings when I'm bored or waiting for something.

Might be a habit/boredom thing. At this point, I don't know LOL

I know it's a boredom thing for me. This is why I don't sit around watching tv, I keep myself busy!

Akimajuktuq

Unfortunately, eating a lot of carbs causes many people to crave foods and struggle with hunger. Fruit is NOT always our friend, nor are excessive quantities of nuts. Over indulgence of carbs often goes hand in hand with fat, but it's the CARBS that block the feeling of satiety. You need the fat minus the carbs (I like the fat bomb recommendation).

It is a myth that a ketogenic lifestyle cannot support a very active lifestyle. Once a body is fat-adapted, it's unstoppable. imo

The fats are not the problem (please don't fall for that), but the carbs are. (No carbs are not "bad" but for those of us with metabolic syndrome-as in everyone who is sick/fat-they must be limited).

55% fat may not be enough for you. Try eating more. I started out at 60% but I was still struggling, so now I'm at 75% and even try for higher. I feel like super woman and I'm not struggling.

I don't think eating at night is a problem in and of itself (I do all of my eating afternoon/night), but for me, if I eat a bunch of carbs in the morning, I will be hungry all day and will binge at night. That's why I intermittent fast until at least lunch and if I do eat breakfast, it's fat and protein ONLY.

edit: at 5'6 and 120, you are under weight. As an athlete, with muscle, you probably should weigh more. Just my opinion, but your body could be trying to get to a healthier weight.

I'm not anti-fat at all. I was hovering around 75g carbs/day previously, but was still hungry. I was upping my carbs per Paleo for Athletes because I had also ramped up my marathon training and increased my overall calorie goals.

At 120 lbs, I am not actually underweight, as my BMI is in the "normal" range. Before I started lifting last year I was 113 lbs--THAT is underweight!

My comment about your weight is only my opinion; thank you for not being offended. My "normal" bmi range is 124-154 and I have to disagree with the range. Only the upper end is accurate. I have a 28" waist when I am about 140, so I just can't imagine it being healthy to be smaller than that. I'm not "big boned".. but do have wide hips.

If you increased carbs and hunger increased, it would be my reasoning that increasing carbs is detrimental to your satiety. That's my experience anyway. When I ate SAD (tons of grains, sugars, processed foods) I had many very serious health issues, one of which was Binge Eating Disorder which involved massive pigouts every night (and day if I wasn't at work). No matter how much I ate I could never feel full. The only thing that resolved BED for me was a fat based diet with very restricted carbs. Not everyone needs to restrict carbs, but anyone who is craving or over-eating should consider it.

TriLifter

If you increased carbs and hunger increased, it would be my reasoning that increasing carbs is detrimental to your satiety. That's my experience anyway. When I ate SAD (tons of grains, sugars, processed foods) I had many very serious health issues, one of which was Binge Eating Disorder which involved massive pigouts every night (and day if I wasn't at work). No matter how much I ate I could never feel full. The only thing that resolved BED for me was a fat based diet with very restricted carbs. Not everyone needs to restrict carbs, but anyone who is craving or over-eating should consider it.

Yup--I have BED too. Honestly, nothing hs helped it the way I'd hoped. Every day is a struggle for me.

homesweeths

If you increased carbs and hunger increased, it would be my reasoning that increasing carbs is detrimental to your satiety. That's my experience anyway. When I ate SAD (tons of grains, sugars, processed foods) I had many very serious health issues, one of which was Binge Eating Disorder which involved massive pigouts every night (and day if I wasn't at work). No matter how much I ate I could never feel full. The only thing that resolved BED for me was a fat based diet with very restricted carbs. Not everyone needs to restrict carbs, but anyone who is craving or over-eating should consider it.

Yup--I have BED too. Honestly, nothing hs helped it the way I'd hoped. Every day is a struggle for me.

That's one reason why I keep my carbs under 100g and closer to 50g most days. The more carbs I eat, the more I seem to want. Of course, I'm not sure how much advice I can offer -- though I used to be a runner, my knees have gotten so bad in the past 10 years that it's hard just to walk. I'm not running up an appetite due to workouts, in other words. The joints are getting better, though, the further into this Paleo journey I go... I hope to be able to take long walks again, hopefully sooner than later.