low carb vs keto

1234usmc

For those that have been doing this awhile. Do you think there is benefit in low carb but not all the way into ketosis? I have been working hard to keep my carbs low and I have avoided the bis ones like potatoes, bread and pasta. I love quest bars, they have good protein and low sugar but there are 20 g of carbs or so. Can you go in and out of ketosis? My wife was just getting on me bcuz I didn't eat corn on the cob last night and I mentioned the carbs. She says I am being ridiculous now. I am just trying to lower my blood sugar and hopefully reverse my t2 diabetes.

nvmomketo

I'm curious what the veterans will say too.

I'm doing keto because I find carbs make it very difficult to control my intake of more carbs and I wouldn't be low carb for long then. I went LCHF for prediabetes, autoimmune issues, and to help me lose weight. After a couple of weeks I seemed to naturally slip into ketosis. I seem most stable here, but hope to switch back to LCHF once I lose all my weight.... As long as my cravings can handle it.

wabmester

Let me first say that I'm a moderate carb guy -- usually around 100g, but all over the map. I'm in and out of ketosis often.

In terms of weight loss, there's not a lot of difference. It comes down to the psychological level of carbs it takes for you to lose cravings. Ketones do seem to reduce hunger, but you don't need a lot of them, and you'll make a bunch any carb intake under 100g or so. Ketones generally go up as carb intake goes down.

Having said all of that, there are some cases that you may want to restrict at levels below 100g. Specifically, T2D and metabolic syndrome. Especially if your triglycerides are high. TG production goes up with carb intake. And it correlates pretty well with insulin resistance, the main underlying cause of T2D.

So how low do you need to go? Physiologically, your brain needs about 40g of glucose per day. To me, it doesn't make a lot of sense to go below that level unless you're still triggering cravings at that level. It's not bad to go below 40g, but you'll be forcing your body to make glucose from protein, so to preserve muscle mass, you should increase your protein intake a bit if you go that low.

What some diabetics do is measure their blood glucose level after a meal to see how carb sensitive they are. Start at a moderate level, and reduce it until you're happy with your readings.

Lots of good info here:
http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/

professionalHobbyist

Thanks Wab. Very useful explanation

KETOGENICGURL

123USMC… what I am finding is many of us are just sensitive to carbs at all… I stayed at <25 the first 5 months, then added some and stopped losing. So for Prediabetics, and metabolic issues, and other diabetes related problems it MIGHT be safer to STAY VLC for 6 months and just see what happens.

when I get to 100 carbs my BG goes up, stays up, and I am fighting to go the other way. I get some carbs from my plant based protein..so can't go to <10, or suffer, but if you try avoiding the corn, arbs, etc you MAY see a real improvement on the T2..woudn't that be perfect? bet your wife will see the light then.

I had one lady scream at me about carbs saying I am irresponsible, because she loathes the writing of Taubes & Lustig…so be it, her choice…so the is not as much love for LCHF out there.

randiewilliams72

I agree it's a personal choice. I like vegetables so if I go over in carbs they are usually the culprit. I don't stress over it. I try to stay under 20 net carbs and usually I do. For me it is the cravings. So cutting out sugar, pastas, rice, potatoes and all the other culprits helped cut my cravings.

wabmester

I should add that for a lot of people (including me), we start out at moderate carbs to eat the stuff we love, but we eventually lose our cravings even for the Good Stuff, and our carb intake naturally drops.

My main carb sources are veggies, berries, nuts, and chocolate. I didn't think I'd ever cut back on dark chocolate, but even that has become less interesting as my general hunger has waned.

The stuff that cranks up my carb load is usually Asian cuisine. I cannot resist many Asian dishes, but those treats are becoming more rare. Also, those dishes often come drenched in vinegar which has amazing anti-glycemic properties.

professionalHobbyist

Some like me eat 100 carbs but do long duration cardio. So I need it to sustain that effort

It seems the goal is to at some point in the day run out of glycogen and burn fat as fuel.

So how you get there for weight loss seems to not matter too much from what I see.

Doing this from a body recomposition angle, I need more carbs at a moment in time to do a certain thing. Those carbs get burnt up immediately doing those exercises.

But there are never bunches of little bored carbs running around in my system with nothing to do!

1234usmc

Thanks for all the responses. I'm am hoping giving up the biggies ( pasta, bread, potatoes and corn) will be enough to show a difference in my blood sugar. I'm not doing it for weight loss. I have already lost 32 lbs and only plan to lose another 15-20. So hopefully it will help finish that off too. If cutting way back isn't enough, I'll have to get more drastic I guess.

AngInCanada

Just wanted to chime in, quest bara only net about 5 or 6 carbs so if you are counting net carbs, its easy to fit them into plan. For me, I don't have issues with quest bars. Atkins bars on the other hand unleash the sugar dragon badly.

azcowgirrlup

I have my carbs set at 15 grams, but I try to stay way under 10 grams. Some times veggies will bring me up a bit over the 10 grams, but its veggies, so I don't stress. And no., I don't count net carbs. To me a Carb is a Carb is a Carb. I am prediabetic and this keeps me from having to start on meds. I apparently am very Carb sensitive, so this is how I eat. I don't eat bread, pasta, rice, potatoes, corn, etc. I can't eat those foods with out huge blood glucose issues, but I don't really miss them any more. Grilled corn, oh I remember how much I loved it, but feeling good is better than that!

1234usmc

I really want some ice cream right now!!!

wabmester

I'd try to shame you into not doing it, but I just had a small bit of gelato.

Get the ice cream with the highest fat content you can find. Sometimes called "premium." Carbs are often pretty low.

nvmomketo

1234usmc wrote: »

I really want some ice cream right now!!!

How about whipped cream instead? Add vanilla and some stevia drops and it will be sweet...

Sunny_Bunny_

I discovered carb smart vanilla yogurt recently and I add shaved 85% dark chocolate. Tastes like desert to me.
I wonder how it would be frozen???

minties82

I definitely agree that it is a personal experiment. I seem to lose the most weight and have a happy gut and blood sugars at 0-15 carbs, but anything up to 30 or so keeps the weightloss going and cravings down.

1234usmc

I didnt have the ice cream, having a medical test today so no eating after midnight. I have tried the Kroger no sugar added but it is still high in carbs. So is the Breyers carb smart. I suppose both have less carbs than regular ice cream but still have way to many. Like I said, the goal right now is to cut wayyyyy back and see how it goes from there. My family had pasta last night and it was killing me. I ate one strand of spaghetti

slimzandra

When I get the ice cream cravings, (like when everyone else is eating it) I go for heavy cream whipped with a hand blender add vanilla and a some berries. My own little sundae.

My carbs are about 15g-30g (for the last 80 days) I haven't had any pasta, bread, potatoes, rice and corn. My carbs largely consist of spinach, mushrooms, kale, broccoli, cauliflower, occasionally add peppers or a tomato cooked in butter and coconut oil, berries for desserts, nuts. Last week, I had a day where I splurged and went over 200g of carbs and I felt miserable the next day (I had a piece birthday cake -ugg.) and I also had alcohol (2 martinis). The next day I was completely wrecked. The biggest downside for keto level carbs and no sugars as a daily routine is that I find I can't drink, and also handle a huge spike in sugar and carbs, not only does it throw me out of keto, but gives me huge headaches and I feel ill. (I've done this 3 times in the last 80 days, I'm a slow learner.) I was a veteran drinker and a huge carb person before I started this and it never bothered me. Now, it's not worth it, I really can't process it. I find I feel much better with keeping my levels fairly consistent day to day, no matter where they are set. Either at 15g or 100+, but to have a huge daily fluctuation, either up or down does not agree with me. I gradually reduced my carbs, from low to keto over about 3.5 weeks, when I started this. I did really well, I did not get any negative side effects. Like @minties mentioned, I guess it is a personal experiment, your mileage may vary. It is not ridiculous to skip the corn, that is a good thing, certain foods are not in your diet right now. You have goals and making good choices is the only way to keep on track. Keep up the good work.

fishgutzy

I just started replacing my post workout breakfast protein bars with 3 hard boiled eggs with coconut oil and habañero pepper. Zero carbs. Holds me a lot longer. And I'm still at a 1000 calories deficit for the day after that from swimming 4 miles.
Little by little I'm cutting more processed junk out of my daily food.