Differences between CICO and LCHF

daylitemag

I'm still new to the LCHF WOE, but I've noticed a couple of differences over CICO. I've gained and lost weight most of my life. I've never followed a particular "diet" (except for a brief stint in Weight Watchers when I was about 13). In the past I've simply done the CICO thing and it's always worked for me to lose an average of 2 LBS/wk. I expect I'm going to see similar results with LCHF; however there are a couple of differences that I've noticed. Perhaps others can add to the list?

1. I am NEVER hungry. On straight CICO I definitely get hungry - particularly toward the end of the day. I would come home from work literally ready to eat my own arm. This often led to eating foods that I shouldn't have. With LCHF eating a large, protein and fat rich breakfast sees me through the day. I try to eat something in the late afternoon just to ensure I won't be starving before dinner.
2. On CICO I never really experienced any cravings as I generally allowed myself to eat a pretty varied diet - as long as the Calorie count stayed where I wanted it. So far, with LCHF I am noticing that I do seem to be craving carbs. The cravings are still very mild, but its often in the back of my mind that I want to eat some form of carbs. Not necessarily anything terrible (i.e. Ice Cream, chocolate bars, cookies), but just some rye bread or a piece of fruit.

I'd be interested to hear what any of you do to satisfy some cravings without blowing your carb grams through the roof.

noclady1995

I'm daily new (started week 2) and also noticed I crave carbs, but not any crazy cravings either. Just the other day I discovered cream cheese pancakes (I add a tiny bit of vanilla to the recipe) and fell in love! Last night I was craving carbs and made some of these pancakes topped with butter and they satisfied that craving. I also reach for some fat bombs I made that are also really yummy when I have sweet cravings. I'm in Pinterest everyday looking for a variety of ideas. I tend to eat the same things but like to keep myself open to ideas.

ms_smartypants

I made the low carb mozzarella cheese sticks from pinterest and I didn't miss the breadcrumbs

daylitemag

noclady1995 wrote: »

I'm daily new (started week 2) and also noticed I crave carbs, but not any crazy cravings either. Just the other day I discovered cream cheese pancakes (I add a tiny bit of vanilla to the recipe) and fell in love! Last night I was craving carbs and made some of these pancakes topped with butter and they satisfied that craving. I also reach for some fat bombs I made that are also really yummy when I have sweet cravings. I'm in Pinterest everyday looking for a variety of ideas. I tend to eat the same things but like to keep myself open to ideas.

Sounds like a good strategy!

lithezebra

CICO and LCHF aren't incompatible. I'm doing both.

lrosemoore1

I'm 2 weeks along with you, down 5 real lbs (and 3 extra ones that crept up on me during a week of eating everything). I felt good on paleo, but like cheese, so I'm trying low carb-but no sweetners/sugar at all. I walk past sweets like an uncaring zombie. Lol. I so get an empty feeling in my gut, sometimes 20 min after a meal. Looking at my diary, I have to add more protein. Good luck to you all!

GBO323

I've lost almost 80 pounds primarily counting calories. I like the Low Carb because I feel better, sleep better, and find I'm not trying to gasp hungrily into the next meal like I do with CICO w/Carbs.

The issue I had with Atkins before(like 7-10 years ago) was I had a list of foods, but no limits. The new Atkins does put parameters around total food input. Makes a difference.

Not having carb cravings. The Atkins chocolate treats are keeping me well within bounds.

ladipoet

I personally believe the best way to kill a craving is to feed it. That said, I always feed my cravings conscientiously. So what does that mean? It means I usually make whatever it is I'm craving at home from healthy flours, healthy fats and sugar substitutes (where applicable), etc.

KetoGirl83

ladipoet wrote: »

I personally believe the best way to kill a craving is to feed it. That said, I always feed my cravings conscientiously. So what does that mean? It means I usually make whatever it is I'm craving at home from healthy flours, healthy fats and sugar substitutes (where applicable), etc.

I try to do that too but it's tricky, with certain foods I just can't. I found early on LCHF that it's way easier to totally avoid that which is really bad for me. I've been a year without eating any flour and can now look at bread and think "carbs" instead of "yummy". But I know that if I had a slice I would want the whole loaf. And tomorrow it would be much more difficult to say no.

When I "give in" to a craving I try to feed it with a similar experience but different food: I want mangoes I eat some berries or cherry tomatoes (still raw and sweet taste), I want ice cream I make it with so much fat it's impossible to eat a lot (still frozen), I want a Mars bar I eat 99% chocolate.

There's a memory of how much I loved certain foods, I make an effort to pair that memory with an image of how bad those foods were for me: "yummy bread/rice/pasta/potatoes = me 200lbs overweight".

LCHF made it possible to control cravings because my body feels well fed all the time. That gives me a precious moment of reason between wanting some carbage and actually eating it, that makes it possible to choose not to eat. I no longer have those bouts of ravenous hunger when I would eat whatever was closer (and never, ever, feeling satisfied). LCHF changed my life.

lodro

What Ketogirl says. LCHF makes my abstinence possible. "All things in moderation" and then reducing calories never did this for me.

neohdiver

I've lost quite a bit of weight on two schemes:

CICO & content moderation. I'm on a low carb diet now because my body can't tolerate carbs (diabetes) - I will lose all the weight I need to on a low carb diet, but going in (theoretically and confirmed in 4 weeks of eating this way), I would put it as the least likely of the three for me to be able to lose weight and maintain the loss - and the irony is that (even if I don't lose a pound, I still need to eat this way for the rest of my life).

CICO: Lost the most (in two or more cycles - a cumulative total of over 100 lbs), and maintained it once for around 4 years. I don't feel hungry (true, regardless of how/what I am eating). I have identified what causes cravings (the presence sugar, and to a lesser extent fats, and the absence of complex carbs). As long as I stay within the calorie count, I can eat what I feel like, so I can omit sugar and most fat and eat enough complex carbs to keep the cravings away. The challenge is that I have to count calories forever. I can sustain it easily for as long as it takes to lose the weight. Maintaining it is harder, because the thrill of seeing the scale stay the same isn't the same as the thrill of seeing it drop, so I lose the motivation to keep counting.

Content moderation: Lost the most in a single cycle - around 65 lbs, and maintained it for around 5 years. Again, hunger is never an issue for me. I eliminate anything intentionally sweetened and anything with more than minimal fat conent, have a small serving of lean protein two times a day (more generous if the protein is plant protein), as many veggies as I can/feel like eating, and - in the early stages - large quantities of empty carbs (rice cakes or enormous quantities of popcorn without added oil). As I get closer to my goal, I shift from empty carbs to denser more calorie packed complex carbs. I have calories pretty much memorized - so I could retrospectively count - but I never needed to. So maintenance is easier - it is a way of eating, rather than daily counting. And I designed the way of eating around the things that cause cravings, so I had virtually none.

LCMP: In 4 weeks I've lost 12.6 lbs. I don't have the option of not maintaining this WOE, because it is the only way anyone has discovered to keep blood glucose within a safe range. But I have to not only count, but count 2-3 things forever - I also have to choose foods that have the right balance of components to meet, but not exceed one limit, and to not exceed the other. At least while I'm losing, I'm also still counting calories. Diabetes is hard on the internal organs - specifically kidneys - which is also one of the organs that processing excess protein is hard on. So just focusing on the carbs isn't a good option for me. Not only that, but I have to exclude most carbs (which, for me, keep cravings away rather than cause them) and include fats (which are the second biggest craving trigger for me). And - I'm just not that fond of fats that aren't combined with sugar or carbs.

At least for now I have the really positive feelings I always have during the losing phase - discovering "new" clothing on at least a weekly balance, watching the scale numbers decline, etc. Even losing a small portion of my weight has always made me feel disproportionately better. I also have the added joy - 3 weeks after starting this way of eating - of having completely normal blood glucose levels. I never even topped 100 today at all - and any post eating peak of below 120 is considered normal. But I'm not looking forward to the post-honeymoon phase of this way of eating.

I know this way of eating is a godsend to many people who find it. In a sense, it is for me as well, given how quickly it has allowed me to control my blood glucose levels - but not in the sense that it is for most people of eliminating hunger (which I never experience) or minimizing cravings.

annieboomboom

I have been on LCHF since last January. My weight loss is not as fast as some experience but I was determined that this was a better diet for me not only from a weight loss perspective but because I felt better. My mind is sharper , I have more energy, and the aches and pains in my joints have disappeared. Total loss is about 18 lbs.

For more than 6 months, I simply did not weigh.
Clothes became my yard stick for change. I bought a pair of expensive size 12 jeans that didn't fit and wore them comfortably last night.

I also choose to drink now mixing wine or spirits with seltzer to stretch the experience. I do watch my intake and recognize that more fat eleviates hunger for me. I work at the gym 3-4 times a week.

I had a blood draw last week and anxious to look at my readings; cholesterol etc.
I am looked at askance by people who are practicing low fat dieting. They think I am crazy. But I decided hunger is not my game.

I have rarely cheated in all that time. It was simply too easy not to. It has become a lifestyle at this point.

I want to get more weigh off but feel now that it will come in time.

This site has been tremendously helpful and supportive.

slimzandra

CICO and WW and other weight loss programs, i.e., Jenny Craig, etc., I felt like I had no direction while eating 1300 cals. I was constantly hungry, feeling deprived, it was not sustainable.

LCHF and CICO - I still eat 1300 cals. but carbs are 30g or less and much more fats. I eat real organic foods and I have an awakening about cooking with fats - coconut oil and butter have changed everything. Occasionally, I miss my rye bread with my eggs, and I miss fruits too. I have been doing this since May, averaging 1 lbs a week. In September I learned my lesson about adding back in carbs, since I thought I had this under control. I did think I could add in apples, and an occasional slice of rye as long as the total carbs were still around 30g. - The result? Stalled weight loss and more cravings. Sugary carbs beget carbs and stall progress. Lesson learned. My revelation was leafy greens cooked in fats and a nice steak or piece of chicken have a much better satiety and less cravings for something else.

Thanks for this thread, great posts above.

daylitemag

neohdiver wrote: »

I've lost quite a bit of weight on two schemes:

CICO & content moderation. I'm on a low carb diet now because my body can't tolerate carbs (diabetes) - I will lose all the weight I need to on a low carb diet, but going in (theoretically and confirmed in 4 weeks of eating this way), I would put it as the least likely of the three for me to be able to lose weight and maintain the loss - and the irony is that (even if I don't lose a pound, I still need to eat this way for the rest of my life).

CICO: Lost the most (in two or more cycles - a cumulative total of over 100 lbs), and maintained it once for around 4 years. I don't feel hungry (true, regardless of how/what I am eating). I have identified what causes cravings (the presence sugar, and to a lesser extent fats, and the absence of complex carbs). As long as I stay within the calorie count, I can eat what I feel like, so I can omit sugar and most fat and eat enough complex carbs to keep the cravings away. The challenge is that I have to count calories forever. I can sustain it easily for as long as it takes to lose the weight. Maintaining it is harder, because the thrill of seeing the scale stay the same isn't the same as the thrill of seeing it drop, so I lose the motivation to keep counting.

Content moderation: Lost the most in a single cycle - around 65 lbs, and maintained it for around 5 years. Again, hunger is never an issue for me. I eliminate anything intentionally sweetened and anything with more than minimal fat conent, have a small serving of lean protein two times a day (more generous if the protein is plant protein), as many veggies as I can/feel like eating, and - in the early stages - large quantities of empty carbs (rice cakes or enormous quantities of popcorn without added oil). As I get closer to my goal, I shift from empty carbs to denser more calorie packed complex carbs. I have calories pretty much memorized - so I could retrospectively count - but I never needed to. So maintenance is easier - it is a way of eating, rather than daily counting. And I designed the way of eating around the things that cause cravings, so I had virtually none.

LCMP: In 4 weeks I've lost 12.6 lbs. I don't have the option of not maintaining this WOE, because it is the only way anyone has discovered to keep blood glucose within a safe range. But I have to not only count, but count 2-3 things forever - I also have to choose foods that have the right balance of components to meet, but not exceed one limit, and to not exceed the other. At least while I'm losing, I'm also still counting calories. Diabetes is hard on the internal organs - specifically kidneys - which is also one of the organs that processing excess protein is hard on. So just focusing on the carbs isn't a good option for me. Not only that, but I have to exclude most carbs (which, for me, keep cravings away rather than cause them) and include fats (which are the second biggest craving trigger for me). And - I'm just not that fond of fats that aren't combined with sugar or carbs.

At least for now I have the really positive feelings I always have during the losing phase - discovering "new" clothing on at least a weekly balance, watching the scale numbers decline, etc. Even losing a small portion of my weight has always made me feel disproportionately better. I also have the added joy - 3 weeks after starting this way of eating - of having completely normal blood glucose levels. I never even topped 100 today at all - and any post eating peak of below 120 is considered normal. But I'm not looking forward to the post-honeymoon phase of this way of eating.

I know this way of eating is a godsend to many people who find it. In a sense, it is for me as well, given how quickly it has allowed me to control my blood glucose levels - but not in the sense that it is for most people of eliminating hunger (which I never experience) or minimizing cravings.

I can relate to much of this. Thanks for sharing.

daylitemag

I think one of my biggest challenges in this is my inability to eat/enjoy vegetables. I feel like I need something to cut all the heavy meat, fat and salt. The craving for something like an apple is hard to shake. As I said with this WOE I am never hungry but am also finding that when it does come time to eat I'm starting to dread salty fatty meaty food. This is all coming from my life long addiction to carbs and I must find the will to overcome the cravings, or risk back sliding.

KenSmith108

The only time I get cravings is when I get hungry.
To stay "Not Hungry" I eat 3 good meals a day.
My primary reason for LC is not weight loss.
I watch my carbs & protein, take my meds & walk a little.
I can finally get decent control of my blood glucose levels.
I've lost 86 lbs so far but that's just bonus.
This WOE is turning out to be something I'd like to
continue the rest of my days.

OR

Lucille4444

Daylitemag,
I admit to being a beginner at low carb eating, but try to keep my carbs around 25-35 day, by counting and planning.
Would it be possible for you to count and plan, and perhaps have a small apple, and stay within the guidelines you have set for yourself?
I have found sugar free jello and nocal fruit flavored kool aid type drinks nice when I want a little something sweet.

nvmomketo

I do CI<CO and LCHF because I am trying to lose some weight still. I find it all but impossible to lose weight without limiting carbs. It is also impossible for me to control my BG. LCHF works really well.

Would I like to go back to eating anything I could if I could keep the health improvements? Sure! But that's not going happen. I think of LCHF as a medically required diet, just like eating gluten free is for me (celiac). If I quit, I will be unhealthy so I may as well embrace the positive aspects of this woe, like lower carb cravings, and ignore the negatives, like no chips or candy. Gotta make the best of it, and the positives of a very LCHF diet are pretty good!

neohdiver

daylitemag wrote: »

I think one of my biggest challenges in this is my inability to eat/enjoy vegetables. I feel like I need something to cut all the heavy meat, fat and salt. The craving for something like an apple is hard to shake. As I said with this WOE I am never hungry but am also finding that when it does come time to eat I'm starting to dread salty fatty meaty food. This is all coming from my life long addiction to carbs and I must find the will to overcome the cravings, or risk back sliding.

I eat very little meat, currently. I get my protein from full/high fat yogurt, "seasoned" with cinnamon, crushed pecans, chia seeds, and a squirt of drink mix sweetened with stevia; cheese; and lots of nut butter. Those come in decent carb/protein ratios to meet my needs. In 4 weeks, I believe I've had meat 6 times, and two were more in the realm of a snack. I was not counting protein at the time, but the day I ate pork, turkey, and a stuffed cabbage roll my body liked the carb load, at least. I can eat relatively large (2 cups) quantities of green beans without elevating my blood sugar or exceeding my net carb count for the day, large quantities of romaine, cabbage, and other salad greens and moderate quantities of raw carrots and turnips. I have not yet tested, but I suspect I'll be able to eat broccoli and caulliflower.

Sour cream is one of the fats I enjoy, so I've added it to crack slaw (essentially hamburger & cabbage - an internet search will pull it for you). I drain the fat from the hamburger when I cook it and add sour cream when I eat it. Chicken wings can be made without added salt & coated with butter & hot sauce. BW3 has several sauces that have pretty low carb counts. I topped off my day yesterday, since I was lazy and short calories, with a half a can of black olives - another fat I enjoy. I'm not terribly sensitive to salt, so the salty doesn't bother me. But I hate most meat fat - so I add my fat from other sources

Since I know (from prior experience) that fat triggers cravings for me, I used to just stop eating it. I wouldn't have enough calories to sustain me if I did that now. Now I'm testing the fats I eat, as I go along, to see which ones I can eat without triggering cravings. Bacon is out (the only definite no-go I've found so far. Cheeses, sour cream, nut butters, and olives are safe.

My diary is brief (I didn't start logging immediately), but open if you want to use it for ideas.

ettaterrell

KetoGirl83 wrote: »

ladipoet wrote: »

I personally believe the best way to kill a craving is to feed it. That said, I always feed my cravings conscientiously. So what does that mean? It means I usually make whatever it is I'm craving at home from healthy flours, healthy fats and sugar substitutes (where applicable), etc.

I try to do that too but it's tricky, with certain foods I just can't. I found early on LCHF that it's way easier to totally avoid that which is really bad for me. I've been a year without eating any flour and can now look at bread and think "carbs" instead of "yummy". But I know that if I had a slice I would want the whole loaf. And tomorrow it would be much more difficult to say no.

When I "give in" to a craving I try to feed it with a similar experience but different food: I want mangoes I eat some berries or cherry tomatoes (still raw and sweet taste), I want ice cream I make it with so much fat it's impossible to eat a lot (still frozen), I want a Mars bar I eat 99% chocolate.

There's a memory of how much I loved certain foods, I make an effort to pair that memory with an image of how bad those foods were for me: "yummy bread/rice/pasta/potatoes = me 200lbs overweight".

LCHF made it possible to control cravings because my body feels well fed all the time. That gives me a precious moment of reason between wanting some carbage and actually eating it, that makes it possible to choose not to eat. I no longer have those bouts of ravenous hunger when I would eat whatever was closer (and never, ever, feeling satisfied). LCHF changed my life.

This! Every body is different. I'm going into week 8 of my diet at first I tried eating around 50 carbs then with out noticing I started going lower and lower I get between 15-30 carbs and I had no idea that I needed more fats to help me and once I added them a whole new world opened up for me, weight started moving faster I do only get between 1300-1500 cals a day and 7 grams of sugar! I do have a drink on weekends and I noticed when I use artificial sugars to my drinks I go crazy with cravings.... After I hadn't had cravings for weeks that hitting me made me learn no sugars nor artificial sugars we're going in my diet..... I do not like cravings and I love the way this WOE gives me freedom over food. I eat plenty of veggies, squash, green beans, cabbage a few times a week. But I really think sticking to my 70-25-5 keeps my cravings gone.. In the last 7 weeks I've lost 18lb from 194 to 176 and it's still moving. Good luck

KarlaYP

As one who went through weight loss surgery, thinking that would give me my health back (it did not!), and believing that just cutting the intake (cico) I would achieve all I wanted (WRONG). I lost weight (110pounds), but felt terrible! Plus, the weight loss lasted about a day and a half (for real) then steadily increased again. This proved to me that it was the food, not the amount (I was still only eating about 1600 calories a day, but they were all carbs!) Creating weight gain for no sensible reason! I was still ahead of cico, but ballooned back up about 80 pounds!

LCHF has given me the health I was seeking with cico, and cico will never take that from me again. As far as cravings (even for fruit) go, I found that I felt better the longer I chose to keep them out of my diet. I see all sugar as poison for me. The cravings will end as long as you choose to not consume them. It doesn't take very long and you don't miss them, at all!

Though, many here use substitutes for these foods and are very successful. It's great to be in a place where you can learn what really helps, and what doesn't!

Boredom; add you a vegetable (roasted cauliflower, broccoli, sauteed mushrooms...), there are many lc options available and when you cook them in butter the satiety is amazing! There are many ways to add the variety you seek!

Your success with LCHF, so far, is great to see!! Achievement of this "Unhungry Land" is a wonderful place to be and gives us control over food that we had only ever heard of!

Hugs! You've got this!!