Confusion over ketosis
pippacorcoran
Posts: 59 Member
I'm 5ft1 and 10.5 stone and trying to loose 2 stone . I'm 23 years old and have a 4 month old baby.
I'm currently in ketosis (have keto sticks) and am trying to eat under 20g of carbs but usually eat under 30.
Some websites say ketosis can be done consuming 50g of carbs,
I darent up my carbs I case I come out of ketosis, but feel like I'm not getting a balanced diet in 20gs
Anyone have any experience of this and any knowledge to share with me? Thank you
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Replies
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It depends on what you mean by getting a balanced diet. 20 gm a day can give me a veggie with my evening meal, or a salad. I don't always spend my carb allowance on veggies, choosing to eat meat, cheese, and heavy whipping cream only on most days. I've been at this level of carbs and in ketosis since last May. I've found that when I eat veggies too often I get knocked out of ketosis (for lack of a better way of putting it). I feel very "balanced" and don't think anything is missing as long as I use my sodium, magnesium, and potassium supplements. Plus I'm healthier than I've ever been as an adult!0
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It depends on what you mean by getting a balanced diet. 20 gm a day can give me a veggie with my evening meal, or a salad. I don't always spend my carb allowance on veggies, choosing to eat meat, cheese, and heavy whipping cream only on most days. I've been at this level of carbs and in ketosis since last May. I've found that when I eat veggies too often I get knocked out of ketosis (for lack of a better way of putting it). I feel very "balanced" and don't think anything is missing as long as I use my sodium, magnesium, and potassium supplements. Plus I'm healthier than I've ever been as an adult!
Thank you for your reply! Supplements sounds like a good idea! Probably just adjustment problems sure I will get used to getting veg and things into my diet0 -
Green leafy veg like spinach or kale is low carb. Depends how low you want to go or stay. I take a multi mineral, magnesium citrate, vitamin D and have been advised to stop b12 as now high after years of low whilst on an Aussie diet (less sugar than usa but similar)0
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I find that I am naturally eating fewer and fewer vegetables. And I feel better and better. I do take vitamin C and D3, and fish oil every morning as well as magnesium in the evening.
I think there is a little voice in our heads that nags us to eat our veggies ! But I m not listening to it anymore.....and I have always been a fierce veggie lover. I fasted all day today, then just ate all my calories in one meal at supper. Two beef/pork burger patties, topped with cheese and a fried egg. The only vegetable matter was about 1/2 Tbsp of minced onion and a bit of pickle for flavour. My carbs are within my goal of under 20 g, and most of my carbs came from the almond meal chocolate chip cookie I just ate, as well as eggs and cheese.
I feel really balanced, and what I ate feels balanced to me. My concept of what constitutes a balanced diet has changed considerably.0 -
Balanced is a very relative term. I feel my diet is balanced as long as I'm eating mostly whole foods and not overdoing any one thing.0
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To those who don't eat fruit or vegies, do you keep an eye on your micros? Do you get a good percentage of those?0
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Some zero carb folks incorporate offal for micros, but others don't think it's necessary. I wish we had more long term human studies on this stuff, but I suppose like so many other areas in life there's no "one answer".0
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Christine_72 wrote: »To those who don't eat fruit or vegies, do you keep an eye on your micros? Do you get a good percentage of those?Some zero carb folks incorporate offal for micros, but others don't think it's necessary. I wish we had more long term human studies on this stuff, but I suppose like so many other areas in life there's no "one answer".
I would also add that unless someone were taking very specific supplements they probably aren't hitting the micro goals anyway. We know theyre important, but not really how important in the long run.
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I believe I've heard that meats contain all the nutrients/minerals that you need.0
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I don't watch micros. I've found a balance of macros that's working great, and the rest seems to work itself out, albeit very sloooowly!
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Thanks for your replies I have got some kale and spinach and I'm getting back on track thanks for your tips
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Don't human carnivores need vitamin C from spinach or a supplement? I am thinking rabbit starvation. I trust you folk more than internet scaremongering, so what is your experience?0
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@FIT_Goat is the one to talk about that. But organ meats have vit C like liver. I'm pretty sure that rabbit starvation is caused by solely eating lean meat. Those whose diet is higher in fat don't appear to have such a problem. Like I said, though, the Goat and @Dragonwolf know more.0
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SamandaIndia wrote: »Don't human carnivores need vitamin C from spinach or a supplement? I am thinking rabbit starvation. I trust you folk more than internet scaremongering, so what is your experience?
I'm not sure on this, but I believe vitamin c can be obtained from rare meat. Definitely lots in spinach too.
I think rabbit starvation is more about a lack of fat and too much protein. I think...0 -
SamandaIndia wrote: »Don't human carnivores need vitamin C from spinach or a supplement? I am thinking rabbit starvation. I trust you folk more than internet scaremongering, so what is your experience?
Rabbit starvation is protein overdose in the absence or near-absence of carbs and/or fat. It comes from the fact that rabbits tend to be very lean, particularly in the winter when explorers were under the circumstances where the only thing they could eat to keep from starving is rabbit.
As for Vitamin C -- http://zerocarbzen.com/vitamin-c/
tl;dr -- when eating only meat, most of the purposes for Vitamin C are bypassed, so overall need is greatly reduced and met by meat intake.Christine_72 wrote: »To those who don't eat fruit or vegies, do you keep an eye on your micros? Do you get a good percentage of those?
No, I don't bother tracking micros. The RDA values are for a mixed diet that include carbohydrates and a high amount of nutrient absorption-blocking grains, which is completely irrelevant on a meat-only diet. Red meat, in particular, has the nutrients we need to survive and thrive, and several groups of people have done exactly that (while the Inuit are the most common example, several Plains Native American tribes, namely the Blackfoot and Sioux tribes lived almost entirely on buffalo and other large ungulates, among other groups; the general exception is berries when they're in season). Additionally, the nutrients in meat are more bioavailable than the same ones found in plants, because the plant varieties are oftenbound up in indigestible compounds, like phytates and insoluble fiber or in forms that are not directly usable by our body and need converted.
So, for example, even though dark leafy greens have over 1000% the RDV of Vitamin K on paper, it's the K1 form, which the only partially uses and needs to convert to K2 to fully utilize, but the conversion is extremely inefficient and we need dietary K2 to obtain the benefits of K2.
http://discovermagazine.com/2004/oct/inuit-paradox
http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/all-meat-diets/
http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/food/meats/
http://chriskresser.com/vitamin-k2-the-missing-nutrient/0 -
SamandaIndia wrote: »Don't human carnivores need vitamin C from spinach or a supplement? I am thinking rabbit starvation. I trust you folk more than internet scaremongering, so what is your experience?
No. You do not need any vitamins at all eating just meat. That includes vitamin C. I have gone over a year without any dietary source of vitamin c, still have not got scurvy. And, I am at no risk of it either. That is even without eating organ meats. There is enough antiscorbutic properties in fresh meat (even cooked muscle meat) to avoid scurvy. Even enough to reverse scurvy in those who develop it. Stefansson used fresh meat as a cure for scurvy when on his arctic explorations when some men had developed it by avoiding meat and eating biscuits and crap. It doesn't have vitamin c, exactly, but it seems unnecessary to consume vitamin c when eating fresh meat.
Rabbit starvation is extremely rare. It requires meat so lean that you won't get it that lean even from rabbits who weren't already starving themselves. You basically need to avoid all sources of fat and carbs. With enough of either of those, you won't develop it. It happens when you try and subsist entirely on protein alone (350g+ a day depending on body weight for extended periods). You will feel like crap so quickly that you will certainly stop before you hurt yourself. If the meat is extremely lean, the onset of negative physical effects can happen in days. Stefansson started experiencing them extremely quickly when they intentionally removed all possible fat from his meat.
In short, both of these are non-issues for carnivores. We eat fatty meat, even when I hit 40% protein, I am still getting plenty of fat, enough to avoid rabbit starvation.
Edit: I don't supplement at all and I don't watch my macros or micros. There is an abundance, if not a super-abundance, of all the required nutrients for perfect health in muscle meat alone. I will sometimes eat organ meats (marrow, chicken livers, liverwurst, sweetbreads, etc.) but not specifically for any nutrients. I eat those because they are tasty and I enjoy them. If I didn't (or I try a meat I am not fond of, like kidney) I wouldn't eat them any more.0 -
Very enlightening thread as I've been wondering about the mentions I've seen of veggies being unnecessary but hadn't researched it that much myself since I still usually include a few servings most days. Thanks for the links and further explanation!0
