Transitioning from being "informally low carb" to Keto. I have questions!
AlyssaPetsDogs
Posts: 421 Member
Hi Everyone,
I have been keeping an eye on my carb intake for a while and for the most part, I have cut out super carb-y foods from my regular diet (pastas, breads, rices etc.). It helped me lose the first 35 pounds! I am aware of the carbs in fruit and I cut those back a little bit as well.
I have been reading a lot about Keto diets (the launch pad on here was super successful and I did visit it - thank you!) and I think this might be something I want try out. I just have a few, probably dumb, questions, that I did not find the answer to on the launch pad (if they are on the launch pad, I apologize profusely. I did read through the Keto stuff twice).
1. It seems like 5% carbs is the magic percentage. Does this vary from person to person? I have a friend who mentions she has "done Keto" before and she says that she can eat more carbs if she exercises. She is also very tiny and thin, so that may have something to do with it. Also, is the 5% for net carbs?
2. I'm currently on 1200 calories (fitness level set to sedentary) and I exercise regularly and eat back maybe 1/3 of my exercise calories. Anything I should probably change about this if I restrict my carbs even more? (I'm female, 23, 5'7", 190 pounds with a goal of 150 pounds)
3. I know people caution in the forums "don't go low carb unless you want to eat like that for the rest of your life, you'll gain it all back right away if you go back to eating bread etc." I read in the Keto article from the launchpad that there can be a gain if you go back into eating carbs regularly. I know a carb-y meal of pizza can kick you out of ketosis, but is it safe to assume that the occasional cheat meal won't have a drastic impact?
4. Can you guys point me to some of your diaries or maybe be my friend so I can creep on your diaries for food and snack inspirations? I already know that pork rinds are amazing, but I'm sure there are other awesome snacks that work well with this kind of diet.
Thanks again and I appreciate any input, support, or suggestions! Have a great weekend!
I have been keeping an eye on my carb intake for a while and for the most part, I have cut out super carb-y foods from my regular diet (pastas, breads, rices etc.). It helped me lose the first 35 pounds! I am aware of the carbs in fruit and I cut those back a little bit as well.
I have been reading a lot about Keto diets (the launch pad on here was super successful and I did visit it - thank you!) and I think this might be something I want try out. I just have a few, probably dumb, questions, that I did not find the answer to on the launch pad (if they are on the launch pad, I apologize profusely. I did read through the Keto stuff twice).
1. It seems like 5% carbs is the magic percentage. Does this vary from person to person? I have a friend who mentions she has "done Keto" before and she says that she can eat more carbs if she exercises. She is also very tiny and thin, so that may have something to do with it. Also, is the 5% for net carbs?
2. I'm currently on 1200 calories (fitness level set to sedentary) and I exercise regularly and eat back maybe 1/3 of my exercise calories. Anything I should probably change about this if I restrict my carbs even more? (I'm female, 23, 5'7", 190 pounds with a goal of 150 pounds)
3. I know people caution in the forums "don't go low carb unless you want to eat like that for the rest of your life, you'll gain it all back right away if you go back to eating bread etc." I read in the Keto article from the launchpad that there can be a gain if you go back into eating carbs regularly. I know a carb-y meal of pizza can kick you out of ketosis, but is it safe to assume that the occasional cheat meal won't have a drastic impact?
4. Can you guys point me to some of your diaries or maybe be my friend so I can creep on your diaries for food and snack inspirations? I already know that pork rinds are amazing, but I'm sure there are other awesome snacks that work well with this kind of diet.
Thanks again and I appreciate any input, support, or suggestions! Have a great weekend!
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Replies
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1: less percentage, more hard target. I aim for >20g, but I've heard that some get away with as high as 50g.
2: if your weight is behaving as you desire at that calorie count, keep it there.
3: I run a CKD, which is keto for 6 days, and one high-carb day to replenish glycogen. It's not a problem.
4: Do NOT look at my diary for the past month or so for ideas. I am currently running RFL, which is not a way that you should eat unless you know what you are doing. It can cause significant harm if you screw it up.
If you feel like going a ways back though, you'll know you hit my CKD era when you see nothing but protein shakes, chicken wings, and ribs for every day other than Fridays.2 -
I aim for around 30 or less net instead of a percentage. I'm fully fat adapted and rarely cheat but the few off plan things I've had weren't any problem. You just need to be careful because some people have bad cravings following a cheat and it ends up derailing them long term! I would continue to eat back the same amount of calories from exercise since that is working for you. I'd get the calories from fat and protein rather than carbs however.
Feel free to friend me! I log daily and have been keto over a year!3 -
1) depends on the person. I stick to less than 20 total carbs per day. Most start at 20 net and adjust depending on how their body reacts.
2) that's fine -- just watch your macros on fat and protein.
3) a cheat meal is miserable in my world. I feel like poop for days after. It has set my out of ketosis for days...not worth if in my opinion.
4) you can friend me and check out mine.
Good luck!2 -
Hi and welcome!!
1 = I try and stay under 20 net carbs but have gone as high as 25 before and been fine. But I am also only about a month into this so don't know where my tolerance is as of yet.
2 = MFP has me set to 1310 and I do my best to maintain that and eat back *some* of my exercise calories. This has been a bit difficult! This way of eating makes me full all the time but I do have to watch carefully because of the higher fat content it's very easy to go over for me.
3 = I don't know. I haven't really cheated yet. I'm scared to because of all the people who have and feel like poo for doing it! I feel great and I don't want to mess that up. Really though I haven't even wanted to cheat. YET LOL
4 = My diary is public. Feel free to add me or just look if you like. Do remember I am fairly new at this so some of my foods look a bit boring still! It will only be relevant to Keto for the last 3 to 4 weeks.
Hope this helps and it's nice to have you here!1 -
As far as "cheat" meals are concerned, whether you're in keto or not (I never monitored and still lost 20 pounds in 13 weeks) once you've been living LC for a while if you're lucky going off plan will make you feel so awful it won't be worth repeating. Five months into my new WOE, I made some cream cheese brownies for a holiday event and had a four hour tummy ache from merely licking the bowl and beaters. Talk about instant feedback.
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Theoretically and anecdotally, once you've been at Keto for a while, you may become more metabolically flexible and eating higher amounts of carbs (not high carb though) in rotation for several months will not be a problem. There was some interesting talk about this on the KetoSummit. You can probably Google 'Metabolic flexibility' and find a podcast somewhere. It's mainly a cheat meal of garbage carbs that most people feel sick from, although there are some who are more sensitive to even fresh fruit and higher carb veggies.
I'm doing <25 which is low for me (I have 8 lbs to lose to hit my original goal weight), as I maintained easily for a year and a half at 100g net.... then I got lax and didn't log. You are welcome to lurk in my diary - it's public - the past two weeks will be the best examples as they are my strictest. You may find something useful.
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Thank you everyone for your responses! I greatly appreciate it! I may have more questions eventually - we will see how this goes!0
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My honest opinion is that how often you eat is more important than how low carb you go.
Some people need to be very low carb (keto) to have enough appetite control to eat less often.
A person can be in a full time state of ketosis anywhere from 20 to 150g carbs. Maybe even more if they are seriously active. The activity level AND insulin sensitivity is what determines this. If you eat less than 100g total carbs a day, you'll be in ketosis at least some of the time. Maintaining full time ketosis is NOT necessary for weight loss UNLESS it's the only way a person can gain control of their appetite. As far as weight loss goes, it really does come down to how much you eat and I think a huge part of that is how often you eat.
I would aim to eliminate all snacks. Experiment with the carb limit that works for you that makes it possible to eat only 2 or 3 meals a day without snacks. You need to allow your body to access body fat for energy as often as possible. Let it snack on body fat between meals. If you can eat 100g carbs and feel no need to snack, then that's a great goal for you. If you try that for a few days and have to actively fight off the hunger between meals, then you need to look at what was in that last meal. Why wasn't it able to hold you over for 5-6 hours? Was it too low fat? Was it too many carbs, triggering an insulin response? Was it too sweet, triggering sweet cravings? Was it too low protein? Or too much protein if you're insulin resistant?
While people will eat fewer carbs for cutting body fat with no intention of continuing to eat that way afterward with success, I think it would only be possible to maintain the loss if the eating habits overall are going to be a permanent change. If you increased carbs and therefore found yourself hungrier and needing to eat more often again, then I don't think you'll maintain it very long. So it is a good idea to lose the weight in a way that you plan to keep up with.9 -
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That's great advice! I definitely have had no trouble losing weight at a caloric deficit (I'm now at 1200 calories per day - I started around 1600 maybe? I can't remember). I usually have not had any issues being hungry on the 1200 calories, but I do have a snack in between breakfast and lunch usually. I always get too hungry. I might look at having larger calorie meals, but we will see! I have to eat something for breakfast otherwise my stomach starts growling in class at 9. Never fails!0
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I have to say I don't think my losses are different when I eat more often, but on low carb I usually find I naturally want to go longer between meals as I'm just not hungry.
Re: cheat meals - it depends how often you have them really. People's experiences vary. You'll see some people say they had a day eating non stop junk and it broke a stall and they lost a lb. many others find they feel terrible or that they 'gain' 4lbs overnight.
The thing to remember is that no, you don't gain all your weight back as soon as you stop low carb. That would be physically impossible unless you stopped low carb and started eating massive amounts of calories. What you do gain back is water weight, or glycogen, and this can be anything from 2lbs to 7lbs or in some cases more. It's not fat, and if you low carb again it will go almost as fast as it showed up. But if you lose 50lbs on low carb you won't magically gain that back if you switch plans.
The same is true with the weight gain post cheat meals. It's glycogen, not fat. If I get back on track the day after a cheat I may not lose for a week but I'll get off any glycogen gained within that week instead - so it's okay once every few months. If i did it every week I'd really slow my losses.
The main worry with cheat meals is that carbs are addictive and convenient and it's very easy to go off track for a lot longer than a meal - that's when it can be a real problem.
Still, I've gotten off track many times and I'm back on. As long as you pick yourself up and keep going eventually you'll be just fine.3 -
I would consider my diet LCHF rather than Keto and still consume products like full-fat milk which are perhaps not strictly low carb considering given quantities, so my carbs will be above 20g per day but less than 100g. No "cheat meals" though with any regularity, I'd prefer to stay on plan and allow for the occasional exception...
Tom3 -
Thanks so much! Yeah I really don't have regular cheat meals. It's really just the day after I finish exams where I'll have a bunch of pizza or if I'm on vacation etc. I tend to be pretty good at staying on track.
Thank you everyone!0 -
Apart from real ale (beer) and good sourdough bread I've not missed my carb intake much at all, and certainly feel the benefits of keeping more on track. I started gradually though, eg. smaller carb portions, and have only been stricter since the beginning of August.1
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moonlights wrote: »I have to say I don't think my losses are different when I eat more often, but on low carb I usually find I naturally want to go longer between meals as I'm just not hungry.
Re: cheat meals - it depends how often you have them really. People's experiences vary. You'll see some people say they had a day eating non stop junk and it broke a stall and they lost a lb. many others find they feel terrible or that they 'gain' 4lbs overnight.
The thing to remember is that no, you don't gain all your weight back as soon as you stop low carb. That would be physically impossible unless you stopped low carb and started eating massive amounts of calories. What you do gain back is water weight, or glycogen, and this can be anything from 2lbs to 7lbs or in some cases more. It's not fat, and if you low carb again it will go almost as fast as it showed up. But if you lose 50lbs on low carb you won't magically gain that back if you switch plans.
The same is true with the weight gain post cheat meals. It's glycogen, not fat. If I get back on track the day after a cheat I may not lose for a week but I'll get off any glycogen gained within that week instead - so it's okay once every few months. If i did it every week I'd really slow my losses.
The main worry with cheat meals is that carbs are addictive and convenient and it's very easy to go off track for a lot longer than a meal - that's when it can be a real problem.
Still, I've gotten off track many times and I'm back on. As long as you pick yourself up and keep going eventually you'll be just fine.
My solution to the problem of convenience carbs has been to run my refeeds using carbs that require prep. I generally stick to things like potatoes (sweet and redskin mostly), rice, and bagels (though I guess you could eat cold soggy bagels if you hate yourself).
Pairing that with the fact that these sources primarily break down into glucose, it's made my refeeds a lot more oroductive, and notably less bloat/*kitten* feeling inducing. Hell, I crammed a pound and a quarter of potatoes, a 6-pack of Lender's Onion, and a half pound sweet potato into myself in a few hours after lifting yesterday, and all is well.
Except for the whole "I forgot that when you microwave cook potatoes the inside gets obsurdly hot compared to the outside" part. Yeah, eating toasted bagels after burning the *kitten* out of your mouth with molten Irish bait is not a good time.1 -
The higher I set my carbs, the hungrier I am. If I cheat one day and eat a bunch of stuff that's not normally in my diet, my stomach is rumbling the next morning for more.0
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alyssadanielle2493 wrote: »That's great advice! I definitely have had no trouble losing weight at a caloric deficit (I'm now at 1200 calories per day - I started around 1600 maybe? I can't remember). I usually have not had any issues being hungry on the 1200 calories, but I do have a snack in between breakfast and lunch usually. I always get too hungry. I might look at having larger calorie meals, but we will see! I have to eat something for breakfast otherwise my stomach starts growling in class at 9. Never fails!
I was the same way about breakfast. I tried IF going to 16/8 schedule only eating lunch and dinner. Within a couple of days, there was no hunger issues in the morning and in fact sometimes I am still not hungry at lunch since.
Last week, I experimented with switching to only breakfast and lunch with success and may change to that full time.
The first step is getting rid of snacks. I was a hardcore snack eater - frequently with 2 between breakfast and lunch, one or two in the afternoon and one in the evening. I did up the amount of calories per meal when eliminating snacks.3 -
Ugh I am a snacker too, especially right before bed. That is the hardest one to nix. I have keto friendly snacks in my night stand so at least I'm snacking on plan, but I've been feeling stalled so I might have to stop.1
